Haydos Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 One of the most bullshit phrases in football. There's only so long you churn that out for. I like the lad but I fear he's done here unless he produces something this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danizen Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 I said the same in the Marshall thread the other day but here goes. I completely agree that form is temporary and class is permanent. However it depends what you think his form and his class are. I (and quite a few people) reckon Waghorn's "class" is absolutely shite and he had 6 months in very good form. Works both ways. Depends on your viewpoint, I guess. Completely agree with this. He carried us through Fryatt's injury and scored some important goals to eventually get us in the Play-Offs. He's done very little since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubbins Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 Waghorn has never looked close to rediscovering the decent form he had for half of the season we had him on loan. You can say all he needs is a run of games but based on the vast majority of his performances does he deserve one. He has done very little since we signed him and has been poor when he has started games this season. (Danns has turned into a pariah on here for the same reason). How long a run of games do you give him anyway. Can we afford to have him blasting chances over the bar for 4 or 5 games in the hope that he may come good. Get rid.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnyBoy Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 cant get his miss against Brum out of my head Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shade Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 catch 22, I'd like to see a player play half a season non-stop before I announce whether they're great or useless. the problem is you can't afford to persevere if they don't show much after 3 or 4 starts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain... Posted 22 October 2012 Author Share Posted 22 October 2012 Waghorn has never looked close to rediscovering the decent form he had for half of the season we had him on loan. You can say all he needs is a run of games but based on the vast majority of his performances does he deserve one. He has done very little since we signed him and has been poor when he has started games this season. (Danns has turned into a pariah on here for the same reason). How long a run of games do you give him anyway. Can we afford to have him blasting chances over the bar for 4 or 5 games in the hope that he may come good. Get rid.. One big difference between Waghorn, and Danns/Beckford/Vassell is that he is still young can and will still improve, those 3 are all past their best and going down hill, another big difference is attitude, you get the impression that Waghorn would run through a wall for this club. So can we afford to have a young talented player in the squad and on the bench for the season to help him improve and develop, then yes, should he start ahead of Vardy or Nugent? No, but he is part of the development squad for a reason, he is still developing. catch 22, I'd like to see a player play half a season non-stop before I announce whether they're great or useless. the problem is you can't afford to persevere if they don't show much after 3 or 4 starts. ...so that would require 2 or 3 more starts before you could judge him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 for all those saying its not fair to judge because he is only a sub and never starts. Knockaert started for us as a sub, impressed and is now in the team, countless others have over the years too, if he can't do the job when coming on, fresh against tiring defenders then why the hell should he be given a start? The only fact is, for nearly 3 years he hasn't performed at a high enough level for us and only Nigel Pearson has ever shown any interest in signing him on loan from us. He seems a nice lad and is a hard worker but its time to move on and give his place to either Schlupp or Futacs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 Waghorn has never looked close to rediscovering the decent form he had for half of the season we had him on loan. You can say all he needs is a run of games but based on the vast majority of his performances does he deserve one. He has done very little since we signed him and has been poor when he has started games this season. (Danns has turned into a pariah on here for the same reason). How long a run of games do you give him anyway. Can we afford to have him blasting chances over the bar for 4 or 5 games in the hope that he may come good. Get rid.. Has anyone actually suggested he needs a run of games in OUR first team? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 Has anyone actually suggested he needs a run of games in OUR first team? what has he done to show he is worthy of that place? seriously, players that perform as a sub generally get rewarded by starting games, so why should Martyn Waghorn be given the chance a head of Schlupp, Futacs or even someone like Harry Panayiotou? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 for all those saying its not fair to judge because he is only a sub and never starts. Knockaert started for us as a sub, impressed and is now in the team, countless others have over the years too, if he can't do the job when coming on, fresh against tiring defenders then why the hell should he be given a start? The only fact is, for nearly 3 years he hasn't performed at a high enough level for us and only Nigel Pearson has ever shown any interest in signing him on loan from us. How do you know who has or hasn't shown an interest in signing him on loan? Did Knockaert miss almost the whole of last season injured? Had Knockaert started a handful of games in his correct position over the last three years? And comparing Waghorn against one of the most talented players to pull on a Leicester shirt in the last decade is ludicrous. He's a young player, lacking confidence and form. The best thing for him is to go out on loan, something that might have happened for all any of you know had Beckford not decided he no longer wanted to be here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 what has he done to show he is worthy of that place? seriously, players that perform as a sub generally get rewarded by starting games, so why should Martyn Waghorn be given the chance a head of Schlupp, Futacs or even someone like Harry Panayiotou? What has Schlupp, Futacs or Panayiotou done to warrant a start ahead of Waghorn? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 What has Schlupp, Futacs or Panayiotou done to warrant a start ahead of Waghorn? they haven't failed as much in their appearences for a start Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubbins Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 One big difference between Waghorn, and Danns/Beckford/Vassell is that he is still young can and will still improve, those 3 are all past their best and going down hill, another big difference is attitude, you get the impression that Waghorn would run through a wall for this club. Well hes not improved in the 2 years hes been here and just because hes young does not neccessarily mean he will improve. Joachim had the best years of his career playing for us at age 18/19 Heskeys best ever season was when he was at Liverpool aged 23/24, Luke Chadwick at the start of his career looked at one point like he was going to be a Man Utd regular and very quickly slipped into obscurity. He can run through as many brick walls as he likes but if he cant hit the target from 4 yards it doesnt really benefit us.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain... Posted 22 October 2012 Author Share Posted 22 October 2012 Well hes not improved in the 2 years hes been here and just because hes young does not neccessarily mean he will improve. Joachim had the best years of his career playing for us at age 18/19 Heskeys best ever season was when he was at Liverpool aged 23/24, Luke Chadwick at the start of his career looked at one point like he was going to be a Man Utd regular and very quickly slipped into obscurity. He can run through as many brick walls as he likes but if he cant hit the target from 4 yards it doesnt really benefit us.. First of all, he has barely played in the 2 years he has been here, and during those 2 years, 3 managers, countless players, coaches, formations, and playing styles who actually has improved as a player? Wellens and Gally are 2 of the most hated players at the club, closely followed by Dyer and Waghorn, King was a figure of hate for a while, until he finally got fit and a run in the side in his preferred position. I'm not saying he is amazing, and he should be playing every week, I'm just sick of the unnecessary abuse that he receives, especially seeing as it will do nothing more than damage his confidence to hear the fans that loved him and he loved back give him abuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 they haven't failed as much in their appearences for a start They haven't failed as much in their appearances? Waghorn appeared 9 times for us and Hull last season in the league and scored two goals. Schlupp 21 league appearances and 2 goals. Futacs clearly is only going to be plan B and is not going to fit into our system as a starter. The other is a kid who has done nothing to warrant starting a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 neither has Waghorn which is the point you keep avoiding, he is given a chance every time he steps onto the pitch and doesn't do anything with them and considering you keep going on about not getting starts so its not fair to say that about Schlupp is extreme hypocrisy... don't give me that out of position bullshit either, if he doesn't want to play there then speak to the manager, we've seen other players play out of position for us and do brilliantly, Waghorn just isn't good enough Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain... Posted 22 October 2012 Author Share Posted 22 October 2012 neither has Waghorn which is the point you keep avoiding, he is given a chance every time he steps onto the pitch and doesn't do anything with them and considering you keep going on about not getting starts so its not fair to say that about Schlupp is extreme hypocrisy... don't give me that out of position bullshit either, if he doesn't want to play there then speak to the manager, we've seen other players play out of position for us and do brilliantly, Waghorn just isn't good enough Pearson thinks he has, and that is all that counts, and it is good enough for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whoareyaaa Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 They haven't failed as much in their appearances? Waghorn appeared 9 times for us and Hull last season in the league and scored two goals. Schlupp 21 league appearances and 2 goals. Futacs clearly is only going to be plan B and is not going to fit into our system as a starter. The other is a kid who has done nothing to warrant starting a game. What about the Season before that ? 34 games 4 goals ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain... Posted 22 October 2012 Author Share Posted 22 October 2012 What about the Season before that ? 34 games 4 goals ? You mean 11 starts and 4 goals? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubbins Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 I'm not saying he is amazing, and he should be playing every week, I'm just sick of the unnecessary abuse that he receives, especially seeing as it will do nothing more than damage his confidence to hear the fans that loved him and he loved back give him abuse. I dont believe hes taking any particularly strong abuse from Leicester fans at the games. Hes not being booed and theres no mass chanting of 'what a waste of money' is there so I dont see where this critical knock to his confidence is coming from. Im sure he took some stick when he blasted over from 4 yards on saturday but to be fair he had just blasted over from 4 yards and that is gonna attract stick no matter who you are. As with all our players I also seriously doubt that he ever really loved us half as much as the amount of zeroes on his wage slip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whoareyaaa Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 You mean 11 starts and 4 goals? Well if you want to look at it like that its 11 starts and 2 goals ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manwell Pablo Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 First of all, he has barely played in the 2 years he has been here, and during those 2 years, 3 managers, countless players, coaches, formations, and playing styles who actually has improved as a player? Wellens and Gally are 2 of the most hated players at the club, closely followed by Dyer and Waghorn, King was a figure of hate for a while, until he finally got fit and a run in the side in his preferred position. I'm not saying he is amazing, and he should be playing every week, I'm just sick of the unnecessary abuse that he receives, especially seeing as it will do nothing more than damage his confidence to hear the fans that loved him and he loved back give him abuse. Yes I am sure he reads Foxestalk every night before bed and cries himself to sleep, certainly what I'd be doing with my evenings if I was a pro footballer aged 22 earning 5 figures every week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain... Posted 22 October 2012 Author Share Posted 22 October 2012 Well if you want to look at it like that its 11 starts and 2 goals ? Ok 11 starts, 19 appearances off the bench, 4 goals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manwell Pablo Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 You mean 11 starts and 4 goals? No he means 34 appearances and 4 goals EDIT: or whatever he said the first time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 22 October 2012 Share Posted 22 October 2012 neither has Waghorn which is the point you keep avoiding, he is given a chance every time he steps onto the pitch and doesn't do anything with them and considering you keep going on about not getting starts so its not fair to say that about Schlupp is extreme hypocrisy... don't give me that out of position bullshit either, if he doesn't want to play there then speak to the manager, we've seen other players play out of position for us and do brilliantly, Waghorn just isn't good enough Done nothing? He's done more than those players ever have. He did it three years ago and has hardly started in his preferred position more than a dozen times since then. He played 9 league games last year and scored as many as Schlupp did in over twice that amount. Hypocrsy? You are the one saying players need to take their chances whether it be sub or starting. And seem to be advocating Schlupp being ahead of him. Well Schlupp has never done anything to show himself better than Waghorn, neither have the others. Playing out of position bullshit? He's a striker, sticking him out wide for most of his appearances you'll get the same standard as you did with Nugent out wide. Rubbish. I don't care who of Waghorn or Schlupp start when someone is injured. The support strikers are probably of similar ability. But whilst some get rimmed, Waghorn gets abused. Even though he's the only one to ever do anything for us of any real note. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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