Student Season Tickets

[Father Ted]

Oh you spotted me missing a 'u' off the end of a word? And called me sad for spotting your effort in trying to make up a word?

yourself is one word by the way you thick hypocrite.

Don't worry mate, the best argument that flowwolf and lcfcstu can come up with against us spotting grammatical errors. Leave them to it.

[yorkie1999]

Don't worry mate, the best argument that flowwolf and lcfcstu can come up with against us spotting grammatical errors. Leave them to it.

And being arrogant cvnts that think the club owes them a favour by offering cheaper tickets whereas the reality is you're an adult, take up the same bum space as every other adult and therefore should have to pay the same price or learn to live in the real world and decide what is more important, your edu or your phone contract, Internet access and your football.

[The Year Of The Fox]

Don't worry mate, the best argument that flowwolf and lcfcstu can come up with against us spotting grammatical errors. Leave them to it.

It's basic grammar pal, something that anyone with a half decent GCSE grade should know.

Go back and read through all of posts on this thread. So many points I've made have remained unanswered.

What you want basically is a discounted ticket due to the fact that you can't be arsed to get some form of part time job, yet don't see why you should make sacrifices in order to help yourself. You believe you deserve a discount on the back of that you may one day achieve greatness. Fine, one day you may do. But right now you're just a spotty teenager (or slightly older) who has done nothing in life to date. You are no better than someone who left school at 16.

The arrogance some of you come out with is embarrassing. 'We're all thick', 'brains the size of peas', 'failures in life', 'stuck in dead end jobs', 'I'll never have to worry about being able to afford a season ticket when I graduate'

Bloody hell, for your own sakes hope everyone at the Uni's you're going to are as jumped up as yourself, else you may find someone with dislike of tossers pulls your head down from the cloud in ways you could never imagine.

[The Year Of The Fox]

Suppose I'll have to wait a few hours for a reply now. You're probably all still out on the piss.

[flowwolf]

Suppose I'll have to wait a few hours for a reply now. You're probably all still out on the piss.

Or actually studying ? :D :D :D

[flowwolf]

Oh you spotted me missing a 'u' off the end of a word? And called me sad for spotting your effort in trying to make up a word?

yourself is one word by the way you thick hypocrite.

It was elementary my dear Watson ! :D :D

As I have already said your whinging and whining is irrelevant, the club has rumbled you and your ilk . The party is over.

Now run along and get your fantastic life changing qualifications so you can start at your local B&Q stacking shelves with the other ex students. Then you can stand proud and buy your season ticket at the same price as anyone else and not have everyone taking the piss. :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

[flowwolf]

Don't worry mate, the best argument that flowwolf and lcfcstu can come up with against us spotting grammatical errors. Leave them to it.

Just a thought but is Ted short for tedious ? oh and shouldn't there be "is" between us and spotting ?

I guess your not taking English then ? :D :D

[Father Ted]

It's basic grammar pal, something that anyone with a half decent GCSE grade should know.

Go back and read through all of posts on this thread. So many points I've made have remained unanswered.

What you want basically is a discounted ticket due to the fact that you can't be arsed to get some form of part time job, yet don't see why you should make sacrifices in order to help yourself. You believe you deserve a discount on the back of that you may one day achieve greatness. Fine, one day you may do. But right now you're just a spotty teenager (or slightly older) who has done nothing in life to date. You are no better than someone who left school at 16.

The arrogance some of you come out with is embarrassing. 'We're all thick', 'brains the size of peas', 'failures in life', 'stuck in dead end jobs', 'I'll never have to worry about being able to afford a season ticket when I graduate'

Bloody hell, for your own sakes hope everyone at the Uni's you're going to are as jumped up as yourself, else you may find someone with dislike of tossers pulls your head down from the cloud in ways you could never imagine.

Says you, the one who said you would love to see Dylan living on the streets in years to come you sick cvnt. If you really want to go through what I've achieved in life so far then you'll be shocked, I've done a lot more for my community, charities and personal qualifications than you can ever wish for. So get ****ed, I couldn't give two shits what GCSE grades you got or anybody else got for that matter but if you're so interested I can send you my CV via PM? What do you reckon? I can even give your buddies a taster too...

Your such a hypocrite too, I remember when you first came on to this forum, your SPAG was attrocious and you were constantly grilled about it. If you want to get even more personal, I seem to remember the big deal that you made about a parking fine when you were in the wrong, in fact I may have to dig that thread up to show what an absolute hypocrite you are.

[MarshallForEngland]

I am sorry for the length of this contribution; I have been absent for several days (studying for exams believe it or not). Will have to split the post up because of the limited number of quote blocks I am allowed.

I am disappointed in what this discussion has turned into. There seems to be a distinct lack of compassion towards students, and even some of the "safe" generalisations that have been made (inexperience of youth, lack of knowledge about real world, inability to grasp adult issues and responsibilities etc) are indicative of a level of ignorance I went to University to escape.

All very interesting but I wont salute you I can't stand another rejection . Has it ever crossed you youthful mind that people who pay the full price of a ticket are actually subsidizing the concessionary ? As for the pensioners they have done their bit towards society laddie paying years of tax while you have a life time of work ahead of you. Believe me they have had no concessions when they were young.

Isn't this exactly the type of "probable" (as opposed to fact) to which you refer in your next post? You have no real evidence for any of what you've just said.

Do you deny the existence of pensioners who have never worked? Do you not acknowledge that your age group is among the most financially burdensome in society? If you want to argue on the basis of a net-gain tax contribution, what is your response to the estimated £2billion a year that trips and falls amongst the over 70s cost the NHS every year?

Needless to say, this is a ludicrous argument and I would have to be cruel and monstrous to believe that this mattered, but it is the logical extreme of what you are saying. To claim that “pensioners…have done their bit towards society [by] paying years of tax” is a weak argument because a significant majority of us will die having cost more money for tax-funded institutions than we have contributed.

In fact, as others have stated, somebody with a career in which they use their degree will be more likely to fit into a higher tax band and therefore pay more income tax; their additional cash will also generate tax revenue when it is spent or invested. You identify this as a “probable”, but it exists as such in exactly the same way your “probable” about senior citizens does. You cannot consume your cake and still possess it.

Will you also answer my question from before? Would you be in favour of removing the concession (which presumably you accept with unabashed fervour, if not at LCFC then certainly at every opportunity where a senior discount is offered) because other people your age have decided to carry on working instead of retiring? Your answer should be no (I am in favour of senior concessions), but if it’s not then you’re being inconsistent.

So as someone who still pays the full price of a ticket can you explain why I should subsidise a student to go to a football match ? It's not as if it is an essentiality for your health or well being is it ? which is what subsidising should be about .

Forgive me for sounding patronising, but don't use financial terms if you don't know what they mean. If you insist on using the term “subsidy” (it’s not really a subsidy but I will grant you that it is to show why what you’re saying is daft) then try to think about why subsidies occur in real life. They can be used to maintain competition, to stabilise prices, to stimulate job growth etc. Do you see what each of those things have in common? They all represent a long-term economic goal despite the short-term deficit in funds they may induce.

Do you not see the obvious parallels? Concessionary prices for students represent a long-term investment. For a short period of time they are unable to contribute to the coffers as much as their working counterparts, but they are more likely to earn a higher salary with more surplus cash later, thus being more lucrative to the club than the person who spends his entire life on minimum wage (I mean no disrespect to anybody who does this).

So come on tax dodger and explain exactly why I should susidise you to go to a football match.

You have no idea how much tax I pay or have paid. I have worked since I was 15, left school to go into full time work and now attend University full time as a “mature student” (I am 23). My loans don’t cover accommodation. I work part time at weekends to make up the rest of the rent that the loans don’t cover, with a bit left over for food.

As stated before, your “tax” argument is weak for the reason that student are statistically likely to contribute more tax revenue than non-students, and virtually every one of us will cost far more to tax-funded services than we contribute.

Oh dear it has become so boring. Come on you so called educated ones I will ask the question one more time , Why do you think your tickets to a Leicester city match should cost you less than anyone else is paying ? it is not a hard question considering your educational backgrounds so come on then explain why ? and please don't continue with the side tracking on the issue . Give us your reason.

1. Lack of purchasing power

2. Long-term investment

3. Fills some of the 10,000 empty seats which are empty every week (which will almost certainly increase as students and others are priced out)

All those complaining about the price hike are missing the point. Every one of us live within our means. Just because I may be on more money than a student doesn't mean I have more spare money. What will happen when you graduate? You'll buy a house at some point. The house will probably be proportionate to the wage you earn. A bigger house means more council tax as an example.

Unless you end up in a job where you're being paid stupid money its very unlikely that you'll ever be in a position where you can easily afford a season ticket. Especially when you have the student loan to pay back. Thats why people aren't sympathising too much. Everyone on here will budget their money to some extent.

Clearly I cannot speak for every other student, but from my own personal experience I would much rather be the financial position I was before I went to University than the one I am in now.

I actually don’t agree that people’s motives are founded on logic and reason to that extent either. As much as I hate to say it (because I think it’s unjustified) there seems to be an inferiority complex with some of the people here. They appear to be motivated by bitterness and resentment at the decision of some people to go to University, and feel a bit insecure when confronted with somebody who is embarking on a more traditionally academic career. There is no need to feel this way in my opinion, but I guess it’s a natural response when feeling intimidated.

Its a bit of a myth about going to uni anyway. Granted there will be some graduates one day earning big money. My brother graduated from his architect degree last year. What does he do currently? Works at Halfords and Wickes.

Everybody knows at least one person like this, almost certainly more than one in fact. And everybody knows several people who have no University education but manage to earn plenty of money nonetheless. We tend to notice these exceptions more precisely because they are anomalous. As has been demonstrated here already, generally speaking graduates command higher salaries.

Great point again

As much as you may hate to hear it but graduates on good degrees will be earning on average 11k more than those without a degree, therefore paying a higher tax band and contributing overall more to the country over their working lives. Just because students may contribute nothing/very little during their 3/4 years at uni, they will contribute a lot more over a lifetime, so perhaps your the tax dodger?

Tru dat.

That's the point. Its not fact. (certainly not in my case anyway) Unless you're planning on living with mum n dad after graduating you'll never have as much spare cash as you do now.

Yes it was sarcasm. Going to uni does not automatically make you more intelligent than those who didn't go. Of course, some will become doctors/surgeons etc and yes they'd be rightly called heroes. I'd say though that x amount of the posters on here who think they are/will be superior than no university goers, purely because they're at Uni, will be studying a pointless subject, or got in to uni with poor grades in their pointless A Level subject.

A local artist (I can’t remember his name but with retrospectively credit him when I remember) sings that if you generalise it’s general lies

[The Year Of The Fox]

Says you, the one who said you would love to see Dylan living on the streets in years to come you sick cvnt. If you really want to go through what I've achieved in life so far then you'll be shocked, I've done a lot more for my community, charities and personal qualifications than you can ever wish for. So get ****ed, I couldn't give two shits what GCSE grades you got or anybody else got for that matter but if you're so interested I can send you my CV via PM? What do you reckon? I can even give your buddies a taster too...

Your such a hypocrite too, I remember when you first came on to this forum, your SPAG was attrocious and you were constantly grilled about it. If you want to get even more personal, I seem to remember the big deal that you made about a parking fine when you were in the wrong, in fact I may have to dig that thread up to show what an absolute hypocrite you are.

My spelling atrocious? Constantly grilled about it? Think you've got me confused with someone else. Funny that I first joined this forum two/three months before you did! I concede that when I use my mobile to post on, I do very rarely revert to text speak. But I certainly didn't have a mobile that I could access this forum on five years ago (when I first joined and was regularly grilled over it!!)

How do you know what I've done for charities and the community? Is this a my dick is bigger than your dick competition? The missis tells me I'm big, but I'm unsure. I feel embarassed to get it out sometimes.

A big deal over a parking fine? Yes I asked the question about it. Maybe I was in the wrong if you want to act as self righteously as you are. And well, if something so little as someone parking on a yellow line overnight makes me an arsehole then you'll fall out with a lot of people in your life. You wouldn't know yet, you probably can't drive. Incidentally I won the parking fine appeal. Before someone mentions it trying to make me feel embarassed, why not dig up the 'raghead' comment too. I'll still stand by what I said. As per though, its people judging others on something they have no experience of. (double edit) and before you say it I do have experience of students. Thankfully there aren't that many like you

[MarshallForEngland]

Well why do we get the, 'woe is me' from students then? Deal with the fecker and realise you'll always have to budget for things once you're in the big wide world.

Politically driven bullshit?

Don't like students? I don't like a lot of their attitudes certainly. Some good mates of mine are post graduates though.

Presumably you aren’t this acerbic and hostile to them? Your “big wide world” stuff is patronising. I did a foundation year at the start of my degree. It’s akin to an Access Course. The significant majority of those people were middle-aged, starting a career change. Many of them had reasonably good jobs which they were temporarily putting on hold (or reducing the number of hours they did) while they were studying. To suggest that these people know less about “the big wide world” than non-students is ludicrous.

Look at the end of the day if you cant afford something (not just a ST) you dont have it, thats life im afraid id like to go Barbados for a month but got no hope unless i win the bloody lottery and theres no hope of that

Crap analogy. To make the analogy work, the facts must be like this: The Minister for Tourism in Barbados decided that, because Barbados was only at 2 thirds of its intended tourist capacity, that he would offer concessionary rates for countries who were initiating harsh austerity measures following a recession but showed signs of economic growth, knowing that if he got them hooked on Barbados now, they would be sure to spend more money there when they had more surplus cash. It would also mean that an otherwise “untapped” market could go there, meaning the number of people there was higher, thus increasing the overall appeal of Barbados.

He says he will do this for as long as he believes the recession will last, and you (hypothetically being from one the countries he has made provisions for) enjoy a trip every year for 3 years for the concessionary price. The Germans are pissed because they have to pay full price due to their economic prosperity.

But the Minister then triples your price, making it the same as what the Germans pay, because some people were pretending to be from one of the countries covered in the scheme when they weren’t, and the administrative and logistical task of checking was too much, and the Germans complained so much that it was the divs in the economically under-performing countries that put themselves in that mess; they chose to overspend, they chose to borrow more than they could pay back, they chose to invest their cash wrongly, and even if trying to fix that now they are the ones who have chosen to enforce such stringent austerity measures limiting the amount of surplus cash around.

“Why should we subsidise them; it’s not our fault they made bad decisions!” they roared with a fervent zeal and bitterness, resentful of the idea that even though they are struggling now, the countries with a growth plan which results in a lack of disposable income for Joe Public in the immediate future but concentrates on long-term growth might one day result in a higher contribution to the global coffers than their own.

You stereo type by calling yourself a student. And while we are at can I have my tax money back because if you are a typical product of the system then we are all being had. With your IQ I wonder how you even got into University in the first place, still it keeps the unemployment figures down I suppose.

Why is it that the "intelligent" students are resorting to personal abuse whereas the non-students are attacking the posts not the poster?

Expected better from you Daggers. Look at the post I quoted immediately above (one example of many). There have been some personal insults flying on from both “sides”; don’t count the hits and not the misses

Not at all. The loans are there for a reason. If you can't afford the increase of the ST then get a job. That was what I meant.

You assume that a job creates surplus cash for students. Many students, me included, need a job just to make up the rest of accommodation cost. And I go to a University in a relatively small city. In London and the nearby counties (although there is a small increase in loan and grant size which partially accounts for the inflated prices) it is unbelievably difficult to get by on just the loans, especially if you only get the minimum amount.

Yes you will have long days at Uni judging from what you've said. But thats the price you pay. You can't make an omlette without breaking the egg! And anyway, although your days will seem long due to you presumably not being used to the hours, those days are the norm really to any working class person

This is no more than ignorance of facts. You have no idea what situation most students find themselves in. I was working 60 hour weeks before Uni, and with my job and Uni combined I easily do more than that now. I have all of the obligations I did before I went to University, except for now I have the additional burden of purchasing the books on a mandatory reading list, as well as all the materials required for the submission and completion of assignments (just one assignment cost me £15 just in printing costs plus at least that amount again in materials). That’s just one assignment, of which there are dozens in an academic year, and I do a subject which is not material-intensive (people on Fashion or Textile courses will tell you how much they spend on materials).

I have more outgoings now than I did when I was working full-time; I still have to pay rent and bills, and I still have to eat. What on earth do you think happens when you become a student?

Have the club given any reason for the increase across the board ? Will they ? We all know the rows of empty seats so a few less students is not going to make any difference. I suspect the club have looked in to the wide spread abuse of student tickets and decided to put a stop to it , and you can't blame them for that.

Mind you they surly won't won't miss out on the revenue of pies and pints in the ground because students would not be able to afford to buy them would they.

This is so short-sighted. It’s not just students that are affected by this. As a result of me not being able to go, my father won’t go (he won’t attend on his own, as it has been a father & son activity for years). As such, none of our family is going. Of course this is just one personal story and could be a unique case, but I strongly suspect that there are others in a similar situation.

You are arguing against yourself. You already acknowledge that there are rows of empty seats. Do you think that the new measures are likely to increase the number of empty seats or decrease the number of empty seats? You appear to hold the belief that the honest majority should be punished for the actions of a handful of transgressors. Is this correct?

Why should a student be allowed to have a cheap ticket to watch a match when non students who cannot afford to go suffer by being denied that same right ? you students think you are some sort of holy cow that we are all in awe of and sympathise with , Well sorry if Mr reality has tapped you on the shoulder and welcome to the real world.

So far off the mark it’s unbelievable. I am amazed that, being part of a financially burdensome minority, that you can take such an insensitive view. It’s about the purchasing power of the individual. An able adult is still able to work full time even if at the current time he has no occupation and therefore no income. A full time student cannot (in the majority of cases) work full time even if he wants to.

I have made a phone call to someone who knows why the student concession has been scrapped. Apparently many students who do not even like football have been getting a season ticket for a family member who does. The logistics for checking people are who they say they are on the day is neigh on impossible, so to put a stop to this the concessions have been scrapped. Hoisted on your own petard springs to mind.

Exactly the same thing happens with every special rate. There are people who use someone else’s senior ticket despite being below the required age. There are young-looking people in their 20s claiming to be youths. Would you advocate scrapping every concessionary rate for this reason? And if your response is that you should show your ID to prove your age, what is wrong with having to show your student ID to prove that you are a student? Once again, you want to have your cake and eat it too.

The funniest thing about this thread is the amount of bitter ***** that seem to love having a pop at students. You know what you're all a bunch of ****ing hypocrites if you needed your life saving by surgery from a doctor just remember that at one point they were a student and you'll be thanking God that they decided to be a "tax dodger", "obnoxious ****" or any of the other abusive insults some of you have chosen to throw out at students. Flowwolf especially would deserve being left to rot by a doctor, you've come across as nothing more than an abusive, old bitter human being!

I cannot disagree with any of this.

[caz05]

Presumably you aren’t this acerbic and hostile to them? Your “big wide world” stuff is patronising. I did a foundation year at the start of my degree. It’s akin to an Access Course. The significant majority of those people were middle-aged, starting a career change. Many of them had reasonably good jobs which they were temporarily putting on hold (or reducing the number of hours they did) while they were studying. To suggest that these people know less about “the big wide world” than non-students is ludicrous.

Crap analogy. To make the analogy work, the facts must be like this: The Minister for Tourism in Barbados decided that, because Barbados was only at 2 thirds of its intended tourist capacity, that he would offer concessionary rates for countries who were initiating harsh austerity measures following a recession but showed signs of economic growth, knowing that if he got them hooked on Barbados now, they would be sure to spend more money there when they had more surplus cash. It would also mean that an otherwise “untapped” market could go there, meaning the number of people there was higher, thus increasing the overall appeal of Barbados.

He says he will do this for as long as he believes the recession will last, and you (hypothetically being from one the countries he has made provisions for) enjoy a trip every year for 3 years for the concessionary price. The Germans are pissed because they have to pay full price due to their economic prosperity.

But the Minister then triples your price, making it the same as what the Germans pay, because some people were pretending to be from one of the countries covered in the scheme when they weren’t, and the administrative and logistical task of checking was too much, and the Germans complained so much that it was the divs in the economically under-performing countries that put themselves in that mess; they chose to overspend, they chose to borrow more than they could pay back, they chose to invest their cash wrongly, and even if trying to fix that now they are the ones who have chosen to enforce such stringent austerity measures limiting the amount of surplus cash around.

“Why should we subsidise them; it’s not our fault they made bad decisions!” they roared with a fervent zeal and bitterness, resentful of the idea that even though they are struggling now, the countries with a growth plan which results in a lack of disposable income for Joe Public in the immediate future but concentrates on long-term growth might one day result in a higher contribution to the global coffers than their own.

Expected better from you Daggers. Look at the post I quoted immediately above (one example of many). There have been some personal insults flying on from both “sides”; don’t count the hits and not the misses

You assume that a job creates surplus cash for students. Many students, me included, need a job just to make up the rest of accommodation cost. And I go to a University in a relatively small city. In London and the nearby counties (although there is a small increase in loan and grant size which partially accounts for the inflated prices) it is unbelievably difficult to get by on just the loans, especially if you only get the minimum amount.

This is no more than ignorance of facts. You have no idea what situation most students find themselves in. I was working 60 hour weeks before Uni, and with my job and Uni combined I easily do more than that now. I have all of the obligations I did before I went to University, except for now I have the additional burden of purchasing the books on a mandatory reading list, as well as all the materials required for the submission and completion of assignments (just one assignment cost me £15 just in printing costs plus at least that amount again in materials). That’s just one assignment, of which there are dozens in an academic year, and I do a subject which is not material-intensive (people on Fashion or Textile courses will tell you how much they spend on materials).

I have more outgoings now than I did when I was working full-time; I still have to pay rent and bills, and I still have to eat. What on earth do you think happens when you become a student?

This is so short-sighted. It’s not just students that are affected by this. As a result of me not being able to go, my father won’t go (he won’t attend on his own, as it has been a father & son activity for years). As such, none of our family is going. Of course this is just one personal story and could be a unique case, but I strongly suspect that there are others in a similar situation.

You are arguing against yourself. You already acknowledge that there are rows of empty seats. Do you think that the new measures are likely to increase the number of empty seats or decrease the number of empty seats? You appear to hold the belief that the honest majority should be punished for the actions of a handful of transgressors. Is this correct?

So far off the mark it’s unbelievable. I am amazed that, being part of a financially burdensome minority, that you can take such an insensitive view. It’s about the purchasing power of the individual. An able adult is still able to work full time even if at the current time he has no occupation and therefore no income. A full time student cannot (in the majority of cases) work full time even if he wants to.

Exactly the same thing happens with every special rate. There are people who use someone else’s senior ticket despite being below the required age. There are young-looking people in their 20s claiming to be youths. Would you advocate scrapping every concessionary rate for this reason? And if your response is that you should show your ID to prove your age, what is wrong with having to show your student ID to prove that you are a student? Once again, you want to have your cake and eat it too.

I cannot disagree with any of this.

You my dear either have too much time on your hands or you need to get laid

[The Year Of The Fox]

Presumably you aren’t this acerbic and hostile to them? Your “big wide world” stuff is patronising. I did a foundation year at the start of my degree. It’s akin to an Access Course. The significant majority of those people were middle-aged, starting a career change. Many of them had reasonably good jobs which they were temporarily putting on hold (or reducing the number of hours they did) while they were studying. To suggest that these people know less about “the big wide world” than non-students is ludicrous.

Crap analogy. To make the analogy work, the facts must be like this: The Minister for Tourism in Barbados decided that, because Barbados was only at 2 thirds of its intended tourist capacity, that he would offer concessionary rates for countries who were initiating harsh austerity measures following a recession but showed signs of economic growth, knowing that if he got them hooked on Barbados now, they would be sure to spend more money there when they had more surplus cash. It would also mean that an otherwise “untapped” market could go there, meaning the number of people there was higher, thus increasing the overall appeal of Barbados.

He says he will do this for as long as he believes the recession will last, and you (hypothetically being from one the countries he has made provisions for) enjoy a trip every year for 3 years for the concessionary price. The Germans are pissed because they have to pay full price due to their economic prosperity.

But the Minister then triples your price, making it the same as what the Germans pay, because some people were pretending to be from one of the countries covered in the scheme when they weren’t, and the administrative and logistical task of checking was too much, and the Germans complained so much that it was the divs in the economically under-performing countries that put themselves in that mess; they chose to overspend, they chose to borrow more than they could pay back, they chose to invest their cash wrongly, and even if trying to fix that now they are the ones who have chosen to enforce such stringent austerity measures limiting the amount of surplus cash around.

“Why should we subsidise them; it’s not our fault they made bad decisions!” they roared with a fervent zeal and bitterness, resentful of the idea that even though they are struggling now, the countries with a growth plan which results in a lack of disposable income for Joe Public in the immediate future but concentrates on long-term growth might one day result in a higher contribution to the global coffers than their own.

Expected better from you Daggers. Look at the post I quoted immediately above (one example of many). There have been some personal insults flying on from both “sides”; don’t count the hits and not the misses

You assume that a job creates surplus cash for students. Many students, me included, need a job just to make up the rest of accommodation cost. And I go to a University in a relatively small city. In London and the nearby counties (although there is a small increase in loan and grant size which partially accounts for the inflated prices) it is unbelievably difficult to get by on just the loans, especially if you only get the minimum amount.

This is no more than ignorance of facts. You have no idea what situation most students find themselves in. I was working 60 hour weeks before Uni, and with my job and Uni combined I easily do more than that now. I have all of the obligations I did before I went to University, except for now I have the additional burden of purchasing the books on a mandatory reading list, as well as all the materials required for the submission and completion of assignments (just one assignment cost me £15 just in printing costs plus at least that amount again in materials). That’s just one assignment, of which there are dozens in an academic year, and I do a subject which is not material-intensive (people on Fashion or Textile courses will tell you how much they spend on materials).

I have more outgoings now than I did when I was working full-time; I still have to pay rent and bills, and I still have to eat. What on earth do you think happens when you become a student?

This is so short-sighted. It’s not just students that are affected by this. As a result of me not being able to go, my father won’t go (he won’t attend on his own, as it has been a father & son activity for years). As such, none of our family is going. Of course this is just one personal story and could be a unique case, but I strongly suspect that there are others in a similar situation.

You are arguing against yourself. You already acknowledge that there are rows of empty seats. Do you think that the new measures are likely to increase the number of empty seats or decrease the number of empty seats? You appear to hold the belief that the honest majority should be punished for the actions of a handful of transgressors. Is this correct?

So far off the mark it’s unbelievable. I am amazed that, being part of a financially burdensome minority, that you can take such an insensitive view. It’s about the purchasing power of the individual. An able adult is still able to work full time even if at the current time he has no occupation and therefore no income. A full time student cannot (in the majority of cases) work full time even if he wants to.

Exactly the same thing happens with every special rate. There are people who use someone else’s senior ticket despite being below the required age. There are young-looking people in their 20s claiming to be youths. Would you advocate scrapping every concessionary rate for this reason? And if your response is that you should show your ID to prove your age, what is wrong with having to show your student ID to prove that you are a student? Once again, you want to have your cake and eat it too.

I cannot disagree with any of this.

Fair enough points, but the main point still stands- if a student can't afford to go its no different to a non student being unable to afford to go! Whats the big deal? They/you deserve no more than the next person

[The Year Of The Fox]

Presumably you aren’t this acerbic and hostile to them? Your “big wide world” stuff is patronising. I did a foundation year at the start of my degree. It’s akin to an Access Course. The significant majority of those people were middle-aged, starting a career change. Many of them had reasonably good jobs which they were temporarily putting on hold (or reducing the number of hours they did) while they were studying. To suggest that these people know less about “the big wide world” than non-students is ludicrous.

Crap analogy. To make the analogy work, the facts must be like this: The Minister for Tourism in Barbados decided that, because Barbados was only at 2 thirds of its intended tourist capacity, that he would offer concessionary rates for countries who were initiating harsh austerity measures following a recession but showed signs of economic growth, knowing that if he got them hooked on Barbados now, they would be sure to spend more money there when they had more surplus cash. It would also mean that an otherwise “untapped” market could go there, meaning the number of people there was higher, thus increasing the overall appeal of Barbados.

He says he will do this for as long as he believes the recession will last, and you (hypothetically being from one the countries he has made provisions for) enjoy a trip every year for 3 years for the concessionary price. The Germans are pissed because they have to pay full price due to their economic prosperity.

But the Minister then triples your price, making it the same as what the Germans pay, because some people were pretending to be from one of the countries covered in the scheme when they weren’t, and the administrative and logistical task of checking was too much, and the Germans complained so much that it was the divs in the economically under-performing countries that put themselves in that mess; they chose to overspend, they chose to borrow more than they could pay back, they chose to invest their cash wrongly, and even if trying to fix that now they are the ones who have chosen to enforce such stringent austerity measures limiting the amount of surplus cash around.

“Why should we subsidise them; it’s not our fault they made bad decisions!” they roared with a fervent zeal and bitterness, resentful of the idea that even though they are struggling now, the countries with a growth plan which results in a lack of disposable income for Joe Public in the immediate future but concentrates on long-term growth might one day result in a higher contribution to the global coffers than their own.

Expected better from you Daggers. Look at the post I quoted immediately above (one example of many). There have been some personal insults flying on from both “sides”; don’t count the hits and not the misses

You assume that a job creates surplus cash for students. Many students, me included, need a job just to make up the rest of accommodation cost. And I go to a University in a relatively small city. In London and the nearby counties (although there is a small increase in loan and grant size which partially accounts for the inflated prices) it is unbelievably difficult to get by on just the loans, especially if you only get the minimum amount.

This is no more than ignorance of facts. You have no idea what situation most students find themselves in. I was working 60 hour weeks before Uni, and with my job and Uni combined I easily do more than that now. I have all of the obligations I did before I went to University, except for now I have the additional burden of purchasing the books on a mandatory reading list, as well as all the materials required for the submission and completion of assignments (just one assignment cost me £15 just in printing costs plus at least that amount again in materials). That’s just one assignment, of which there are dozens in an academic year, and I do a subject which is not material-intensive (people on Fashion or Textile courses will tell you how much they spend on materials).

I have more outgoings now than I did when I was working full-time; I still have to pay rent and bills, and I still have to eat. What on earth do you think happens when you become a student?

This is so short-sighted. It’s not just students that are affected by this. As a result of me not being able to go, my father won’t go (he won’t attend on his own, as it has been a father & son activity for years). As such, none of our family is going. Of course this is just one personal story and could be a unique case, but I strongly suspect that there are others in a similar situation.

You are arguing against yourself. You already acknowledge that there are rows of empty seats. Do you think that the new measures are likely to increase the number of empty seats or decrease the number of empty seats? You appear to hold the belief that the honest majority should be punished for the actions of a handful of transgressors. Is this correct?

So far off the mark it’s unbelievable. I am amazed that, being part of a financially burdensome minority, that you can take such an insensitive view. It’s about the purchasing power of the individual. An able adult is still able to work full time even if at the current time he has no occupation and therefore no income. A full time student cannot (in the majority of cases) work full time even if he wants to.

Exactly the same thing happens with every special rate. There are people who use someone else’s senior ticket despite being below the required age. There are young-looking people in their 20s claiming to be youths. Would you advocate scrapping every concessionary rate for this reason? And if your response is that you should show your ID to prove your age, what is wrong with having to show your student ID to prove that you are a student? Once again, you want to have your cake and eat it too.

I cannot disagree with any of this.

Yes and no. Yes because most of them were/still are in need of haircuts. My brothers spelling was far worse than Father Teds and I still rip him for it. And no because to be fair to them I never heard them mention student discount, and their rights to get things cheaper.

[The Year Of The Fox]

Says you, the one who said you would love to see Dylan living on the streets in years to come you sick cvnt. If you really want to go through what I've achieved in life so far then you'll be shocked, I've done a lot more for my community, charities and personal qualifications than you can ever wish for. So get ****ed, I couldn't give two shits what GCSE grades you got or anybody else got for that matter but if you're so interested I can send you my CV via PM? What do you reckon? I can even give your buddies a taster too...

Your such a hypocrite too, I remember when you first came on to this forum, your SPAG was attrocious and you were constantly grilled about it. If you want to get even more personal, I seem to remember the big deal that you made about a parking fine when you were in the wrong, in fact I may have to dig that thread up to show what an absolute hypocrite you are.

*cough*

Huh?

[Father Ted]

My spelling atrocious? Constantly grilled about it? Think you've got me confused with someone else. Funny that I first joined this forum two/three months before you did! I concede that when I use my mobile to post on, I do very rarely revert to text speak. But I certainly didn't have a mobile that I could access this forum on five years ago (when I first joined and was regularly grilled over it!!)

How do you know what I've done for charities and the community? Is this a my dick is bigger than your dick competition? The missis tells me I'm big, but I'm unsure. I feel embarassed to get it out sometimes.

A big deal over a parking fine? Yes I asked the question about it. Maybe I was in the wrong if you want to act as self righteously as you are. And well, if something so little as someone parking on a yellow line overnight makes me an arsehole then you'll fall out with a lot of people in your life. You wouldn't know yet, you probably can't drive. Incidentally I won the parking fine appeal. Before someone mentions it trying to make me feel embarassed, why not dig up the 'raghead' comment too. I'll still stand by what I said. As per though, its people judging others on something they have no experience of. (double edit) and before you say it I do have experience of students. Thankfully there aren't that many like you

You do make me laugh. I also use my mobile to post but I don't revert to text talk... what makes a mobile any different to a computer?

As for the charities/communities business, your the one belittling my achievements in life so far and now you've turned it on to me... you're the one who wanted to hear it.

Also, the parking fine has so many parallels with this situation. You were in the wrong - 100% but you got away on a technicality after moaning and saved yourself £X so why can't we moan and save ourselves a valuable £X amount? I passed my driving test 9 months ago actually but haven't driven since as 1) I can't afford a car and 2) I can't afford insurance...

People like you make me sick, really fvcking sick. You are the sort of person who goes on and on about 'ragheads' and 'immigrants stealing our jobs' but is so blinded, ignorant and thick to see any bigger picture or have a sense of self-civilisation or respect.

I'm fed up of arguing in here with you, I'm sure it's made great reading for some but I really can't be bothered to waste time on a twat like you.

Marshall For England

[Father Ted]

Yes and no. Yes because most of them were/still are in need of haircuts. My brothers spelling was far worse than Father Teds and I still rip him for it. And no because to be fair to them I never heard them mention student discount, and their rights to get things cheaper.

*Grammar - get it right please, my spelling is rather good actually and I don't need to use a spellchecker unlike you.

[The Year Of The Fox]

You do make me laugh. I also use my mobile to post but I don't revert to text talk... what makes a mobile any different to a computer?

As for the charities/communities business, your the one belittling my achievements in life so far and now you've turned it on to me... you're the one who wanted to hear it.

Also, the parking fine has so many parallels with this situation. You were in the wrong - 100% but you got away on a technicality after moaning and saved yourself £X so why can't we moan and save ourselves a valuable £X amount? I passed my driving test 9 months ago actually but haven't driven since as 1) I can't afford a car and 2) I can't afford insurance...

People like you make me sick, really fvcking sick. You are the sort of person who goes on and on about 'ragheads' and 'immigrants stealing our jobs' but is so blinded, ignorant and thick to see any bigger picture or have a sense of self-civilisation or respect.

I'm fed up of arguing in here with you, I'm sure it's made great reading for some but I really can't be bothered to waste time on a twat like you.

Marshall For England

It depends if I'm at work or not (something you probably have no experience of)

I too am giving up. You're just making yourself look immature now. You have no evidence whatsoever and are just assuming without prbably even reading the thread. Having said that, if you're horrified about the parking fine then you'll be mortified with that thread.

[Bettsj2]

This thread was interesting at the start but now it's boiled down to students sounding like they've swallowed a thesaurus and trying to patronise the working man, and the working man sounding like some righteous bigot who thinks everyone should 'get down pit'.

In all honesty, yes the price rise for some people seems excessive. On the phone in, a chap was on saying that his kids ticket has gone up 100%. That is obviously a heavy price hike, but even saying that, I find it hard to believe that the money cant be found if they really want to go. That goes for students and workers. £300 over the course of a year is not much at all. Buy it on your overdraft or credit card and pay it back over the course of a year if you REALLY want to go. If you dont, just go to a game every so often. If people are that hard up for cash then you should be making savings anyway and a season ticket to the football isnt exactly life dependant.

[Dylan]

Wonder how many of you will be complaining and slating students when a former student saves your life, helps your eyesight, creates the medicine to make you or your family feel better, employs you etc....

Without students, doctors/pharmacists/dentist/opticians would not be there to help YOU in the future. Who would be there to teach your children? Should be encouraging people to go to university; how are we expected to grow as a country with an uneducated population- even more important as we're in such a slump.

[Bettsj2]

Wonder how many of you will be complaining and slating students when a former student saves your life, helps your eyesight, creates the medicine to make you or your family feel better, employs you etc....

Without students, doctors/pharmacists/dentist/opticians would not be there to help YOU in the future. Who would be there to teach your children? Should be encouraging people to go to university; how are we expected to grow as a country with an uneducated population- even more important as we're in such a slump.

If some dumb ****er wasnt around to serve me my weekly Zinger Tower box meal at KFC, i'd be kicking off big style. Should we give them cheap season tickets too?

Pay the ****ing moneh.

[Matt]

Wonder how many of you will be complaining and slating students when a former student saves your life, helps your eyesight, creates the medicine to make you or your family feel better, employs you etc....

Without students, doctors/pharmacists/dentist/opticians would not be there to help YOU in the future. Who would be there to teach your children? Should be encouraging people to go to university; how are we expected to grow as a country with an uneducated population- even more important as we're in such a slump.

I'll remember that when i'm building houses, without 'uneducated' people like me you wouldn't have a house to live in, i'll charge people like you double as I didn't get student prices.

[m00nie]

Wonder how many of you will be complaining and slating students when a former student saves your life, helps your eyesight, creates the medicine to make you or your family feel better, employs you etc....

Without students, doctors/pharmacists/dentist/opticians would not be there to help YOU in the future. Who would be there to teach your children? Should be encouraging people to go to university; how are we expected to grow as a country with an uneducated population- even more important as we're in such a slump.

who built the doctors surgery ?? oh the bricklayer who did his apprentice on low money but paid out full for his season ticket..

[The Year Of The Fox]

Wonder how many of you will be complaining and slating students when a former student saves your life, helps your eyesight, creates the medicine to make you or your family feel better, employs you etc....

Without students, doctors/pharmacists/dentist/opticians would not be there to help YOU in the future. Who would be there to teach your children? Should be encouraging people to go to university; how are we expected to grow as a country with an uneducated population- even more important as we're in such a slump.

But we don't owe you yet. They say that too many people think the world owes them a living. Here's a prime example. For every student graduating and living in to a career as you mentioned above, there will be x amount who don't.

If you do become the next Louis Pasteur then fair enough. You will be earning your corn then, and yes the world would rightly owe you. Gaining entry into university does not mean we owe you. We're talking about a season ticket here, not you being (completely) priced out of education (again)

Is a season ticket vital in you developing your career? No! You have chosen the honourable path you're going down, and knew what would be entailed in going to uni ie. Long study hours, not enough time to work (according to some), and allegedly not enough spare cash! So why should we subsidise something which everyone else regards as a luxury?

[The Year Of The Fox]

Wonder how many of you will be complaining and slating students when a former student saves your life, helps your eyesight, creates the medicine to make you or your family feel better, employs you etc....

Without students, doctors/pharmacists/dentist/opticians would not be there to help YOU in the future. Who would be there to teach your children? Should be encouraging people to go to university; how are we expected to grow as a country with an uneducated population- even more important as we're in such a slump.

Equally when your grandmas boiler breaks down in the height of winter, remember the uneducated twat who went round to fix it