The Smiths

[Fox92]

18 minutes ago, The Bear said:

At this point I don't want to see any reunion whatsoever. Particularly now we've lost Andy Rourke. Just wouldn't be the same. 

 

Not to mention that Morrissey is a loon nowadays. 

 

Marr might have got the rights to the Smiths name but I doubt he'd ever use it as such to tour with. He'd get too much stick off the fans if he did. I doubt that's why he's done it any way. He probably did it just to stop Morrissey ever doing it. 

Exactly what I think. It's funny reading all of Morrissey's hard fans comments though. 

[FLAN]

Marr did a great set supporting new order recently where did did 4 or 5 Smiths songs. For a certain generation it was euphoric 

[purpleronnie]

4 hours ago, FLAN said:

Marr did a great set supporting new order recently where did did 4 or 5 Smiths songs. For a certain generation it was euphoric 

Always seems really odd to me when he sings smiths songs, given Morrissey was such a 'unique' singer/character, Marr singing morrissey lyrics never quite works...for me anyway.

Edited 17 September 2024 by purpleronnie

[Libertine]

[Daggers]

11 hours ago, Bellend Sebastian said:

Struggling to think of any incarnation of The Smiths they could put on stage that wouldn't be shite.

Struggling to think of any iteration of anything involving the fat old racist that wouldn't be shit - but then he wouldn't turn up anyway. 

[Fox92]

1 hour ago, Libertine said:

Brilliant. I really like the reason for declining a new compilation album “given the number already in existence”.

 

And exactly what I thought regarding Morrissey seemingly picking flights for no reason.

[Bellend Sebastian]

12 hours ago, SpacedX said:

But that's the point. Johnny Marr is perfectly happy in his own skin. He won't tour as The Smiths on his own and in so doing compromise his integrity and their history because he neither wants to nor needs to. 

 

What? A tribute band can't substitute for 1980s Smiths. Paint by numbers, derivative dross like Oasis, 'definitely/maybe' (and would do it better than this current  farcical reunion). I grant you, many of these tribute acts nail it as musicians but it is artistically meaningless. 

 

The problem is, these days, touring is where the money is and this is tempting bands out of hiatus or retirement, destroying their legacy and often trading on the name, where key members are frequently absent of their choosing or deceased and replaced by makeshift hired musicians. Bands like the Smiths were inimitable and even original personnel very often struggles to recapture the essence of the band meaning that these nostalgia tours are a pale imitation of the past or an outright parody and might are about as relevant as the tribute bands that are often tighter and more professional. Either that, or the acrimony that tore them apart in the first place simmers underneath and eventually boils over onstage. Witness the recent debacle surrounding Jane's Addiction. Occasionally this tension can be the spark that reignites the old flame that made a band so special, but when you know that they are solely out there for the money, with the original potency gone, it's all somewhat sterile and flaccid.  

 

 

I think it could give the surviving members a run for their money, in era appropriate venues for much closer to era appropriate prices. Also, not having a 65 year old frontman who increasingly looks older than he is might give them the edge. 

 

I never saw the Smiths live, the closest thing I got to was seeing Morrissey on his first solo tour, and whilst it was fantastic and a near riot, I'm not sure anybody there was dwelling on the artistic meaning (his band were a bit shite at the time to be honest) 

[Bellend Sebastian]

1 hour ago, Daggers said:

Struggling to think of any iteration of anything involving the fat old racist that wouldn't be shit - but then he wouldn't turn up anyway. 

I've never really been that arsed by what Morrissey says and the time when loads of punters and journos hung on his every word ended about three and a half decades ago.

 

I'm struggling to think of anyone with dodgy views who has been less effective at using them to influence the public conversation. Remember when he endorsed For Britain? They subsequently managed to get a total of about 600 votes across 4 by-elections and have since been dissolved through lack of interest. There are racist lichen on rocks in Iceland that more people sit up and listen to when they belch out some balls about Sadiq Khan

 

 

[Daggers]

10 minutes ago, Bellend Sebastian said:

I've never really been that arsed by what Morrissey says and the time when loads of punters and journos hung on his every word ended about three and a half decades ago.

 

I'm struggling to think of anyone with dodgy views who has been less effective at using them to influence the public conversation. Remember when he endorsed For Britain? They subsequently managed to get a total of about 600 votes across 4 by-elections and have since been dissolved through lack of interest. There are racist lichen on rocks in Iceland that more people sit up and listen to when they belch out some balls about Sadiq Khan

 

 

 Not played a single song of his since he began spouting bile. It's only now I'll play old Fall albums after MES went all nasty.

[Bellend Sebastian]

11 minutes ago, Daggers said:

 Not played a single song of his since he began spouting bile. It's only now I'll play old Fall albums after MES went all nasty.

The more you ignore him, the more racist he gets 

[SpacedX]

12 hours ago, Bellend Sebastian said:

I think it could give the surviving members a run for their money, in era appropriate venues for much closer to era appropriate prices. Also, not having a 65 year old frontman who increasingly looks older than he is might give them the edge. 

 

To clarify, that is not the point I was making. I'm saying that a tribute band could not substitute for the original band in their day just as a reformation couldn't. It almost invariably never does. 

[The Bear]

11 hours ago, Bellend Sebastian said:

The more you ignore him, the more racist he gets 

Well he does bear more grudges than lonely high court judges. 

[The Bear]

12 hours ago, Daggers said:

 Not played a single song of his since he began spouting bile. It's only now I'll play old Fall albums after MES went all nasty.

Not sure I agree with this stance in general. I don't stop listening to Michael Jackson songs cos he was a bit of a wrong un. 

 

Got to separate the art from the artist. 

[FLAN]

19 hours ago, purpleronnie said:

Always seems really odd to me when he sings smiths songs, given Morrissey was such a 'unique' singer/character, Marr singing morrissey lyrics never quite works...for me anyway.

Couldn’t really hear him over the crowd tbf 

[The Bear]

He's not got Morrissey's unique crooning style, but Johnny has a decent voice. Good enough to cover his own songs IMO. 

 

Everyone lost their minds when Rick Astley did them at Glasto, but his voice slightly annoyed me as it sounded like he was trying too hard to be Morrissey. I still enjoyed the covers though. 

[Daggers]

14 hours ago, The Bear said:

Got to separate the art from the artist. 

Erm, nah. I'm good.

 

 

[bovril]

14 hours ago, Daggers said:

Erm, nah. I'm good.

 

 

That's easy though because the art is shit

[Trav Le Bleu]

On 17/09/2024 at 22:08, Daggers said:

 Not played a single song of his since he began spouting bile. It's only now I'll play old Fall albums after MES went all nasty.

This is exactly why I can only just listen to Adolf and the Doodlebugs after all these years.

[Daggers]

3 minutes ago, Trav Le Bleu said:

This is exactly why I can only just listen to Adolf and the Doodlebugs after all these years.

 

[purpleronnie]

One of the best album tracks.

 

 

[Bellend Sebastian]

On 02/11/2024 at 15:19, purpleronnie said:

One of the best album tracks.

 

 

I wholeheartedly agree. My favourite Smiths album. 

 

I know there's some debate over which is "the best", but I think of the four, the last three are all equally brilliant. It's only the debut that, due to slightly of its time production and if I'm being super critical, them not quite having cracked writing true pop songs (which I think most of the Smiths' output is and there's no shame in that), that falls short of greatness

[Blueman1967]

This is my favorite Smiths album, also good one to start, if you want to start listening to them

 

 

[Bellend Sebastian]

17 hours ago, Blueman1967 said:

This is my favorite Smiths album, also good one to start, if you want to start listening to them

 

 

It's literally where I started, in about 1990. I knew William it was Really Nothing, How Soon is Now and Heaven Knows I'm Miserable now already but the rest of it was all very mysterious to me. 

 

It was years later that I realised it was a compilation. I think it was really cheap when it first came out, what a bargain

[The Bear]

In terms of variety and production value then Louder Than Bombs is by far the best for newcomers. 

 

Hatful Of Hollow's issue for me is you get live session versions which aren't a patch on the original versions. A few exceptions are the vastly superior This Charming Man and stuff that isn't on other albums like Handsome Devil. 

[purpleronnie]

9 minutes ago, The Bear said:

In terms of variety and production value then Louder Than Bombs is by far the best for newcomers. 

 

Hatful Of Hollow's issue for me is you get live session versions which aren't a patch on the original versions. A few exceptions are the vastly superior This Charming Man and stuff that isn't on other albums like Handsome Devil. 

Funny you say that because its pretty much a given these days that most smiths fans prefer HOH to the debut, based on the production of the two Lp's.