Tactics Under Maresca

[Chrysalis]

2 minutes ago, Lambert09 said:

We haven’t even had a proper chance to see what mavididi can do because team are already focusing on keeping him out of the game because we just have kids on the right. 

 

Ridiculous amount of space given to wanya today, it was the same for mcateer. If we get the rw decision correct, teams are in trouble 

Yep, need a balanced team.

[Simmo86]

2 minutes ago, Matt said:

It's gonna be boring at times, teams are sit back, teams are gonna make it hard for us.

 

Tbh, i'm not sure Huddersfield actually did make it boring (by sitting back) or making it hard for us (Let's not sound like Pep, Rodri or Klopp claiming "they didn't play how we wanted them to play"), they sounded pretty expansive and certainly not exactly defensive.

 

That's what I can't get my head around the last 2 seasons though, we weren't a good side, teams didn't sit back, yet we played this tepid possession ball on the edge of our own box to 'draw teams out' whilst making no attempt whatsoever to go forward, I understand the reasoning and theory this season, but the past 2 seasons, nonsense.

 

Celtic? In the Scottish Pub League? No challengers, so they fucking should have.

 

They were very aggressive and didn’t give us a chance especially in the first 60 mins of getting into any rhythm. Lots of niggly fouls when the ball got played into midfield but we also played into their hands with sloppy play. 
 

We still created chances and got into good areas but again like last Sunday and Wednesday individually quality let us down in those areas.

 

It’s completely different last year though, now it’s individual quality letting down the tactical plan whereas last year it was the tactical plan letting down the individual quality.

[StriderHiryu]

11 minutes ago, Simmo86 said:

 

It’s completely different last year though, now it’s individual quality letting down the tactical plan whereas last year it was the tactical plan letting down the individual quality.

Wonderfully put! Look at the Praet chance, he’s put through cleanly on goal with lots of time to make his decision and execute. Frankly that was poor from a player who I believe cost us 18m quid. Iheanacho was also super selfish for one opportunity where Mavididi was totally free.

 

The system / tactics are creating these chances, we just need to put them away. 
 

 

[Lambert09]

15 minutes ago, Simmo86 said:

They were very aggressive and didn’t give us a chance especially in the first 60 mins of getting into any rhythm. Lots of niggly fouls when the ball got played into midfield but we also played into their hands with sloppy play. 
 

We still created chances and got into good areas but again like last Sunday and Wednesday individually quality let us down in those areas.

 

It’s completely different last year though, now it’s individual quality letting down the tactical plan whereas last year it was the tactical plan letting down the individual quality.

you’re being king suggesting there was any kind of tactical plan last year 

[Lambert09]

3 minutes ago, StriderHiryu said:

Wonderfully put! Look at the Praet chance, he’s put through cleanly on goal with lots of time to make his decision and execute. Frankly that was poor from a player who I believe cost us 18m quid. Iheanacho was also super selfish for one opportunity where Mavididi was totally free.

 

The system / tactics are creating these chances, we just need to put them away. 
 

 

they weren’t even the worst examples, anyone can miss a 1vs1.

 

The worst was when we broke and had 6vs 1 and wanya cuts back and allows them to get everyone back.  That was wide open for a tap in from someone if we’d kept moving that ball 

Edited 12 August 2023 by Lambert09

[sheffield_fox]

46 minutes ago, Jaspa said:

Might aswell drop this here too -

 

https://twitter.com/markstatsbot/status/1690392601529286656

Wow these stats are superb. 

[ARM1968]

14 minutes ago, Lambert09 said:

they weren’t even the worst examples, anyone can miss a 1vs1.

 

The worst was when we broke and had 6vs 1 and wanya cuts back and allows them to get everyone back.  That was wide open for a tap in from someone if we’d kept moving that ball 

Agree with this. They need to know when to go and when to stop and recirculate. Multiple times today we had an overload and failed to exploit it. Times we had multiple runners splitting their defence and no pass. Madders would have thrived with this. 

[Spudulike]

If these early season results continue then we won't be far away from ex-players and pundits touting Enzo for almost every PL vacancy when the sackings start. 

[inckley fox]

To be honest, same as in the Cov game, I thought the patient build-up tactics were going more and more out of the window as the match progressed, and it was a more positive and direct approach which turned things in our favour. I've seen little evidence so far that the 300-passes-in-order-to-put-our-defence-under-pressure approach is reaping dividends.

 

Having vastly superior personnel to our opponents, it seems that the key to victory has so far not been what some call Marescaball, but rather just getting to a stage in the match where you allow players with pedigree to do what they need to do. That's not to say that his grand plan won't end up working, nor that Maresca doesn't deserve a lot of credit for affording them that flexibility. But we'll see how practical his approach is over the coming weeks and months, especially as we (hopefully) bring in the sort of creative player that he clearly requires.

[Number 6]

Seen a lot of situations in both league games so far where quick movement through the lines, beating the press, has lead to really promising positions. Usually one of the wide players or KDH bearing down on the defence and having tons of space. 

 

I think so far we've made some poor decisions in these positions, but it's really promising that we keep finding ourselves in them.

[JimJams]

I think the young lads suffer from a lack of confidence in those situations. They probably want to take it on but second guess themselves, worried about losing the ball and instead of making a decision they dally and it goes to shit anyway. It's not uncommon in young wingers.

[Simmo86]

36 minutes ago, sheffield_fox said:

Wow these stats are superb. 

Can’t remember their chance after half time that gave them such a high XG 

[lfu]

11 minutes ago, Simmo86 said:

Can’t remember their chance after half time that gave them such a high XG 

Ward's missed header in the 46th minute apparently

Must be using an odd xG model

[WoodyFox]

1 hour ago, Simmo86 said:

It’s nothing like last season 

Yes it’s the championship 

[Simmo86]

22 minutes ago, lfu said:

Ward's missed header in the 46th minute apparently

Must be using an odd xG model

Ahh yeah I remember, was hardly a sitter though. 

[Lambert09]

50 minutes ago, JimJams said:

I think the young lads suffer from a lack of confidence in those situations. They probably want to take it on but second guess themselves, worried about losing the ball and instead of making a decision they dally and it goes to shit anyway. It's not uncommon in young wingers.

On the money. If you are a player from the academy you dont go with instinct, you go with with what you think the manager wants. In this case, they will more than likely be thinking about possession rather than perhaps going for glory. I get the sense Doyle is making a few unnatural decisions as well. 

[BKLFox]

Nothing mentioned about the subs? I imagine if Rodgers put 2 GKs on the bench there would be loads of posts slating him and making out it was the little weasels way of having a dig at the board about wanting signings

[Bert]

1 minute ago, BKLFox said:

Nothing mentioned about the subs? I imagine if Rodgers put 2 GKs on the bench there would be loads of posts slating him and making out it was the little weasels way of having a dig at the board about wanting signings

It’s been mentioned. It was one of the questions asked. 

[foxfanazer]

11 minutes ago, BKLFox said:

Nothing mentioned about the subs? I imagine if Rodgers put 2 GKs on the bench there would be loads of posts slating him and making out it was the little weasels way of having a dig at the board about wanting signings

Still defending him

 

Let it go mate

[Number 6]

15 minutes ago, BKLFox said:

Nothing mentioned about the subs? I imagine if Rodgers put 2 GKs on the bench there would be loads of posts slating him and making out it was the little weasels way of having a dig at the board about wanting signings

Ffs I'd had a whole afternoon of not thinking about that clappy ****.

[JimJams]

Not sure why so much is being made of it as a message to the board. It might just be because he has to keep one of them and at present doesn't know which one it'll likely be (it'll be Ward) so he's put them both on the bench so's not to upset anybody. We know they're probably 3rd choice at best, but imagine being the one left out of the matchday squad and then being the one that ends up staying. It's probably just trying to avoid any disharmony in the GK position.

[StriderHiryu]

Huddersfield (0) vs Leicester (1) Notes

 

- We played the same system we've used all season: 433 / 3241

- Huddersfield played high press (to an extent) and man-for-man. The Atalanta of the Championship! They played 4231.  They pressed everyone but our CBs when is possesion, so Vestergaard especially often had ages on the ball.

- Helik seemed to be man-marking either Winks or Ricardo, resulted in being ridiculously high up the pitch such that he was sitting on our 18 yard box. This led to him having a fantastic chance, which he should have scored.

- Huddersfield were very physical, leaving a bit in on challenges and working the crowd.

- We play differently with Iheanacho compared to Vardy. Vardy looks to run in behind, Nacho drops deep to link up. I think this was a tactic specific for this match, as it's the infamous "False 9" scenario. Look at the clip below to see why we went this way, man-for-man means you can drag defenders with you. Remember when Maresca said "we will have to come up with a different solution"? False 9 was the solution.

- False 9 was also the reason why a lot of our chances were Vestergaard clipping a ball over the top. Seems basic, but if Nacho drags men with him, there are spaces for the attacking 8's.

- Nacho had lots of good chances and moments but poor decision-making in the final third. More effective than Vardy though IMO.
- Praet started over Ndidi, but I felt he was quite wasteful throughout the game, squandering chances both in terms of passing and shooting. Clear why we want an attacking midfielder.

- Wanya Marcal was pretty good, got into some great positions at time. Honestly, I was a bit surprised he was taken off. My feeling is we started the half slow and were getting bullied in the middle of the park. So putting Ndidi in sorted that out.

- Mavididi scored but was a threat throughout. Hugged the touchline to create space in the half-spaces for the attacking 8s, and really attacked his man. I think he's still finding his feet but if starts getting confident I think he will tear this division a new one. Teams won't be able to match his pace and power.

- Special mention for Wout Faes! Mopped up everything defensively. But also showcased a different side to our tactics. When one of the outside CBs steps up to win the ball, they have licence to push forward if the space is there to make another attacking player. He did this against Coventry and a few times today, Doyle does the same on the other side.  Faes was class, he made one small error when a clearance went straight up rather than out, but otherwise he looked elite at this level.

 

Move of the Match

 

Full highlights aren't out yet, so I haven't got the full move but will put it here later. Really slick vertical transition to unleash one of our attacking 8's! Shame it wasn't put away. Winks and Ricardo combine, Nacho false 9 drags defenders with him, so Praet can run through in acres as Ricardo plays a delicious sliding pass through the lines.

 

 

Overall Thoughts

 

We won the game but I think Warnock edged the tactical battle given the relative resources both teams have at their disposal. The man for man approach was surprisingly effective and I think we will see other teams employ it until we demolish someone that does. I don''t think we ever looked like losing, but we were running out of ideas before Mavididi scored. That said, this could be a rare game where both managers tactics worked, because we did make chances, we just didn't put them away!

 

 

[Chrysalis]

2 hours ago, Lambert09 said:

they weren’t even the worst examples, anyone can miss a 1vs1.

 

The worst was when we broke and had 6vs 1 and wanya cuts back and allows them to get everyone back.  That was wide open for a tap in from someone if we’d kept moving that ball 

Yes this is the better point.

 

If the system is good enough, it doesnt matter if 1 on 1 gets missed as there will be plenty of other chances.

 

This is the main weakness I am seeing so far we need to be more pacy in the final 3rd and vary it up a bit.  But given we had a compromised pre season, dont have our final squad yet and havent played many games I will accept things are not going to be at their best yet.

 

For the possession we had I would expect probably 20-30 shots with most on target from inside the box, we had 17, but a fair amount of those were from outside of the box as we was struggling to penetrate it.

 

However that 10 minute spell where we were really dominant,  sweeping the ball around, winning it back immediately, it did lead to a goal, that was a pure grind of a goal where they simply couldnt get the ball for a long spell all over the pitch and it led to an opening.  Thats the second change from last season, for spells of games now we are getting good at quickly winning the ball back, its just not sustained for the game.

Edited 12 August 2023 by Chrysalis

[StriderHiryu]

 

[Nalis]

38 minutes ago, StriderHiryu said:

Huddersfield (0) vs Leicester (1) Notes

 

- We played the same system we've used all season: 433 / 3241

- Huddersfield played high press (to an extent) and man-for-man. The Atalanta of the Championship! They played 4231.  They pressed everyone but our CBs when is possesion, so Vestergaard especially often had ages on the ball.

- Helik seemed to be man-marking either Winks or Ricardo, resulted in being ridiculously high up the pitch such that he was sitting on our 18 yard box. This led to him having a fantastic chance, which he should have scored.

- Huddersfield were very physical, leaving a bit in on challenges and working the crowd.

- We play differently with Iheanacho compared to Vardy. Vardy looks to run in behind, Nacho drops deep to link up. I think this was a tactic specific for this match, as it's the infamous "False 9" scenario. Look at the clip below to see why we went this way, man-for-man means you can drag defenders with you. Remember when Maresca said "we will have to come up with a different solution"? False 9 was the solution.

- False 9 was also the reason why a lot of our chances were Vestergaard clipping a ball over the top. Seems basic, but if Nacho drags men with him, there are spaces for the attacking 8's.

- Nacho had lots of good chances and moments but poor decision-making in the final third. More effective than Vardy though IMO.
- Praet started over Ndidi, but I felt he was quite wasteful throughout the game, squandering chances both in terms of passing and shooting. Clear why we want an attacking midfielder.

- Wanya Marcal was pretty good, got into some great positions at time. Honestly, I was a bit surprised he was taken off. My feeling is we started the half slow and were getting bullied in the middle of the park. So putting Ndidi in sorted that out.

- Mavididi scored but was a threat throughout. Hugged the touchline to create space in the half-spaces for the attacking 8s, and really attacked his man. I think he's still finding his feet but if starts getting confident I think he will tear this division a new one. Teams won't be able to match his pace and power.

- Special mention for Wout Faes! Mopped up everything defensively. But also showcased a different side to our tactics. When one of the outside CBs steps up to win the ball, they have licence to push forward if the space is there to make another attacking player. He did this against Coventry and a few times today, Doyle does the same on the other side.  Faes was class, he made one small error when a clearance went straight up rather than out, but otherwise he looked elite at this level.

 

Move of the Match

 

Full highlights aren't out yet, so I haven't got the full move but will put it here later. Really slick vertical transition to unleash one of our attacking 8's! Shame it wasn't put away. Winks and Ricardo combine, Nacho false 9 drags defenders with him, so Praet can run through in acres as Ricardo plays a delicious sliding pass through the lines.

 

 

Overall Thoughts

 

We won the game but I think Warnock edged the tactical battle given the relative resources both teams have at their disposal. The man for man approach was surprisingly effective and I think we will see other teams employ it until we demolish someone that does. I don''t think we ever looked like losing, but we were running out of ideas before Mavididi scored. That said, this could be a rare game where both managers tactics worked, because we did make chances, we just didn't put them away!

 

 

Thanks for this and agree that Huddersfield did as well as they could have tactically. From what I've seen I actually dont think Huddersfield were poor today, if they play like that this season I reckon they'll finish comfortably top half.