Tom17LCFC Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 How will we know that Pearson isn't good enough, or how will we know that the new manager might be good enough? Any new manager might be good enough. It seems clear right now that Pearson isn't. And if we go down after a manager takes over with 17 points from 24 games, then generally speaking, people will point towards the points total Pearson accumulated as the overbearing reason for our relegation. Unless you see signs that Pearson is top flight management material, as opposed to a laughing stock who misspends money left, right and centre, fields players who plenty of other PL sides knew weren't good enough years ago, picks fights with opposition players, teams and his own fans, and is currently rock bottom, in which case, yeah, it is silly to want Pearson out. But all of the above is kind of, well, entirely true. Even if it astounds you. you make valid points in the first 2 sentences and I can see where you're coming from but in my opinion I can't see any viable alternatives. either he keeps us up and we can build from there or he takes us down and we're in a prime position to rebuild and come back even stronger in 2 seasons time. misspends money? elaborate please... picks fights with opposition players? again please elaborate. if you're on about mccarthur today then I'm slightly concerned for you. he made a one-off comment at a fan, hardly picking a fight. I'm not even gonna go into that because that just opens up a complete different argument I don't think we'd agree on
inckley fox Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 Even though he played well apart from his dire finishing. I think I can. What, in the latest goalless performance for the latest side that's going to get relegated with Nugent in its line-up, did we benefit from player today, in your view? If you like we'll park the fact that he's our 6th most played player, is a centre forward, and has scored 1 goal from open play all season. you make valid points in the first 2 sentences and I can see where you're coming from but in my opinion I can't see any viable alternatives. either he keeps us up and we can build from there or he takes us down and we're in a prime position to rebuild and come back even stronger in 2 seasons time. misspends money? elaborate please... picks fights with opposition players? again please elaborate. if you're on about mccarthur today then I'm slightly concerned for you. he made a one-off comment at a fan, hardly picking a fight. I'm not even gonna go into that because that just opens up a complete different argument I don't think we'd agree on If you need to stay up desperately, have 9m at your disposal, and spend it all on a guy who you leave on the bench then that's sort of misspent, no? Especially when you score no goals in the two games he's left on the bench.
Manwell Pablo Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 We didnt score it led to nothing, he missed a sitter. If your content with that as opposed to a 9.5 miillion pound new striker then should apply for with a job with Nigel So because other people can't finish its Nugents fault and for the last time I have acknowledged his failing in front of goal . I don't think I've said anywhere I don't want Kramaric to play.
cityfanlee23 Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 Can I just remind you all that this season we have won 4 games... to reach 35 points this season (which still isnt SAFE at this point) We need to win another 6, can someone tell me where they are coming from cause I cant see it...
Ric Flair Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 You can put lipstick on a pig, but it is still a pig.
The Doctor Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 How do you know that "one of Europes hottest attacking proprieties" wouldnt have done better which was the original point Is Kramaric a no10 and can he play the link up? He'd probably do better with the finishing, but if he can't do the link up then the chances don't happen in the first place. For me it's Kramaric over Ulloa, not Nugent.
Tom17LCFC Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 What, in the latest goalless performance for the latest side that's going to get relegated with Nugent in its line-up, did we benefit from player today, in your view? If you like we'll park the fact that he's our 6th most played player, is a centre forward, and has scored 1 goal from open play all season. If you need to stay up desperately, have 9m at your disposal, and spend it all on a guy who you leave on the bench then that's sort of misspent, no? Especially when you score no goals in the two games he's left on the bench. I think it's a bit unfair to call the signing of Kramaric money misspent. he's not played competitive football for the best part of 2 months. a bit unreasonable to expect him to start every game unless you'd take him off after 30 minutes. to be fair you can ask why pearson signed him if he needs time to acclimatize but I suppose time will tell.
Ric Flair Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 Can I just remind you all that this season we have won 4 games... to reach 35 points this season (which still isnt SAFE at this point) We need to win another 6, can someone tell me where they are coming from cause I cant see it... Don't worry suddenly Nugent is going to score one on ones, Morgan is going to stop gifting goals and Matty James is going to actually penetrate a defence from a set piece and lead to numerous goals. The lack of trying to change things from Pearson is beyond words. I just pull a horrible face and make noises when I think of our current plight.
inckley fox Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 So because other people can't finish its Nugents fault and for the last time I have acknowledged his failing in front of goal . I don't think I've said anywhere I don't want Kramaric to play. Who, in your view, should score our goals? Because Ulloa's return is quite respectable. Don't we need anybody else to chip in? The fact that he's awful in front of goal, and is one of the players we most need to be reliable in front of goal, is a major reason for us being where we are. Where else do we look? Do we have a go at Schlupp, Mahrez, Cambiasso who have scored pretty much as many goals as you'd have expected them to? If you play two forwards, you need both of them to be capable of scoring once in a while.
jimmeh Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 Its almost as If pearson is trying to get sacked.
inckley fox Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 Is Kramaric a no10 and can he play the link up? He'd probably do better with the finishing, but if he can't do the link up then the chances don't happen in the first place. For me it's Kramaric over Ulloa, not Nugent. Most of the Croatian fans on here said he was a no. 10.
Manwell Pablo Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 What, in the latest goalless performance for the latest side that's going to get relegated with Nugent in its line-up, did we benefit from player today, in your view? If you like we'll park the fact that he's our 6th most played player, is a centre forward, and has scored 1 goal from open play all season. If you need to stay up desperately, have 9m at your disposal, and spend it all on a guy who you leave on the bench then that's sort of misspent, no? Chances were there to win that game so the forwards did their job in creating chances, he looked threatening, unfortunatley when the chances came, they were not put away. And he was as guilty of that as everyone else. My biggest frustration is that of all the people having cracks at goal and getting themselves into good positions. Leo Ulloa failed to be among them once. I can remember people blaming lack of service on the scarce number of chances he gets in October November and December. For me it is becoming abundantly clear he's just got shit movement and positional sense. If you look at most of the goals he's scored two have been put on his head and were good finishes but the rest have literally fell into his lap through defensive errors penalties or miss hit crosses, he is hardly ever stood or running where he should be. Nugent is a pretty bad top level player and will struggle to score a lot of goals (i've been saying this for a very long time) however he does enough for me to be in the side still based on what he's up against. Anyway this isn't the point I was trying to make, the inital point I was making is most of those crying for Pearsons head have been quite vocal about playing Nugent and Ulloa it's a lack of consistancy.
The Doctor Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 Most of the Croatian fans on here said he was a no. 10. Fair enough if so, and if that is the case and he plays the nugent role then I'd have him over Nugent, but Nugent wasn't the problem in todays team: the problem was Ulloas impression of a slab of concrete, the ball bouncing 5 yards every time he tried to control it.
Manwell Pablo Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 Who, in your view, should score our goals? Because Ulloa's return is quite respectable. Don't we need anybody else to chip in? The fact that he's awful in front of goal, and is one of the players we most need to be reliable in front of goal, is a major reason for us being where we are. Where else do we look? Do we have a go at Schlupp, Mahrez, Cambiasso who have scored pretty much as many goals as you'd have expected them to? If you play two forwards, you need both of them to be capable of scoring once in a while. Was respectable. Since the Man u game (that's coming up for 5 months ago) he's got one more league goal than Nugent. And he actually plays up front. But to answer your question Kramaric, obviously.
inckley fox Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 I think it's a bit unfair to call the signing of Kramaric money misspent. he's not played competitive football for the best part of 2 months. a bit unreasonable to expect him to start every game unless you'd take him off after 30 minutes. to be fair you can ask why pearson signed him if he needs time to acclimatize but I suppose time will tell. That's the whole point! It's only misspent if he's on the bench! If your job was to keep a side up, and you had 9m to spend to achieve those aims, then why would you buy a guy who was going to be useless for the next 5 games? My suspicion is that he's not useless, but he might not have been what you needed for that money. Players changed hands for less money than that who will have a very quick impact, and will need to. Either Pearson misspent the only funds he had to keep us up by buying a player who he leaves out of the side, or Pearson made a monumental error in his selection. It's one or the other.
Ric Flair Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 Ulloa has been crap of late in the league. However, David Nugent has missed some disgusting chances againmst Villa and Palace and I can't accept that. I genuinely don't know what our best team is at the minute, all of it has it's downsides. Ulloa still has the knack of scoring every so often, Nugent is so shot of confidence it's horrible to see. That pass to Cambiasso rather than go for goal was an embarrassment.
HankMarvin Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 difference between performance - Nuge has performed well and probably had most touches in opposition half of any of our players in recent games plus pass completion and results - 0 goals scored. His talking taking up a strikers position, albeit because his goal scoring record is so poor his been dropped deeper. We have a young 9.5 million signing on the bench getting splinters up his arse, tracked by a host of clubs across Europe - a)Do you think because Nugent put in a "shift" he should be starting in front of formerly said player b) do you not think this will start to effect Kramarics confidence
Superpants82 Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 The moment the words "the players that got us promotion will get a chance this season" he was doomed to fail. I really believe that to be an underlying fact in the lack of summer transfers.
Webbo Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 Ulloa has been crap of late in the league. However, David Nugent has missed some disgusting chances againmst Villa and Palace and I can't accept that. I genuinely don't know what our best team is at the minute, all of it has it's downsides. Ulloa still has the knack of scoring every so often, Nugent is so shot of confidence it's horrible to see. That pass to Cambiasso rather than go for goal was an embarrassment. He'd have never scored from that angle.
cityfanlee23 Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 That's the whole point! It's only misspent if he's on the bench! If your job was to keep a side up, and you had 9m to spend to achieve those aims, then why would you buy a guy who was going to be useless for the next 5 games? My suspicion is that he's not useless, but he might not have been what you needed for that money. Players changed hands for less money than that who will have a very quick impact, and will need to. Either Pearson misspent the only funds he had to keep us up by buying a player who he leaves out of the side, or Pearson made a monumental error in his selection. It's one or the other. Michu. Laudrup
HankMarvin Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 Chances were there to win that game so the forwards did their job in creating chances, he looked threatening, unfortunatley when the chances came, they were not put away. And he was as guilty of that as everyone else. My biggest frustration is that of all the people having cracks at goal and getting themselves into good positions. Leo Ulloa failed to be among them once. I can remember people blaming lack of service on the scarce number of chances he gets in October November and December. For me it is becoming abundantly clear he's just got shit movement and positional sense. If you look at most of the goals he's scored two have been put on his head and were good finishes but the rest have literally fell into his lap through defensive errors penalties or miss hit crosses, he is hardly ever stood or running where he should be. Nugent is a pretty bad top level player and will struggle to score a lot of goals (i've been saying this for a very long time) however he does enough for me to be in the side still based on what he's up against. Anyway this isn't the point I was trying to make, the inital point I was making is most of those crying for Pearsons head have been quite vocal about playing Nugent and Ulloa it's a lack of consistancy. I actually thought they both shit, and should've tried Vardy and Kramaric
Robin JD Popley Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 Even the most ardent of Nigel's fans must accept that after today he is no longer the man for the job. Putting our best player in recent weeks on the bench and not in the starting line up, not starting with our new striker and persistently starting with Wes despite his woeful performances this season. Sadly think the game is up as far as our Premier days go, so let's get rid now to plan for the future and if by some sheer fluke, even perhaps keep us up. I implore you Top act now!
Manwell Pablo Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 I actually thought they both shit, and should've tried Vardy and Kramaric Vardy Vardy somehow has fewer goals than Nugent and fewer good performances than Ulloa which is an astonishing feat Vardy shouldn't even be getting off the bench if you ask me.
smudger63 Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 Tell you what, i could so easily get involved in this debate, because i have strong views, but to be honest, i can`t be arsed to argue the point anymore. Nothing is going to make any difference now anyway. Much as it hurts me to say it, i think that today, although not mathematically, i think we were relegated. I just don`t see where our next league win is coming from. Pearson hasn`t showed me any signs of him coming to terms with this division, but i have to say, that even if we get rid of Pearson , i think it`s too late now to make enough of a difference. For me, this is more of a debate to have at the end of the season, after our likely relegation. Of course, I already know the pro Pearson fans will say, "we have to keep big Nige, despite his failure and our relegation, because he knows the championship, and will get us back up again". I`m actually beginning to think that Pearson is some kind of cult leader, and has brainwashed some of our fans, so that they will follow him unconditionally, no matter how bad things get!
inckley fox Posted 7 February 2015 Posted 7 February 2015 The moment the words "the players that got us promotion will get a chance this season" he was doomed to fail. I really believe that to be an underlying fact in the lack of summer transfers. Throughout our history, whenever the word 'faith' has been bandied about liberally, it's ended badly for us. Some of us say Hammond's done alright, some call for De Laet to be back in the side, some say we play better with Nugent in the side, or that King is a good lad, or Drinkwater or Vardy are good lads, some say Konchesky's experience is valuable - but none of them have been up to it, and at times that causes other players to look worse than they are. The fact that these are the players who, Ulloa and Morgan aside, have played most for us this season tells you everything. In the past, when we've coped with promotion, it's been because players have a chance or two to show themselves before being moved out of the picture. O'Neill always talked of 'unforgivable errors', and those who made them - Watts, Taylor, Whitlow, Fenton, even Cottee, Gilchrist and Taggart at first - were quickly moved aside. You can't afford to keep persisting until 33 year olds learn to adapt. A guy of Schlupp, Moore or Knockaert's age maybe, but not a guy of Konchesky or Nugent's. Many of our key weaknesses last season remain key weaknesses this season. Left back, right back, left wing, centre forward, cover at centre back... They just haven't been addressed, even though respectable sums have been shelled out.
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