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David Lowe

Reading Away now 8.07pm kick-off.

By David Lowe, in Leicester City Forum

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crisp monster

crisp monster

Posted
Posted

Irrelevant. Standing in itself did not cause the disaster.

True but the behaviour of their fans had a major part in the tragic events of that day.

Not saying I'd have done any different if City had reached a semi final and I didn't have a ticket - I'd have tried anything to get in, but I'd hold my hands up afterwards and say I contributed to it in some way.

Terrible tragedy but there have been others and it's time for the rest of us to move on and leave it to Liverpool to grieve.

promised land

promised land

Posted
Posted

Seriously?

 but this is almost as farcical as the Gary Speed tributes.

I never understood why every ground did this, he was Welsh and as far as I know never wore our shirt.

I didn't waste my energy in clapping.

Oh to add to it all he didn't even die in an accident, health, tragedy. He went and topped himself and left his family to try and carry on.

Cowards way out.

purpleronnie

purpleronnie

Posted
Posted

True but the behaviour of their fans had a major part in the tragic events of that day.

Not saying I'd have done any different if City had reached a semi final and I didn't have a ticket - I'd have tried anything to get in, but I'd hold my hands up afterwards and say I contributed to it in some way.

Terrible tragedy but there have been others and it's time for the rest of us to move on and leave it to Liverpool to grieve.

Are you a south yorkshire policeman?

 

The evidence shows conclusively that Liverpool fans neither caused nor contributed to the deaths.

leicesterlad1989

leicesterlad1989

Posted
Posted

I never understood why every ground did this, he was Welsh and as far as I know never wore our shirt.

I didn't waste my energy in clapping.

Oh to add to it all he didn't even die in an accident, health, tragedy. He went and topped himself and left his family to try and carry on.

Cowards way out.

Now I do agree with regards to the tributes to Gary Speed. But as for using the fact he took his life as part of the reason now to show respect is a complete joke. Do you understand depression? Having lost a close family friend due to similar circumstances that comment has touched a nerve. Without sounding like Stan Collymore, maybe you should look into depression before making comments like that. Anyway thats off the topic...

Not fussed with a 7 min delay. Unfortunately cant make the game so wont affect my travel arrangements. Plus its the 25th anniversary so its a nice show of respect.

crisp monster

crisp monster

Posted
Posted

Are you a south yorkshire policeman?

The evidence shows conclusively that Liverpool fans neither caused nor contributed to the deaths.

Of course they contributed - thousands turning up without tickets and having no right to enter an area.

Police and Sheffield Wednesday ballsed up massively and should take the blame for the tragedy but do you really think that the Liverpool fans that tried to gain entry when the chance arose,didn't contribute to the whole sequence of events?

The evidence just pointed the finger at the easy targets - and no - I'm not a copper

Jimmy

Jimmy

Posted
Posted

Thousands didn't turn up without tickets, police government and press all conspired and lied about what happened and people like you bought it

leicesterlad1989

leicesterlad1989

Posted
Posted

Don't like this either. If I narrowly missed out on a ticket for the FA Cup semi-final I'd be outraged.

 

Hopefully those 96 tickets will be taken from the free tickets the FA seem to throw around to celebs and god knows who else in the prawn sandwich sections.

Guest MattP

Guest MattP

Posted
Posted

Are you a south yorkshire policeman?

 

The evidence shows conclusively that Liverpool fans neither caused nor contributed to the deaths.

 

Come on Ronnie, to say they didnt contribute is ridiculous. They even did the same in Athens for a Euro final (despite denying it again), if they can do it there can you imagine how many were at it when they went to Hillsboro?

 

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2007/may/25/newsstory.sport8

 

 

Can I go on the record as saying if I am ever killed in a football related disaster that I certainly dont want this as a "tribute" to me.

 

Give my empty seat to a City fan who can't get a ticket or even better had been to the games all season and couldn't afford to go to Wembley.

Captain...

Captain...

Posted
Posted

Come on Ronnie, to say they didnt contribute is ridiculous. They even did the same in Athens for a Euro final (despite denying it again), if they can do it there can you imagine how many were at it when they went to Hillsboro?

 

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2007/may/25/newsstory.sport8

 

 

Can I go on the record as saying if I am ever killed in a football related disaster that I certainly dont want this as a "tribute" to me.

 

Give my empty seat to a City fan who can't get a ticket or even better had been to the games all season and couldn't afford to go to Wembley.

 

What happened in Athens was a disgrace, and from a set of fans that really should know better, but that doesn't go on to prove that it happened20 years earlier at Hillsborough. The report was clear in its findings:

 

 

The report, substantially authored by professor Phil Scraton of Queen's University, Belfast, and unanimously agreed by the panel of eight experts, found there was "no evidence … to verify the serious allegations of exceptional levels of drunkenness, ticketlessness or violence among Liverpool fans".

 

The fact Liverpool fans acted disgracefully in Athens and at Heysel, isn't evidence of any wrongdoing at Hillsborough.

 

As I said in another thread the reason for the continued remembrance of Hillsborough, more so than Bradford, is the shocking nature of it, the importance of the game, the subsequent cover up, the years battling for the truth, the cover-up being exposed and the impact on all football fans, it was the catalyst, more so than Heysel for Football fans being treated as criminals, and it was all based on lies.

 

Hopefully this will be the last significant memorial, 25 years coming so soon after the truth finally coming out, until the 50th anniversary.

Guest MattP

Guest MattP

Posted
Posted

What happened in Athens was a disgrace, and from a set of fans that really should know better, but that doesn't go on to prove that it happened20 years earlier at Hillsborough. The report was clear in its findings:

 

 

The fact Liverpool fans acted disgracefully in Athens and at Heysel, isn't evidence of any wrongdoing at Hillsborough.

 

As I said in another thread the reason for the continued remembrance of Hillsborough, more so than Bradford, is the shocking nature of it, the importance of the game, the subsequent cover up, the years battling for the truth, the cover-up being exposed and the impact on all football fans, it was the catalyst, more so than Heysel for Football fans being treated as criminals, and it was all based on lies.

 

Hopefully this will be the last significant memorial, 25 years coming so soon after the truth finally coming out, until the 50th anniversary.

 

That;s scousers for you though Captain, there is no "knowing better" - had a fixture like that happened a week after Hillsborough they would have poured in ticketless and en masse, it's what they do. It's what anyone who has followed football for a long period of time knows they do.

 

Exceptional levels of drunkenness, ticketlessness or violence among Liverpool fans? the last one is probably true, but as I have said before if you seriously believe there wasn't an excess of drunkeness and ticketless fans then you have would have to live on another planet to buy it. Maybe it was, maybe just for one game in the 70's,80's and 90's they did all turn up sober and conincidentally this was the one.

 

The police still maintain that drunkeness played a huge part though and will be stating that again in the next inquiry. This one will also be calling up numerous fans and pub landlords who can testify to it on the day as well who were excluded from the "independant panel's evidence"

 

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/hillsborough-officers-accuse-liverpool-fans-6676907

 

As I've said again I'm happy to take the information from people who were actually at the event rather than an "independent panel". Not a single one of them was at the game and like pretty much every government inquiry of the last 15 years it reached the verdict they wanted to give.

 

The Bishop of Liverpool was on the "independent panel", the woman who produced that biased Hillsborough documentary was on it, it wasn't remotly independent.

 

I'll tell you the most awful thing about the tragedy, the ones who died were the ones at the front, the guys and girls who were there at 1.30 to get a prime spot watching the football, I bet none of the ticketless gate climbers piling into the middle pen at 3.05 perished in it.

 

History is certainly written by the winners.

Guest MattP

Guest MattP

Posted
Posted

I've heard that Wigan were planning on doing this anyway  :ph34r:

 

24,000 empty seats dedicated to the victims of the 2004 Tsunami.

Leicesterpool

Leicesterpool

Posted
Posted

True but the behaviour of their fans had a major part in the tragic events of that day.

Not saying I'd have done any different if City had reached a semi final and I didn't have a ticket - I'd have tried anything to get in, but I'd hold my hands up afterwards and say I contributed to it in some way.

Terrible tragedy but there have been others and it's time for the rest of us to move on and leave it to Liverpool to grieve.

I agree in some degree that I found it hard to believe that no liverpool fan was drunk on the day. Plus quite a few Liverpool fans who were they did say they believed some Liverpool supporters who did travel didn't have tickets! However the police do play a major part in this disaster. 

Captain...

Captain...

Posted
Posted

That;s scousers for you though Captain, there is no "knowing better" - had a fixture like that happened a week after Hillsborough they would have poured in ticketless and en masse, it's what they do. It's what anyone who has followed football for a long period of time knows they do.

 

Exceptional levels of drunkenness, ticketlessness or violence among Liverpool fans? the last one is probably true, but as I have said before if you seriously believe there wasn't an excess of drunkeness and ticketless fans then you have would have to live on another planet to buy it. Maybe it was, maybe just for one game in the 70's,80's and 90's they did all turn up sober and conincidentally this was the one.

 

The police still maintain that drunkeness played a huge part though and will be stating that again in the next inquiry. This one will also be calling up numerous fans and pub landlords who can testify to it on the day as well who were excluded from the "independant panel's evidence"

 

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/hillsborough-officers-accuse-liverpool-fans-6676907

 

As I've said again I'm happy to take the information from people who were actually at the event rather than an "independent panel". Not a single one of them was at the game and like pretty much every government inquiry of the last 15 years it reached the verdict they wanted to give.

 

The Bishop of Liverpool was on the "independent panel", the woman who produced that biased Hillsborough documentary was on it, it wasn't remotly independent.

 

I'll tell you the most awful thing about the tragedy, the ones who died were the ones at the front, the guys and girls who were there at 1.30 to get a prime spot watching the football, I bet none of the ticketless gate climbers piling into the middle pen at 3.05 perished in it.

 

History is certainly written by the winners.

 

The report says there wasn't exceptional levels of ticketlessness and drunkenness, not that there wasn't any.

 

Continuing to blame it on that is false, people had been drinking, alcohol rarely helps any situation, but it was not the cause. Football matches had been rife with a small numbre of people without tickets trying to get in, again anyone without a ticket wouldn't have helped, but the numbers were nothing like enough to cause the deaths of 96 people. The reason was a failure to close the gates when the middle and most popular pen was full and funnel people to the side pens, this was then exacerbated by the cage surrounding the pen and the police not realising the severity of it and fighting them back.

 

This is why it is still a big deal, because now the truth has been revealed, people are still questioning it and trying to blame the Liverpool fans, it was a tragic accident, caused by incompetence, followed by a gross miscarriage of justice.

StanSP

StanSP

Posted
Posted

Anyone else think we might seal promotion against Reading? Like they did to us all those years back, needing a draw (?) at the Walkers to seal their way back to the Premier League. Would be one of those quirks where we do/need the same and get promotion in their back yard.

 

Had a quick glance at the fixtures and worked it out in my head if it could work out or if we might even get the job done before but still not sure.

shade

shade

Posted
Posted

The report says there wasn't exceptional levels of ticketlessness and drunkenness, not that there wasn't any.

Continuing to blame it on that is false, people had been drinking, alcohol rarely helps any situation, but it was not the cause. Football matches had been rife with a small numbre of people without tickets trying to get in, again anyone without a ticket wouldn't have helped, but the numbers were nothing like enough to cause the deaths of 96 people. The reason was a failure to close the gates when the middle and most popular pen was full and funnel people to the side pens, this was then exacerbated by the cage surrounding the pen and the police not realising the severity of it and fighting them back.

This is why it is still a big deal, because now the truth has been revealed, people are still questioning it and trying to blame the Liverpool fans, it was a tragic accident, caused by incompetence, followed by a gross miscarriage of justice.

nah it was the scousers, Jeremy Clarkson said so while he was sneering at a Sikh on MattP's behalf.

The Doctor

The Doctor

Posted
Posted

Anyone else think we might seal promotion against Reading? Like they did to us all those years back, needing a draw (?) at the Walkers to seal their way back to the Premier League. Would be one of those quirks where we do/need the same and get promotion in their back yard.

 

Had a quick glance at the fixtures and worked it out in my head if it could work out or if we might even get the job done before but still not sure.

 

I'd expect it to be done before to be frank - We could confirm it against Brighton by winning v Yeovil, Brighton & Sheff Weds, drawing with Burnley and Wigan if:

 

QPR and wigan draw tonight, QPR draw one other game and Derby draw 2 games in the next 4. Shouldn't be that hard - QPR face Blackburn, Blackpool and Bournemouth in that time & Derby face Ipswich, Middlesbrough, Charlton, Blackpool.

 

I could certainly see Ipswich, M'Boro and Blackburn picking up a point in those sets of matches.

Dan

Dan

Posted
Posted

That's a fair bit of working out considering just one result blows up the entire thing lol

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