CityIsBlue Posted 28 January 2020 Posted 28 January 2020 There's literally no way in which Catalan Dragons/Rugby League can benefit from this. Stupid decision, how on earth do you think this is in any way a good decision? I hate the modern PC culture, but you must understand that airing offensive views, with the 'intention' to offend, is just a stupid thing to do. Another moronic 'Celebrity' who has used their own elevated platform to try and promote their own views/beliefs. Airing negative views about different genders/races/religions/sexualities etc, in an environment which contains different genders/races/religions/sexualities etc is just moronic. No doubt this will bring out the voices of the Right and the Left in the Media to explain why the Right/Left are to blame for this. Despite the fact that both sides are just as racist/prejudiced/out of touch as each other.
Nalis Posted 28 January 2020 Posted 28 January 2020 Feel like Rugby League has been on the up over the past few years so its sad to see such a backward step taken regardless of on field talent.
urban.spaceman Posted 28 January 2020 Posted 28 January 2020 I'm not comfortable with the way he was treated at all to be honest. This was his original post: I found it really, really weird that it was framed as solely homophobic when I'm at least 4 things on that list. I'm an atheist (and an anti-theist depending on my mood) but I also believe wholly in free speech, to the point where I find it quite disturbing when people lose their jobs for saying something someone else doesn't like. For one thing that's showing absolute intolerance for other people's views - however vile you find those views, people are still entitled to them and entitled to express them. It's seriously ****ing childish to be just as intolerant back, when a reasoned, respectful discussion could lead to a change of mind. And who gets to decide what can't be said? Who gets to decide what I can't hear? This is the weirdest thing of our era - the modern left has become so intolerant of anything it doesn't agree with that people lose careers over it. I don't agree with what Folau said. I wouldn't have heard of him otherwise. I don't even like his religion. But the guy has a right to work.
Nalis Posted 28 January 2020 Posted 28 January 2020 1 hour ago, urban.spaceman said: I'm not comfortable with the way he was treated at all to be honest. This was his original post: I found it really, really weird that it was framed as solely homophobic when I'm at least 4 things on that list. I'm an atheist (and an anti-theist depending on my mood) but I also believe wholly in free speech, to the point where I find it quite disturbing when people lose their jobs for saying something someone else doesn't like. For one thing that's showing absolute intolerance for other people's views - however vile you find those views, people are still entitled to them and entitled to express them. It's seriously ****ing childish to be just as intolerant back, when a reasoned, respectful discussion could lead to a change of mind. And who gets to decide what can't be said? Who gets to decide what I can't hear? This is the weirdest thing of our era - the modern left has become so intolerant of anything it doesn't agree with that people lose careers over it. I don't agree with what Folau said. I wouldn't have heard of him otherwise. I don't even like his religion. But the guy has a right to work. He is saying homosexuality is a sin and is grouping it with adultery and thieves so he is basically saying homosexuality is wrong. An example of free speech is saying immigration in the UK should be minimised and arguing a case for it (regardless of where the individual stands on the issue). Falou's stance isn't a free speech argument, it's a hate statement.
Finnegan Posted 29 January 2020 Posted 29 January 2020 4 hours ago, urban.spaceman said: I'm not comfortable with the way he was treated at all to be honest. This was his original post: I found it really, really weird that it was framed as solely homophobic when I'm at least 4 things on that list. I'm an atheist (and an anti-theist depending on my mood) but I also believe wholly in free speech, to the point where I find it quite disturbing when people lose their jobs for saying something someone else doesn't like. For one thing that's showing absolute intolerance for other people's views - however vile you find those views, people are still entitled to them and entitled to express them. It's seriously ****ing childish to be just as intolerant back, when a reasoned, respectful discussion could lead to a change of mind. And who gets to decide what can't be said? Who gets to decide what I can't hear? This is the weirdest thing of our era - the modern left has become so intolerant of anything it doesn't agree with that people lose careers over it. I don't agree with what Folau said. I wouldn't have heard of him otherwise. I don't even like his religion. But the guy has a right to work. Get in the ****ing sea. Absolutely not having any of this to be honest.
leicsmac Posted 29 January 2020 Posted 29 January 2020 As is the case with all of these situations, freedom of speech comes hand in hand with the freedom of choice of other private individuals to respond to it as they will - as long as such a response is legal. Can't say you are morally inclined to freedom if you believe in the first but not the second.
Guest Posted 29 January 2020 Posted 29 January 2020 5 hours ago, urban.spaceman said: I'm not comfortable with the way he was treated at all to be honest. This was his original post: I found it really, really weird that it was framed as solely homophobic when I'm at least 4 things on that list. I'm an atheist (and an anti-theist depending on my mood) but I also believe wholly in free speech, to the point where I find it quite disturbing when people lose their jobs for saying something someone else doesn't like. For one thing that's showing absolute intolerance for other people's views - however vile you find those views, people are still entitled to them and entitled to express them. It's seriously ****ing childish to be just as intolerant back, when a reasoned, respectful discussion could lead to a change of mind. And who gets to decide what can't be said? Who gets to decide what I can't hear? This is the weirdest thing of our era - the modern left has become so intolerant of anything it doesn't agree with that people lose careers over it. I don't agree with what Folau said. I wouldn't have heard of him otherwise. I don't even like his religion. But the guy has a right to work. Fair play to you mate because that is a pretty remarkable reading of the situation. When a person has repeatedly and unflinchingly expressed the view that gay people are destined to burn in hell for all eternity unless they recognise the inherent wickedness of their existence and repent, I'm really not sure it's "just as intolerant" to say that that person's opportunities at the top level of professional sport should perhaps be limited. He's also apparently not as big a believer in freedom of expression as you are as he's quite happily signed a contract that's contingent on his keeping his mouth firmly closed from now on.
Jimothy Posted 29 January 2020 Posted 29 January 2020 12 hours ago, urban.spaceman said: I'm not comfortable with the way he was treated at all to be honest. This was his original post: I found it really, really weird that it was framed as solely homophobic when I'm at least 4 things on that list. I'm an atheist (and an anti-theist depending on my mood) but I also believe wholly in free speech, to the point where I find it quite disturbing when people lose their jobs for saying something someone else doesn't like. For one thing that's showing absolute intolerance for other people's views - however vile you find those views, people are still entitled to them and entitled to express them. It's seriously ****ing childish to be just as intolerant back, when a reasoned, respectful discussion could lead to a change of mind. And who gets to decide what can't be said? Who gets to decide what I can't hear? This is the weirdest thing of our era - the modern left has become so intolerant of anything it doesn't agree with that people lose careers over it. I don't agree with what Folau said. I wouldn't have heard of him otherwise. I don't even like his religion. But the guy has a right to work. I'm all for free speech, but I also understand that there are consequences to what we say. I'm free to go into work this morning and call my boss a ****, he would also then be free to sack me. I think we'd all agree some of the things on that list are things people could expect to be punished for. Thieving, adultery, lying etc, whether it be criminal punishment or the end of your relationship. I think we'd all agree on that even if we have done this things ourselves. But to put homosexuels and atheists alongside those, implies that they are equally as deplorable. One of those things is something people can't chose and the other is a belief, just like he expects us to respect his belief. So he's free to say what he likes, but he also has to accept his employer might not want to be associated with him when he does, especially as someone in the public eye.
ealingfox Posted 29 January 2020 Posted 29 January 2020 Ah yes that famous bastion of leftist politics and values, *checks notes* Rugby Australia!
Trav Le Bleu Posted 29 January 2020 Posted 29 January 2020 14 hours ago, urban.spaceman said: I'm not comfortable with the way he was treated at all to be honest. This was his original post: I found it really, really weird that it was framed as solely homophobic when I'm at least 4 things on that list. Well you've already admitted to being an atheist, but does your wife know you're a lying, thieving, adulterer? Seriously though, I agree, but from the opposite side, whilst still disagreeing with Mr Folau (I was going to say Israel, but didn't want to be accused of anti-semitism). I am a Christian and believe all those things are wrong, but since these things are all listed together, no one thing is worse than the other. Also... where does that say bible verse say anything about going to Hell? There are two gay people in the office I work in and I treat them no different to anyone else. In fact, they're two of the nicer people there. I might disagree with their lifestyle, but then I disagree with the people who regularly get drunk or who lie and cheat in my work place, but you just get along. The guy has been punished and says he's going to keep his views to himself from now on. Anyone still castigating him is pretty much doing exactly the same thing back to him and two wrongs don't make a right.
Guest MattP Posted 29 January 2020 Posted 29 January 2020 He is entitled to his views, clubs are entitled to not to tolerate those views. Catalan are entitled to employ him though and now it's up to the players and supporters of that team to take a moral stance against it if they wish. On a personal note, I think his views do cross the line from religious belief to bigotry and I wouldn't want him near a team I support.
Footballwipe Posted 29 January 2020 Posted 29 January 2020 3 hours ago, Trav Le Bleu said: Well you've already admitted to being an atheist, but does your wife know you're a lying, thieving, adulterer? Seriously though, I agree, but from the opposite side, whilst still disagreeing with Mr Folau (I was going to say Israel, but didn't want to be accused of anti-semitism). I am a Christian and believe all those things are wrong, but since these things are all listed together, no one thing is worse than the other. Also... where does that say bible verse say anything about going to Hell? There are two gay people in the office I work in and I treat them no different to anyone else. In fact, they're two of the nicer people there. I might disagree with their lifestyle, but then I disagree with the people who regularly get drunk or who lie and cheat in my work place, but you just get along. The guy has been punished and says he's going to keep his views to himself from now on. Anyone still castigating him is pretty much doing exactly the same thing back to him and two wrongs don't make a right. Yes because the way someone is is exactly the same as the poor decision making of people getting drunk, cheating and lying. At least this thread has taught me you're just a bigot hiding behind "religion."
CosbehFox Posted 29 January 2020 Posted 29 January 2020 20 hours ago, Nalis said: Feel like Rugby League has been on the up over the past few years so its sad to see such a backward step taken regardless of on field talent. This is the annual bad news story. For previous years, see Ben Barba's return to Australia and Zak Hardaker.
Trav Le Bleu Posted 29 January 2020 Posted 29 January 2020 5 hours ago, Footballwipe said: Yes because the way someone is is exactly the same as the poor decision making of people getting drunk, cheating and lying. At least this thread has taught me you're just a bigot hiding behind "religion." That's me pal. You have a nice day too! You can't say something nice without people turning it into an opportunity for hate speech, but thanks for emphasising the point I was making. Just to clarify, a bigot is someone who is intolerant of people with different opinions or lifestyles. The paragraph you highlighted shows that I'm not. It would seem however that you are intolerant of my beliefs, so...
srex9 Posted 29 January 2020 Posted 29 January 2020 3 hours ago, Trav Le Bleu said: That's me pal. You have a nice day too! You can't say something nice without people turning it into an opportunity for hate speech, but thanks for emphasising the point I was making. Just to clarify, a bigot is someone who is intolerant of people with different opinions or lifestyles. The paragraph you highlighted shows that I'm not. It would seem however that you are intolerant of my beliefs, so... Well said. I feel these topics really expose a lot of hypocracy. Most people don't even recognise their own prejudice when they are sitting on their high horse. It really does work both ways. Folau was incredibly foolish and insensitive and was rightly punished (the extent is up for debate imo). Whilst what Wigan have done is reasonably amusing on the surface I just feel it's going to add to the issue and create further division/animosity. No doubt others will say it's 'raising awareness'. Would be far more effective to just get on with it imo. If he steps out of line again then he's finished.
Carl the Llama Posted 29 January 2020 Posted 29 January 2020 3 hours ago, Trav Le Bleu said: That's me pal. You have a nice day too! You can't say something nice without people turning it into an opportunity for hate speech, but thanks for emphasising the point I was making. Just to clarify, a bigot is someone who is intolerant of people with different opinions or lifestyles. The paragraph you highlighted shows that I'm not. It would seem however that you are intolerant of my beliefs, so... I don't think you seem particularly hateful of gay people but I do think it's worth pointing at that it's not a "lifestyle" as you've called it twice now, it's a genetic fact which they have no control over. People who are born gay don't follow a code of conduct, it's no different to the way that any 2 different straight people will probably live completely different lives. Choosing to go to Church every Sunday is a lifestyle choice, being sexually attracted to members of the same sex isn't. You wouldn't call being black a lifestyle (I hope) because that would be mental, doing it for gay people is just as ridiculous.
Trav Le Bleu Posted 30 January 2020 Posted 30 January 2020 12 hours ago, Carl the Llama said: I don't think you seem particularly hateful of gay people but I do think it's worth pointing at that it's not a "lifestyle" as you've called it twice now, it's a genetic fact which they have no control over. People who are born gay don't follow a code of conduct, it's no different to the way that any 2 different straight people will probably live completely different lives. Choosing to go to Church every Sunday is a lifestyle choice, being sexually attracted to members of the same sex isn't. You wouldn't call being black a lifestyle (I hope) because that would be mental, doing it for gay people is just as ridiculous. No, I wouldn't call being black a lifestyle. I feel the nature vs nurture debate is open on both sides, and not just on this issue either. All I know is that I get a lot more abuse because I'm religious (though I appreciate your reply as being very even, not abusive) than I've ever handed out (which is none), and I'm the bigot? Disagreeing with something isn't abuse. I also objected to being called a bigot because of religion, when the gay people in my office get far more abuse from people who are atheists. Being called a bigot because of being religious (not something you did) is compounding the problem by being prejudice.
Carl the Llama Posted 30 January 2020 Posted 30 January 2020 6 minutes ago, Trav Le Bleu said: No, I wouldn't call being black a lifestyle. I feel the nature vs nurture debate is open on both sides, and not just on this issue either. All I know is that I get a lot more abuse because I'm religious (though I appreciate your reply as being very even, not abusive) than I've ever handed out (which is none), and I'm the bigot? Disagreeing with something isn't abuse. I also objected to being called a bigot because of religion, when the gay people in my office get far more abuse from people who are atheists. Being called a bigot because of being religious (not something you did) is compounding the problem by being prejudice. I'm not sure what you mean by this?
Guest Cujek Posted 31 January 2020 Posted 31 January 2020 On 29/01/2020 at 13:02, Voll Blau said: Good work Wigan.
CosbehFox Posted 12 February 2020 Posted 12 February 2020 On 29/01/2020 at 15:38, Cardiff_Fox said: This is the annual bad news story. For previous years, see Ben Barba's return to Australia and Zak Hardaker. And the next one is here, Anthony Gelling arrested for GBH, wounding with intent. Not good from the rumour mill.
slymunn Posted 13 February 2020 Posted 13 February 2020 16 hours ago, Cardiff_Fox said: And the next one is here, Anthony Gelling arrested for GBH, wounding with intent. Not good from the rumour mill. It doesnt sound good but the picture doing the rounds of his wife is from a car crash the other year. How Todd Carney got to play over here shows Catalan are not too bothered about things if the player is good enough.
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