VAR

[Mark_w]

The League Two final demonstrated exactly why we need VAR. There needs to be some stability with handball rules, more effort to improve officiating, and people need to get over the offsides being tight.

[SemperEadem]

I don’t really believe that in the long run it helps a club like us compete. It’s very swings and roundabouts, win some you lose some with it.

But if it’s my team ‘doing well’ off it vs actually having the euphoria of a proper goal celebration back then I would have us struggling in the uni bond if it meant we had great goal moments there to stay.

[Mark_w]

2 minutes ago, Sol thewall Bamba said:

There will be issues with or without VAR. The only debate is whether you're happy to lose a massive proportion of the passion of the game or not. 

 

How anyone that goes to games can be for it I cannot fathom. 

You don't lose a massive proportion of the passion of the game. I was pretty sure the Tielemans goal would be ruled out at Wembley but I still went nuts. You just have to accept the other side might be celebrating in 30 seconds and you might look a little silly. Doesn't take anything away from the celebrations, it just adds to the drama and emotion. Awaiting the VAR decision for Chilwell's goal and the release when it was ruled out definitely added to the experience at Wembley.

[HybridFox]

Planning to bring in "automatic" offsides for the World Cup next year when we haven't even got this shambles sorted yet!

[SemperEadem]

VAR does in no way add to the drama and emotion of celebrating a goal. Never having that.

[Sol thewall Bamba]

1 minute ago, Mark_w said:

You don't lose a massive proportion of the passion of the game. I was pretty sure the Tielemans goal would be ruled out at Wembley but I still went nuts. You just have to accept the other side might be celebrating in 30 seconds and you might look a little silly. Doesn't take anything away from the celebrations, it just adds to the drama and emotion. Awaiting the VAR decision for Chilwell's goal and the release when it was ruled out definitely added to the experience at Wembley.

I guess time will tell. But the era of big goal celebrations is coming to an end imo. 

[Mark_w]

6 minutes ago, SemperEadem said:

VAR does in no way add to the drama and emotion of celebrating a goal. Never having that.

It adds to the drama and emotion of conceding one. And it doesn't take any emotion or drama away from scoring one imo.

[Super_horns]

8 minutes ago, Mark_w said:

It adds to the drama and emotion of conceding one. And it doesn't take any emotion or drama away from scoring one imo.

Not sure many will agree there but fair enough.

 

A lot of people do say it takes the emotion away.

 

Which I think is the main complaint - more so than the rules or decisions themselves.

 

 

 

Edited 2 June 2021 by Super_horns

[Fox92]

1 hour ago, filbertway said:

Well you kinda go "yeaa..." but you can't exactly enjoy the moment can you...unless you're unaware that VAR exists, or in denial that there's a chance it could be ruled out for a multitude of reasons.

 

The game is too subjective and the past 2 seasons should show that we don't have the technology or clear enough definition of rules at the moment for VAR to improve the game.

 

26 minutes ago, Walkers said:

 

No one is saying stand still until a screen tells you to celebrate. But if a goal that you so wildly celebrated is correctly disallowed, do you really have ground to complain? I still maintain people don't look at this from both sides, no way in a VAR-less world will people see us concede a goal that should have been disallowed, and think "ah nevermind, they've already celebrated, would be a shame to see them have to uncelebrate the moment". They'd be bemoaning the lack of technology in order to help reach the right decision. I think people have embarrassment issues. 

 

I'm not saying you stand around until a screen tells you to celebrate but it's impossible, in filbertway's words, to just go "yeaa..". That will never happen at a game. Your involved in the emotion of the game and when a goal goes in everybody celebrates it reglardless of VAR in that minute. I've never been at a game when people don't celebrate just in case VAR rules it out.

 

Your other point I wasn't disagreeing with, Walkers. IF the goal is correctly ruled out then of course there's no ground to complain because technically it shouldn't stand. Werner scored with his hand against us, goal gets ruled out, Chelsea fans sing "it's not football anymore". Since when has handball been allowed!

 

Fans will sing against it when they have a goal ruled out, even if it's correctly ruled out, and fans will be for it when it goes their way. Biased. I think that's just a natural part of life never mind VAR and football. I think what would help is the decisions being talked about/shown live in the ground because when you're there, as we all know, you have no clue what's going on. The timing aspect is one of my issue's with it; football isn't a stop start game.

Edited 2 June 2021 by Fox92

[davieG]

12 minutes ago, Super_horns said:

Not sure many will agree there but fair enough.

 

A lot of people do say it takes the emotion away.

 

Which I think is the main complaint - more so than the rules or decisions themselves.

 

 

 

It doesn't so much take the emotion away as delays it. There was plenty of emotion when Chilwell's goal was disallowed.  Despair and elation being reversed. I guess you could argue you get it twice but not doubled.

[filbertway]

33 minutes ago, Fox92 said:

 

I'm not saying you stand around until a screen tells you to celebrate but it's impossible, in filbertway's words, to just go "yeaa..". That will never happen at a game. Your involved in the emotion of the game and when a goal goes in everybody celebrates it reglardless of VAR in that minute. I've never been at a game when people don't celebrate just in case VAR rules it out.

Maybe a slight exagerration on my part mate  I find I celebrate normally for about 4/5 seconds and then stop and begin wondering how or if the officials will contrive to disallow the goal. 

 

I'd rather be able to look at the ref or lino immediately, see if they have given the okay and then carry on going nuts. 

[Fox92]

2 hours ago, filbertway said:

Maybe a slight exagerration on my part mate  I find I celebrate normally for about 4/5 seconds and then stop and begin wondering how or if the officials will contrive to disallow the goal. 

 

I'd rather be able to look at the ref or lino immediately, see if they have given the okay and then carry on going nuts. 

I wasn't having a go btw. I get what you mean now you've explained in more detail.

[Corky]

4 hours ago, Super_horns said:

We had the Newport manager asking it to  be used more though after the play off final on Monday ..

 

So they might have a different attitude towards it to fans but one thing is for certain the communication needs to be better and some of the rules changed .

 

 

There were no guarantees a video ref would've come to a different decision.

 

It's just another referee looking at a video judging a subjective decision, not some spot on corrective device.

[BenTheFox]

I'm not only against VAR, but also the way it is being implemented. Supporters inside the stadium are left in the dark for 2/3 minutes on end while the referee is having a conversation with someone 100 miles away. Almost every stadium has a big screen and yet all we get is a screensaver type image  saying decision pending. 

[BenTheFox]

One thing I will always say though is that we have to cut officials more slack for getting  marginal decisions wrong if we remove VAR. If someone's toe is offside but the linesman doesn't flag then don't crucify them. They're having to look at when the ball is being played, the position of the last defender, the position of the attacker and position of the goalkeeper. 

Edited 2 June 2021 by BenTheFox

[BenTheFox]

Also, how naff does it look that a referee has to run to the other side of the pitch to look at a tele in front of thousands of people? 

[David Hankey]

The "problem" with VAR is that there is still a human element attached. On one day the "man in the box" can decide one thing and on a different day another man decides something different.

 

The toe-nail and elbow offsides are very harsh and I guess over a season they all balance out. If anyone is checking the decisions, for and against, Leicester City last season I would be very interested to see how we fared. 

[StanSP]

50 minutes ago, BenTheFox said:

I'm not only against VAR, but also the way it is being implemented. Supporters inside the stadium are left in the dark for 2/3 minutes on end while the referee is having a conversation with someone 100 miles away. Almost every stadium has a big screen and yet all we get is a screensaver type image  saying decision pending. 

Agreed. Ever since the start I've longed to have comms relaid to the stadium and fans inside. Commentators can hear it if you're watching on TV, so I don't see why fans - either in the stadium or at home - should be allowed to listen to it. 

It may even alleviate some of the criticism that is rightly aimed at officials through being able to work out how they've come to some of their decisions.

[Super_horns]

3 hours ago, Corky said:

There were no guarantees a video ref would've come to a different decision.

 

It's just another referee looking at a video judging a subjective decision, not some spot on corrective device.

Agree - as you say all subjective.

 

3 hours ago, BenTheFox said:

I'm not only against VAR, but also the way it is being implemented. Supporters inside the stadium are left in the dark for 2/3 minutes on end while the referee is having a conversation with someone 100 miles away. Almost every stadium has a big screen and yet all we get is a screensaver type image  saying decision pending. 

Except two of the big boys ofcourse.