Harry Souttar

[Osavo]

5 hours ago, Lambert09 said:

With a change of manager you don’t think you could make up 6 points? 
 

we’re at the worst we could be, I don’t think it’s crazy to think we could improve. I don’t think we will under marti but it’s hardly the most unreasonable possibility.

 

Obviously depending on the outcome of the psr nonsense 

I genuinely don't think we can. The club appears completely rotten and, although not doing a brilliant job, Cifuentes has been dealt a bad hand. 

 

Even if we sack this manager, which I think should happen btw, do you trust the board to hire a competent replacement capable of rallying the dressing room and closing the gap?

[jayfox26]

35 minutes ago, Osavo said:

I genuinely don't think we can. The club appears completely rotten and, although not doing a brilliant job, Cifuentes has been dealt a bad hand. 

 

Even if we sack this manager, which I think should happen btw, do you trust the board to hire a competent replacement capable of rallying the dressing room and closing the gap?

I dont trust them to hire a competent manager but im also not convinced that any competent manager would come here. We need someone experienced at this level who could get us tactically sound and motivate the players and use them to their strengths. Mowbray could be an option. Isn't glamorous but would steady us for now. Guaranteed if we sacked Marti that they'd hire Russell Martin and if that's the case id rather keep Marti.

[Lambert09]

4 hours ago, Osavo said:

I genuinely don't think we can. The club appears completely rotten and, although not doing a brilliant job, Cifuentes has been dealt a bad hand. 

 

Even if we sack this manager, which I think should happen btw, do you trust the board to hire a competent replacement capable of rallying the dressing room and closing the gap?

I guess my hope is that they get lucky. Like with maresca. I actually think we may go and try and get BBM back from cardiff.  He was brought here with an eye on making him a manager and things just didn’t line up. Now that he’s had a real job and is proving himself  I would bet anything we’d at least try 

[ACF]

He will be desperate to prove his fitness and form for the World Cup. Souttar Nelson & Okoli back three would save lives 

[Muzzy_no7]

Presuming he wasn’t registered and now is 🤷‍♂️

[foxinsocks]

1 hour ago, ACF said:

He will be desperate to prove his fitness and form for the World Cup. Souttar Nelson & Okoli back three would save lives 

But this overlooks the fact thst he isnt very good

[LCFCJohn]

13 minutes ago, foxinsocks said:

But this overlooks the fact thst he isnt very good

Not idea how these injuries will affect him but ability wise, Souttar is a brilliant defender at this level. 

[foxinsocks]

1 minute ago, LCFCJohn said:

Not idea how these injuries will affect him but ability wise, Souttar is a brilliant defender at this level. 

if so then he has hidden it well.  Stoke didn't rate him and his brief spots here were poor.

[CrazyKopCorner]

I thought he was excellent at Brentford and Newcastle away at the end of the 2023. 

 

I also thought Stoke fans did rate him.

[LCFCJohn]

Just now, foxinsocks said:

if so then he has hidden it well.  Stoke didn't rate him and his brief spots here were poor.

Stoke did rate him. He just had an awful injury there and we waved a huge fee under their noses. Separate ability as a defender from the position we were when we signed him, the fee we signed for and the injuries. Being a poor signing due to return and the situation of our club is a separate matter from his ability as a defender at this level. 
 

He was immense for Sheffield United last season when they as a great start to the season and a really strong defensive record. That record and the overall team performance when downhill when they lost Souttar and Arblaster to serious injuries at a similar time (Arblaster has only just returned to their squad in the past couple of weeks so similarly bad to Souttar).

 

I live in Sheffield, I work with Blades fans, I have neighbours and other friends who are Blades fan and watch them a decent amount. They absolutely loved him. He was a rock for them and a club like Sheffield United pride themselves on a strong defence.

[smudger63]

Stoke fans and Sheffield United fans both rated him very highly while playing for them in this league. I would go as far as to say, that had Soutter not got injured last season while at Sheffield United, they would probably have been promoted as Champions. Much like, had we kept kasper the season we were relegated under Rodgers, we would have stayed up.

[LCFCJohn]

3 minutes ago, CrazyKopCorner said:

I thought he was excellent at Brentford and Newcastle away at the end of the 2023. 

 

I also thought Stoke fans did rate him.

They did. It’s just negativity for negativities sake. As I said in a reply about the same, separate the business and the return from our perspective, with ability at this level.

 

No Championship club like Stoke would reject £18mill or whatever it was for a central defender coming off an awful injury no matter how they rate his ability. More fool us for paying it. 
 

And like you say, on the brief times he has even been given a chance for us, he has been good. 
 

Problem is, he is perceived as a ‘lump’, a clogger who can’t play ‘football’. This is an unfair perception anyway as he is not anywhere near as bad as people suggest. But injuries aside, when he has been fit, this is why he has not really played as his face doesn’t fit with our supposed way of playing…

[ClaphamFox]

18 minutes ago, foxinsocks said:

if so then he has hidden it well.  Stoke didn't rate him and his brief spots here were poor.

Both of these statements are completely untrue.

[TheGoldenGod]

23 minutes ago, foxinsocks said:

if so then he has hidden it well.  Stoke didn't rate him and his brief spots here were poor.

Just made something up....fair play!

[Edingleyfox]

I think Souttar is a decent player he was very highly rated in Sheffield and Stoke and I just don’t think he got enough of a run at Leicester. I think he could make a good combination with Nelson..I’m curious as to why he hasn’t been given a few minutes is this fitness or is the club looking to sell.Looks like the club don’t want to sell Okoli but I’m not convinced he is at the same level 

[adejo92]

Is it sheer desperation to think he's going to come in & improve the defence, or is he actually alright?

 

Can't remember how good he was when he played for us what feels like an eternity ago, and never really followed him on loan.

[coolhandfox]

2 hours ago, CrazyKopCorner said:

I thought he was excellent at Brentford and Newcastle away at the end of the 2023. 

 

I also thought Stoke fans did rate him.

Brother is a Stoke fan, told me at the time he thought we over paid and he can only play as one of 3 CBs.

[coolhandfox]

1 hour ago, adejo92 said:

Is it sheer desperation to think he's going to come in & improve the defence, or is he actually alright?

 

Can't remember how good he was when he played for us what feels like an eternity ago, and never really followed him on loan.

Only way the defence improves is better coaching.

[1972 Fox]

5 hours ago, ACF said:

He will be desperate to prove his fitness and form for the World Cup. Souttar Nelson & Okoli back three would save lives 

Okoli is awful. He isn't saving any lives

 

Edited 3 January by 1972 Fox

[LCFCJohn]

1 hour ago, coolhandfox said:

Brother is a Stoke fan, told me at the time he thought we over paid and he can only play as one of 3 CBs.

Neither of these things mean they didn’t rate him or that he isn’t a very good defender at this level.

 

We definitely overpaid. But they can rate him whilst also seeing £ signs when Aiyawatt’s Leicester get in touch. 
 

Again, being better in a 3 is a case of tactical approach. Signs players suited to what you want as a club. Plenty of defenders probably work in a 2 and not a 3 but wouldn’t called not good players as a result. 

[Leicesterpool]

Souttar certainly isnt a top flight player but is really good championship defender cant wait to see him return.

[coolhandfox]

2 minutes ago, LCFCJohn said:

Neither of these things mean they didn’t rate him or that he isn’t a very good defender at this level.

 

We definitely overpaid. But they can rate him whilst also seeing £ signs when Aiyawatt’s Leicester get in touch. 
 

Again, being better in a 3 is a case of tactical approach. Signs players suited to what you want as a club. Plenty of defenders probably work in a 2 and not a 3 but wouldn’t called not good players as a result. 

BIL definitely rated him, just not sure his introduction alone is going to change our fortunes around.

 

I think being better coach and structured is more important than swapping out one player.

 

Whoever has played out of Nelson, Vestergaard, Faes and Okoli we have struggled, not sure adding him in changes it.

Edited 3 January by coolhandfox

[ACF]

1 hour ago, 1972 Fox said:

Okoli is awful. He isn't savin any lives

Come on mate awful is a bit of an over exaggeration. His & Nelson’s biggest weakness is aerial duels. A back three with the giant Harry would help massively. Souttar and Nelson can pass, Okoli can use his physicality and speed. Think this formation is best to get rid of some of our biggest weaknesses in the squad and maximise the chances we could create. We’re getting nothing from our fullbacks.

                     Stol                  
                                        
          Okoli Souttar Nelson          
                                        
             Hamza/Ricardo
              James Skipp               
                                        
           Fatawu Page Monga            
                                        
                Daka/Evans                     

 

[1972 Fox]

4 minutes ago, ACF said:

Come on mate awful is a bit of an over exaggeration. His & Nelson’s biggest weakness is aerial duels. A back three with the giant Harry would help massively. Souttar and Nelson can pass, Okoli can use his physicality and speed. Think this formation is best to get rid of some of our biggest weaknesses in the squad and maximise the chances we could create. We’re getting nothing from our fullbacks.

I don't disagree with most of your points above but I stand by Okoli is awful, if not worse than that.

 

Similarities as a player to Daniel Amartey but worse.

[Spudulike]

Very decent at international level with Australia.