The Politics Thread 2019

[Facecloth]

[BlueSi13]

22 minutes ago, Bryn said:

 

We ask for valid and evidence-based arguments for being stripped of our European citizenship for a bunch of xenophobes. Still haven't seen one in 3 years.

Because we British don't want to be "European Union Citizens".  If that's so important to you you still have time to leave 

[Mike Oxlong]

1 hour ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

Cons now polling at 33% on YouGov

“Cons”

 

Mmm, seems quite apt ! 

[Voll Blau]

19 minutes ago, BlueSi13 said:

Because we British don't want to be "European Union Citizens".  If that's so important to you you still have time to leave 

I was born in Britain with, as far as I know, exclusively British ancestry.

 

I'll stay here and fight until I regain my right to be a European citizen ta. The sheer arrogance of your statement makes me even more determined in that mission.

[Strokes]

Wow this thread is even more vile now, you all deserve each other.

[Donk]

1 hour ago, Facecloth said:

Leicester_easily_led?

Leicester_simpleton?

Leicester_shoot_myself_in_the_foot?

Leicester_i_knew_what_i_was_voting_for_even_though_it_was_never_clear_what_we_were_getting?

 

Any of these could work.

Leicester_i_voted_to_leave_i_didnt_vote_for_a_deal_despite_the_whole_campaign_being_built_on_the_premise_we_would_have_a_better_deal_than_currently?

 

Or maybe Leicester_i_voted_leave_because_cameron_told_me_we_were_leaving_the_single_market_irrespective_of_the_fact_he_was_campaigning_to_remain

 

Or just to be concise

Leicester_cognitive_dissonance

[Donk]

1 hour ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

As seems to be the case on here, plenty of people ask for the 52% to put their reasons up why, they put them up then are slated for it. Others like me have got bored of doing so, so will just get abuse from posters such as yourselves for having a difference of opinion.

 

Is that Communism? Facism? I don't know.

 

Enjoy your day all

The reason you and other brexiteers (not exclusively you) get slated is that almost every reason that is put up as a reason to brexit can be shot to pieces within about 2 minutes.

 

When this happens, you feel youve been made to look silly. So you entrench your position further because when youre enlightened as to why your belief is wrong, which could have been honest or simply through lack of information, you perceive this as the "remoaner" side patronising you and abusing you.

 

Then, other people who now also feel silly when really they should feel more enlightened and informed, will create an echo chamber where you reject the informed opinion of people who are demonstrating why you are wrong.

 

This creates a siege mentality where the other side of the debate is now your "enemy" even though we are both inhabiting this country together and we will benefit or suffer together.

 

Thats why people dont change their minds.

 

Because logically, facts should change peoples minds.

 

But real world facts are completely irrelevant if you have created an alternative brexit reality.

 

 

[HappyHamza]

49 minutes ago, BlueSi13 said:

Because we British don't want to be "European Union Citizens".  If that's so important to you you still have time to leave 

I think this is basically what it comes down to. 

 

Can I ask why not?

 

Please don't refer to the war in your answer. 

[Facecloth]

51 minutes ago, BlueSi13 said:

Because we British don't want to be "European Union Citizens".  If that's so important to you you still have time to leave 

Fine don't make use of the privileges you gain from being one (although you probably do), but why should I lose my EU citizenship? You might not want to eat apples, but does that mean we should remove them from all shops so nobody can eat them? Or maybe just maybe you can choose not to buy them, and I can still have the choice to do so. Everybodies happy.

[HappyHamza]

29 minutes ago, Strokes said:

Wow this thread is even more vile now, you all deserve each other.

You're making a valid point but our entire democratic system is under huge strain and positions are dangerously entrenched. Just wait until no deal is catastrophic. It won't just be this thread. 

[Buce]

32 minutes ago, Strokes said:

Wow this thread is even more vile now, you all deserve each other.

 

Maybe. 

 

But our kids don’t deserve to have their future stolen by a bunch of xenophobic Little Englanders. 

[Alf Bentley]

1 hour ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

 

As has been said 10000000 times, you can't debunk the arguments because as someone has said earlier they are personal to each individual.

 

Boris must be doing something right to be polling at 33%? Half the country voted to leave. We've got to move on my friend, can't keep crying over spilt milk.

 

At the 2017 election, Theresa May polled 42% and Corbyn polled 40%. Presumably they were both doing something much better than Boris? 

 

Yes, (just over) half the country voted to leave and it's frustrating that we've not finalised anything yet.

But, as you say, people had all sorts of personal reasons for voting as they did - and all sorts of visions as to what Brexit (undefined in the referendum) would mean - and our democratic representatives have been deadlocked about that.

 

Some Leave voters wanted a deal to keep a close relationship with the EU (Soft Brexit). Some wanted a deal offering a more distant relationship (Hard Brexit). Some voted on instinct without thinking much about what Brexit would mean in practice.

Very few, including very few Leave leaders, advocated a No Deal Brexit.....yet we are now told that we have to accept this extreme form of Brexit, and the powers of our democratic representatives have to be limited so as to enable our unelected executive to force through that extreme solution against the will of parliament - or to use it as a threat against the EU (even though Ireland is the only EU state that stands to lose as much from No Deal as the UK does). Some threat! A bit like threatening to damage your neighbour's house by blowing up your own!  

 

We do need to move on. But if we move on by undermining democracy, damaging our economy/society, dividing our people and treating almost half the nation with contempt, then we won't be moving on to a good place.

[Leicester_Loyal]

8 minutes ago, Facecloth said:

Fine don't make use of the privileges you gain from being one (although you probably do), but why should I lose my EU citizenship? You might not want to eat apples, but does that mean we should remove them from all shops so nobody can eat them? Or maybe just maybe you can choose not to buy them, and I can still have the choice to do so. Everybodies happy.

Unfortunately we live in a democracy, and leave won.

 

4 weeks 2 days to go...

Edited 1 September 2019 by Leicester_Loyal

[Facecloth]

2 minutes ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

Unfortunately we live in a democracy, and leave won.

Ah the default answer when you simply can't argue any thing that is good or right about Brexit.

 

You didn't win, nobody won in all of this.

[Buce]

14 minutes ago, HappyHamza said:

You're making a valid point but our entire democratic system is under huge strain and positions are dangerously entrenched. Just wait until no deal is catastrophic. It won't just be this thread. 

 

This. 

 

Brexit has torn apart families and friendships and it's only going to get worse.

Edited 1 September 2019 by Buce

[Facecloth]

5 minutes ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

Unfortunately we live in a democracy, and leave won.

 

4 weeks 2 days to go...

Also people answer like this and wonder why frustrated people call them names. I mean the state of this response, it's pathetic.

[Leicester_Loyal]

4 minutes ago, Facecloth said:

Also people answer like this and wonder why frustrated people call them names. I mean the state of this response, it's pathetic.

What are you expecting, me to type out the thousands of words that have already been said in this thread? It's hilarious how angry you (and others) are getting about it

[Donk]

1 minute ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

Unfortunately we live in a democracy, and leave won.

 

4 weeks 2 days to go...

Not even that statement is fully true.

 

Lets totally ignore the fact electoral law was broken, even though we shouldnt.

 

We live in a parliamentary democracy not a direct democracy.

 

The referendum was advisory so technically it didnt have to be acted upon at all.

 

But being as it WILL be acted upon, it is up to elected members of parliament to agree with a majority over the WAY we leave.

 

Because there is no mandate for any FORM of leave, only "to leave".

 

So unless youre given the type of leave that resides in your head, which is different to the next person, and the next person etc (or more to the point you dont care, because youre an end in itself brexiteer who just wants to put two fingers up at some demographic you vaguely dont like)

 

Then you wont get what you wanted anyway.

 

You could be asked the question "what did you win".... but for the millionth time, you dont know what youve "won" so theres no point cobbling an answer together.

 

And even if you do get exactly what you wanted, youll find out pretty quickly you lost anyway.

 

 

 

[Leicester_Loyal]

Just now, Donk said:

Not even that statement is fully true.

 

Lets totally ignore the fact electoral law was broken, even though we shouldnt.

 

We live in a parliamentary democracy not a direct democracy.

 

The referendum was advisory so technically it didnt have to be acted upon at all.

 

But being as it WILL be acted upon, it is up to elected members of parliament to agree with a majority over the WAY we leave.

 

Because there is no mandate for any FORM of leave, only "to leave".

 

So unless youre given the type of leave that resides in your head, which is different to the next person, and the next person etc (or more to the point you dont care, because youre an end in itself brexiteer who just wants to put two fingers up at some demographic you vaguely dont like)

 

Then you wont get what you wanted anyway.

 

You could be asked the question "what did you win".... but for the millionth time, you dont know what youve "won" so theres no point cobbling an answer together.

 

And even if you do get exactly what you wanted, youll find out pretty quickly you lost anyway.

 

 

 

Same old arguments We've had these for 3 and a half years

[Donk]

1 minute ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

Same old arguments We've had these for 3 and a half years

And they are as true today as they were then.

 

And you couldnt answer then and still cant now.

 

If you took a step back, youd eventually realise youre posting smiley face emojis celebrating the fact you voted to make yourself poorer.

 

Enjoy your "winnings".

[Facecloth]

7 minutes ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

What are you expecting, me to type out the thousands of words that have already been said in this thread? It's hilarious how angry you (and others) are getting about it

You can't see why people are pissed off about the country going down the shitter?

Edited 1 September 2019 by Facecloth

[Donk]

1 minute ago, Facecloth said:

You can't see why people are pissed off about the country going down the shitter?

No he cant.

 

Because what he "won" was seeing people who actually understand whats going on get frustrated.

 

And thats all he ever wanted.

 

To say "my lifes shit and full of vague repressed hate. So you can have some too"

[Rain King]

24 minutes ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

Unfortunately we live in a democracy, and leave won.

 

4 weeks 2 days to go...

What's happening on October 1st?

[Donk]

Just now, pds said:

What's happening on October 1st?

Leicester_Loyal's premature brexit ejaculation.

[UpTheLeagueFox]

 

"Nahhhhh, I'll wait for Survation, the other pollsters are run by right wing companies. Oh, this IS survation....."