Another poll...but a serious question about Ranieri

[Ian Nacho]

3 hours ago, foxfanazer said:

My issue with him is I've seen nothing to suggest he can turn things around when things go wrong. He's almost a victim of his own success as he never really had it tough last season. This season we just keep doing the same things over and over. Something has got to give and sadly it's easier to get rid of a manager than overhaul a whole squad. We need someone who can put a rocket up some of these players

Over the years he has proved he isn't a long term manager. The longest he's been at a club was when he was at Fiorentina for 5 years and that was 20 years ago!

[Ian Nacho]

A good season is pretty much out the window now so all we can hope for in the league this year is that we stay up which I don't think chopping and changing things with the management will do us any favours. We need to stick with Claudio until the end of the season and then we can decide if we need to move on and get someone new in for the summer which gives them more time to prepare for the upcoming season. Also there not many other managers in the world which have such extensive experience of European football which comes in very handy for our Champions League campaign which we need to make a proper go of it as lets be honest, we're probably never going to be in ever again. After last season we've just got to give the guy time to sort things out, that's what he deserves. In Claudio we trust. 

[volpeazzurro]

3 hours ago, Manwell Pablo said:

 

He's got to take a good proportion of the blame for Sunday.

 

He played a formation out of nowhere that didn't suit our players and it looked like we hadn't prepared properly to play it.

 

In fact he's said about as much himself. 

I  just don't believe this. Are we honestly saying that professional footballers are unable to grasp more than one way of setting up and understanding what their job is within that formation? Can Barcelona and Bayern only play 442? It wasn't that long ago that people were complaining that Ranieri had no plan B, that he was slavishly sticking to 442! He's tried other tactics and the players appear to whine, if the media are to be belived, that they can't cope and don't fix what ain't broken. Well it was broken and I for one don't fall for the excuse that it's all down to Kante having gone. The fact is some of our players are not putting a shift in and are a total disgrace. They didn't win last year because they were the countries top footballing talents, the fact is some of them seem to believe they're something they're not. Nor do I believe they're not playing for the manager, they're not playing because they're in the comfort zone and are bone idol! The manager is a class act compared to the majority of these journeymen.

Leicester supporters have always stuck by their team even when playing shit as long as they can see honest endeavour. These previous hero's are starting grate on me.

[Manwell Pablo]

26 minutes ago, volpeazzurro said:

I  just don't believe this. Are we honestly saying that professional footballers are unable to grasp more than one way of setting up and understanding what their job is within that formation? Can Barcelona and Bayern only play 442? It wasn't that long ago that people were complaining that Ranieri had no plan B, that he was slavishly sticking to 442! He's tried other tactics and the players appear to whine, if the media are to be belived, that they can't cope and don't fix what ain't broken. Well it was broken and I for one don't fall for the excuse that it's all down to Kante having gone. The fact is some of our players are not putting a shift in and are a total disgrace. They didn't win last year because they were the countries top footballing talents, the fact is some of them seem to believe they're something they're not. Nor do I believe they're not playing for the manager, they're not playing because they're in the comfort zone and are bone idol! The manager is a class act compared to the majority of these journeymen.

Leicester supporters have always stuck by their team even when playing shit as long as they can see honest endeavour. These previous hero's are starting grate on me.

 

I'm not saying they are blameless some of them were utterly embarrassing but to think Ranieri doesn't have to take some of the blame is total footballing naivety. If not are we honestly saying there is no point in a football manager if players should simply go out and play football in any system they see fit with equal success?

 

Formations generally work better if practiced, and the diamond is very very easy to get wrong if you aren't prepared as it has zero width in theory, we didn't look like we got it at all. Drinkwater got wide about twice in the entire half and looked like a fish out of water when he did, Mendy was even worse, neither of them took up good positions we were far too compact and Morgan just ended up launching everything at Jamie Vardy which was never going to work. The formations about ball retention (which is why I can't work out why we even attempted it) not whacking it over the top to Vardy. 

 

Drinkwater is a good midfielder but he is lost on the side of a diamond, couldn't find space, and I don't even know what Mendy is, we seem to use a different setup everytime he plays, but again he did not look suited to the role, he was bad, both of them along with Ndidi looked frustrated as anything for pretty much the entire half. Shinji was definitely trying but was awful again not helped by the fact he was part of a central front three with crap outlets. With the ball they were dire, without they were even worse, the space Southampton got to try and expose Simpson and Fuchs was embarrassing and a key reason why were so open.  Simpson did not have a great game, Fuchs was appalling. 

 

The look on the faces of some of the players both during and after the match did not seem to be one of a comfortable person, to me anyway, I think many are probably frustrated they aren't capable of adapting their style of play to threaten teams in a different way to the way we did last season, maybe there is a lack of effort in certain quarters but it is most certainly not the only problem. Do people honestly think football is such a simple game that it is simply down to whoever tries the hardest?

[Max Wall]

3 hours ago, Manwell Pablo said:

 

He's got to take a good proportion of the blame for Sunday.

 

He played a formation out of nowhere that didn't suit our players and it looked like we hadn't prepared properly to play it.

 

In fact he's said about as much himself. 

Agreed regarding Saturday, however, he has played formations the players know previously this season and they've performed miserably.

If, as the initial question asks, we are 14/15th at the end of the season and we put up a creditable performance against Seville then we will have improved significantly from what we're currently seeing. If that's the case, I would most definitely keep CR as he would have been at the helm during that improvement. It appears to be a massive 'if' at this stage though.

[Manwell Pablo]

Just now, Max Wall said:

Agreed regarding Saturday, however, he has played formations the players know previously this season and they've performed miserably.

If, as the initial question asks, we are 14/15th at the end of the season and we put up a creditable performance against Seville then we will have improved significantly from what we're currently seeing. If that's the case, I would most definitely keep CR as he would have been at the helm during that improvement. It appears to be a massive 'if' at this stage though.

 

I'd disagree there as personally I think Sunday was a different level of out and out poorness when compared with anything else I've seen this season. Would not of scored if we were still playing now and so vulnerable it was unreal. 

 

Slightly bemused why we have changed it so much, picked up good results against West Ham and Everton, solid enough draw at borough, I'm not being funny surely a tonking against Chelsea is not reason to change a system that was worked prior to that, they're going to win the league. 

 

I get the irony of me claiming the Diamond should get in the bin after one game and saying this but we need to accept certain systems and certain players might not always get the desired result but we need to find one that can get enough of them and stick with it even if does mean Liverpool and Man U have an easy day against us as it's not those games that matter anymore. 

[Max Wall]

Just now, Manwell Pablo said:

 

I'd disagree there as personally I think Sunday was a different level of out and out poorness when compared with anything else I've seen this season. Would not of scored if we were still playing now and so vulnerable it was unreal. 

 

Slightly bemused why we have changed it so much, picked up good results against West Ham and Everton, solid enough draw at borough, I'm not being funny surely a tonking against Chelsea is not reason to change a system that was worked prior to that, they're going to win the league. 

 

I get the irony of me claiming the Diamond should get in the bin after one game and saying this but we need to accept certain systems and certain players might not always get the desired result but we need to find one that can get enough of them and stick with it even if does mean Liverpool and Man U have an easy day against us as it's not those games that matter anymore. 

That may be true but that also may be a consequence of playing poorly previously and getting spanked. Confidence drops and the performances get progressively worse culminating in that miserable performance yesterday. That said, the freshest defeat often feels the worst. In all honesty, there have been several games where we looked like we could play all day and not score, starting with the opening game where we were given a penalty when the offence was outside the box. Yesterday just added to the growing tide of opinion but we've been awful in all but a handful of games.

 

Goal less against Arsenal, Soton, Chelsea, Bournmouth, Everton, Boro, Chelsea again, Soton again,

Unwarranted penalty goal against Hull (and one of the two against Boro in the draw)

Together with odd goals in 2-1 defeats to WBA, Watford and Sunderland, that makes for terrible reading.

With the exception of Palace, Stoke, Burnley and a ridiculously set up Man City, we've been toothless.

One goal against Liverpool and Man Utd once we'd been put to the sword

[Manwell Pablo]

8 minutes ago, Max Wall said:

That may be true but that also may be a consequence of playing poorly previously and getting spanked. Confidence drops and the performances get progressively worse culminating in that miserable performance yesterday. That said, the freshest defeat often feels the worst. In all honesty, there have been several games where we looked like we could play all day and not score, starting with the opening game where we were given a penalty when the offence was outside the box. Yesterday just added to the growing tide of opinion but we've been awful in all but a handful of games.

 

Goal less against Arsenal, Soton, Chelsea, Bournmouth, Everton, Boro, Chelsea again, Soton again,

Unwarranted penalty goal against Hull (and one of the two against Boro in the draw)

Together with odd goals in 2-1 defeats to WBA, Watford and Sunderland, that makes for terrible reading.

With the exception of Palace, Stoke, Burnley and a ridiculously set up Man City, we've been toothless.

One goal against Liverpool and Man Utd once we'd been put to the sword

 

I don't know why you've left the fact out that we looked horrendously vulnerable and just picked up on the goals thing, perhaps because it credits your point more to leave it out.

 

 Again, I'd disagree, Vardy had a nightmare and missed loads of good chances against Hull. I'm quite pragmatic, this is not knee jerk or just a case of a latest defeat, Sunday was awful beyond anything else I have seen and that has nothing to do with it being the latest game.  I've seen the vast majority of those games, yes we were bad in some but nearly all of them we competed and were in the game bar defeats to top sides (mostly away) we were totally awful on Sunday across the entire pitch, thoroughly well beaten by a Southampton team not even out of third gear. It was dreadful. 

[Max Wall]

7 minutes ago, Manwell Pablo said:

 

I don't know why you've left the fact out that we looked horrendously vulnerable and just picked up on the goals thing, perhaps because it credits your point more to leave it out.

 

 Again, I'd disagree, Vardy had a nightmare and missed loads of good chances against Hull. I'm quite pragmatic, this is not knee jerk or just a case of a latest defeat, Sunday was awful beyond anything else I have seen and that has nothing to do with it being the latest game.  I've seen the vast majority of those games, yes we were bad in some but nearly all of them we competed and were in the game bar defeats to top sides (mostly away) we were totally awful on Sunday across the entire pitch, thoroughly well beaten by a Southampton team not even out of third gear. It was dreadful. 

I don't disagree mate but I think we were equally as awful against Sunderland who are an infinitely worse team than Southampton. Bournmouth also had a stroll against us and the point at home to Boro, even though we scored twice from the spot, was daylight robbery. I just think yesterday was an accumulation of awfulness.

[Max Wall]

32 minutes ago, Manwell Pablo said:

 

I'd disagree there as personally I think Sunday was a different level of out and out poorness when compared with anything else I've seen this season. Would not of scored if we were still playing now and so vulnerable it was unreal. 

 

Slightly bemused why we have changed it so much, picked up good results against West Ham and Everton, solid enough draw at borough, I'm not being funny surely a tonking against Chelsea is not reason to change a system that was worked prior to that, they're going to win the league. 

 

I get the irony of me claiming the Diamond should get in the bin after one game and saying this but we need to accept certain systems and certain players might not always get the desired result but we need to find one that can get enough of them and stick with it even if does mean Liverpool and Man U have an easy day against us as it's not those games that matter anymore. 

This is why I concentrated on goals, it was in direct response to your post.

[Max Wall]

34 minutes ago, Manwell Pablo said:

 

I'd disagree there as personally I think Sunday was a different level of out and out poorness when compared with anything else I've seen this season. Would not of scored if we were still playing now and so vulnerable it was unreal. 

 

Slightly bemused why we have changed it so much, picked up good results against West Ham and Everton, solid enough draw at borough, I'm not being funny surely a tonking against Chelsea is not reason to change a system that was worked prior to that, they're going to win the league. 

 

I get the irony of me claiming the Diamond should get in the bin after one game and saying this but we need to accept certain systems and certain players might not always get the desired result but we need to find one that can get enough of them and stick with it even if does mean Liverpool and Man U have an easy day against us as it's not those games that matter anymore. 

Please don't think I'm ignoring the defence and our vulnerability, we are dreadful all over the pitch.

[Manwell Pablo]

1 minute ago, Max Wall said:

This is why I concentrated on goals, it was in direct response to your post.

 

The statement isn't just about scoring goals though? 

 

It just needs to be better than that  we will go down if it is not.

[NotTheMarketLeader]

4 hours ago, Adster said:

If the players aren't playing for Ranieri, sack the ****ing players, the bunch of *****. 

 

Last season, Ranieri made their careers and boosted their value up considerably. If they don't play for him anymore it's the players that can **** off. 

 

That should be enough motivation. 

I do feel the players are taking the piss with Ranieri, but sadly we can't sack 15 players so if he cannot turn it around - which it looks like he can't then sadly he should go IF we have a suitable replacement.

[Max Wall]

4 minutes ago, Manwell Pablo said:

 

The statement isn't just about scoring goals though? 

 

It just needs to be better than that  we will go down if it is not.

We agree. Attack, defence, midfield, it all needs to improve significantly. If my posts suggested I thought otherwise then I can confirm that I don't.

[dynamark]

Players took it into their own hands in the great escape - this is defo the time to do it again  and cut loose of the managerial shackles..

[jim5000]

Last season he won the league, but it was with a team someone else had put together. Most of his signings have been poor, and he binned off the Swiss captain (central midfielder), the Croatian lad, and a load of defenders. It's now his squad and he can't seem to find any answers. We have put up with some downright shocking performances this season, from day 1 onwards...

 

I'm not sure he's the best option going forward after this season - even if he keeps us up, and what with us being Leicester, I can totally see us winning the league and getting relegated next season. We've always been a yo-yo team, just this is the biggest drop in one go!

[Johnthefoxrayner]

I'm not being funny but if I performed badly in my job week in week out I would be sacked 

[volpeazzurro]

1 hour ago, Manwell Pablo said:

 

I'm not saying they are blameless some of them were utterly embarrassing but to think Ranieri doesn't have to take some of the blame is total footballing naivety. If not are we honestly saying there is no point in a football manager if players should simply go out and play football in any system they see fit with equal success?

 

Formations generally work better if practiced, and the diamond is very very easy to get wrong if you aren't prepared as it has zero width in theory, we didn't look like we got it at all. Drinkwater got wide about twice in the entire half and looked like a fish out of water when he did, Mendy was even worse, neither of them took up good positions we were far too compact and Morgan just ended up launching everything at Jamie Vardy which was never going to work. The formations about ball retention (which is why I can't work out why we even attempted it) not whacking it over the top to Vardy. 

 

Drinkwater is a good midfielder but he is lost on the side of a diamond, couldn't find space, and I don't even know what Mendy is, we seem to use a different setup everytime he plays, but again he did not look suited to the role, he was bad, both of them along with Ndidi looked frustrated as anything for pretty much the entire half. Shinji was definitely trying but was awful again not helped by the fact he was part of a central front three with crap outlets. With the ball they were dire, without they were even worse, the space Southampton got to try and expose Simpson and Fuchs was embarrassing and a key reason why were so open.  Simpson did not have a great game, Fuchs was appalling. 

 

The look on the faces of some of the players both during and after the match did not seem to be one of a comfortable person, to me anyway, I think many are probably frustrated they aren't capable of adapting their style of play to threaten teams in a different way to the way we did last season, maybe there is a lack of effort in certain quarters but it is most certainly not the only problem. Do people honestly think football is such a simple game that it is simply down to whoever tries the hardest?

'Formations generally work better if practiced, and the diamond is very very easy to get wrong if you aren't prepared'

 

I agree that the diamond wasn't a success. But these aren't a pub team, they didn't just turn up on the Sunday and Ranieri come up with a magic formula called a diamond,  even you and I have some idea what a diamond formation requires so they've got know and be prepared to adapt . They've not had a game for a week, they must have been doing something in training and I suspect one of them would be being drilled in what to do in a diamond. Whatever formation, it didn't excuse Drinkwaters lack of effort in tracking the first goalscorer as pointed out on Sky. Or the tracking for the overlap for that matter.  No formation whether diamond or 442 will be a success if players don't put the effort in and there's a distinct lack of it.

[Koke]

Danny Murphy wrote a good article yesterday on our tactical car crash yesterday at Southampton.

 

http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/38713714

[fuchsntf]

6 hours ago, Koke said:

 

I think we will stay up because we still have better individual attacking players than the bottom 5 (although we've scored 1 in 5 league games, which is worrying). But moving forward I'm not sure he can or will address the major issues in the squad in the summer, and we'll find ourselves in a similar position next season.

Its this blind belief, that I find amazing on this forum..

In contrast,..I dont believe at the moment we have better Individual  players.

They have not under performed in the odd game They  have been really poor in 98% of the games.

I have seen all the bottom 8 teams play far better football than we have even got near..

[STUHILL]

It completely depends on the manner in which we stay up. 

 

If we struggle like this for the rest of the season and just stay up by the skin of our teeth, then absolutely we should look for a fresh start and new manager.

 

If however, he makes some decent signings in this window and we see a big change in performance and results, then of course he should stay. 

 

I actually think we will end up falling somewhere in between that, with only 1 decent signing in this window plus some good performances, mixed in with some bad and staying up with gap of 5-6 points. 

 

That will then be a really tough choice, whether we make a change or not. Even then, I would be tempted to give him the first 10 games of the new season. The danger of that of course, is giving him another transfer window, so depending on what we do in this one, will have impact on my thoughts on giving him another summer and 10 games, if we do finish 16th/17th this season.

[Matt]

I need to see what change he can come up with to answer this question.

 

If it continues as it is then we need another manager.

 

If he does manage to turn it round and there is a decent upturn in form then based on the time and what goes on probably keep him.

[Koke]

23 minutes ago, fuchsntf said:

Its this blind belief, that I find amazing on this forum..

In contrast,..I dont believe at the moment we have better Individual  players.

They have not under performed in the odd game They  have been really poor in 98% of the games.

I have seen all the bottom 8 teams play far better football than we have even got near..

 

Those great ball playing sides you've watched are below us. We've been utter garbage all season as you say but weirdly still above 5 other clubs and have a better GD than most sides around us..

 

It's this blind pessimism I find amazing on this forum.

[funkyrobot]

If he keeps us up is a big IF. If he does keep us up then there will have been a major change in form. At the moment it's difficult to see where the points we'll need to stay up are going to come from.

[foxinsocks]

This question will be decided by the availability of an akternative.  I woukd stick with claudio. . .  I dont know who we voukd attract thay would be better

He has learnt form sone very ecpensive lessons. ..... so his errors shoukd reduce