General News Thread

[Greg2607]

7 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

But you have to dam rivers to do that, habitat destruction etc.  Legal challenges etc.

Sure, but you also end up with new habitat in and around that reservoir. Much more so than building pipelines, which will also come with habitat damage, legal challenges etc.   

 

The UK needs to get over it's NIMBYISM and crack on with infrastructure projects that benefit the nation. 

 

One of the core reasons for our decline as a nation is that our infrastructure is crumbling and no one wants to accept anything that may have a perceived impact on them. 

 

Perfect example.... I live on a new build estate that's been completed in the last 3 years. At the time of our purchase, there was outline planning for another 100 houses in the edge of our estate (came up in all our searches)

 

Roll forward three years and a developer wants to now build those 100 houses.... Guess what.... People on the estate are up in arms about it. 

 

As a nation, we need to get out of our own way. 

 

 

[bovril]

10 hours ago, urban.spaceman said:

It's like we're addicted to chaos. 

 

5 hours ago, RobHawk said:

Politics is ****ed in this country. 

I think the issue is that our living standards have declined so much in this country relative to others and people are flailing about trying to do something about it without really having any kind of coherent answer, while ignoring the things that have caused it because they don't want to lose voters. Transplant that on to a very individualistic society where most social bonds and sense of community have slowly unravelled and you have the cluster**** which is British politics 2025. 

[Free Falling Foxes]

Oh dear. Another person making a living online and shouting from the rooftops about it.

I work in a school and too many students, when asked what they wish to do when they leave school, say they are going to be an online gamer or 'influencer'.

[urban.spaceman]

2 hours ago, leicsmac said:

I'm trying to put my finger on exactly when such things became so fast-food. The era of widespread instant digital communication, perhaps? 

 

Or perhaps things always were that way and the digital era has just given the sentiment much more power. 

I've mentioned it before on here for sure but I left the country in January 2016 before Cameron formally called the referendum and returned on the 24th of June, without having the opportunity to register to vote cos they'd made it impossible to do so while travelling, and without seeing any debates or news coverage, and being completely dialled out of social media etc. Leicester winning the league was also another major distraction of course.

 

So I missed the 6 months worth of campaigning, publicity, discussions, etc. Practically anything to do with Brexit, I missed out on cos I was having the time of my ****ing life. The first time I realised something was wrong was when the South African news channels were reporting that a British MP had been murdered. 

 

The country had completely changed when I arrived home. It was bewildering the and still is bewildering now. 

 

What the **** happened to this country in those 6 months? It's been relentless chaos ever since. What the **** happened?

[The Doctor]

11 hours ago, urban.spaceman said:

People on the left think Labour are on the far right. People on the right think Labour are on the far left. 

 

I'm honestly just tired of the hysteria, the misinformation and the bullshit.
 

It's like we're addicted to chaos. 

honestly the problem with this is it's frequently used to argue that labour are centrists. Maybe relative to UK politics they are but if that's the case, when a labour PM is saying the sort of things that used to get you kicked out of the Tories for being too racist, then UK politics has mired itself in and normalised the far right.

[RobHawk]

3 hours ago, TamworthFoxes said:

How do you think he is getting on with smashing the gangs? 🤔

I'll be honest and say it's not an issue I'm massively close to as I'm bored of the usual debate on the issue. Im never going to agree with reform as long as Farage is there. I did mention in my post, about mis information and Farage is the king of this. He showed this during the referendum and I'm at a point where I tune his stupidity out. 

 

From what I do know, I think it's an issue that is yet to be fixed. I don't think there is an easy answer to it and I think it's only something that will be fixed with time. A year is **** all in politics, so far it goes under the category of must do better but I don't think it's any worse than this time last year regardless of what certain politicians want you to believe. 

 

If anyone truly thought everything would be fixed after just a year in power, they are stupid and delusional. Does my life feel a bit better than this time last year, yes, not by a huge amount but certainly better than pre election with the Tory party. 

[leicsmac]

50 minutes ago, urban.spaceman said:

I've mentioned it before on here for sure but I left the country in January 2016 before Cameron formally called the referendum and returned on the 24th of June, without having the opportunity to register to vote cos they'd made it impossible to do so while travelling, and without seeing any debates or news coverage, and being completely dialled out of social media etc. Leicester winning the league was also another major distraction of course.

 

So I missed the 6 months worth of campaigning, publicity, discussions, etc. Practically anything to do with Brexit, I missed out on cos I was having the time of my ****ing life. The first time I realised something was wrong was when the South African news channels were reporting that a British MP had been murdered. 

 

The country had completely changed when I arrived home. It was bewildering the and still is bewildering now. 

 

What the **** happened to this country in those 6 months? It's been relentless chaos ever since. What the **** happened?

It wasn't just the UK, either. Around that time things started to get pushed to 11 in other places, too. 

 

As for what happened or exactly how it happened, I have no idea. Which is frustrating because getting a bead on exactly how we ended up here is critical to addressing it going forward. 

[bovril]

1 hour ago, urban.spaceman said:

What the **** happened to this country in those 6 months? It's been relentless chaos ever since. What the **** happened?

British political discourse from like 2012-2016 was full of the looniest shit you've ever heard. And plenty of anti immigrant stuff too, it was just directed towards Europeans and thus seen as more acceptable. I actually think it calmed down a little after 2016 as people took stock after Brexit.

Edited 13 August 2025 by bovril

[leicsmac]

Another thing to add. 

 

Everything, including the political, appears to have become so much more personal. And far too many people conflate the "personal" with "always important".

[CornwallFox]

We have gb news, the telegraph and a huge social media bot presence force feeding the masses near 24/7 coverage of immigrants in hotels. Immigration has always been a lightening rod issue for the right and they've successfully weaponised the small boats issue - as the tories intended when they stopped processing claims I might add - to the huge benefit of Reform (who the tories didn't see coming). But with that comes an ability to feed the masses right wing rhetoric on a whole host of other issues such as net zero, taxing wealth etc

 

The problem on the left is that the small boats issue is a problem that needs fixing - but while labour is following the media narrative on that issue its also following it on all the others. They are terrible at calling out the right on issues such as economics and climate change where taxing wealth and net zero are absolutely the right policies. So we end up with the most extreme right wing narrative imaginable going unchallenged. 

[urban.spaceman]

1 hour ago, The Doctor said:

honestly the problem with this is it's frequently used to argue that labour are centrists. Maybe relative to UK politics they are but if that's the case, when a labour PM is saying the sort of things that used to get you kicked out of the Tories for being too racist, then UK politics has mired itself in and normalised the far right.

Like what?

[The Doctor]

2 minutes ago, urban.spaceman said:

Like what?

Literally 3 months ago when he put out his immigration stance that directly lifted from Enoch Powell's Rivers of Blood speech, that got Powell kicked out of the Tories by Heath.

[Tommy G]

2 hours ago, Free Falling Foxes said:

Oh dear. Another person making a living online and shouting from the rooftops about it.

I work in a school and too many students, when asked what they wish to do when they leave school, say they are going to be an online gamer or 'influencer'.

But online gamers and influencers can make plenty of £££ - even in the short term, you don't need to make a 40 year career out of it

[Greg2607]

1 minute ago, Tommy G said:

But online gamers and influencers can make plenty of £££ - even in the short term, you don't need to make a 40 year career out of it

Submitting "Bonnie Blue" Into evidence...... 

[bovril]

1 hour ago, leicsmac said:

It wasn't just the UK, either. Around that time things started to get pushed to 11 in other places, too. 

My own theory which I am honing into a 10,000 word essay I will submit to the LRB is that a lot of it is simply parochial, monolingual Anglophones coming into contact via social media with a variety of opinions that contradict their own, which drove them insane. 

Edited 13 August 2025 by bovril

[leicsmac]

Just now, bovril said:

My own theory which I am honing into a 10,000 word essay I will submit to the LRB is that a lot of it is simply parochial, monolingual Anglophones coming into contact via social media with a variety of opinions that contradict their own, which drove them insane. 

*plays Colonel speech from end of Metal Gear Solid 2 again*

 

"The world is being engulfed in 'truth'".

 

It's as plausible a theory as any tbh. 

 

[Muzzy_no7]

6 hours ago, The Doctor said:

as I don't know all 60m people in the UK, obviously it's a tiny proportion of data, however frankly I've had enough experiences and know enough people who've had enough experiences to know that the police aren't interested in protecting people, just property. Hell, there's a reason why a lot of feminists say that rape has been effectively decriminalised in the UK with it's abysmally low conviction rates and it's not because the police are listening to victims and investigating that henious crime

Low conviction rates? Direct your anger towards the courts and CPS. 
 

Police aren’t interested in protecting people? Jesus wept you are a lost cause. 

[urban.spaceman]

1 hour ago, The Doctor said:

Literally 3 months ago when he put out his immigration stance that directly lifted from Enoch Powell's Rivers of Blood speech, that got Powell kicked out of the Tories by Heath.

Which brings me back to my original post. 

 

15 hours ago, urban.spaceman said:

People on the left think Labour are on the far right. People on the right think Labour are on the far left. 

 

I'm honestly just tired of the hysteria, the misinformation and the bullshit.
 

It's like we're addicted to chaos. 

That speech didn't lift or quote anything from Powell's speech. They were completely different speeches arguing completely different things. 

 

I'm so ****ing tired of these extremes, I really am. 

 

[SpacedX]

1 hour ago, The Doctor said:

Literally 3 months ago when he put out his immigration stance that directly lifted from Enoch Powell's Rivers of Blood speech, that got Powell kicked out of the Tories by Heath.

That's a hell of a stretch and simply not true. 

 

The irony being however, that much of the recent rhetoric coming from the government concerning in particular, asylum, boats arriving, smashing the gangs, and international study visas has clearly been to appease the populist voter gravitating to Reform and an attempt to stem the rise of nationalistic sentiment playing into the hands of the far right. 

[leicsmac]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cz71rp7yn05o

 

The wife of South Korea's jailed former president, Yoon Suk Yeol, has been arrested over a raft of charges, including stock manipulation and bribery.

Former first lady Kim Keon Hee denied all charges during a four-hour court hearing in Seoul on Tuesday. But the court issued a detention warrant, citing the risk that she may destroy evidence.

South Korea has a history of former presidents being indicted and imprisoned. However, this is the first time both the former president and former first lady have been jailed.

Yoon was detained in January to face trial over a failed martial law bid last year that plunged the country into chaos and eventually led to his ouster.

Prosecutors say Kim, 52, made over 800 million won ($577,940; £428,000) by participating in a price-rigging scheme involving the stocks of Deutsch Motors, a BMW dealer in South Korea. 

 

The SK's don't tend to mess around when it comes to corrupt politics. 

[Free Falling Foxes]

This would happen whilst my laptop is in for repair. I'm trying to convince Mrs.FFF it's a total coincidence. 

[urban.spaceman]

3 hours ago, The Doctor said:

aside from all the themes of it you mean. The whole island of strangers stuff is invoking the exact same attitudes as in Powell's Rivers of Blood speech. They were not arguing different things, they were born out of the same attitudes and the actual extremism is in trying to normalise those views.

I honestly couldn't disagree more. 

 

3 hours ago, The Doctor said:

aside from all the themes of it you mean.

Powell was talking about immigrants from the Commonwealth being a racial threat to the native white population, predicting inevitable racial conflict and bloodshed in the future just by their mere existence in this country. Starmer didn't say anything near to that and it really is offensive to suggest he did. He argued the opposite about immigration in fact, saying:

 

"Migration is part of Britain’s national story. We talked last week about the great rebuilding of this country after the war; migrants were part of that, and they make a massive contribution today. You will never hear me denigrate that."

“Britain must compete for the best talent in the world in science, in technology, in healthcare.”

 

What his speech set out was reforming a system that had been deliberately broken by the Tories and Brexit, bringing down immigration to a sustainable level after the Tories more than quadrupled it, and restricting access to people with skills in areas the economy actually needs.

 

That couldn't be more different from what Powell said. 

 

One was warning of an existential racial threat by blaming immigrants' even being here as the problem; the other is literally celebrating and welcoming migration but in terms that actively benefit our country's economy and social cohesion, blaming the broken system for the problems we face and not people migrating here. 

 

I struggle to see what's wrong with that. 

 

3 hours ago, The Doctor said:

The whole island of strangers stuff is invoking the exact same attitudes as in Powell's Rivers of Blood speech.

Where?

 

Seriously, where? What am I missing?

 

"Let me put it this way: Nations depend on rules – fair rules. Sometimes they’re written down, often they’re not, but either way, they give shape to our values. They guide us towards our rights, of course, but also our responsibilities, the obligations we owe to one another. Now, in a diverse nation like ours, and I celebrate that, these rules become even more important. Without them, we risk becoming an island of strangers, not a nation that walks forward together."

 

'Island of strangers' refers to US, what WE would become to each other if the rules that shaped our values were not kept in tact. That's nothing to do with migration or immigrants, that's about the system itself, about the structure of our society that has been literally been broken down over the last 14 years by the Tories in an act of deliberate ideological sabotage. 

 

3 hours ago, The Doctor said:

They were not arguing different things, they were born out of the same attitudes and the actual extremism is in trying to normalise those views.

They were arguing completely different things, with completely opposing ideological standpoints, painting very, very different pictures about Britain's future. 

 

I wish I could see what you see but on the other hand I'm glad I don't. I go back to my original point - I'm so ****ing tired of everything in our culture being framed on the extremes of left and right. It needs to stop. 

[leicsmac]

12 minutes ago, urban.spaceman said:

I honestly couldn't disagree more. 

 

Powell was talking about immigrants from the Commonwealth being a racial threat to the native white population, predicting inevitable racial conflict and bloodshed in the future just by their mere existence in this country. Starmer didn't say anything near to that and it really is offensive to suggest he did. He argued the opposite about immigration in fact, saying:

 

"Migration is part of Britain’s national story. We talked last week about the great rebuilding of this country after the war; migrants were part of that, and they make a massive contribution today. You will never hear me denigrate that."

“Britain must compete for the best talent in the world in science, in technology, in healthcare.”

 

What his speech set out was reforming a system that had been deliberately broken by the Tories and Brexit, bringing down immigration to a sustainable level after the Tories more than quadrupled it, and restricting access to people with skills in areas the economy actually needs.

 

That couldn't be more different from what Powell said. 

 

One was warning of an existential racial threat by blaming immigrants' even being here as the problem; the other is literally celebrating and welcoming migration but in terms that actively benefit our country's economy and social cohesion, blaming the broken system for the problems we face and not people migrating here. 

 

I struggle to see what's wrong with that. 

 

Where?

 

Seriously, where? What am I missing?

 

"Let me put it this way: Nations depend on rules – fair rules. Sometimes they’re written down, often they’re not, but either way, they give shape to our values. They guide us towards our rights, of course, but also our responsibilities, the obligations we owe to one another. Now, in a diverse nation like ours, and I celebrate that, these rules become even more important. Without them, we risk becoming an island of strangers, not a nation that walks forward together."

 

'Island of strangers' refers to US, what WE would become to each other if the rules that shaped our values were not kept in tact. That's nothing to do with migration or immigrants, that's about the system itself, about the structure of our society that has been literally been broken down over the last 14 years by the Tories in an act of deliberate ideological sabotage. 

 

They were arguing completely different things, with completely opposing ideological standpoints, painting very, very different pictures about Britain's future. 

 

I wish I could see what you see but on the other hand I'm glad I don't. I go back to my original point - I'm so ****ing tired of everything in our culture being framed on the extremes of left and right. It needs to stop. 

The divisions you talk of here do have to stop, or at least be mitigated. That is a matter of necessity. 

[bovril]

Agree that Britain's political discourse is absolutely exhausting and it's also remarkable how many people have internalized the idea that things they don't like (mostly immigration) is the fault of Labour. Cognitive dissonance I guess.

[MaidstoneFox]

3 hours ago, bovril said:

Agree that Britain's political discourse is absolutely exhausting and it's also remarkable how many people have internalized the idea that things they don't like (mostly immigration) is the fault of Labour. Cognitive dissonance I guess.

Don't want to go into social history too much here, but the main thing that has changed is the means of communication and the incredible speed of the news cycle. Yesterday's news used to be tomorrow's chip paper, but now it's constantly updated and from multiple sources. Immigration has always and will always be a fuse for social unrest and a gateway for political opportunists. Labour is I think more seen as a political elite or autocratic non-ideological government now by lots of people, whereas in the past they had closer trade union and traditional working class roots. In that sense they are seen as interchangeable and just as complicit for immigration problems as the previous government.