General Election, June 8th

[Guest Foxin_mad]

16 hours ago, daz*dsb said:

I agree that the protest shouldn't be violent or cause serious disorder, there is no benefit in that to anyone.

 

But people have a right to protest and a right to take to the streets - just because it doesn't suit your viewpoint and it isn't at what you'd deem a suitable time doesn't make it any less their right to do so. 

 

Just because the current government won with extra seats at a democratic election doesn't mean that the large numbers who didn't vote for them can't come out in protest at the way things are being run. The idea that 'you lost so sit down, shut up and take it as it comes' isn't any good at all either.

 

I accept that Brexit is happening - I don't accept nor like the Tory approach to it. I accept that the Tories are in government, they 'won' the GE - I don't accept the way in which they're currently operating this country. If large numbers of people taking to the streets makes them realise that despite their 'win' there are still large numbers of people who are disgruntled with their current 'system' then that's a good thing. They need to realise that there's half a country (nearly / approx) who aren't on board with what they're doing and they need to make some serious changes to their manifesto and operation to appease them. 

Peaceful protest is fine, the fact it is called a day of rage and run by an organisation called  'Movement for Justice By Any Means Necessary' seems to suggest it will not likely be peaceful.

 

We do not even know what the queens speech is yet, the Tories may have though **** it lets spend a shit load of money we don't have as that's what the young want. They have already acknowledged that changes have to be made to the manifesto.

 

2

16 hours ago, leicsmac said:

I think the irony lies in the idea or belief that the other side of the spectrum have never endorsed such action themselves.

I am not sure there have been any events where the far right (however despicable they maybe) have threatened to bring down a government that was democratically elected, but I am happy for you to enlighten me with examples.

 

16 hours ago, Buce said:

 

Do they not have annual leave where you work?

 

 

Link?

I wouldn't waste a days leave to go and stand with a bunch people like this:

 

http://www.lbc.co.uk/politics/parties/labour/uncovered-john-mcdonnell-praises-2010-riots/

 

 

[DJ Barry Hammond]

14 hours ago, MattP said:

It was a 2% swing to Labour in the election, it's actually not that much, both main parties were flattered by the voting collapse of the third parties. May got the biggest vote share since Major but I'm not going to convince myself it's a victory for her, it wasn't.

 

I don't think we are socialists at all, I just think we have a lot of young people who haven't seen what socialism is yet decided to vote for someone who promised them a lot of things, they soon might and at least then we'll kill it off for another 30 years.

 

Perhaps what is more concerning is for some reason a majority of our country we're quite willing to vote for one of the most uninspiring manifesto's ever known in recent memory.

 

What the two positions combined probably show us is that politics overall is letting people down, giving a binary choice that a majority can't decide on with any enthusiasm.

[Strokes]

1 hour ago, toddybad said:

Really struggling to see why the over 65s are getting so defensive when their votes have given the largest party its seats at the recent election and their votes have seen the core of government policies being produced to target the grey vote for decades. 

Because people have suggested they lose their votes, people have fought wars for such things.

[RobHawk]

17 hours ago, Foxin_mad said:

Calling it a 'Day or Rage' doesn't exactly suggest its going to be a nice peaceful protest. The fact its on a working day gives a good indication on the type of momentum activists that will be turning up.

 

No not at all. This is true, the country has bigger issues. People in Labour are advocating riots and disorder to bring down a government that although it does not have a commons majority it has a significant number of extra seats and won a democratic election in a democratic country. I can understand people may peaceful protest but McDonnell essentially calling  for disorder is a disgrace.

Same could have been said for the Brexit referendum - How much has that cost?

[Guest MattP]

40 minutes ago, DJ Barry Hammond said:

Perhaps what is more concerning is for some reason a majority of our country we're quite willing to vote for one of the most uninspiring manifesto's ever known in recent memory.

 

What the two positions combined probably show us is that politics overall is letting people down, giving a binary choice that a majority can't decide on with any enthusiasm.

Only because of the alternative on offer I would imagine.

 

The other option on offer was the absolute economic destruction of the country under the Labour manifesto.

 

41 minutes ago, Foxin_mad said:

I wouldn't waste a days leave to go and stand with a bunch people like this:

 

http://www.lbc.co.uk/politics/parties/labour/uncovered-john-mcdonnell-praises-2010-riots/

Very few of these people will have taken a day off, it will be the same people who turn up to all these protests, like the women you pictured. McDonnell has tweeted again this morning about the need for it to be peaceful, this is a man who knows he'll be in the shit soon as this turns violent over his comments in the past.

 

If you want a protest to be peaceful, do you?

 

1) Call it a "day of rage"

2) Not call it a "day of rage"

 

Any sensible person knows the answer.

[Guest]

19 minutes ago, RobHawk said:

Same could have been said for the Brexit referendum - How much has that cost?

 

Not as much as it's going to.

 

2 minutes ago, MattP said:

Only because of the alternative on offer I would imagine.

 

The other option on offer was the absolute economic destruction of the country under the Labour manifesto.

 

Very few of these people will have taken a day off, it will be the same people who turn up to all these protests, like the women you pictured. McDonnell has tweeted again this morning about the need for it to be peaceful, this is a man who knows he'll be in the shit soon as this turns violent over his comments in the past.

 

If you want a protest to be peaceful, do you?

 

1) Call it a "day of rage"

2) Not call it a "day of rage"

 

Any sensible person knows the answer.

Economic destruction - lmao

Day of rage - yes, not the cleverest thing to have called for.

[Realist Guy In The Room]

5 minutes ago, MattP said:

Only because of the alternative on offer I would imagine.

 

The other option on offer was the absolute economic destruction of the country under the Labour manifesto.

 

Very few of these people will have taken a day off, it will be the same people who turn up to all these protests, like the women you pictured. McDonnell has tweeted again this morning about the need for it to be peaceful, this is a man who knows he'll be in the shit soon as this turns violent over his comments in the past.

 

If you want a protest to be peaceful, do you?

 

1) Call it a "day of rage"

2) Not call it a "day of rage"

 

Any sensible person knows the answer.

Or maybe just dont have a protest?

 

They dont actually achieve anything.

[Guest MattP]

6 minutes ago, Realist Guy In The Room said:

Or maybe just dont have a protest?

 

They dont actually achieve anything.

People always have a right to protest, no problem with that.

 

They should always be more considerate about timing and rhetoric though, the public will judge them at the end of the day.

[Guest Foxin_mad]

32 minutes ago, RobHawk said:

Same could have been said for the Brexit referendum - How much has that cost?

A lot and I was against it, again particularly because of the poor campaigns and bad delivery of key information, but that said in the last election (2015) presumably people voted for it as it was in Cameron's manifesto and he got a majority, if they didn't want it they should have voted elsewhere?! I am not against people having choice on anything.

[Buce]

18 minutes ago, Realist Guy In The Room said:

Or maybe just dont have a protest?

 

They dont actually achieve anything.

 

Two words: Poll Tax.

[Guest Foxin_mad]

12 minutes ago, Realist Guy In The Room said:

Or maybe just dont have a protest?

 

They dont actually achieve anything.

 

4 minutes ago, MattP said:

People always have a right to protest, no problem with that.

 

They should always be more considerate about timing and rhetoric though, the public will judge them at the end of the day.

This.

 

I think that done correctly protest is a fine thing and it can achieve a great deal, as we have seen in the past. A peaceful mobilisation of people whatever their views is powerful and in very large numbers would send out a statement.

 

But to have something called a 'day of rage' suggests a group of self serving twats who want to smash up some things and loot some shops, probably for the latest iPhone.

 

Of course they will all be holding some intelligent placard from 'Socialist Worker' saying '**** the Tories' or 'Kill Tory Scum.' Ranting some bollocks about 'class wars', Labour have been advocating a 'class war'.......of course they do realise that a lot of charitable work and donations come from the rich and elderly, the rich already pay for 80% of our public services, do we really want a 'war' with them FFS!

[Darkon84]

It'll be interesting to see how these protests go today and whether they can actually stay peaceful for once. They're already being accused of hijacking the grief of the Grenfell disaster, with the residents already distancing themselves from the people who claim to be protesting on their behalf.

 

[DJ Barry Hammond]

25 minutes ago, Realist Guy In The Room said:

Or maybe just dont have a protest?

 

They dont actually achieve anything.

 

Dr King may disagree with you. 

 

The anecdotal problem I would suggest however, is peaceful protests tend to have much less of an impact these days. To be successful, your protest needs some sort of edge to get it noticed and make the bums of those in power twitch.

 

Simply marching in numbers and shouting doesn't tend to do this anymore. There has to be a stunt or extra endorsement to the campaign that gets it in people's minds.

[Rincewind]

Doing nothing achieves less.

[Nick]

Awful Queens Speech...

[Rincewind]

Some will say it was brilliant. But if it was spoken in Mandarin backwards they say it was brilliant.

 

Certainly be imore interesting. 

[Nick]

 

 

She's got to dash in all fairness as she has to get to Ascot to represent 'the people'...

[Alf Bentley]

5 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said:

 

 

She's got to dash in all fairness as she has to get to Ascot to represent 'the people'...

 

Mr. Skinner referred to this in his habitual contribution:

 

 

[Nick]

I also didn't know a Queens speech could be delivered without a minority government agreement in place?

[Nick]

1 minute ago, Alf Bentley said:

 

Mr. Skinner referred to this in his habitual contribution:

 

 

That's brilliant  

[Alf Bentley]

1 minute ago, Swan Lesta said:

I also didn't know a Queens speech could be delivered without a minority government agreement in place?

 

I presume that 1978-79 was the last time it happened, was it?

Minority Labour Govt under Callaghan after the collapse of the Lib-Lab pact?

[Nick]

2 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

 

I presume that 1978-79 was the last time it happened, was it?

Minority Labour Govt under Callaghan after the collapse of the Lib-Lab pact?

Sure - I simply thought the DUP agreement would have to be done before this process took place...

 

So what happens now - do the commons vote on whether to accept the governments proposals? 

[Guest MattP]

3 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

Mr. Skinner referred to this in his habitual contribution:

 

 

That's pretty funny.

 

Nothing I didn't expect from that speech, the awful foxhunting vote binned, expansion of grammar schools sacrified and it totally revolved around Brexit, was never going to be anything radical after the result the election delivered.

[Guest MattP]

1 minute ago, Swan Lesta said:

Sure - I simply thought the DUP agreement would have to be done before this process took place...

 

So what happens now - do the commons vote on whether to accept the governments proposals? 

Next week.

[Nick]

Just now, MattP said:

That's pretty funny.

 

Nothing I didn't expect from that speech, the awful foxhunting vote binned, expansion of grammar schools sacrified and it totally revolved around Brexit, was never going to be anything radical after the result the election delivered.

And the best 'possible' deal..... which sounds like some real fighting talk over some table scraps!