Bettsj2 Posted 19 December 2012 Posted 19 December 2012 I think most of the old Wellens fans, who used to slag me, back here slagging me again. Why don't we have Wellens back. Apparently he was even better for Ipswich than he was for us. Wellens, can't wait. Come on Nigel, I wouldn't put it past you. You obviously know a good, strong, combative and effective midfield when you see one. NOT! Hmm. You're making a point echoed by many but the elements of 'Pearson cant see what we need' etc is a little naive and not really true. He's always said that if there's an opportunity to bring a player in that can add something then he will. The 'pussy' midfield you refer to was sured up by the loan signing of Jay Spearing in his first tenure. Was that to your liking or was that conveniently down to someone else? Point being he can see weakness but wont just make a panic signing in an attempt to paper over a crack, he'll prefer to take his time to make sure in the long term, it adds value and makes sense. I agree with you that another plan, or even 2,3,4 other plans would be useful but if the players aint there then they aint there. Pearson used to experiment with the midfield quite often in his first tenure. In League 1, Berner played the holding sweeper role on several occassions and in the Championship, we played a diamond, 3 man midfield and 5 man midfield on several occassions. These are all plan b's. The tone of your posts seem to suggest you want the plan b to be the plan a.
Oxfordfox83 Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 I don't think that's what happens though mate. IMO people often seem to see some criticism and SLAM... Jump on it, curb it and finish it... Rather than stopping and picking the bones out of it. Peeps like DT and Seenitall sometimes make some good points IMO. Sure, I don't always agree, but on some things I kinda see what they are saying. But when 20 posters then call them 'arseholes' etc their arguments are lost and they are kinda branded into Pearson haters. One of the terms often used is 'no divine right' to success. This phrase effectively kills any counter argument dead because it states, however poorly we have played, that its really ok because we are all expecting 'too much' anyway. Where do you go with that? Can you see what I'm getting at? Sure, when someone quotes a negative, come back with a positive, but try to see the 'negative' for how it was meant. Personally, and I don't mind saying it, i think Sven fooked the club up and Pearson is still picking up the pieces. But that don't mean he has to then go and play King and Drinky in the middle against Millwall does it? Most of us knew that wouldn't work. Anyway, tis all opinion as I see it, not fact.. And I think Pearson is doing generally, a good job. This is the point I assume you lost your mind. All Arthur's points might be taken more seriously, if the thread title wasn't so moronic. And then I suppose there's the content of the message. The random collection of inconsistent gripes, assuming his own limitless capabilities that we can never measure because he's never achieved anything in football. Why should we pick through the vomit of his post to get to the fairly predictable carrot of 'we should maybe mess with the midfield'. The guy clearly hasn't got a foggy one, nor has seenitall. DT occasionally does when his meds are right. But when they talk so much utter sh1te, why is it incumbent on us to ignore the 90% that's drivel and pander to the occasional bit of sense? Message to everyone who whines about being shot down in flames: talk less crap with your posts and you might be debated with on a level that makes you feel special.
Dan Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 I really do not know why people insult me instead of entering into intelligent debate. I've just caught up on the last bunch of posts and I am quite satisfied that those who malign me are not capable of intelligent debate, so that explains things pretty well. However it would be gratifying if some of those 'debators' actually either read what I said or tried harder to understand what I said. Now I risk becoming 'a broken record' by repeating yet again that I am entirely consistent with my views and have been for season after season, OK? Not really, everything about what I quoted reeked of arrogance, spoilt brat mentality that can only bring negativity in the ground. I understand we're a decent sized club but we have absolutely no divine right to anything, especially when our 'fans' seem to be absolutely oblivious to reality so often.
Dan Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 In my opinion yes. I think it's best to give both sides to the argument(s). I've said it all season.. I'm a fan of Nige, I concur with his no-nonsense approach, I usually agree with his signings and we are fifth. + I also think he's not tactically the best and doesn't always play his best team. - See, it can be done... Just my opinion, of course, but I tire of the happy clappers as much as the critics. I don't know why people feel they have to fall into one of these two positions. It comes across as very defensive and doesn't look at the real issues. At least, as they exist in my mind. There's a fine line between those who give constructive criticism, and those who give criticism at every single opportunity possible and rarely speak up when something positive happens, those who have absolutely unrealistic expectations because we've got 'rich' owners who've spent a bit (of our money that we don't yet have). I've got a very lot of faith in Pearson, probably more than most. I rate his attitude, his style of football (which is something I wasn't keen on beforehand but he's changed), his signings (most of the time) and his long-term vision. Whilst there are some flaws he's still not fixed, he's done far more for this club than any manager since O'Neill, by an absolute stretch, yet it seems because he's not the most entertaining in interviews, because he's not big name and involved in the hype, that he's not the right man. People need to stop thinking we're above reality. Neutrals used to piss me off when they'd slate me for thinking we'll do well but... people have to stop expecting everything ASAP and have a bit of patience, and dare to consider what we're working on will do in five years. Could you imagine if the whole league had our attitude even this season? Our net spend this year is no more than most in this league yet we still have some who expect us to destroy the league, it's embarrassing, if the whole league had that approach it would be an absolute mess of a league (if it isn't already). I can fully understand the odd frustrations but.. it could be so much worse on the pitch. We've got some cracking young players, I maintain no side in this league has as many quality young players as we do, the majority would kill for this squad, it's a long-term plan and it's actually doing well in the short-term, yet it's not enough. Then again the club have got some responsibility. Their constant upping of prices to silly money you'd expect to pay for a side that creams everyone and the amount of laughable hype last year only breeds arrogance and dis-content should things go wrong. Things aren't perfect, but they're so much closer to that than the opposite of perfect, and yet some think we deserve so much more because we have so called amazing support (myth), a big ground and were in the Premier nearly 10 years ago. Rant over, but it most likely isn't the last.
Leicester_Numan Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 Babylon, it's me again. There is nothing wrong with the players. The problem is Pearson's formation and lack of tactical acumen. Let me put it another way - Eric Morecombe, when playing a 'tune' on the piano which was supposed to be the intro to Tchaikovsky's piano concerto, but was nothing like it, said to the conductor Andre Previn " I'm playing the right notes, just not in the right order". Making sense yet? We could have played with a team consisting of Nugent, King, Drinkwater, Dyer ( or Marshall ), Knockaert ( or Vardy ) at Millwall and have a better chance of winning than we did with the starting line-up that Pearson picked. It is not that difficult to understand. 4-2-3-1 eg - De Laet, Morgan, Whitbread, Konchesky; James, Drinkwater; Knockaert, King, Marshall; Nugent. Do you get it yet? Just like the notes being played in the right order ( or formation ), our team should have the right formation. Same players ( except a second holding midfielder ) different formation, different outcome. Simple really. It was Greig's piano concerto . Nugent up front on his own? Against their 2 centre backs? Seriously? After that statement I put more faith in Pearsons tactical knowledge than yours
flowwolf Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 I think he was a shit signing, I make no bones about that. Obviously Pearson bought him to give us a bit of a plan B in some games, but I don't think he provides the physical presence that Pearson thought he would. All managers have and will sign shit players in their time though, it's not a science. Pearson has signed enough quality players to get away with the odd dud every now and then. For every Marco Futacs there's a Tom Cleverley, Wes Morgan and Ben Marshall. For every Robbie Nielson, there's a Danny Drinkwater, Anthony Knockaert and Ritchie de Laet. Alex Ferguson spent £20 million on Anderson and £28 million on Hargreaves. What does that make him? A bad manager? No. Fair enough.
5waller5 Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 Fair enough. Who? Futacs? He was cheap and a high risk signing ... I agree he doesn't look great but could have come good, and may still .... but we haven't lost much in trying him out so risk / reward equation was ok.
indierich06 Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 Who? Futacs? He was cheap and a high risk signing ... I agree he doesn't look great but could have come good, and may still .... but we haven't lost much in trying him out so risk / reward equation was ok. I presume you mean low risk? Like I say - it was a bit of a gamble, he hasn't been amazing, but it doesn't particulalry matter. I think he could do a job for us, but he's never going to be a key player.
The People's Hero Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 I have nothing to say to any of you idiots.
artursteppe Posted 20 December 2012 Author Posted 20 December 2012 It was Greig's piano concerto . Nugent up front on his own? Against their 2 centre backs? Seriously? After that statement I put more faith in Pearsons tactical knowledge than yours It was Greig's piano concerto . Nugent up front on his own? Against their 2 centre backs? Seriously? After that statement I put more faith in Pearsons tactical knowledge than yours How many goals did we score with two up front, and how many did we concede. Touche I think!
Babylon Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 I have nothing to say to any of you idiots. Did the idiots think we'd be in a relegation scrap this year? Relegation scrap with Nigel 'what plan B?' Pearson in charge. We can spend what we like and collect whoever we want, its going to be the same old chosen men, who haven't been good enough time and again, some of whom are now past it. You're a smart chap TPH, but stick to non footballing matters.
The People's Hero Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 I stand corrected - but its not been all that impressive of late has it? I can name a number of weaknesses which still have not been addressed. For the size of club, the money spent over the last few seasons, the facilities, the support, we are doing ok, probably underachieving a little.
davelcfc100 Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 this thread makes me feel sick, our fans have to be the most fickle in whole country
cc_star Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 this thread makes me feel sick, our fans have to be the most fickle in whole country A win & this thread will be buried along with others like it that appear after every weak result. Still, not one idiot has countered my post on the first page of this article with anything
indierich06 Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 How many goals did we score with two up front, and how many did we concede. Touche I think! So we'd be more likely to score with one striker than we would with two? The way you talk it's like there's no doubt we would have won the game if we'd played your system and everyone's an idiot for not seeing that. Well I'm sorry, but that's not how football works. Your 'right notes in the wrong order' analogy just doesn't stand up because there's no science to winning football matches - you don't just put the right players in the right slots and then you're guarenteed to win every game. People put too much stock in formation. It all comes down to whether your 11 players are more talented, more organised, better at working as a team than the other 11 players. You could play Barcelona's starting 11 against us in more or less any formation and they would destroy us. You could put the world's greatest tactician in charge of Leicester City and he'd still lose games. There is no magic formula for success.
p_kam Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 i think NP know that we need a few more players, but NP being NP he will never say he needs it. he will also never say a bad word about his player or team. i think in jab we will bring the right players that we need to push on, because the problems are clear by so may that NP will also know them he will get us going. but in the mean time he has to do with what he has with. I think their are things he can change now with playing surtien players against different teams and as well as formations and game plans. but he will get the players we need to push on.
Babylon Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 I stand corrected - but its not been all that impressive of late has it? Lately? No not really. But a seasons success is also measured on what happened before the last few games, and what will happen after. I too can name a number of weaknesses which still have not been addressed. But I can also name many than have been. I do not expect magic wand type football management, it can take time to shape a team. As long as we are improving, and clearly we have then that's all I ask we keep doing. We'll see what players we can shift and what we can get in come January, it should give us a clearer idea of how things will shape up.
The People's Hero Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 Lately? No not really. But a seasons success is also measured on what happened before the last few games, and what will happen after. I too can name a number of weaknesses which still have not been addressed. But I can also name many than have been. I do not expect magic wand type football management, it can take time to shape a team. As long as we are improving, and clearly we have then that's all I ask we keep doing. We'll see what players we can shift and what we can get in come January, it should give us a clearer idea of how things will shape up. I also don't expect the waving of a magic wand but time and again we've been killing teams with a pressing game and made the opposition look awful (Derby and Barnsley) only to take our foot off their throats (and the pedal) and allow them time on the ball to grow in confidence. I know you can't press and play at 100mph for 90 minutes, but often I feel NP 'calls them off' too early and we suffer as a result The issue is that he's a stubborn meathead who doesn't learn from his mistakes. He'll be making the same errors in 20 years time when we've fired and re-hired him for the 9th time.
Leicester_Numan Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 How many goals did we score with two up front, and how many did we concede. Touche I think! So how do you think we're going to do any better with Nugent up front on his own? He's not the right kind of striker for that role. Ideally with a 5 in midfield we would have played Waggy up front but with him not being available that job falls to Futacs as the only other striker we have who can hold the ball up. As Pearson himself commented, there is a tendancy to hit the ball long when Futacs is on the pitch. I'm pretty sure he would keep telling the players to pass it to him on the deck but they obviously don't. So, there's your reason why he went with Nugent & Vardy up front. Best of the available options. Maybe Pearson should tattoo "keep it on the deck" on the players foreheads so they don't forget.
Dan Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 I have nothing to say to any of you idiots. Suits me.
The People's Hero Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 Suits me. Yes, that gimp suit does suit you!
Dan Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 Might wear it on the final day at Forest, could do with a laugh during relegation.
DANGEROUS TIGER Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 This is the point I assume you lost your mind. All Arthur's points might be taken more seriously, if the thread title wasn't so moronic. And then I suppose there's the content of the message. The random collection of inconsistent gripes, assuming his own limitless capabilities that we can never measure because he's never achieved anything in football. Why should we pick through the vomit of his post to get to the fairly predictable carrot of 'we should maybe mess with the midfield'. The guy clearly hasn't got a foggy one, nor has seenitall. DT occasionally does when his meds are right. But when they talk so much utter sh1te, why is it incumbent on us to ignore the 90% that's drivel and pander to the occasional bit of sense? Message to everyone who whines about being shot down in flames: talk less crap with your posts and you might be debated with on a level that makes you feel special. I cannot remember whining at being shot down in flames! I do my own share of shooting, so one has to expect it, but don't forget that some people may equally consider your views and posts as dire s--t. None of us are perfect. Anyway, have a good Xmas.
Bluetintedspecs Posted 20 December 2012 Posted 20 December 2012 I have nothing to say to any of you idiots. You've got an over inflated opinion of yourself........based on what?
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