ozleicester Posted 16 January 2014 Posted 16 January 2014 You see here, I'm caught between thinking "another pushy gobshite parent with no idea of the education system thinking they know best" and "he's bang on about seeing culture and government influence in education". to be fair.. youve about nailed it with both. Unless they are going to pay for every cent of raising my kid and take responsibility for everything it does the government can pull their head in and leave it to me.
Soar Fox Posted 16 January 2014 Author Posted 16 January 2014 Did teachers get fined when they want on strike in October?
Uncle Albert Posted 16 January 2014 Posted 16 January 2014 Have you seen the terms & conditions for them Sun holidays? After just having a quick look it would be cheaper for a family of 4 to go abroad than have a week at centre parcs. Center Parcs is a bastard rip off, I used to go years ago but they've priced themselves out in recent years.
ADK Posted 16 January 2014 Posted 16 January 2014 How about this for a new guideline? No more than 10 days a year for the purposes of holidays or leisure. No more than 5 days in 4 weeks for the purposes of holidays or leisure. Requests for absence can be refused by the school at times where attendance is critical (during exams for example). A holiday with family is far more beneficial to a child than a weeks schooling imo.
Parafox Posted 16 January 2014 Posted 16 January 2014 Did teachers get fined when they want on strike in October? They lost pay. Not fined. No, it is the difference between having a foreign holiday and not having one. You can get a holiday very cheaply in the UK. The sun offer holidays for £10. I think once you get to school it is unacceptable to take kids out without authorisation. Have you ever been on a Sun £10 holiday? I have. Never again... EVER!!!
Parafox Posted 16 January 2014 Posted 16 January 2014 How about this for a new guideline? No more than 10 days a year for the purposes of holidays or leisure. No more than 5 days in 4 weeks for the purposes of holidays or leisure. Requests for absence can be refused by the school at times where attendance is critical (during exams for example). A holiday with family is far more beneficial to a child than a weeks schooling imo. Good idea. Link it to general attendance levels too. If they exceed a max number of days lost through sickness (say 14 days in 12 months, 6 in 6 months, bearing in mind the actual number of school days per year) then deduct the those days from the holiday allowances.
Jon the Hat Posted 16 January 2014 Posted 16 January 2014 They lost pay. Not fined. Have you ever been on a Sun £10 holiday? I have. Never again... EVER!!! My sister has. The point is it is possible - so to say it is taking the kids out of school or no holiday is not true. No bargain fancy holiday certainly.
Jon the Hat Posted 16 January 2014 Posted 16 January 2014 how exactly are teachers supposed to manage lots of kids taking time off at different times? How do you make sure everything is covered for all students? Lets be honest, it wont be the parents who take reponsibility for that will it? Clearly this has the potential to impact the education of other kids in the class. Bad idea all round. Better to stagger holidays more to lower demand in peak areas.ensure say 3 weeks minimum overlap with other local schools and let them vary it.
Dr The Singh Posted 16 January 2014 Posted 16 January 2014 Having 3 kids, this is something that does effect us, worse still is that we know of certain schools that pay lip service to it and certain don't!!
Jon the Hat Posted 16 January 2014 Posted 16 January 2014 Having 3 kids, this is something that does effect us, worse still is that we know of certain schools that pay lip service to it and certain don't!! One imagines the better school dont like it.
ADK Posted 16 January 2014 Posted 16 January 2014 I believe it should be up to the parents what is best for their children within reason. The burden should be on the authorities to prove a parent is being irresponsible by taking their kids out of school. The burden should not be on the parents. A week of school is not going to make any difference and if I was a parent I would make sure my children caught up with any work.
Bayfox Posted 16 January 2014 Posted 16 January 2014 Did teachers get fined when they want on strike in October? did they **** and they didnt reimburse people who had to take a days leave at short notice either. Or pay for extra child care.
AoWW Posted 16 January 2014 Posted 16 January 2014 did they **** and they didnt reimburse people who had to take a days leave at short notice either. Or pay for extra child care. Why would they? Schools aren't there as your personal child-care service.
lavrentis Posted 17 January 2014 Posted 17 January 2014 Priced up Greece in August £4000!!! Can do Sri Lanka for that 4 of us.Anybody been? Take the kids out of school week before half term usually for skiing as they don't do too much that week.Apart from that stick to hols,although with the daughter now taking options I might bite the financial bullet.however,the school closed for a strike the other term so I will pro rata my fine accordingly if it occurs! Kinel mate, if you tell me where you are going I'll look for a cheaper deal then that !!
absolutelegend Posted 17 January 2014 Posted 17 January 2014 no one seems to consider the value of holidays to children, the best education anyone can get is experiencing the world, seeing other cultures. haha, you think these kids are going to museums and the ballet? ffs, people know about this when they decide to have kids. if you don't like it / can't afford them, don't have them!...or you cut your cloth accordingly and go somewhere else that doesn't incur a tour operator.
Bayfox Posted 17 January 2014 Posted 17 January 2014 Why would they? Schools aren't there as your personal child-care service. yet I have to send my child according to law unless I choose to home school. They can dictate when I have to send them. They can fine and now it seems send to prison parents who choose to educate their children by showing them more than the village they live in. yet they can choose to strike. They should be greatful they have a job in the current climate. One funded by people going to work and paying taxes. Did I state that they were my private baby sitting service? But how do you think employers feel when someone they pay to come to work can't. it can be difficult enough to find a job to suit working around your kids. My parents frequently took me to the states in feb or april/may during term time. I can say that was the best education I had. My school work never suffered and I had work to do whilst away. i'm sure most parents aren't doing it to deprive kids of an education just due to the huge savings they can make.
cambridgefox Posted 17 January 2014 Posted 17 January 2014 Kinel mate, if you tell me where you are going I'll look for a cheaper deal then that !!Anywhere really,but not too shabby.Think I could go further afield for less and get more.Honestly looking at Sri Lanka now.
Captain... Posted 17 January 2014 Posted 17 January 2014 There are 2 very good points in this thread one is from Raj: How would you react if teachers took holidays during term time? From Ozleicester: The cultural and educational benefits of a foreign holiday can be great. If you go to France or Spain and pick up some of the language it will be advantageous as well as experiencing different cultures. The solution to me would be to work with the teachers, they should know what they will cover in those weeks and have the lesson planned, so that should any kids go on holiday during term time, then they should get the work they will cover in advance and the parents should ensure that they do it while they are away, but it shouldn't be encouraged and it should need to be approved in advance by the school and only if there is seen to be some benefit for the child, or some valid reason, other than saving a few quid. Rather than punishing the parents financially.
davieG Posted 17 January 2014 Posted 17 January 2014 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-shropshire-25773249
Dr The Singh Posted 17 January 2014 Posted 17 January 2014 There are 2 very good points in this thread one is from Raj: How would you react if teachers took holidays during term time? From Ozleicester: The cultural and educational benefits of a foreign holiday can be great. If you go to France or Spain and pick up some of the language it will be advantageous as well as experiencing different cultures. The solution to me would be to work with the teachers, they should know what they will cover in those weeks and have the lesson planned, so that should any kids go on holiday during term time, then they should get the work they will cover in advance and the parents should ensure that they do it while they are away, but it shouldn't be encouraged and it should need to be approved in advance by the school and only if there is seen to be some benefit for the child, or some valid reason, other than saving a few quid. Rather than punishing the parents financially. Daftest point i've ever heard.......there contract does not allow that, so it's not possible, it's like saying what if schools ran 365 days year, so no holiday. But in saying that, the school my kids go to have had 4 inset days, which has meant that me or my mrs have had to take time off or arrange childcare for those days. The teachers, as per inset days or if the daft idea of term time holidays would have to give prior advance notice etc,etc For me, I think parents should be allowed 14 days off for sickness and holidays as a general rule, obviously cricumstances dictate differing actions. So if you child has great attendance, 2 weeks off isn't that much of a distraction from education. If your child has had alot of time off, then it's upto the schools discretion.
Captain... Posted 17 January 2014 Posted 17 January 2014 Daftest point i've ever heard.......there contract does not allow that, so it's not possible, it's like saying what if schools ran 365 days year, so no holiday. But in saying that, the school my kids go to have had 4 inset days, which has meant that me or my mrs have had to take time off or arrange childcare for those days. The teachers, as per inset days or if the daft idea of term time holidays would have to give prior advance notice etc,etc For me, I think parents should be allowed 14 days off for sickness and holidays as a general rule, obviously cricumstances dictate differing actions. So if you child has great attendance, 2 weeks off isn't that much of a distraction from education. If your child has had alot of time off, then it's upto the schools discretion. What is an inset day? Is that like a teacher day? The point is there would be outrage if a teacher took a holiday during term time, they have a contract, as do the kids, they have a responsibility to turn up to school seeing as we are paying for it as tax payers. I wouldn't have an allowance for holidays/sick as that would encourage parents to take their kids out, at the moment it is a minority of parents that do, you don't want to give all parents the green light to take kids out for 2 weeks a year.
Dr The Singh Posted 17 January 2014 Posted 17 January 2014 What is an inset day? Is that like a teacher day? The point is there would be outrage if a teacher took a holiday during term time, they have a contract, as do the kids, they have a responsibility to turn up to school seeing as we are paying for it as tax payers. I wouldn't have an allowance for holidays/sick as that would encourage parents to take their kids out, at the moment it is a minority of parents that do, you don't want to give all parents the green light to take kids out for 2 weeks a year. It's called inset days where I live, but yeah it's teacher's day. Kids don't have contract. You can't make kids responsible for turning upto school, that's parents responsibility. How many kids you got CPC? To put kids or parents in the same catogory as teacher is not right, i'm a tax payer, I believe it is my right as a parent to decide if my child is fit enough to attend school, for a multitude of reasons that I believe I need not have to justify, just like my employment, eg bereavement, access to chidcare, sickness (parent or child), religious, special ocassions. There is no exact science, process or protocol that you can contractually agree. Teachers on the other hand, like myself, are employed, it's a choice that we all have, and we all have to abide our contractual agreements. Education in this country for children to 16 is by law, there is no choice, but it's governed by policies, if you go to eduction.gov you can read it, it's upto the head teacher to decide whether parent should be fined and whether there is a 'execeptional' circumstance for the holiday, there's no contract, no law, just guidlines. And as I have stated, I know parents from other schools that are allowed term time off, and the school my kid goes to doesn't. This is flaky as shit 'The Education (Pupil Registration) (England) Regulations 2006 currently allow headteachers to grant leave of absence for the purpose of a family holiday during term time in “special circumstances†of up to ten school days leave per year. Headteachers can also grant extended leave for more than ten school days in exceptional circumstances. Amendments to the 2006 regulations remove references to family holiday and extended leave as well as the statutory threshold of ten school days. The amendments make clear that headteachers may not grant any leave of absence during term time unless there are exceptional circumstances. Headteachers should determine the number of school days a child can be away from school if the leave is granted.'
ADK Posted 17 January 2014 Posted 17 January 2014 I guess if I have children I'll just have to pay the fine and be called a criminal.
StanSP Posted 17 January 2014 Posted 17 January 2014 Think it is incredibly harsh for them to be fined so much, if at all, for this. Especially when you think of the circumstances and the reasons given. Maybe there should be a quota for how many days you can take your kid(s) out of school for holiday purposes? Obviously that'd prevent people taking the piss throughout the school year, but it really was just a week in this instance. In the grand scheme of things, is that really going to affect the child for the whole time they are in education (minimum 13/14 years staying in school all the way through to 18)
Charl91 Posted 17 January 2014 Posted 17 January 2014 I bet the same people demanding to be able to take their kids during term time, are the same people that would be banging on about how shit the education system is, and how kids aren't learning anything. If every parent has their child out of school for 2 weeks, making it impossible for everyone to cover everything, I bet they'd be the first to complain that children's education is going downhill, and it's because the teachers are shit. Why the **** are teachers being blamed for this? Schools are held responsible by the Government/Ofsted if they have low attendance - if the school has low attendance, then they'll get the shit for it. Why should they be shafted because you don't want to go on holiday during term time? If you have a problem with it, blame the Government. They make the rules. Or just don't have kids, or go somewhere cheaper.
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