Take a bow Sam Wallace...

[Babylon]

13 minutes ago, Webbo said:

All these articles seem to be coming out after we won on Monday. I wonder if they wouldn't have been slagging us off if we'd lost?

A few of those have been a bit questioning of it all before then as well to be fair to them.

[sdb]

Very good. Spot on. 

[Kitchandro]

Hmmm. I think the first article is spot on, but Delaney's is a bit wide of the mark. It's basically an insult - not only did Ranieri not do much, but the whole team was lucky. Lucky because we didn't have injuries, lucky that the other teams were shit, lucky because we were on a good run from the previous season.

 

'The true key to the tale, and just one reason why it was so statistically improbable, was that it required hundreds of different elements going right at exactly the same time.'

 

Sorry, but this is just as tiresome as people saying we should be happy to go down. Things don't just go your way, I'm sick of saying we won the league for any reason other than the fact we did pretty much everything right.

 

People deserve to take credit when things go right and they need to take responsibility when things go wrong. Miguel's attitude is the sort of crap that has bred the apathy we have seen all season.

[Countryfox]

1 hour ago, davieG said:

Leicester fans back their chairman - outrage over Claudio Ranieri has come from outside

SAM WALLACECHIEF FOOTBALL WRITER

1 MARCH 2017 • 5:59PM

 

If you missed the online bookmakers’ stunt involving a hearse and a flower arrangement that read “RIP football” at the King Power Stadium on Monday night then you were not alone – were the gambling commission also to regulate lame ideas, it would have earned an immediate charge.

 

Best not to go through the excruciating detail, other than to say that it was supposed to signify what Claudio Ranieri’s sacking meant for the soul of the game because when people look for answers to the big questions of the age, obviously online bookmakers tend to be the first port of call. The response was so underwhelming even the bookies in question, a publicity-ravenous operation, quietly dropped the whole thing.

 

Not for the first time the mood of football fans was called wrong, and the true answers were to be found by watching the reaction of the Leicester City fans who attended the King Power. There was no mass outpouring of rage at Ranieri’s sacking, rather it was heartfelt thanks for what had been achieved, expressed most notably in the 65th minute when the mobile phone lights were turned on and his song was sung.

 

There was a march to celebrate Ranieri’s achievements, the occasional homemade A3 message and someone reworked their bedsheet banner to read “Dilly ding dilly wrong” but no-one called for the removal of the owners, the Srivaddhanaprabha family, or proclaimed the end of football as we know it. One week on from the sacking of the manager who steered Leicester to the title and the outrage has largely come from outside the club.

 

It has come from those who believe that Leicester’s Thai owners should be so eternally grateful for the 2015-16 season that their manager should have stayed indefinitely. Leicester were patronised to death in winning the title and now again in losing it. 

Over and again, we have been told that Ranieri “deserved the chance” to stay at Leicester although four of the five managers who won the six previous Premier League titles have also been sacked or replaced.

 

It is an interesting question. How low does a title-winning manager deserve to take a team in the following seasons before that nebulous quota of goodwill is extinguished and someone is compelled to say, “Sorry Claudio mate, but we’re out of contention for the Vanarama play-offs, I think it is time to make a change”? 

 

On BBC Five Live’s 606 show, Robbie Savage told a Leicester fan who called in to support the owner, Vichai Srivaddhanaprabha, that as a player he would have accepted “eight or nine years” in the Championship and “the odd season” in the Premier League in return for that one title.

 

Funnily enough, if you go back 20 years, including 1996-97, that is roughly what Leicester have done – 10 in the Premier League, 10 in the Championship and one in League One in 2008-09. Even so it goes without saying: exactly from whom is this trade-off available? Because you would be pretty sure that Ipswich Town, among others, would be eager to sign up.

 

It also begs another question, why should Leicester not have ambition? It is the case that having had their season in the sun they simply must go away and bother no one again, or accept a Blackburn Rovers-style decline.

 

Leicester never expected to be champions but having done so they are entitled to protect their status even if it means sacking a decent, likeable man.

 

The notion that Leicester are a nonentity who should simply be grateful is somewhat undermined by their place in the trophy roll call of recent years. If one goes back to 1997, taking into account the three domestic trophies won in that year, and every year since then, the picture is quite striking.

 

From the 1996-97 season Manchester United have won the most with a combined total of 17 Premier League titles, FA Cups and League Cups. Next come Chelsea (14); Arsenal (9); Manchester City and Liverpool (5) and, in sixth place, are Leicester with three.

 

Historically they are ahead of clubs such as Tottenham, on two trophies since 1996-97, and Swansea City, Middlesbrough, Blackburn, Birmingham City, Portsmouth and Wigan Athletic, all on one.

 

It should be said, as politely as possible, that the likes of Everton, West Ham, Southampton, Stoke City, Sunderland, Newcastle United, Aston Villa, West Bromwich Albion – we could go on here – have won none at all in those 21 years.

 

There is no Leicester fans’ song for Vichai Srivaddhanaprabha, the joke being that they keep running out of syllables, but perhaps there should be. It is he who spent around £120 million on the club. He also pledged £2 million towards building a new children’s hospital in the city. He gave £100,000 to the fund to rebury Richard III and £23,000 to a fan who was raising money for research into his son’s rare genetic disorder.

 

For a billionaire who commutes in a helicopter perhaps it is not such big a deal but it has been remembered, which is why the notion of hounding him out is considered utterly ludicrous. It does not mean he will get it right every time, but he has got it right enough times.

 

The League Managers’ Association chief executive Richard Bevan said that Vichai’s decision to sack Ranieri had “undermined the profession”, so it will be interesting to hear from all those managers who refuse to work for Leicester on a point of principle. As things stand, Roy Hodgson looks a good bet and he was de facto LMA president for the four years he was England manager.

 

It is notable that Leicester’s most famous fan, Gary Lineker, described the decision more in terms of the sadness it evoked rather than a sense of injustice. He did say though that Leicester should be building statues fir Ranieri rather than sacking him and of course, the generous Thai owners may yet do that.

 

In the meantime there are two crowdfunded appeals for Ranieri statues that have been launched by separate groups of Leicester fans, one which quotes its project at £100,000 and the other at a cut-price £10,000.

 

By lunchtime on Wednesday they had raised £90 and £817 respectively which suggests there are other issues rather more pertinent to Leicester fans than big bronze statements to reassure the rest of the football world they care about Ranieri’s feelings.

 

Light bulb moment for the press !! ....    hope the rest of you opinionated, condescending bunch of journalistic wallies read it and then, (especially you jug ears), roll it up and shove it where the sun don't shine. 

[WigstonWanderer]

Good articles. One of them making the point that I have, that getting relegated wouldn't have been good for anyone, least of all Claudio.

[Kitchandro]

17 minutes ago, HoustonFox said:

Some good stuff on the Guardian too. Take a look at the first comment at the bottom of this article, FT gets a mention too! 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2017/mar/01/footballers-not-trying-premier-league-leicester-city

 

 

How pompous is this? Writes a football article and you get halfway down until she starts talking about football.

 

Another shockingly patronising piece, this time in the opposite extreme. I'm not the only Leicester fan who has criticised the players for a lack of effort, there were plenty on here with that view after the Southampton game, but it's typical how this disappears when we, ironically, clearly start putting in more effort. At least when I say something, I mean it.

 

This woman hasn't watched our games any more than those fools who say we should be happy with where we were under Ranieri last week. But I doubt that will be pointed out this time, because our players are the flavour of the month again.

 

Monday's match proved that we were better off without Ranieri, but it also proved that these players have not had the correct attitude all season.

[Countryfox]

2 minutes ago, Kitchandro said:

, but it also proved that these players have not had the correct attitude all season.

 

And who's to blame for that ?

[ALC Fox]

31 minutes ago, Wookie said:

Had no idea about this "From the 1996-97 season Manchester United have won the most with a combined total of 17 Premier League titles, FA Cups and League Cups. Next come Chelsea (14); Arsenal (9); Manchester City and Liverpool (5) and, in sixth place, are Leicester with three." which is absolutely fantastic when you consider we've only been in the top flight for 9 of those 20 seasons. Add in a new ground, administration, a managerial merry go round, our lowest ebb, Sousa, Sven  and spunking of money, Nige cutting the cloth, record points total, a great escape and the greatest sporting story ever it's not been half bad supporting us.

 

It's an amazing statistic. If football is all about winning - which maybe all sport should be - as opposed to just treading water in a league or finishing top half or in the European spots, then, domestically speaking, that makes us the sixth best club in the country during the last 21 years.

 

[Kitchandro]

7 minutes ago, Countryfox said:

 

And who's to blame for that ?

The players.

[TheSomersetFox]

6 minutes ago, Kitchandro said:

How pompous is this? Writes a football article and you get halfway down until she starts talking about football.

 

Another shockingly patronising piece, this time in the opposite extreme. I'm not the only Leicester fan who has criticised the players for a lack of effort, there were plenty on here with that view after the Southampton game, but it's typical how this disappears when we, ironically, clearly start putting in more effort. At least when I say something, I mean it.

 

This woman hasn't watched our games any more than those fools who say we should be happy with where we were under Ranieri last week. But I doubt that will be pointed out this time, because our players are the flavour of the month again.

 

Monday's match proved that we were better off without Ranieri, but it also proved that these players have not had the correct attitude all season.

Ranieri is the one who has constantly came out and defended shocking performances like the ones away at Bournemouth and Sunderland. Seem to remember him saying something along the lines of 'Last year, everything was perfect, this year everything is going against us'. He allowed the poor attitude to settle in and stay. He didn't change anything, and i'm not sure why these players wouldn't follow orders anyway. Some will point to the fat contracts, but it was up to Ranieri to fire them up in spite of it. Like someone else said on here, saying 40 points was our target again was an embarrassment 

[yorkie1999]

Missed the point of the lady who phoned in when savage said he'd happily spend 8 years  after winning the league which was that savage doesn't support Leicester. A player obviously would say that because they only work for clubs and that's their pinnacle.

[Countryfox]

7 minutes ago, Kitchandro said:

The players.

 

I disagree Kitch and think CR was more to blame (I'm not suggesting  the players were totally blameless) and think as someone said in another thread CR was slowly undoing all the good work done by NP and people/players were generally not happy with this.   Theres a lot more to it and I'm sure we'll find out what that is in time ....

[Bunyip]

Maybe it was the constant tactical changing by Ranieri and his perchance to play players like Mussa even when it should've been obvious  he is never going to be goodenough, coupled with his obvious defencive style of play compared to last season. 

 

 

If you were one of the players would you not get dispirited if you are told to play in a manner you are not suited ?  What if you felt  " hang on a minute boss we played like this last season and the season before it got us to stay up and you now want to change the team's winning formula " ? 

 

Again if you were part of that team would you not get dismayed when you know you have played awful and you know it's because you are being told to play that way but you can't tell anyone  because it would be disloyal ?

 

Finally if you were one of the players and had to witness the boss coming out with ridiculous post match comments saying you and the team had played well , and you know and the rest of the world know you've been awful , would you still feel respectful to such a man .

 

For all that's been said about his departure we can never get the players true feelings on the matter because it would be unprofessional to do  so and against club policy. However just wait until a few years until they are free to do so and I think there will be a very different image of Ranieri to come.

[HoustonFox]

27 minutes ago, Kitchandro said:

How pompous is this? Writes a football article and you get halfway down until she starts talking about football.

 

Another shockingly patronising piece, this time in the opposite extreme. I'm not the only Leicester fan who has criticised the players for a lack of effort, there were plenty on here with that view after the Southampton game, but it's typical how this disappears when we, ironically, clearly start putting in more effort. At least when I say something, I mean it.

 

This woman hasn't watched our games any more than those fools who say we should be happy with where we were under Ranieri last week. But I doubt that will be pointed out this time, because our players are the flavour of the month again.

 

Monday's match proved that we were better off without Ranieri, but it also proved that these players have not had the correct attitude all season.

Think you've missed the point of the article.  It's a satirical piece about how "players not trying" is the new fad from all the pundits, and how in reality players can't turn it on and off again...  

 

Did you read the comment from the Leicester fan at the bottom? 

[Koke]

Here's another article by John Giles from the independent. His article is quite harsh saying Ranieri isn't a particularly good manager  (some here night agree IDK).

 

------

 

Sometimes in football, two wrongs actually do make a right.

Popular opinion weighed in behind Claudio Ranieri after he was sacked and a raft of football men who should know better waded into a debate they didn’t know much about.

Nobody can really know what happened between Ranieri and his players other than the people who were in the middle of it.

Jamie Carragher was particularly annoying on the subject when he attacked the players and the owners, suggesting that Ranieri should have been left in position and Leicester fans should just accept relegation as part of the club’s tradition.

 

How patronising a remark was that? For him and the chorus of nonsense which supported Ranieri, the Italian was wronged by the owners and wronged by the Leicester players.

After Leicester hammered Liverpool 3-1 on Monday evening, reality dawned.

The two ‘wrongs’ have produced the right result. Ranieri is gone and on the evidence of this game, the players have been released from some sort of weight.

It’s best when trying to understand what happened to deal with the evidence and for me it’s an open and shut case perfectly illustrated by the attitude the players showed in the game against Liverpool.

If the squad was in disarray as some have claimed, if they were the rabble they appeared to be in Sevilla last week, then how were they able to go back to the well and beat Liverpool?

Surely if this was a bunch of lads riddled by egos, envy and all the bad things that come with unexpected and major success, they would have been just as disorderly and ineffective against Liverpool?

I’m not saying some of those factors were not in play. I would bet that Ranieri had a difficult dressing room to deal with after they won the title.

Nor am I saying that player power is a good thing but in this case, I think the accusation that they were the main reason Ranieri got the sack is over-stated in a very big way.

It was his job to manage the success and he failed to do that.

Ranieri is not a good manager and I think the players knew this better than anyone.

They were able to roll along with him because he adopted a hands off approach and the imprint Nigel Pearson left on them held firm for nine months. It’s still there, Monday proved that. With Craig Shakespeare in temporary control, they were able to travel back in time to a moment when they were very good indeed and reproduce that form to blow a well-rested but very, very poor Liverpool away

It can go both ways in circumstances like that. With Ranieri gone, the spotlight moved immediately to the players and they were on trial against Liverpool.

Carragher’s accusation and many others like it would have stung the players badly.

Put yourself in their shoes and imagine, for a moment, that Ranieri is as I say, a very poor coach. Imagine if you’re a player and you know that too.

By some miracle, you win the title and when the wheels come off in the next campaign, you are getting it in the neck for not performing, not doing your best when you know in your heart and soul that the problem is the manager.

This is the same in any walk of life. You are less likely to work hard for someone who gets all the credit but does none of the hard graft or is quite clearly a passenger in the effort.

The point at which that was no longer sustainable came when Ranieri tried to manage, tried to put his stamp on players who didn’t rate him.

I have no doubt that there was communication between key men in the squad and the owners but I don’t think there was an organised campaign by the players to oust Ranieri.

I think they were asked for their opinion and they gave it.

So while I don’t support in any way the idea that players should virtually have the power of hiring and firing a manager, I can understand what happened at Leicester and why it unfolded in the way it did.

Who should they hire? The safest option now seem to be to leave Shakespeare in control until the end of the season.

He was with the club before Ranieri arrived and knows exactly what makes these players tick.

My bet is Leicester will kick on from here if they do that.

[ZeGuy]

1 hour ago, HoustonFox said:

Some good stuff on the Guardian too. Take a look at the first comment at the bottom of this article, FT gets a mention too! 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2017/mar/01/footballers-not-trying-premier-league-leicester-city

 

 

Argh, you beat me to it. Loved her ironic tone

[Koke]

1 hour ago, Babylon said:

Take a bow Miguel Delaney... like busses they all come at once.

 

http://ind.pn/2ldq6Dg

 

Sam Wallace, Miguel Delaney, John Giles and even Tony Evans and John Cross are are putting some perspective on it.

 

 

[Babylon]

Amazed people think it's so easy to give "100%" and that it's going to give the same results every time.

 

Firstly external forces can impact exactly what that 100% gets you. You get sent out with the wrong players, wrong formation etc, then you're likely to get far less from that 100% than you would with the right players and right formation.

 

Then there are other things like emotions and feelings that can play a part. Likes and dislikes, happy and sad, belief in what your doing or not believing in it etc.

 

If you feel right in every way, you're going to get more from your 100% than you are if you're unhappy, fed up, pissed off and demotivated. Doesn't mean you're not putting your all in, they are humans not robots. You can't turn on a switch and get the same thing every time.

 

A managers job is to manage people. It sounds to me like he's been failing with the fundamental basics of management in keeping your staff happy and motivated.

[Kinowe Soorie]

1 hour ago, Wookie said:

Had no idea about this "From the 1996-97 season Manchester United have won the most with a combined total of 17 Premier League titles, FA Cups and League Cups. Next come Chelsea (14); Arsenal (9); Manchester City and Liverpool (5) and, in sixth place, are Leicester with three." which is absolutely fantastic when you consider we've only been in the top flight for 9 of those 20 seasons. Add in a new ground, administration, a managerial merry go round, our lowest ebb, Sousa, Sven and spunking of money, Nige cutting the cloth, record points total, a great escape and the greatest sporting story ever it's not been half bad supporting us.

 

Same Bastard!

[Corky]

Also, when did this trade-off stuff all begin? Why should one season of success mean you should accept ten years of mediocrity and struggle?

[HoustonFox]

2 minutes ago, Corky said:

Also, when did this trade-off stuff all begin? Why should one season of success mean you should accept ten years of mediocrity and struggle?

Happened when we won the league Corky.  Don't remember anyone saying it when Chelsea or Man City won it for the first time?

[Number 6]

Think the Delaney piece is spot on. Don't think he's saying we were lucky as such, you make your own luck, but last season was the perfect storm for us. Also his point about building a structure where the manager is disposable being the smartest move is great and exactly what we need to do.

[Guest Mickyblueeyes]

Finally, they see it after spending the last 5 days selling papers on us being rubbish. I prefer it when they hate us.

[jet-plane]

Thank you for this thread and to it's contributors.

 

I once again feel that "maybe i am not alone", and that the ability of humans to search a little deeper using intelligence and logic to properly understand events, has not yet been lost forever.

 

Maybe, just maybe, Shearer, Savage, Carragher, Merson, etc, nearly every parasitic ex-player, etc ........ are a bit simple and haven't actually given it that much thought.

[Dan]

4 hours ago, MattP said:

Superb read.

 

They all thought we were going to turn up, boo the team and attack the owners didn't they?

 

No self pity in this City.

I like this.

 

Fantastic article. I think the shambles of a media we have these days just make gems like this article all the better.