Defensive Shambles

[Trav Le Bleu]

1 minute ago, Goober said:

Anyone think our current shitness from set-pieces is because of these new regulations for holding in the box? We were very sly in our box last year and got away with a lot, but it was very effective, good defending. We may have had to consciously change our style

Yeah, I agree, but we knew this the same as any other team and have had time to change our style.

 

My own take is that we need to bed Hernandez in somewhere, Hugh and Morgan aren't getting any younger. I'd like to see him start next to Wes for a few games regularly. Not saying that will sort our problems, but I think it's worth trying.

 

A fit Mendy could well make a difference too. Had Kante been injured early doors last season, we might have suffered similarly.

[Fox92]

4 hours ago, lee7 said:

Conceding 12 goals in 3 matches against Liverpool, Chelsea and Man united shows just how defensively weak we have become. 

We can no longer play 4-4-2 against the big teams. 

Totally agree. We had a World Class defensive midfielder last season mopping everything up and protecting our poor defence. Now that's gone we seem to have gone back three years.

 

Our defence is too old - particularly Huth and Morgan - and we should have bought in replacements in the summer. Something else we got wrong.

[fuchsntf]

4 hours ago, Col city fan said:

Here we go...it didn't take long did it.

This defence is the SAME back four who were an absolute rock last season. Yet now, apparently, they are over the hill.

Look to the midfield. There's the problem...... Did you not see goal 2 and 3 today? Mata, completely unmarked, with time to do what Mata does well.

I didn't think it would be long before the defence started to be scapegoated.

Todays team was the same team as last season, with the same formation, with one change....Kante out, Amartey in.

It might be a valid point Col, except the goals were movements from corners,

Thats the back 4 jobs.

Dont forget, even when DD or Kante sometimes went walk about, and our defence

was under pressure last season...they held out.

Plus when Kante got beaten or outpaced, the defence was well placed and covered.

I am one of the 1st on this forum to protect and not try and go over the top on

Game mistakes, or a poor performances.

Granted Amartey is no Kante, but Kante has gone.

I actually think it was right to try this set up in the c 1st few games,

including this one.

One could say the club invested in a defender, a midfielder, and 2 strikers, across each line.+GK

We had young players in the squad waiting to break through So on basics duty done.

But its the basics letting us down, plus not to forget everybody last season  ran around like a bluearsed- fly.

 

I am far from panicking, but the L'pool and this Manu game have seen a previous top defence implode against quality in your face opposition players.

Morgan with 4 closed seasons at full pull, plus the high intensive normal season,

That must have a down side, and Negative effects on your mental and physical attributes.

He is paying for his dedication, and imo its cost him.Not meaning he is finished, not meaning

other players are not to blame for the 4 games 4 goals against the elite.

Claudio needs to look for a plan and Stratergy, and yes agreeing with you on the midfield....

Albrighton might need to be sacrificed (I am a big fan of his) at away games, and now I see Gray pushing both him and Mahrez for the right for a longer run.

Though we might need to Accomodate the idea of playing DD, Mendy, Amartey together.

If we had lost 2-1 today , I wouldnt have seen it so bad, but it wasnt just something, or just Kante..there is alot Of  misfiring and alot of that something missing...

I have never been so negative...

Todays side at home ,with an another slight tweek and approach, should be ok.

 

[Col city fan]

41 minutes ago, fuchsntf said:

It might be a valid point Col, except the goals were movements from corners,

Thats the back 4 jobs.

Dont forget, even when DD or Kante sometimes went walk about, and our defence

was under pressure last season...they held out.

Plus when Kante got beaten or outpaced, the defence was well placed and covered.

I am one of the 1st on this forum to protect and not try and go over the top on

Game mistakes, or a poor performances.

Granted Amartey is no Kante, but Kante has gone.

I actually think it was right to try this set up in the c 1st few games,

including this one.

One could say the club invested in a defender, a midfielder, and 2 strikers, across each line.+GK

We had young players in the squad waiting to break through So on basics duty done.

But its the basics letting us down, plus not to forget everybody last season  ran around like a bluearsed- fly.

 

I am far from panicking, but the L'pool and this Manu game have seen a previous top defence implode against quality in your face opposition players.

Morgan with 4 closed seasons at full pull, plus the high intensive normal season,

That must have a down side, and Negative effects on your mental and physical attributes.

He is paying for his dedication, and imo its cost him.Not meaning he is finished, not meaning

other players are not to blame for the 4 games 4 goals against the elite.

Claudio needs to look for a plan and Stratergy, and yes agreeing with you on the midfield....

Albrighton might need to be sacrificed (I am a big fan of his) at away games, and now I see Gray pushing both him and Mahrez for the right for a longer run.

Though we might need to Accomodate the idea of playing DD, Mendy, Amartey together.

If we had lost 2-1 today , I wouldnt have seen it so bad, but it wasnt just something, or just Kante..there is alot Of  misfiring and alot of that something missing...

I have never been so negative...

Todays side at home ,with an another slight tweek and approach, should be ok.

 

Watch goals 2 and 3 back...and the bloke nearest to Mata on both occasions who hadn't tracked his run. Then reply.

Im with you on goals 1 and 4.. They were defensive errors on set pieces.

[GaelicFox]

6 hours ago, lee7 said:

Conceding 12 goals in 3 matches against Liverpool, Chelsea and Man united shows just how defensively weak we have become. 

We can no longer play 4-4-2 against the big teams. 

How many were from set pieces and corners and poor marking ...

 

the formation needs changing agreed 

 

but we have to face facts huth and Morgans lack of pace to react is scary and they are a liability right now , mainly because their aggressive marking has been taking away from them with the rule change 

 

we we need a young quick and proven centre half in January 20-30m ! Get it spent 

[GaelicFox]

21 minutes ago, Col city fan said:

Watch goals 2 and 3 back...and the bloke nearest to Mata on both occasions who hadn't tracked his run. Then reply.

Im with you on goals 1 and 4.. They were defensive errors on set pieces.

2nd goal was Morgan's fault terrible attempted clearance and ya he was asleep for 3rd goal but so was Simpson in middle 

 

if your calling him out at being at fault for both goals that's harsh IMO 

[Koke]

Huth is 32 and Morgan is 33 in January. I'm astonished that we didn't invest in couple of young ish CBs in the summer. Hernandez is OK as cover but I'm not sure he will ever be good enough as consistent first choice.

[GaelicFox]

7 minutes ago, Koke said:

Huth is 32 and Morgan is 33 in January. I'm astonished that we didn't invest in couple of young ish CBs in the summer. Hernandez is OK as cover but I'm not sure he will ever be good enough as consistent first choice.

This !

[MurphyMagic]

Some serious work needs to be done on defending crosses into our box. This really should of been addressed a long time ago as even last season we looked vulnerable from crosses. We just don't seem to attack the ball and always seem to be rooted to the ground. 

 

Hopefully today will wake the players up to try and get back to doing the basics well including matching the opposition for work rate, because to me even that seems lacking at the moment, with Vardy being a prime example. He just isn't quite as relentless with defending from the front as he once was. 

[lgfualol]

8 minutes ago, Koke said:

Huth is 32 and Morgan is 33 in January. I'm astonished that we didn't invest in couple of young ish CBs in the summer. Hernandez is OK as cover but I'm not sure he will ever be good enough as consistent first choice.

We should have got Süle in. Young German that Huth would have helped to form into a destroyer. 

[dedlock]

Our defence was like a colander.

We need to defend corners better, Smalling scored too easily.

The defending in that 5 minute spell when 3 goals were conceded was shambolic,poor concentration and poor positioning.

CR needs to seriously deal with this in training. He managed it last season. Promises of pizza?

[fuchsntf]

6 hours ago, Col city fan said:

Here we go...it didn't take long did it.

This defence is the SAME back four who were an absolute rock last season. Yet now, apparently, they are over the hill.

Look to the midfield. There's the problem...... Did you not see goal 2 and 3 today? Mata, completely unmarked, with time to do what Mata does well.

I didn't think it would be long before the defence started to be scapegoated.

Todays team was the same team as last season, with the same formation, with one change....Kante out, Amartey in.

 

 

[sly1]

Get it sorted city not good enough 

[Aidan]

11 hours ago, Mickyblueeyes said:

Ranieri is being really tested this year. So far he is failing. I don't care what people think. My opinion is he is out of his depth. 

Agree. My feeling also even last season. Ranieri reminds me of Peter Sellers' 'Chance' character in 'Being There'. He is a likable person but I believe he is a below average coach, especially in the PL. Dilly Ding Dilly Dong type of coaching can only take you so far. I'd say the Lads did it last season in spite of CL not because of him. This season, the team as a whole simply lost that hunger and passion. 

[Grewks]

13 hours ago, Charl91 said:

I'm sorry, but I've been saying this all season. Amartey is not good enough. He's been poor in every game bar Swansea. He has no positional sense whatsoever, doesn't seem to work hard enough for a defensive midfielder, his passing is terrible and unimaginative, and he misses far too many tackles.

 

I don't care about the "He's only young, he'll get better" bollocks. He's not good enough now.

 

?

 

Instead of bashing a kid which was signed because 'He's only young, he'll get better".

 

 

Blame the manager who decided to not even try and replace Kante (We were linked with Gueye weeks before Walsh went to Everton, and also last year before we got Kante).

[erlee]

Chelsea's system doesn;t suit Kante from day#1 - so he is floundering there too

 

Meanwhile our passing (i,e. ball)  is abysmal - we have not improved one bit from last season.  Have you noticed we keep giving the ball away - non crisp passing, not enough power, too high/bounce..  basically not good enough.  The diff this season is - our tenacity/defence has not been able to compensate for the loss of  ball-possession...

[Aidan]

5 hours ago, erlee said:

Chelsea's system doesn;t suit Kante from day#1 - so he is floundering there too

 

Meanwhile our passing (i,e. ball)  is abysmal - we have not improved one bit from last season.  Have you noticed we keep giving the ball away - non crisp passing, not enough power, too high/bounce..  basically not good enough.  The diff this season is - our tenacity/defence has not been able to compensate for the loss of  ball-possession...

Right on!

[foxfanazer]

It was embarrassing to watch yesterday. I was working in a bookies and people were putting on bets for 8 and 9 nil at half time

[Foxhateram]

19 hours ago, Tuna said:

 

The problem is Amartey is a 21 year old kid who has only played in the Danish league which lets face it is about as good as the SPL. It's hard to expect too much from him but there we are, we have nobody else. We didn't strenthen enough in the summer, we were unlucky with Papy Mendy's injury but we are exhausting Drinkwater by playing him every game and the only other option we have is King who I'm sorry to say, yes good club man, but he's best coming off the bench to see out victories not starting games, realistically he's not good enough for where we are supposed to be now. Letting Inler go looks like a mistake as he may have come in useful in matches such as these.

Well Inler was shite for us so you can forget that one, and I would like to point out that once King came on yesterday we scored a goal and kept a clean sheet. Drinky needs someone disciplined in positioning to sit just behind him and sweep. When we play Okazaki then he sweeps infront of drinky. Almost giving him a free role to win posession and deliver quickly. Now without a disciplined Kante and a number 10, he is leaving gaps by chasing the ball to win it, which the best teams are exploiting.That's not drinkys fault though, it is the players around him.

 

I honestly think the worse thing we've done is remove that number 10 player and replace him with an out and out striker. You can't play 4.4.2 these days and have 2 out and out strikers who like to sit high up the pitch. It's like playing 5 a side with that fat guy who just goal hangs. It never works out well.

[stretch1965]

Not panicking yet, we are still in transition and behind the scenes the back room staff will be go through pool/ manure matches with a fine tooth comb and will be identifying areas to address.

 

The league form will take a bit of a knocking because of the champs league however experience in this competition is invaluable going forward.

It might take a two or three transfer Windows and some of the younger players to develop but with the committed owners we have I think in two years time we will be a force with a squad to accommodate most major competitions.

[Mark 'expert' Lawrenson]

The defence is going to need a complete overhaul after this season, both central defenders are aged 32, full backs 29 and 30, soon a whole new defence will be required , yes we have Chilwell for left back but we're going to have to be busy in the transfer market, maybe even in the January window.

 

[Mickyblueeyes]

18 hours ago, lgfualol said:

Do you remember when he won us the league a few months ago

I'm sorry but I think you're missing the point. By winning the league as football fans we are now barred from questioning the manager, his tactics and quite evident flaws for his entire time here? 

 

Success breeds expectations. Nigel was not above criticism after he got us promoted and we sat bottom of the league. Which was right. In the same way nor is Ranieri. Fans are very quick to jump on fellow fans who question the manager as Pearson supporters, as deluded, as ungrateful or some other reason without actually engaging in a debate as to what our bloody stark obvious problem is! 

 

These signs were evident from pre-season. We were ripped apart by Barca and Psg in the same manner. When questioned. Oh, it's barca and psg what do you expect. Ok, fair point. We were incredibly short against Hull and concealed two goals (one from a corner and one from Snodgrass ghosting into the box unmarked) and the reason was we were unfit. Ok, fair enough. We have now been ripped apart by Liverpool, Chelsea (albeit with different players on the pitch) and Man U. Playing go the same system and philosophy. There has been no change and what we had in abundance last year and for a few months the season before that is so far gone we look a pretty different side. Who do you question for that? The kit man? Frank who sits in row DD? The tea lady? No you question the manager as to why we are not adapting to our flaws and giving a better account of ourselves. 

 

Our collapses are on par with the Bolton 5-0 under Taylor all those years ago. Don't get me wrong I respect Ranieri and what he hs done but he seems (evidence on what is being seen from the outside and our continued under-prepared approach to these sort of games) that he is also lacking the tactical know how this year. This is not blasphemy and unlike the earlier poster a call for a return to Pearson (very original and calculated response). It's a genuine question as to whether Claudio sees what is happening and why there is no fix. We seem in-prepared for this season and have not adapted to key loss in the team. There seems some expensive bystanders who are not competing for places and again, I will question the manager. We can't shake up the defence because our £7 million pound player is deemed not good enough! We have replaced Kante with a player who doesn't have the maturity (yet!) to play that role but continue to play the same formation/system as last year - surely these are all questions for the manager? 

 

I'm not saying we should be challenging for the title. I'm saying I want to see my team compete. Had we lost that game 2-0 but had a couple of chances and actually made United break sweat you right it off and go on. We are not and that's why until I see something different the manager is to be questioned. 

 

So no, I don't forget what he did last year. I certainly am not callings for his head. But it's as clear as day his management (albeit tactically or with the aide of his coaching staff) is lacking at present.

 

 

 

 

[Foxes1]

13 hours ago, Koke said:

Huth is 32 and Morgan is 33 in January. I'm astonished that we didn't invest in couple of young ish CBs in the summer. Hernandez is OK as cover but I'm not sure he will ever be good enough as consistent first choice.

We tried and failed to get Keane in from Burnley he is young and knows the English game so whoever's job it is to target transfers knew this and as soon as we were quoted too much we gave in  trying to sign a CB and ended up targeting strikers instead. Should we go back for Keane January probably yes but if we are struggling who is going to want to come to the club.

[erlee]

4 hours ago, Mark 'expert' Lawrenson said:

The defence is going to need a complete overhaul after this season, both central defenders are aged 32, full backs 29 and 30, soon a whole new defence will be required , yes we have Chilwell for left back but we're going to have to be busy in the transfer market, maybe even in the January window.

 

DOESN'T HAVE TO BE 'after this season'   could start in January. . . but between now & january - there's plenty of games.

 

Let's see if Ranieri stick with the flat back 4 & pushing up close to centre circle.  Fuchs - attacking left back (& need to scramble back)..  Huth - slow, Morgan - slightly faster than Huth; Simpson - slightly faster than Morgan.....      defence in shambles this season. needs the goalie to sweep quickfast
 

DILLY DING DILLY GONE

[Sharpe's Fox]

22 hours ago, Goober said:

Anyone think our current shitness from set-pieces is because of these new regulations for holding in the box? We were very sly in our box last year and got away with a lot, but it was very effective, good defending. We may have had to consciously change our style

Not only this but the referee was Mike Dean yesterday who has been dishing out penalties for this left, right and centre this season for grappling. I would expect Huthy to be his usual, grabby self next time.