Southampton (a) Pre Match Thread

[LCFCJohn]

On 05/09/2023 at 19:20, Drink Water said:

They couldn't even get 1 past Sunderland, many in this thread are really overrating Southampton.

It would be surprising if they play that bad and get that bad of a result again all season. 
 

They are quite clearly a promotion rival and playing them away is, on paper at least, one of the toughest fixtures of the season. That’s not overrating them. They may end up midtable, but if they do, they’ll have massively underperformed. 
 

They have also scored more goals than us across the season so far if you remove last weekend (which we also didn’t score) so in the first 4 games for each side. They also have an excellent striker at this level in Adam Armstrong and Che Adams who seems to love playing us. So it’s fair to make the point that if we give them the opportunities that we have given some of our opponents so far this season, we may be less fortunate. 
 

If we keep a clean sheet and win the game, it’ll be a mark of intent. 

[Foxin_Mad]

I think Hull were the best side we have played so far and we lost.

 

Southampton play a similar game to us, I feel that attack and creativity wise they are way better than us.

 

I worry about our defense against better players. 

[Chico1958]

It'll be a test that we should overcome, however last year they did us twice home and away.

 

Hopefully we've done some shooting practice ( On Target ) since Saturday and we'll actually move the ball forward faster.

 

 

 

 

[MGLCFC]

34 minutes ago, Foxin_Mad said:

I think Hull were the best side we have played so far and we lost.

 

Southampton play a similar game to us, I feel that attack and creativity wise they are way better than us.

 

I worry about our defense against better players. 

Really - I thought they were on a par with Cardiff and worse than Coventry - funny how we all see things differently.

[Gamble92]

5 minutes ago, MGLCFC said:

Really - I thought they were on a par with Cardiff and worse than Coventry - funny how we all see things differently.

Agreed. Goals change people's perceptions of a match so much. If Cov bag a couple that they should have second half everyone would have been raving about them. Likewise Fatawu's shot goes inside the post and Hull would be see as negative and boring. Because we didn't score they've pulled off a defensive masterclass and deserved it.

[Foxin_Mad]

16 minutes ago, MGLCFC said:

Really - I thought they were on a par with Cardiff and worse than Coventry - funny how we all see things differently.

 

10 minutes ago, Gamble92 said:

Agreed. Goals change people's perceptions of a match so much. If Cov bag a couple that they should have second half everyone would have been raving about them. Likewise Fatawu's shot goes inside the post and Hull would be see as negative and boring. Because we didn't score they've pulled off a defensive masterclass and deserved it.

Dont get me wrong they werent particularly good and were there for the taking, but in terms of team performance, defensive solidity, tactical ridity, shape they were the best. Technically and visably they were awful but they did a job on us, a job that is pretty easy to do. A lot of of Championsip teams will be the same. 

 

To be honest there has not been one game so far where I can say our performace was good. If all our results ended in draws or narrow defeats it wouldnt have been unfair.

 

There are clearly better teams in this league than any we have played so far and I feel there are better 'teams' than us.

 

I hope we will improve and become more coherant in time, the creativity in the team worries me. We cant create many clear cut opportunities, most of our goals so far have been errors or moments of quality. 

Edited 7 September 2023 by Foxin_Mad

[StriderHiryu]

 

 

Almost all of our first team players still around at Seagrave. Coady can be seen in this video, getting involved in Rondos with the team!

 

This is really good news. The team NEEDS a few more weeks to build up fluency and get the tactical idea. Mavididi, Winks, Ricardo, Yunus, KDH, Fatawu, Coady, McAteer, Vestergaard all around from these clips.

 

 

Edited 7 September 2023 by StriderHiryu

[Gamble92]

34 minutes ago, Foxin_Mad said:

 

Dont get me wrong they werent particularly good and were there for the taking, but in terms of team performance, defensive solidity, tactical ridity, shape they were the best. Technically and visably they were awful but they did a job on us, a job that is pretty easy to do. A lot of of Championsip teams will be the same. 

 

To be honest there has not been one game so far where I can say our performace was good. If all our results ended in draws or narrow defeats it wouldnt have been unfair.

 

There are clearly better teams in this league than any we have played so far and I feel there are better 'teams' than us.

 

I hope we will improve and become more coherant in time, the creativity in the team worries me. We cant create many clear cut opportunities, most of our goals so far have been errors or moments of quality. 

Would you say our goals scored against Coventry were any more clear cut than the chances we got against Hull? 

[goose2010]

11 minutes ago, StriderHiryu said:

 

 

Almost all of our first team players still around at Seagrave. Coady can be seen in this video, getting involved in Rondos with the team!

 

This is really good news. The team NEEDS a few more weeks to build up fluency and get the tactical idea. Mavididi, Winks, Ricardo, Yunus, KDH, Fatawu, Coady, McAteer, Vestergaard all around from these clips.

 

 

isnt he away with Ghana? 

[StriderHiryu]

2 minutes ago, goose2010 said:

isnt he away with Ghana? 

He’s in the clips! So guess not. 
 

My understanding is that he only has one cap. As we’ve all seen he’s got raw attributes but needs some development. Actually there’s a downside that if Maresca makes him too good he will get called up for AFCON 

[BKLFox]

3 minutes ago, goose2010 said:

isnt he away with Ghana? 

Looks like we rejected their request initially but today due to the withdrawal of Joseph Paintsil he has now been allowed to go

[goose2010]

Just now, StriderHiryu said:

He’s in the clips! So guess not. 
 

My understanding is that he only has one cap. As we’ve all seen he’s got raw attributes but needs some development. Actually there’s a downside that if Maresca makes him too good he will get called up for AFCON 

strange as the club tweeted 2 hours ago he is in the Ghana squad and they play tonight

 

 

[pmcla26]

4 minutes ago, StriderHiryu said:

He’s in the clips! So guess not. 
 

My understanding is that he only has one cap. As we’ve all seen he’s got raw attributes but needs some development. Actually there’s a downside that if Maresca makes him too good he will get called up for AFCON 

14 caps, one goal

[Gamble92]

1 hour ago, Chico1958 said:

It'll be a test that we should overcome, however last year they did us twice home and away.

 

Hopefully we've done some shooting practice ( On Target ) since Saturday and we'll actually move the ball forward faster.

 

 

 

 

Apples and oranges 

[Bablemikey]

Still very very early days for our team whereas Southampton have an established style of play. I'm really looking forward to seeing how we get on but I won't be reading too much into the result either way. 

 

[Lillehamring]

18 minutes ago, Bablemikey said:

Still very very early days for our team whereas Southampton have an established style of play. I'm really looking forward to seeing how we get on but I won't be reading too much into the result either way. 

 

And yet Maresca has been with us 5 days longer than Martin has been at southampton?  Am i missing something here?

[FoxinNotts]

1 hour ago, StriderHiryu said:

 

 

Almost all of our first team players still around at Seagrave. Coady can be seen in this video, getting involved in Rondos with the team!

 

This is really good news. The team NEEDS a few more weeks to build up fluency and get the tactical idea. Mavididi, Winks, Ricardo, Yunus, KDH, Fatawu, Coady, McAteer, Vestergaard all around from these clips.

 

 

Great to see Coady out there. I thought Fatawu was selected for Ghana?

[pmcla26]

22 minutes ago, Bablemikey said:

Still very very early days for our team whereas Southampton have an established style of play. I'm really looking forward to seeing how we get on but I won't be reading too much into the result either way. 

 

I'd say we have established our style of play, it's pretty evident that there patterns of play on display that have been worked on, we just haven't become as effective as I think we all know we could be in the future with the players that we have, but that will come with time. 

 

Southampton haven't been any better than us in these opening 5 games. 

[Fox92]

On 05/09/2023 at 19:20, Drink Water said:

They couldn't even get 1 past Sunderland, many in this thread are really overrating Southampton.

Southampton only had 2 shots on target all game. The thing that has worried me so far is that we are allowing teams to many chances. Thankfully, so far, opposition hasn't been good enough to finish off chances but Southampton have more quality up front than those teams we've faced so far.

[Lillehamring]

1 minute ago, Fox92 said:

Southampton only had 2 shots on target all game. The thing that has worried me so far is that we are allowing teams to many chances. Thankfully, so far, opposition hasn't been good enough to finish off chances but Southampton have more quality up front than those teams we've faced so far.

It is worth noting that we have reduced the amounts of attempted shoots against each game:

cov: 20

hud: 13

car: 10

rot: 8

hull: 7

 

[Gamble92]

2 hours ago, Foxin_Mad said:

 

Dont get me wrong they werent particularly good and were there for the taking, but in terms of team performance, defensive solidity, tactical ridity, shape they were the best. Technically and visably they were awful but they did a job on us, a job that is pretty easy to do. A lot of of Championsip teams will be the same. 

 

To be honest there has not been one game so far where I can say our performace was good. If all our results ended in draws or narrow defeats it wouldnt have been unfair.

 

There are clearly better teams in this league than any we have played so far and I feel there are better 'teams' than us.

 

I hope we will improve and become more coherant in time, the creativity in the team worries me. We cant create many clear cut opportunities, most of our goals so far have been errors or moments of quality. 

Yh it is an issue. Not a big fan of the way people perceive xG but it's very obvious ours being so low highlights that this hasn't been some tactical masterclass that's won us the games. I just feel like the theory is if we have the ball the majority of the time then we have the players to produce that individual quality. Rather than creating a basketball type game. I do wonder if a gegenpress type style would work best for this team. Feel like we would create a lot more.

[jmono84]

18 minutes ago, Fox92 said:

Southampton only had 2 shots on target all game. The thing that has worried me so far is that we are allowing teams to many chances. Thankfully, so far, opposition hasn't been good enough to finish off chances but Southampton have more quality up front than those teams we've faced so far.

Looking at the stats we’ve actually been unlucky with goals we have conceded.

 

Out Xg against us is 5.0 but we’ve conceded 4 goals. Compared to Hull and Plymouth who’s Xg 9.5 and 9.2 and conceded 6 and 5 goals.

 

We’re towards the bottom of Xg against and easily in the bottom half for shots/shots on target against.

 

Other than the Coventry corner the goals were either well executed goals or a deflected effort

Edited 7 September 2023 by jmono84

[Foxin_Mad]

1 hour ago, Gamble92 said:

Would you say our goals scored against Coventry were any more clear cut than the chances we got against Hull? 

Not particularly. Id argue apart from maybe McAteer against cov and Praet against Huddesfield we havent really created any clear goalscoring opportunities we havent scored from. 

 

We dont seem capable of opening teams up. 

 

7 minutes ago, Gamble92 said:

Yh it is an issue. Not a big fan of the way people perceive xG but it's very obvious ours being so low highlights that this hasn't been some tactical masterclass that's won us the games. I just feel like the theory is if we have the ball the majority of the time then we have the players to produce that individual quality. Rather than creating a basketball type game. I do wonder if a gegenpress type style would work best for this team. Feel like we would create a lot more.

Agree, Im not particularly against how we play up unitl the final 3rd, in that area we are awful. Theres little movement, no one who can play a ball to open up a defence, a general lack of creativity. There needs to be movement to drag the opposition out of position and create space.

 

Im not really sure we have the correct players in that area.

 

We can not play with Ndidi and KDH, they just dont have enough quality to unlock defences. Wingers by there very nature are hit and miss! 

 

To me Ricardo isnt particularly effective either. Overall the midifeld is poor and lacks technical ability and that is the area you win games. 

[SouthStandUpperTier]

43 minutes ago, FoxinNotts said:

Great to see Coady out there. I thought Fatawu was selected for Ghana?

Not been selected. Too much flair for Chris Hughton's liking.

 

 

[Gamble92]

20 minutes ago, Foxin_Mad said:

Not particularly. Id argue apart from maybe McAteer against cov and Praet against Huddesfield we havent really created any clear goalscoring opportunities we havent scored from. 

 

We dont seem capable of opening teams up. 

 

Agree, Im not particularly against how we play up unitl the final 3rd, in that area we are awful. Theres little movement, no one who can play a ball to open up a defence, a general lack of creativity. There needs to be movement to drag the opposition out of position and create space.

 

Im not really sure we have the correct players in that area.

 

We can not play with Ndidi and KDH, they just dont have enough quality to unlock defences. Wingers by there very nature are hit and miss! 

 

To me Ricardo isnt particularly effective either. Overall the midifeld is poor and lacks technical ability and that is the area you win games. 

Yeah I'm really baffled why there isn't a plan B involving using wing backs/full backs. The fact that we don't change shape surely allows the opposition to know they can stick to their shape and like Hull just rely on our questionable finishing. 

 

Just because it's such a fluid style, I don't see why the formation has to be as rigid as it is.