midland_red Posted 21 May 2017 Posted 21 May 2017 Questions I hope the owners are asking themselves..(Writing this as I go along, trying to clarify my own thoughts) MOST IMPORTANT QUESTION - Do we still have the ambitions (to regularly challenge for European football) that we articulated when we arrived?. Or has experience mellowed this to being one of staying a regular Premiership side This is the big one. If 1) – as I really hope - then a number of things follow a) The team needs significant rebuilding because key players are ageing (Fuchs 31, Huth 32, Morgan 33), AND because Mahrez will be leaving AND because some players will need to be shipped out b) it needs to be established urgently whether Kaspar really wants to go Replacement on this scale cannot be put off, and it will cost money, and the price of good players is going only one way. The owners will need to ask themselves honestly whether they want to stay in the game – with their original ambition – in view of this. If they do, again there are a number of points which follow 1) money has been spent – and often wasted. It follows therefore that the recruitment process needs to be completely overhauled. but a lesson is clearly to buy up and coming players from the championship or lower reaches of the Prem. Mahrez and Kante were exceptions – generally, buying players from other leagues has not worked 2) Outside the club it is not clear who is calling the shots, The owners, on the other hand, do know Are they happy in view of the need for significant replacement? I hope not. The owners have got most big decisions right in the past few years. They – quite reasonably - hesitated before firing CR. I hope they learned a lesson from this. For the noblest of motives they hesitated almost too long…Recruitment needs to be fixed right now 3) Ambition requires that we are seen to play hardball with players who want to leave while under contract. They should never be sold cheaply and never before we have an adequate replacement. If the ambition still exists, then it needs to be articulated again and again and by example too. Which brings us onto Shakey. No question that everyone owes him. We would be been back playing on rainy Tuesday nights at the Shitty Ground without him. He has been unlucky with poor referring and with injuries too But whether he is the person to deliver the owners' ambition - if it is still live – is another question. Questions 1) Can Shakey play hardball with players? He can't be friends any more and needs support in achieving that. 2) Does he understand that serious changes are needed with the players and that change is rarely popular? 3) Would he drive that change through? 4) Does he understand that we cannot live on past glories? The football world owes us nothing 4) Would appointing a big name manager send a statement to the world that we still are ambitious? Serious ambition carries you a long way remember. It helps recruiting players if the money is there 5) But would anyone any good be available and willing (assuming feelers have not been put out already)? 6)If the owners are thinking that way, it would be astonishing if they have not approached potential candidates, yet so far nothing has leaked out, which is unusual.
UPinCarolina Posted 21 May 2017 Posted 21 May 2017 Current mood, reflecting on today and the past season: "And I'm not happy and I'm not sad..."
TAFKA Castroneves Posted 21 May 2017 Posted 21 May 2017 We say it most summers/end of seasons - but this for me is the biggest summer we've had for years - and that's been pressured a bit because we got it wrong last summer and invested in an unbalanced and over-expensive manner. It's actually a good time to entertain bids and see where the grass lies with everyone, see who wants to move on, see who wants to be here for the next stage in this football clubs history - and really now we need to be viewing this summer as an opportunity to re-balance our squad and look at solidifying our Premier League status as a mid-table side - with the ability to trouble the European places if possible, that's what we all want, fans, owners etc. We don't want to be throwing 100million around every summer and being in borderline relegation scraps. I find it interesting the support Shakey has from the players, been a few like Simpson, Vardy and Fuchs who have been very complimentary of our chances with him as boss going forward. Could that support his application? Vardy for example might choose to stay with us again if he believes under Shakey they could get back to the Champions League - he won't if Shakey goes and we get another Claudio, that would probably spell a few more names leaving. I'm not particulary worried about who goes as long as we make the right signings (obvious statement right?), we have shown we are capable of that in the past (yes Walshy's gone which isn't helpful) but we need to bring in a bit of a mixture of youth, experience and for a few different positions as well, it's important we get at least 80% of these transfers right. Going to be a fun summer for us all!
AyewJoking Posted 21 May 2017 Posted 21 May 2017 the only question i have is why not use ****ing paragraphs?
Milo Posted 21 May 2017 Posted 21 May 2017 32 minutes ago, TAFKA Castroneves said: we got it wrong last summer and invested in an unbalanced and over-expensive manner Unfortunately the same people that did this are still happily at the club, though... I do think that this is a watershed moment - what we had is being broken up, by players moving on/staff leaving/father time, etc. It's natural, but it's still a bit scary. If key players leave then we will have more of a free reign with a new manager to do what he wants - if all the players stay then the new manager will be expected to fit into 'our' system, as its been proven to be effective. Owners haven't really put a foot wrong, and they're Abramovich-rich - so they may opt for a clear out and to bankroll big name managers and players till it wins something
midland_red Posted 21 May 2017 Author Posted 21 May 2017 29 minutes ago, Royston. said: the only question i have is why not use ****ing paragraphs? Fair point.. But 'f' word probably superfluous...
BenTheFox Posted 21 May 2017 Posted 21 May 2017 1 hour ago, UPinCarolina said: Current mood, reflecting on today and the past season: "And I'm not happy and I'm not sad..." Anyone who references a Smiths song in any situation is a friend for life. Especially when it's my favourite Smiths song.
Aus Fox Posted 21 May 2017 Posted 21 May 2017 Time for a mass clear out, as much as I love Shakey and what he has done for the club, starting at the top - this needs to happen this week imo. Then a mass clear out of anyone who either dosent want to be here or isn't good enough for where we want to be. Bring in some young quality to go with what we already have. Let's start again, would love to see one of Maguire or Gibson start the ball rolling, then a CM of real quality on the ball.
norwichfox Posted 5 June 2017 Posted 5 June 2017 On 21/05/2017 at 19:13, midland_red said: 1) money has been spent – and often wasted. It follows therefore that the recruitment process needs to be completely overhauled. but a lesson is clearly to buy up and coming players from the championship or lower reaches of the Prem. Mahrez and Kante were exceptions – generally, buying players from other leagues has not worked And Vardy? didn't he work?
EGBFitness Posted 5 June 2017 Posted 5 June 2017 I wouldn't say this summer is as big as last summer. Yes some changes are needed and some questions need to be answered but I think the squad we currently have are more than capable of a top 10 finish, management announcement, Mahrez situation sorted and a few key signings and we're good. A lot will probably judge but we still have the likes of Mendy and James to bring back into the squad who could be like new signings and hopefully see a better season from Musa now he has had his first season in Prem. For me last season was the biggest and we missed out. We will never be in such a strong position to make some big signings and show some real ambition. We was happy with our 5 mins of fame and spend money cautiously on squad players.
Detroit Blues Posted 5 June 2017 Posted 5 June 2017 23 minutes ago, norwichfox said: 1) money has been spent – and often wasted. It follows therefore that the recruitment process needs to be completely overhauled. but a lesson is clearly to buy up and coming players from the championship or lower reaches of the Prem. Mahrez and Kante were exceptions – generally, buying players from other leagues has not worked Players purchased from other leagues that clearly worked out: Mahrez - 0.5 mil - class player, likely to earn us 100x what we paid Okazaki - 7 mil - class player, worth the money. Kante - 5.6 mil - world class player, sold to chelsea for 32 mil. Ndidi - 17 mil - class player. Players worth the amount we paid for them: Benny - 5.6 mil- In a world where jeff schlupp is worth 12.5 mil, benny's probably worth 5.6 as a backup CB. Amartey - 5 mil Kaputska - 2.5 mil Kramaric - 9 mil - Sold him for about what we paid. Players that didn't work out: Inler - 3 mil Mendy - 13 mil Zeiler - 3.5 mil Musa - 16 mil TBD based on next season's performance (or if we sell him in the summer): Slimani - 28 mil
Bazly Posted 5 June 2017 Posted 5 June 2017 Has it been as good as it'll ever get. Almost certainly the last few years have seen emotions of relegation(s), promotion(s), skirting with disaster and who would have believed it Champions of England with a little added treat of European football. So, the only thing to consider now is the owners ambition to be a regular top 5 side. That's going to require all sorts of investment in youth, coaches, players and probably also stadia. So long as the owners invest at the correct level to get top five which means an additional £40mn on wages to have proper deputies for all key roles and positions on the field. That would be small beans for bottom end top five 'elite' clubs.
Bazly Posted 5 June 2017 Posted 5 June 2017 35 minutes ago, Detroit Blues said: Players purchased from other leagues that clearly worked out: Mahrez - 0.5 mil - class player, likely to earn us 100x what we paid Okazaki - 7 mil - class player, worth the money. Kante - 5.6 mil - world class player, sold to chelsea for 32 mil. Ndidi - 17 mil - class player. Players worth the amount we paid for them: Benny - 5.6 mil- In a world where jeff schlupp is worth 12.5 mil, benny's probably worth 5.6 as a backup CB. Amartey - 5 mil Kaputska - 2.5 mil Kramaric - 9 mil - Sold him for about what we paid. Players that didn't work out: Inler - 3 mil Mendy - 13 mil Zeiler - 3.5 mil Musa - 16 mil TBD based on next season's performance (or if we sell him in the summer): Slimani - 28 mil You need to add in to the good value players Fuchs - FREE. Cambiasso - FREE. Sometimes the best things in life, are free.
fuchsntf Posted 5 June 2017 Posted 5 June 2017 2 hours ago, gerrytaggart said: Ill just continue to enjoy the ride. You , me and the docs mongrel mate. Too many suddenly getting too fussy for my enjoyment. Must be 1st time foxes fans.
fuchsntf Posted 5 June 2017 Posted 5 June 2017 49 minutes ago, Bazly said: Has it been as good as it'll ever get. Almost certainly the la few years have seen emotions of relegation(s), promotion(s), skirting with disaster and who would have believed it Champions of England with a little added treat of European football. So, the only thing to consider now is the owners ambition to be a regular top 5 side. That's going to require all sorts of investment in youth, coaches, players and probably also stadia. So long as the owners invest at the correct level to get top five which means an additional £40mn on wages to have proper deputies for all key roles and positions on the field. That would be small beans for bottom end top five 'elite' clubs. If you are a real true foxes fan, you neednt ask....It will only get better, we are like a good Wine or cognac. It took us 100yrs+ for us to mature.We had a few vintages, but none that held the body. We might pop our cork, or become corked. We will always bubble, depends whether its like a Selters, a Champagne or a good andrews to settle the stomach. But we are proud, fearless in our turgid and magnificent days....."We are Leicester" We really do know...."What we are".... We have always dared to dream....!!
Bunyip Posted 5 June 2017 Posted 5 June 2017 We have so much to be grateful for. Whatever happens now is a bonus. We achieved something that most clubs have not and probably never will achieve . Our names on that champions trophy for ever and no one can take that away from us . Not only that it was not some run of the mill big side win taking it in turns to win it . We shall be forever remembered for what we did not just by us the fans but the footballing world at large and I was there to see it. So having seen some dreadful years supporting this club and some god awful players to be where we are now is to me a dream come true. I'm happy just to be seeing premiership football down at my home stadium each season and not have to worry about having to watch lower league dross that we had become so accustomed too. So long as we have our present owners I'm confident that at the very least we shall remain a premiership club and not go the way of the likes of Blackburn. DON'T WORRY BE HAPPY.
Detroit Blues Posted 5 June 2017 Posted 5 June 2017 1 hour ago, Bazly said: You need to add in to the good value players Fuchs - FREE. Cambiasso - FREE. Sometimes the best things in life, are free. It's hard to say that if you signed someone on a free that you paid too much
AyewJoking Posted 5 June 2017 Posted 5 June 2017 my opinion is we kinda blew the "difficult second album" although 12th place and champions league last 8 is nothing to be ashamed of. we kept the faith with the legends squad but overall they were found wanting and the new recruits - ndidi aside, were underwhelming. Now we face a struggle to keep our best players, sign quality new players and the vacant managers position looks murkier by the day. Still a good chance of becoming a run of the mill mid table premier league side though and as long as we remain sucking on that financial premier league tit i'll be happy.
Foxxed Posted 5 June 2017 Posted 5 June 2017 I'm not convinced our tactics are as a good as two seasons ago. Our recruitment without Walsh is going to take some improving although Ndidi is excellent to be fair. Our team spirit has got a lot better but obviously tailed off towards the end of the season. The triumvirate* of Walsh, Shakespeare and Ranieri is going to take some work to replace. But our youth team is looking promising. If we could hover around mid-table, with a high pressing fast counter-attacking game, with some excellent youngsters making a name for themselves, with a chance of a European spot, I'd be very, very happy. * Many thanks for whoever was using this word of the day a while back...
Thracian Posted 7 June 2017 Posted 7 June 2017 On 2017-6-6 at 00:04, Foxxed said: I'm not convinced our tactics are as a good as two seasons ago. Our recruitment without Walsh is going to take some improving although Ndidi is excellent to be fair. Our team spirit has got a lot better but obviously tailed off towards the end of the season. The triumvirate* of Walsh, Shakespeare and Ranieri is going to take some work to replace. But our youth team is looking promising. If we could hover around mid-table, with a high pressing fast counter-attacking game, with some excellent youngsters making a name for themselves, with a chance of a European spot, I'd be very, very happy. * Many thanks for whoever was using this word of the day a while back... You keep harking back to the end of last season while seemingly and totally ignoring circumstances which would have tested every top manager in history. Walsh is gone and Ranieri was far more a failure last season than ever Shakespeare was in our last few matches because we'd have been relegated without him. As for the future we officially have the 19th most valuable team in Europe, and one of the richest clubs too from memory which takes some believing for one who watched us through the era's of Micky Adams, Craig Levine, Rob Kelly, Ian Holloway and Milan Mandaric not so long ago. Indeed, I wonder if any club in history has increased its value and profile so quickly in such a short space of time. The Leicester Mercury has just done an article on some of our emerging fringe players - half a dozen of them - including a full international and the very fact that it's anyone's guess if more than one or two of them will actually establish themselves in our first team, shows how much higher our sights are set compared with the past. With our wealth and our owners' already declared and demonstrated ambition, I'd say our ambitions are simple. To become a force in the Premiership, to become regular and well respected challengers in Europe and to continue broadening our corporate brand image across the world. For me it's the most fabulous adventure and I've no doubts we can achieve and enjoy it. Shakespeare is our logical and deserving choice of manager at this time (downgrading him would be far more ungrateful and insulting than the sacking of Ranieri) but I don't know that we couldn't somehow engage a strategic visionary who's had experience and success on the world stage. Managers don't have to dictate all recruitment. And there's history of people working briiliantly together like Clough and Taylor. Shakespeare strikes me as a team player anyway although he might have to broaden his thoughts still further. But that's inevitable anyway if he takes the managerial reins on a long-term basis. And why not? Every manager needs to evolve just like every team. And personally, having been a manager and coach at part-time professional level, the bigger the job the more help and support you need - and the job is far bigger and more complex today than it ever was in my time. .
Foxxed Posted 7 June 2017 Posted 7 June 2017 5 hours ago, Thracian said: You keep harking back to the end of last season while seemingly and totally ignoring circumstances which would have tested every top manager in history. Walsh is gone and Ranieri was far more a failure last season than ever Shakespeare was in our last few matches because we'd have been relegated without him. As for the future we officially have the 19th most valuable team in Europe, and one of the richest clubs too from memory which takes some believing for one who watched us through the era's of Micky Adams, Craig Levine, Rob Kelly, Ian Holloway and Milan Mandaric not so long ago. Indeed, I wonder if any club in history has increased its value and profile so quickly in such a short space of time. The Leicester Mercury has just done an article on some of our emerging fringe players - half a dozen of them - including a full international and the very fact that it's anyone's guess if more than one or two of them will actually establish themselves in our first team, shows how much higher our sights are set compared with the past. With our wealth and our owners' already declared and demonstrated ambition, I'd say our ambitions are simple. To become a force in the Premiership, to become regular and well respected challengers in Europe and to continue broadening our corporate brand image across the world. For me it's the most fabulous adventure and I've no doubts we can achieve and enjoy it. Shakespeare is our logical and deserving choice of manager at this time (downgrading him would be far more ungrateful and insulting than the sacking of Ranieri) but I don't know that we couldn't somehow engage a strategic visionary who's had experience and success on the world stage. Managers don't have to dictate all recruitment. And there's history of people working briiliantly together like Clough and Taylor. Shakespeare strikes me as a team player anyway although he might have to broaden his thoughts still further. But that's inevitable anyway if he takes the managerial reins on a long-term basis. And why not? Every manager needs to evolve just like every team. And personally, having been a manager and coach at part-time professional level, the bigger the job the more help and support you need - and the job is far bigger and more complex today than it ever was in my time. . Thrac, at this point I would thoroughly support the high pressing fast counter attacking football that Shakey's left testicle is almost certain to employ were it given the chance at an injury-free season.
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