The Railway Man Posted 9 August 2016 Posted 9 August 2016 1 minute ago, Strokes said: I imagine they will be deselected for a general election anyway, so the evil deed will be done if they wait. Fight from the front now and deflect if you lose is the only option I think. This sums it up perfect, if they hang around for 2020 they won't be there anywhere to fight the GE, so split and take the front benches while you can.
Webbo Posted 9 August 2016 Posted 9 August 2016 If Labour split the Corbynites will be able to blame the splitters for any defeat. The only way to stop them is to let them lose on their own.
The Railway Man Posted 9 August 2016 Posted 9 August 2016 5 minutes ago, Webbo said: If Labour split the Corbynites will be able to blame the splitters for any defeat. The only way to stop them is to let them lose on their own. They Corbynites will blame everyone but Corbyn whatever happens, that's what they do. If they sit back and wait for them to lose on their own they 'll be deselected by the nutters who have took over the party anyway, they have less to lose forming a new party.
Guest Bilo Posted 9 August 2016 Posted 9 August 2016 15 minutes ago, Webbo said: If Labour split the Corbynites will be able to blame the splitters for any defeat. The only way to stop them is to let them lose on their own. They still do blame the SDP and Gang of Four for 1983 rather than Foot's catastrophic manifesto.
Guest Posted 9 August 2016 Posted 9 August 2016 3 hours ago, Webbo said: If Labour split the Corbynites will be able to blame the splitters for any defeat. The only way to stop them is to let them lose on their own. Why does it matter who blames who if they lose?
Webbo Posted 9 August 2016 Posted 9 August 2016 On 09/08/2016 at 19:33, FIF said: Why does it matter who blames who if they lose? Because if they don't accept responsibility they'll carry on regardless. Not that I honestly care, if Labour destroys itself I won't weep for it.
The Railway Man Posted 10 August 2016 Posted 10 August 2016 14 hours ago, Webbo said: Because if they don't except responsibility they'll carry on regardless. They will, believe me.
IrememberBobHazell Posted 10 August 2016 Posted 10 August 2016 The problem with setting up a new party is a lack of resource and natural support. Let's say its a moderate Labour MP with a majority of 5,000, he defects and stays to fight at the next election under the new party banner. He might take a fair few thousand votes with him, but there will undoubtedly be many thousand who will be hard core Labour supporters who will vote for the Corbynista because they have always voted Labour. Result? Split left of centre support and with, probably, a candidate for another party coming through the middle to win. It wouldn't matter particularly in the City seats but in seats such as Loughborough and NW Leicestershire which any aspiring government needs to win in would take Labour absolutely out of the game and they are a mile behind in those seats already judging by 2015 results and recent opinions polls.
Guest Posted 10 August 2016 Posted 10 August 2016 6 minutes ago, IrememberBobHazell said: The problem with setting up a new party is a lack of resource and natural support. Let's say its a moderate Labour MP with a majority of 5,000, he defects and stays to fight at the next election under the new party banner. He might take a fair few thousand votes with him, but there will undoubtedly be many thousand who will be hard core Labour supporters who will vote for the Corbynista because they have always voted Labour. Result? Split left of centre support and with, probably, a candidate for another party coming through the middle to win. It wouldn't matter particularly in the City seats but in seats such as Loughborough and NW Leicestershire which any aspiring government needs to win in would take Labour absolutely out of the game and they are a mile behind in those seats already judging by 2015 results and recent opinions polls. But at least they'll be standing for something they believe in.
IrememberBobHazell Posted 10 August 2016 Posted 10 August 2016 Which is the problem with the Corbyn project. Supposedly strong on conviction (I don't believe it but I'm being charitable) but completely impractical. If you want something politically pure you end up with extremeism because only a select few 'get it'.
Claridge Posted 10 August 2016 Posted 10 August 2016 On 9 August 2016 at 16:21, Webbo said: If Labour split the Corbynites will be able to blame the splitters for any defeat. The only way to stop them is to let them lose on their own. 98% of GMB union members decided not to vote for Corbyn when they had the chance. That tells you a lot about the chances of Corbyn ever winning an election for Labour
The Railway Man Posted 11 August 2016 Posted 11 August 2016 the whole thing is amazing aint it. he's lost the mirror, the guardian, some of the unions, his MP's and virtually everyone in the country who isn't part of the hard left fringe. Yet his cult following still carries on like it's going well, we'll never see anything like this in british politics again 23 hours ago, IrememberBobHazell said:
Claridge Posted 11 August 2016 Posted 11 August 2016 2 hours ago, The Railway Man said: the whole thing is amazing aint it. he's lost the mirror, the guardian, some of the unions, his MP's and virtually everyone in the country who isn't part of the hard left fringe. Yet his cult following still carries on like it's going well, we'll never see anything like this in british politics again It's like one of those crazy suicide sects that appear from time to time.
Countryfox Posted 11 August 2016 Posted 11 August 2016 17 minutes ago, Claridge said: It's like one of those crazy suicide sects that appear from time to time. Aha !! ... a potential positive outcome to all this !
Guest Bilo Posted 11 August 2016 Posted 11 August 2016 I honestly don't know what it'd take for the cultists to realise. I imagine even an absolute rinsing by the Tories in 2020 would be blamed on everyone but Corbyn, and the Momentum entryists would carry on regardless.
Mark_w Posted 11 August 2016 Posted 11 August 2016 I really like what we've seen of Owen Smith. I think he'd stand an okay chance of keeping the almost inevitable defeat at the next GE relatively respectable. Shame it's not going to happen.
ousefox Posted 11 August 2016 Posted 11 August 2016 10 hours ago, The Railway Man said: the whole thing is amazing aint it. he's lost the mirror, the guardian, some of the unions, his MP's and virtually everyone in the country who isn't part of the hard left fringe. Yet his cult following still carries on like it's going well, we'll never see anything like this in british politics again Yet still manages to get 31% in the polls? I'm shocked it's that high but guess there's a lot who just refuse to vote Tory.
Carl the Llama Posted 12 August 2016 Posted 12 August 2016 When's this coming out anyway? Can't find it on Marvel's release guide.
Rincewind Posted 12 August 2016 Posted 12 August 2016 On 8/10/2016 at 13:55, FIF said: But at least they'll be standing for something they believe in. Not a good idea in modern politics.
The Railway Man Posted 12 August 2016 Posted 12 August 2016 11 hours ago, Watson said: Yet still manages to get 31% in the polls? I'm shocked it's that high but guess there's a lot who just refuse to vote Tory. Just shows how dumb a lot of people are really, voting for party that literally can't govern.
The Horse's Mouth Posted 12 August 2016 Posted 12 August 2016 11 hours ago, Watson said: Yet still manages to get 31% in the polls? I'm shocked it's that high but guess there's a lot who just refuse to vote Tory. that's actually really impresses considering the war hasn't ended yet .
The Railway Man Posted 12 August 2016 Posted 12 August 2016 It shows how ridiculous polling is that, I'm sure the Tory lead isnt 16 pts as was said a couple of weeks back but no way either are Labour getting over 30% of the voting population supporting them at the minute, we need more lobotomies if they do.
ousefox Posted 12 August 2016 Posted 12 August 2016 28 minutes ago, The Railway Man said: It shows how ridiculous polling is that, I'm sure the Tory lead isnt 16 pts as was said a couple of weeks back but no way either are Labour getting over 30% of the voting population supporting them at the minute, we need more lobotomies if they do. 3 in 10 people isn't that unrealistic considering how much hate there is for Tories and that Labour are still the only opposition that could potentially gain owner under FPTP.
The Railway Man Posted 12 August 2016 Posted 12 August 2016 1 minute ago, Watson said: 3 in 10 people isn't that unrealistic considering how much hate there is for Tories and that Labour are still the only opposition that could potentially gain owner under FPTP. But they literally can't govern, he can't form a shadow cabinet and 80% of his MP's who work with him on a day to day basis have told us he isn;t capable of doing the job. I know a lot of people hate the Tories, but voting for people who can't form a government is a bit silly to say the least.
Buce Posted 12 August 2016 Posted 12 August 2016 2 hours ago, The Railway Man said: Just shows how dumb a lot of people are really, voting for party that literally can't govern. The Brexit vote already did that.
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