Relegation, League 1, financial implications

[wurmer]

1 hour ago, Blue ROI said:

I'd take Mike Flowers Pops over the useless Nepo Baby

I'd have Jimmy Saville backed up by Rolf Harris as DOF over this lot

 

 

Edited 21 April by wurmer

[Tommy G]

2 hours ago, Terraloon said:

Costs such as rates, utilities, insurance, away travel cost around £500k a week.

 

At one point, admittedly a few years ago we were told that the KP was costing £5m a year.

 

 

OK but none of that is relevant to the training ground costing £1m a week, which it isn't, lets not get carried away

[5waller5]

2 hours ago, Terraloon said:

Costs such as rates, utilities, insurance, away travel cost around £500k a week.

 

At one point, admittedly a few years ago we were told that the KP was costing £5m a year.

 

 

£500k / month possibly… but absolutely not a chance it’s £500k/ week.

 

Away travel is also not a Seagrave cost.

[Filberts lovechild]

My mate who’s fairly in the know at Forest says rumours are they are looking at buying our training ground

[Wasyls Pec Deck]

11 minutes ago, Filberts lovechild said:

My mate who’s fairly in the know at Forest says rumours are they are looking at buying our training ground

Surely not… 🤣 Aiyawatt’s credibility is at an all time low and only going in one direction, but that is something the thicko’s who “support the famleh” could level with as being totally unacceptable.

 

While it will be expensive, it’s also attractive to potential buyers and it’s also the way out of the holes he’s dug for us as we need a pipeline of top youth talent.

Edited 21 April by Wasyls Pec Deck

[Terraloon]

3 hours ago, CUJimmy said:

I took it directly from the EFL documentation on their website so I am pretty confident what I said is correct.  We can spend all of what we get in from transfers but only a percentage of other income/investment.  The percentage we can spend drops still further if we were relegated to league 2.  I am not sure what happens to the loan advance either but as the basis for compliance is not spending more than 75% of revenue on player related items rather than overall losses it probably just falls into the other 25% so might not be relevant.  Obviously there is a huge risk in using transfer money to pay wages because you can only do that once.  It’s like selling your family silver to pay the leccy bill.  Whichever way you cut it though it’s a shitshow.

The explanation of how what can and can’t be factored into the relevant income is from page 221 on

https://images.gc.eflservices.co.uk/762f3040-324d-11f0-9fd8-e5dd74a69822.pdf

[Terraloon]

2 hours ago, 5waller5 said:

£500k / month possibly… but absolutely not a chance it’s £500k/ week.

 

Away travel is also not a Seagrave cost.

I said this

 

”

Costs such as rates, utilities, insurance, away travel cost around £500k a week. These are included in the administrative costs part in the accounts

 

At one point, admittedly a few years ago we were told that the KP was costing £5m a year.”

 

Indeed other words all those little bits and pieces, including away travel, cost £500k a week

 

see the section I have copied from the accounts

 

 

Edited 21 April by Terraloon

[reynard]

23 hours ago, 5waller5 said:

I thought I realised how grim it’s going to be… but then read this and realised I was probably too optimistic!!

 

Personally I now think we’re in the 5000/1 territory to avoid administration

Possibly though the money is owed to the banks fortunately and not yet to HMRC.  If they force us into administration the banks will probably not get all their money back.  Of course we could just run out of money for the day to day running of the club which would be another situation altogether.

[splinterdream]

[SafewayFox]

In really simple terms, with Top being a stubborn moron and not selling/looking for investors.

 

Is there a way that we actually survive financially?

[foxfanazer]

Top personally being in financial ruin would soften the blow a little bit 

Edited 22 April by foxfanazer

[Rubbersoul]

44 minutes ago, foxfanazer said:

Top personally being in financial ruin would soften blow a bit 

Hasn’t he basically been pushed to the side in running King Power? 

[cityfanlee23]

Bournemouth need a new ground... We need a smaller one.... Trade?

[Globalfox]

22 hours ago, CUJimmy said:

I took it directly from the EFL documentation on their website so I am pretty confident what I said is correct.  We can spend all of what we get in from transfers but only a percentage of other income/investment.  The percentage we can spend drops still further if we were relegated to league 2.  I am not sure what happens to the loan advance either but as the basis for compliance is not spending more than 75% of revenue on player related items rather than overall losses it probably just falls into the other 25% so might not be relevant.  Obviously there is a huge risk in using transfer money to pay wages because you can only do that once.  It’s like selling your family silver to pay the leccy bill.  Whichever way you cut it though it’s a shitshow.

You are not wrong but it gets complex. We cannot use any revenue generated outside of match days. We cannot include revenue from women’s games but women’s team cost seems murky. Inputs by owner are restricted. Using sales revenue as one year cash flow would be tricky and yes if we do not get promoted it gets harder. The CEO alluded to these challenges and only ‘certain’ income counting at last week’s FCC meeting. The will be relying on the last parachute payments that they are already leveraging. Right now they should be focusing on maximizing revenue but I think they are lost.

[SemperEadem]

Town being even more on it’s arse.

You really would not have known there was a match on last night.

[HankMarvin]

 

[Terraloon]

1 hour ago, Globalfox said:

You are not wrong but it gets complex. We cannot use any revenue generated outside of match days. We cannot include revenue from women’s games but women’s team cost seems murky. Inputs by owner are restricted. Using sales revenue as one year cash flow would be tricky and yes if we do not get promoted it gets harder. The CEO alluded to these challenges and only ‘certain’ income counting at last week’s FCC meeting. The will be relying on the last parachute payments that they are already leveraging. Right now they should be focusing on maximizing revenue but I think they are lost.

Did he specifically mention that the 26/27 parachute payments will count? 
 

Why I ask is because my interpretation is  because the 26/27 part a payment has been “ leveraged” then I am far from sure it will count in terms of revenue in 26/27

[Grebfromgrebland]

We need the monks back and maybe convert most of seagrave into a monastery.

 

Without divine intervention were fooked

[Globalfox]

1 hour ago, Terraloon said:

Did he specifically mention that the 26/27 parachute payments will count? 
 

Why I ask is because my interpretation is  because the 26/27 part a payment has been “ leveraged” then I am far from sure it will count in terms of revenue in 26/27

Yes he specifically said the last payment would count. I think it’s in the subtlety of the advance wording the bank provided an agreed facility. That means that funds are available to drawdown against. Now when you read the EFL manual (yes I know it’s 240 pages) it does address parachute payments as being allowed as revenue. I will say that there is a lot of differences from the Championship so not sure even the club will know. The telling words for me was when he made it clear only some revenue counts. I believe they have only weeks to provide their SMCP projection so I am sure much scrambling going on.

[Terraloon]

20 minutes ago, Globalfox said:

Yes he specifically said the last payment would count. I think it’s in the subtlety of the advance wording the bank provided an agreed facility. That means that funds are available to drawdown against. Now when you read the EFL manual (yes I know it’s 240 pages) it does address parachute payments as being allowed as revenue. I will say that there is a lot of differences from the Championship so not sure even the club will know. The telling words for me was when he made it clear only some revenue counts. I believe they have only weeks to provide their SMCP projection so I am sure much scrambling going on.

Why I ask is because in the SMCP guidance it says this. I would add I am not sure what the definition of forward finance is although this is what AI says”

Forward financing (or forward funding) in football refers to a financial structure where clubs borrow money against guaranteed future revenues—such as transfer installments, central broadcasting funds, or parachute payments—to secure immediate cash flow for operations or player acquisitions

 

 

1.16 Forward Financing:

1.16.1 Distributions - If Premier League Distributions which are relevant to the Reporting Period (a

Parachute Payment for example) have been received by the Club in Cash in a prior Reporting

Period as a result of ‘forward financing’’, the amounts received in the earlier period may not be

included in the calculation of Relevant Turnover.

Guidance:

If a Club is relegated from the Premier League at the end of Season;

Competes in the Championship is Season 2024/25 but is relegated to League One at the end of that

Season; and

Forward finances 100% of its Year 1 Parachute Payment from the Premier League and 70% of its Year 2

Parachute Payment, receiving those amounts during Season 2025/26

IT FOLLOWS THAT

The Club will only be able to include 30% of the Year 2 Parachute Payment within the calculation for

Relevant Turnover for Season 2026/27, its first in League One.

 

 

Edited 22 April by Terraloon

[Terraloon]

On 21/04/2026 at 15:59, Tommy G said:

OK but none of that is relevant to the training ground costing £1m a week, which it isn't, lets not get carried away

But it does make the point that the claim of £1m per week can not be backed up by what we do know as fact

[Globalfox]

43 minutes ago, Terraloon said:

Why I ask is because in the SMCP guidance it says this. I would add I am not sure what the definition of forward finance is although this is what AI says”

Forward financing (or forward funding) in football refers to a financial structure where clubs borrow money against guaranteed future revenues—such as transfer installments, central broadcasting funds, or parachute payments—to secure immediate cash flow for operations or player acquisitions

 

 

1.16 Forward Financing:

1.16.1 Distributions - If Premier League Distributions which are relevant to the Reporting Period (a

Parachute Payment for example) have been received by the Club in Cash in a prior Reporting

Period as a result of ‘forward financing’’, the amounts received in the earlier period may not be

included in the calculation of Relevant Turnover.

Guidance:

If a Club is relegated from the Premier League at the end of Season;

Competes in the Championship is Season 2024/25 but is relegated to League One at the end of that

Season; and

Forward finances 100% of its Year 1 Parachute Payment from the Premier League and 70% of its Year 2

Parachute Payment, receiving those amounts during Season 2025/26

IT FOLLOWS THAT

The Club will only be able to include 30% of the Year 2 Parachute Payment within the calculation for

Relevant Turnover for Season 2026/27, its first in League One.

 

 

Yes it may be a percentage as per the books the bit we do not know is actual dates or amounts. I have my own doubts but he was emphatic about it. Be sure if later it turns out not to be true I will be the first to call him out.

[Chrysalis]

Just cashed out my winnings, thanks Top.

[Chrysalis]

4 hours ago, Globalfox said:

You are not wrong but it gets complex. We cannot use any revenue generated outside of match days. We cannot include revenue from women’s games but women’s team cost seems murky. Inputs by owner are restricted. Using sales revenue as one year cash flow would be tricky and yes if we do not get promoted it gets harder. The CEO alluded to these challenges and only ‘certain’ income counting at last week’s FCC meeting. The will be relying on the last parachute payments that they are already leveraging. Right now they should be focusing on maximizing revenue but I think they are lost.

They just should do a one big hit on the upcoming year accounts, clear it all in one year.
Aggressive reduction of salaries and player sales, if not achieved due to no taker sor players refusing, pay the contracts off and just get them out the club.
Recruit players from that point forward on proper affordable wage structure, with high earners out of club it gets rid of discontent with wage inequality.

A big PSR hit in one year imo is less point deduction than smaller ones in consecutive years.  Also less bad PR.

[Wink84]

3 hours ago, Grebfromgrebland said:

We need the monks back and maybe convert most of seagrave into a monastery.

 

Without divine intervention were fooked

He goes back to Man City at the end of the season mate