iamafox Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 42 minutes ago, tom27111 said: This is why we need Bielsa Too bad that he'll be managing Lille next season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TAFKA Castroneves Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 i mentioned this earlier in the season, early doors it was very apparent that Claudio must have been telling the players not to press so much - I thought at the time probably to counteract the fact we had additional Champions League games this year and thus to not knacker ourselves out so much. The problem with that is we won the Premier League because we pressed - we pressed so well even the king of the press Mr Klopp was stunned at the intensity of our warm ups last season, he knew his team couldn't reach that level. When a club has spent so long (and with a lot of these players for four/five years) in investing in the Sports Science and making our lads to the top of their individual physical peaks it seems a very strange move to start pulling away from that when all our staff are setup for that - and when Claudio was appointed he always said he was brought in to work WITH the pre-existing setup. It was a decision Claudio should have made more with his coaches, perhaps then we would have seen investment in the defence over the summer and us playing in exactly the same way, instead we got investment in Slimani and Musa primarily, which shows Claudio decided to change the game to keep our defence as is - they look so far off the pace this year its incredible really - and now that decision has cost him. Our next manager needs to be someone with the same principles of play as the club wants and is setup for, this is a MUST. That's why i'm game for bridges to be rebuilt and Pearson to come back, we'll be guaranteed to know we're getting that with him - unlike others like Mancini perhaps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaewbudda Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 11 minutes ago, Countryfox said: I love the Don but I think you are wrong mate ... he polished a diamond but at the end of the day it was still a diamond that he inherited. So under new leadership they will start winning, right? The boys have had a chance to air their concerns to the owners and our precious gems should start performing again, shouldn't they? Let's wait and see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Countryfox Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 1 minute ago, Kaewbudda said: So under new leadership they will start winning, right? The boys have had a chance to air their concerns to the owners and our precious gems should start performing again, shouldn't they? Let's wait and see. Or put it another way ... If he had stayed I think we were fooked. Nowt to lose. And Shakey might just surprise us all. I hope so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaewbudda Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 7 minutes ago, LittlethorpeFox said: We need to consider the importance of this story. If the players have been specifically told to abandon the pressing game and sit back, then all this critisicm that is being levelled at them e.g. "the effort levels aren't the same as last season", "they aren't playing at the same intensity" are as much the managers fault because of how they have been set up. So visibly the fans are blaming the players and the analysts can back up our running/tackling/interceptions stats being down on last season - but ultimately they are under instructions from Claudio. I really am 100% behind the players, i think they have done the ight thing speaking up, and i really dont think they have purposely downed tools. But due to the poor management over the season they have lost so much confidence and morale that its turned into a desperate farce that was never going to turn around without something giving, and thank god it finally has! sick of the players getting all the stick and CR (who i love by the way) being seen as a saint who can do no wrong! he's a legend but hes as much to blame as anybody from top to bottom!! Or they could be making excuses for their piss poor performances. Anyway, now that they have shared their concerns, got rid of the manager and told everyone what the problem was we should see them steadily climb up the table and start winning again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the fox Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 6 minutes ago, Kaewbudda said: So let's suppose you're right and it was all his fault. With new leadership, the players will play better and the results should improve, right? I really hope that is what is going to happen. But what I think WILL happen is that we'll see a group of mediocre players run out of excuses and carry on their slide down the table. I really hope I am wrong but I fear the worst. Never said it was all his fault, players did somethings wrong but he was the main reason that they underperformed. For me players like Kasper, n'didi, drinky, mahrez,gray,slimani and vardy are far from mediocre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Countryfox Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 1 minute ago, Kaewbudda said: Or they could be making excuses for their piss poor performances. Anyway, now that they have shared their concerns, got rid of the manager and told everyone what the problem was we should see them steadily climb up the table and start winning again. Do you want that to happen to prove you are right ?? Get positive .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotTheMarketLeader Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 13 minutes ago, TAFKA Castroneves said: i mentioned this earlier in the season, early doors it was very apparent that Claudio must have been telling the players not to press so much - I thought at the time probably to counteract the fact we had additional Champions League games this year and thus to not knacker ourselves out so much. The problem with that is we won the Premier League because we pressed - we pressed so well even the king of the press Mr Klopp was stunned at the intensity of our warm ups last season, he knew his team couldn't reach that level. When a club has spent so long (and with a lot of these players for four/five years) in investing in the Sports Science and making our lads to the top of their individual physical peaks it seems a very strange move to start pulling away from that when all our staff are setup for that - and when Claudio was appointed he always said he was brought in to work WITH the pre-existing setup. It was a decision Claudio should have made more with his coaches, perhaps then we would have seen investment in the defence over the summer and us playing in exactly the same way, instead we got investment in Slimani and Musa primarily, which shows Claudio decided to change the game to keep our defence as is - they look so far off the pace this year its incredible really - and now that decision has cost him. Our next manager needs to be someone with the same principles of play as the club wants and is setup for, this is a MUST. That's why i'm game for bridges to be rebuilt and Pearson to come back, we'll be guaranteed to know we're getting that with him - unlike others like Mancini perhaps You do know we didn't play a pressing game with Pearson? That said if true it was was a mistake of gigantic proportions. I said after the Hull game, if that was our Plan B it was going to be a disaster. So much so I can hardly believe anyone would deliberately change that part of our game. The plot thickens; and I reiterate; IF true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibertyFox Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 6 minutes ago, TAFKA Castroneves said: i mentioned this earlier in the season, early doors it was very apparent that Claudio must have been telling the players not to press so much - I thought at the time probably to counteract the fact we had additional Champions League games this year and thus to not knacker ourselves out so much. The problem with that is we won the Premier League because we pressed - we pressed so well even the king of the press Mr Klopp was stunned at the intensity of our warm ups last season, he knew his team couldn't reach that level. When a club has spent so long (and with a lot of these players for four/five years) in investing in the Sports Science and making our lads to the top of their individual physical peaks it seems a very strange move to start pulling away from that when all our staff are setup for that - and when Claudio was appointed he always said he was brought in to work WITH the pre-existing setup. It was a decision Claudio should have made more with his coaches, perhaps then we would have seen investment in the defence over the summer and us playing in exactly the same way, instead we got investment in Slimani and Musa primarily, which shows Claudio decided to change the game to keep our defence as is - they look so far off the pace this year its incredible really - and now that decision has cost him. Our next manager needs to be someone with the same principles of play as the club wants and is setup for, this is a MUST. That's why i'm game for bridges to be rebuilt and Pearson to come back, we'll be guaranteed to know we're getting that with him - unlike others like Mancini perhaps With you all the way until you said bring back Pearson. Not for me, he burned his bridges well and truly with the owners with his clownish touchline, media and 'family loyalty' antics. Great manager but a very flawed character. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legend_in_blue Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 CR took Pearson's team, the team he built, "TEAM", and added some moments of tactical genius last season which won us the league. This cannot be argued with. He rode his luck with very little in the way of injuries and suspensions. He never had to change the team Pearson built. There was only ever one focus, he rarely needed to tinker. Hard work, resoluteness and luck, particularly towards the end of the campaign, saw us over the line. Cracks were already beginning to show though and teams were sussing us out. Defensively we were sound and it didn't matter too much. Roll on this season and teams have now sussed us out fully. CR does not address the key positions in defence or midfield at the season start. He has no plan B for months. He changes nothing then changes everything and then there's no sense of direction moving forwards at all. The team Pearson built is dismantled mentally. Players have lost their way. Management has not rectified this and players dont believe in or adapt to the system CR continually changes on a game by game basis. This sums it up. CR had to go. What team has he built? I don't see a direction moving forwards at all. Something had to give. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parafox Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 44 minutes ago, Countryfox said: I love the Don but I think you are wrong mate ... he polished a diamond but at the end of the day it was still a diamond that he inherited. I think you mean "turd". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SheppyFox Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 If true this is very important in how the fans should react to the players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Countryfox Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 3 minutes ago, Parafox said: I think you mean "turd". Well actually Para I think I meant 'rough diamond' ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
los dedos Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 While i don't disagree with CR sacking.Regardless of a changes in tactics the players have been making a lot of mistakes.Simple passes miss placed,attackers not marked from set pieces etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parafox Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 1 minute ago, Countryfox said: Well actually Para I think I meant 'rough diamond' ... Fair enough and I wouldn't disagree with that.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fazzyfox Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 Back in September I was presuming Vardy had a niggling injury as every time he went to press across the oppositions defence Ranieri was shouting "Jamie No!" (Like a dog owner!) Coupled with Okazaki being left out so often as well that's one hell of a lot of pressing gone missing and that's before you even mention the K word (not Kingy, the other one). If it was a concern about the amount of additional matches to come this season that's one thing and that's why you get a ton of cash to build a deep squad but if it's more about the centre halves then you're a national Champion with a huge budget (albeit smaller than some others) being compromised by loyalty to two players. Replacing the centre halves was always going to be a big problem, the form they showed last season would make them worth millions if they were in their early twenties, who was better than them last season that we could realistically sign? But to alter the game plan and disrupt all the other players potential output seems bizarre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxfanazer Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 Obviously I don't have the in depth knowledge of a premier league manager when it comes to football tactics but it's astounding that CR would abandon the pressing game that won us the league last year. Why would you choose to play at a low intensity and then when you clearly see it isn't working why wouldn't you revert back to it. If it's true then he's signed his own death warrant and I'd say the players are well within their rights to knock on the owners door Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5waller5 Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 Very interesting insight if true ..... Does make me feel slightly different towards the players. there's always two sides to a story and this wold make sense - and partially justify why things have gone so badly so quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaewbudda Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 I just think that he's been let down really badly by the players. Don't get me wrong, things were going really badly this season and I was really frustrated with his negative defensive approach. He was also far too loyal to certain players, and yes, no matter what he tried, nothing was working. But anyway, we have to move forward now and I am really intrigued to see what sort of team Shakespeare puts out on Monday. Will we see new faces or will it be more of the same? If its more of the same (especially at the back) we are going to get hammered. If he tries something new - especially in central defence - then I applaud him. We shall see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lionheart10 Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 2 hours ago, dorsetboy said: I'm not defended the players but according to this article and others flying about ,players unhappy with formation changes ,shakey had hardly any input and most of all the players wanted to play a high pressure game like last season which won us the title but Claudio said no as he was concerned Wes and huth didn't have the legs so that's why we stopped the 100mph football. If it was me I would have just changed Wes and huth at Xmas for two younger cbs Well he was right there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stadt Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 We weren't really a pressing team last season, Vardy would apply pressure when a trigger occurred (a player receiving the ball facing their own goal, poor touch in opposition half that sort of thing) but we didn't consistently press high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goober Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 4 minutes ago, Wookie said: We weren't really a pressing team last season, Vardy would apply pressure when a trigger occurred (a player receiving the ball facing their own goal, poor touch in opposition half that sort of thing) but we didn't consistently press high. We did when we were at our best though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stadt Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 10 minutes ago, Goober said: We did when we were at our best though I cba to do loads of comparisons but ball recoveries against Man U 2015/16 and 2016/17 *season (obviously) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STUHILL Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 I did wonder this you know. I couldn't understand why players were reportedly so unhappy with Claudio, as he was playing 4-4-2 and he was picking pretty much the same team of last season, but the lack of pressing has been so evident all season and none of us could figure out why our player's weren't doing it and sitting off and dropping deeper. It is ludicrous to think Claudio instructed them not to press, but just as ludicrous as the player's ignoring his instructions to press, after knowing how affective it was last season. For me, if this is true about Claudio, then I can see why the players had become frustrated and would make more sense why we have seen player's kicking off. I guess we will see if there is any truth in this on Monday when we face Liverpool. Would love to see us back to pressing and getting the opposition's faces. I know the players and owners are going to take the brunt of this sacking, especially with the rumours, but I just hope that will make them angry, fired up and give us the spark we have been craving! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old koppite Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 Last season we started most games with 100% energy and pressing. I don't mean high pressing, just pressing all over the pitch as if we always had 3/ 4 players swarming around the opp players. I often thought we can't keep this up for 90 minutes, but we nearly always did, even with some of our players looked knackered around 60 minutes. So, I agree with those who speculate that it was a coaching change this season that has not worked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.