General News Thread

[leicsmac]

24 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

The 1% are already leaving the UK in droves.  Don't bank on the increase actually materialising.

... so it's the other pathway with all the increasing inequality, and social breakdown and violence that entails, then?

 

Unless there's a third way that might be elaborated upon. 

[Trav Le Bleu]

2 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

... so it's the other pathway with all the increasing inequality, and social breakdown and violence that entails, then?

 

Unless there's a third way that might be elaborated upon. 

 

[Jon the Hat]

10 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

... so it's the other pathway with all the increasing inequality, and social breakdown and violence that entails, then?

 

Unless there's a third way that might be elaborated upon. 

You either have to stop spending more money on things that don't deliver benefits, or tax people more.  As no one seems to be able to do the first, then you must do the second.  You cannot just tax the better off though, there aren't enough of them.  2% increase on every band now should do for a start.

[leicsmac]

9 minutes ago, Trav Le Bleu said:

 

Time to die historic on the Fury Road!

 

1 minute ago, Jon the Hat said:

You either have to stop spending more money on things that don't deliver benefits, or tax people more.  As no one seems to be able to do the first, then you must do the second.  You cannot just tax the better off though, there aren't enough of them.  2% increase on every band now should do for a start.

I wouldn't mind that, but unfortunately there appear to be rather a lot of people who are having more trouble getting by that would.

 

I can't see any tax increase having the popularity to succeed even in the medium term unless it targets the much higher earners more. 

[StanSP]

I see that good old British and proud citizen SYL has smeared a totally innocent person again...

[Tommy G]

1 hour ago, leicsmac said:

Time to die historic on the Fury Road!

 

I wouldn't mind that, but unfortunately there appear to be rather a lot of people who are having more trouble getting by that would.

 

I can't see any tax increase having the popularity to succeed even in the medium term unless it targets the much higher earners more. 

Do you understand the tax take between £100K-125K - you keep £38 of every £100 you earn, so are you suggesting this should further increase? 

[kenny]

1 hour ago, leicsmac said:

... so it's the other pathway with all the increasing inequality, and social breakdown and violence that entails, then?

 

Unless there's a third way that might be elaborated upon. 

If we can make the 1% leave the UK, won't that improve equality by making us all poorer together?

 

Every cloud etc?

[leicsmac]

14 minutes ago, Tommy G said:

Do you understand the tax take between £100K-125K - you keep £38 of every £100 you earn, so are you suggesting this should further increase? 

From a purely personal point of view, as I said, I wouldn't mind as it would not affect me in the least, apart from a likely improvement to public services in which I partake. 

 

However, I'm both not a selfish bastard and understand that I'm vastly outnumbered by people for which this is unacceptable, so logically I know it can't work, for that reason that I made clear in my original post. 

 

My personal feelings don't outweigh what exists in terms of other human behaviour, and perhaps other people should consider that concept a little more. 

 

12 minutes ago, kenny said:

If we can make the 1% leave the UK, won't that improve equality by making us all poorer together?

 

Every cloud etc?

Again, as I've said above, I know that there would be caterwauling in the press and threats to leave (and actual leaving).

 

So, with that in mind, what is the way forward that possibly doesn't involve a libertarian paradise where the market dictates who lives and dies and social inequality is baked into the system itself?

 

Edit: unless that kind of have and have-not society is someone's idea of an acceptable time, that is. 

Edited 22 August 2025 by leicsmac

[Greg2607]

7 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

From a purely personal point of view, as I said, I wouldn't mind as it would not affect me in the least, apart from a likely improvement to public services in which I partake. 

 

However, I'm both not a selfish bastard and understand that I'm vastly outnumbered by people for which this is unacceptable, so logically I know it can't work, for that reason that I made clear in my original post. 

 

My personal feelings don't outweigh what exists in terms of other human behaviour, and perhaps other people should consider that concept a little more. 

 

Again, as I've said above, I know that there would be caterwauling in the press and threats to leave (and actual leaving).

 

So, with that in mind, what is the way forward that possibly doesn't involve a libertarian paradise where the market dictates who lives and dies and social inequality is baked into the system itself?

 

Edit: unless that kind of have and have-not society is someone's idea of an acceptable time, that is. 

all of that above conversation goes back to what I said yesterday (or the day before... I talk alot of nonsense, I lose track!) - Ultimately, everyone seems to collectively want change.... but they don't want the things that enable change to impact them. 

 

High Earners - Don't tax me more, I'm taxed enough

Low Earners - Don't reduce my benefits

Pensioners - I NEED my WFA. 

Doctors - We want pay restoration

Businesses - Don't change my trading environment

Home Owners - Don't build that infrastructure NEAR me. 

 

What successive governments have failed to do is build a vision of the future that we are ALL, COLLECTIVELY working towards. All Contributing to.   Afterall, I'm sure those of us who have children, want them to inherit a working, meaningful and supportive society. 

 

Problem is... None of us know what that vision is.   Who could define it on here? 

 

If @Tommy G felt that a 1% increase on his income tax could guarantee his Kids would have the school provision and support networks they needed... I know for a fact he would pay it in an instant. 

 

if @leicsmac KNEW that reducing WFA for pensioners could GUARANTEE a more eco focused future where humanity gets to endure... he would accept it in an instant. 

 

It's why people like Farage are so successful politically.  He paints a vision VERY effectively.  certain demographics can identify with that vision and will move heaven and earth to vote for it. 

 

I would offer to go into politics myself... but there are far too many skeletons in my closet from my youth! 

 

 

 

[leicsmac]

20 minutes ago, Greg2607 said:

all of that above conversation goes back to what I said yesterday (or the day before... I talk alot of nonsense, I lose track!) - Ultimately, everyone seems to collectively want change.... but they don't want the things that enable change to impact them. 

 

High Earners - Don't tax me more, I'm taxed enough

Low Earners - Don't reduce my benefits

Pensioners - I NEED my WFA. 

Doctors - We want pay restoration

Businesses - Don't change my trading environment

Home Owners - Don't build that infrastructure NEAR me. 

 

What successive governments have failed to do is build a vision of the future that we are ALL, COLLECTIVELY working towards. All Contributing to.   Afterall, I'm sure those of us who have children, want them to inherit a working, meaningful and supportive society. 

 

Problem is... None of us know what that vision is.   Who could define it on here? 

 

If @Tommy G felt that a 1% increase on his income tax could guarantee his Kids would have the school provision and support networks they needed... I know for a fact he would pay it in an instant. 

 

if @leicsmac KNEW that reducing WFA for pensioners could GUARANTEE a more eco focused future where humanity gets to endure... he would accept it in an instant. 

 

It's why people like Farage are so successful politically.  He paints a vision VERY effectively.  certain demographics can identify with that vision and will move heaven and earth to vote for it. 

 

I would offer to go into politics myself... but there are far too many skeletons in my closet from my youth! 

 

 

 

On the contrary, that vision is very clear and explicable. You describe it very well with the very previous sentence (also bolded).

 

The vision is, must be, the preservation of human life and civilisation at the quality it is now or better. There are so many threats to that, and a lot of people simply do not see them and take the infrastructure they use every day for granted. Until the day it's no longer there. And everyone, even the most hardened individualist, needs that network and relies on it in ways they don't even consider - if they think otherwise, they are simply mistaken. 

 

The problem arises, again, through simple human short term self interest that often runs counter to projects that would contribute to that goal. 

 

So, I don't think the problem is one of lacking what the vision is, it's more one of being able to implement it in the face of those who do not share the same vision. 

Edited 22 August 2025 by leicsmac

[Greg2607]

Incidentally.... I do think Labour TRIED to paint that picture if you read their manifesto. But the messaging hasn't landed and the media have fixated on the immediate impacts to people in a negative sense.  The vision hasn't landed. 

 

Spreading economic activity out of the south east and into the regions should be something that 3/4's of the country are excited about. 

 

Setting up wealth funds, should be something the country gets excited about. 

 

But the dissenting voices are far far louder and the messaging has been lost. 

 

No celebration of waiting lists coming down. 

No real celebration of trade deals.

No celebration of the breakfast clubs or the relaunch of "sure start" centres. 

No celebration of protecting workers rights.

 

It's much easier for them to generate revenue with angry click bait headlines. 

Edited 22 August 2025 by Greg2607

[Greg2607]

1 minute ago, leicsmac said:

On the contrary, that vision is very clear and explicable. You describe it very well with the very previous sentence (also bolded).

 

The vision is, must be, the preservation of human life and civilisation at the quality it is now or better. There are so many threats to that, and a lot of people simply do not see them and take the infrastructure they use every day for granted. Until the day it's no longer there.

 

The problem arises, again, through simple human short term self interest that often runs counter to projects that would contribute to that goal. 

 

So, I don't think the problem is one of lacking what the vision is, it's more one of being able to implement it in the face of those who do not share the same vision. 

That's your vision though.  It's not one which any political party (other than the greens probably) have tried to paint. 

[Tommy G]

28 minutes ago, Greg2607 said:

all of that above conversation goes back to what I said yesterday (or the day before... I talk alot of nonsense, I lose track!) - Ultimately, everyone seems to collectively want change.... but they don't want the things that enable change to impact them. 

 

High Earners - Don't tax me more, I'm taxed enough

Low Earners - Don't reduce my benefits

Pensioners - I NEED my WFA. 

Doctors - We want pay restoration

Businesses - Don't change my trading environment

Home Owners - Don't build that infrastructure NEAR me. 

 

What successive governments have failed to do is build a vision of the future that we are ALL, COLLECTIVELY working towards. All Contributing to.   Afterall, I'm sure those of us who have children, want them to inherit a working, meaningful and supportive society. 

 

Problem is... None of us know what that vision is.   Who could define it on here? 

 

If @Tommy G felt that a 1% increase on his income tax could guarantee his Kids would have the school provision and support networks they needed... I know for a fact he would pay it in an instant. 

 

if @leicsmac KNEW that reducing WFA for pensioners could GUARANTEE a more eco focused future where humanity gets to endure... he would accept it in an instant. 

 

It's why people like Farage are so successful politically.  He paints a vision VERY effectively.  certain demographics can identify with that vision and will move heaven and earth to vote for it. 

 

I would offer to go into politics myself... but there are far too many skeletons in my closet from my youth! 

 

 

 

Greg for PM 2030

[leicsmac]

13 minutes ago, Greg2607 said:

That's your vision though.  It's not one which any political party (other than the greens probably) have tried to paint. 

I think the post above this covers this - Labour have tried to illustrate this vision, but they're failing at the execution at the moment. 

 

Why it's failing is complex, but understanding it is critical, because the vision itself is critical. 

 

Also, I can't quite understand why at least a plurality of humans wouldn't share a vision where civilisation and even some comforts are still a thing tbh. 

 

 

[Trav Le Bleu]

1 hour ago, Greg2607 said:

all of that above conversation goes back to what I said yesterday (or the day before... I talk alot of nonsense, I lose track!) - Ultimately, everyone seems to collectively want change.... but they don't want the things that enable change to impact them. 

 

High Earners - Don't tax me more, I'm taxed enough

Low Earners - Don't reduce my benefits

Pensioners - I NEED my WFA. 

Doctors - We want pay restoration

Businesses - Don't change my trading environment

Home Owners - Don't build that infrastructure NEAR me. 

 

What successive governments have failed to do is build a vision of the future that we are ALL, COLLECTIVELY working towards. All Contributing to.   Afterall, I'm sure those of us who have children, want them to inherit a working, meaningful and supportive society. 

 

Problem is... None of us know what that vision is.   Who could define it on here? 

 

If @Tommy G felt that a 1% increase on his income tax could guarantee his Kids would have the school provision and support networks they needed... I know for a fact he would pay it in an instant. 

 

if @leicsmac KNEW that reducing WFA for pensioners could GUARANTEE a more eco focused future where humanity gets to endure... he would accept it in an instant. 

 

It's why people like Farage are so successful politically.  He paints a vision VERY effectively.  certain demographics can identify with that vision and will move heaven and earth to vote for it. 

 

I would offer to go into politics myself... but there are far too many skeletons in my closet from my youth! 

 

 

 

I think the problem is that governments on all sides tend to go in big on one or two areas, rather than nibbling a little from everyone that would largely be tolerable.

[leicsmac]

Apparently the UN IPC are liars when it comes to some humanitarian issues. 

 

Apparently. 

[Trav Le Bleu]

2 hours ago, leicsmac said:

Apparently the UN IPC are liars when it comes to some humanitarian issues. 

 

Apparently. 

At least no one in Gaza is starving.

 

Can you imagine!?

[CornwallFox]

8 hours ago, Jon the Hat said:

You either have to stop spending more money on things that don't deliver benefits, or tax people more.  As no one seems to be able to do the first, then you must do the second.  You cannot just tax the better off though, there aren't enough of them.  2% increase on every band now should do for a start.

Simply spend money to invest in things that create growth. Which reeves did in her last budget, so need to see that through and what results. 

Cutting spending doesn't help, as it reduces business investment, reduces growth and tax receipts fall. 

Spending creates business certainty, allows businesses to invest in staff, retooling etc, and can lead to increases in tax revenues beyond the original expenditure. 

Some forms of government spending can lead to 6x the benefits as the cost.

This is the reason tax rates were higher under austerity than  they were before it.

[leicsmac]

1 hour ago, Trav Le Bleu said:

At least no one in Gaza is starving.

 

Can you imagine!?

I know, right?

 

It might even dispel some of the ideas about the apparently black-and-white nature of that conflict the media-based talking heads seem to like if that were occurring. 

 

But of course it's not happening, trustworthy sources are saying it isn't and that the UN are lying. 

 

...... right?

[leicsmac]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/cr5vv3mrpndt

 

Didn't have John Bolton getting raided on my bingo card for this year, tbh. 

 

Hopefully if it comes to it he'll have a good amount to say about the current lot in charge.

[Zear0]

Trump delivering a statement from the Oval Office shortly.  Usually reserved for the more important announcements.  I'm guessing it's the launch of a new scent in his men's fragrance line, but will wait and see.

[leicsmac]

3 minutes ago, Zear0 said:

Trump delivering a statement from the Oval Office shortly.  Usually reserved for the more important announcements.  I'm guessing it's the launch of a new scent in his men's fragrance line, but will wait and see.

It would be fitting if it were an admission of a level of hypocrisy never before seen regarding using the justice system to persecute ones political opposition, but probably not.

[Zear0]

So whilst wearing a hat that reads "Trump Was Right About Everything" it was announcing the World Cup draw would take place at the Trump Kennedy Centre...Troll.

Edited 22 August 2025 by Zear0

[st albans fox]

25 minutes ago, Zear0 said:

So whilst wearing a hat that reads "Trump Was Right About Everything" it was announcing the World Cup draw would take place at the Trump Kennedy Centre...Troll.

Apparently we wouldn’t have been relegated if he’d been president …….

[Lionator]

28 minutes ago, Zear0 said:

So whilst wearing a hat that reads "Trump Was Right About Everything" it was announcing the World Cup draw would take place at the Trump Kennedy Centre...Troll.

Him and Infantino have a proper strange relationship. Seems to prefer him to other international leaders