Jimothy Posted 24 February 2013 Posted 24 February 2013 Agreed, especially the first line. If a normal person like me or you would have done this, we would be in prison, end of. The bail thing is unfair, he is a muderer, get him inside! That's actually a really obvious point I haven't seen anyone make until now. Surely if someone breaks into your house and you have a gun, you shout and warn them that you have a gun. Whether his story is true or not (which I very much doubt it is true) I find it a little worrying that Pistorius would open fire on someone with no warning, no checking who it was. There must be other people close to him that have keys to his house, his parents, siblings, and most likely of all his girlfriend.
Kitchandro Posted 24 February 2013 Posted 24 February 2013 That's actually a really obvious point I haven't seen anyone make until now. Surely if someone breaks into your house and you have a gun, you shout and warn them that you have a gun. Whether his story is true or not (which I very much doubt it is true) I find it a little worrying that Pistorius would open fire on someone with no warning, no checking who it was. There must be other people close to him that have keys to his house, his parents, siblings, and most likely of all his girlfriend. The thing I don't get is he said he thought she was in the bed with him. So for one - he didn't check if she was still in the bed before he started shooting, and he didn't just assume it was her. I mean why wouldn't you assume it was her in the bathroom, if he knew she was in the house with him? Is this thing with the bloody bat true? If so that story doesn't really check out. He's clearly full of shit, his story is absolute bollocks.
theessexfox Posted 24 February 2013 Posted 24 February 2013 There is no way in hell he would have shot 4 times, without calling out to the 'burglar' or checking where the other person in the house was... Let him rot.
leicsmac Posted 24 February 2013 Posted 24 February 2013 Surely if he was as obviously guilty as some of the posters on here make out he wouldn't have been granted bail? Or is it another OJ-style case of a superb defence team against a faffing prosecution, possibly? I reckon he murdered her too but I'm in no way certain about it - going to wait for the actual court case itself before jumping to any conclusions.
AoWW Posted 24 February 2013 Posted 24 February 2013 I'm purely hypothesizing here because I'm genuinely curious... If you'd been in bed with your partner, and you're the only people in the house, if one of you were to get up and go to the bathroom would you really lock the door? I know I wouldn't... perhaps I'm just freakishly liberal!
marko Posted 24 February 2013 Posted 24 February 2013 I'm purely hypothesizing here because I'm genuinely curious... If you'd been in bed with your partner, and you're the only people in the house, if one of you were to get up and go to the bathroom would you really lock the door? I know I wouldn't... perhaps I'm just freakishly liberal! Possibly not, but another possible explanation is that she heard Oscar shouting there was an intruder and as she was in the toilet she locked herself in for safety.
Zingari Posted 24 February 2013 Posted 24 February 2013 I'm purely hypothesizing here because I'm genuinely curious... If you'd been in bed with your partner, and you're the only people in the house, if one of you were to get up and go to the bathroom would you really lock the door? I know I wouldn't... perhaps I'm just freakishly liberal! Probably not Even less likely if said partner had no legs.
BoneDog Posted 24 February 2013 Posted 24 February 2013 Surely if he was as obviously guilty as some of the posters on here make out he wouldn't have been granted bail? Or is it another OJ-style case of a superb defence team against a faffing prosecution, possibly? I reckon he murdered her too but I'm in no way certain about it - going to wait for the actual court case itself before jumping to any conclusions. I'm pretty sure it all comes down to corruption and not incompetence. Usually the routine, but in these cases the media portray it as incompetence on a judges part or something like that. Seems like murder to me. I'm no hard man but if I had a gun in my hand and I heard somebody, I would still feel confident enough not to fire until I caught a glimpse of them. I'd at least communicate with my Mrs first, that's for sure. I'd also shout, and pop off a warning shot to let the intruder know that if they didn't leave through the nearest window pretty sharpish they're going to get shot.
Jimothy Posted 24 February 2013 Posted 24 February 2013 I'm purely hypothesizing here because I'm genuinely curious... If you'd been in bed with your partner, and you're the only people in the house, if one of you were to get up and go to the bathroom would you really lock the door? I know I wouldn't... perhaps I'm just freakishly liberal! I don't think I'd ever lock the door, even during the day, if it was just me and the other half at home. If there are just two of you in the house, you generally know if the other one has gone to the bathroom. And while annoying it's not exactly the end of the world if they accidentally walk in on you.
sdb Posted 24 February 2013 Posted 24 February 2013 The thing I don't get is he said he thought she was in the bed with him. So for one - he didn't check if she was still in the bed before he started shooting, and he didn't just assume it was her. I mean why wouldn't you assume it was her in the bathroom, if he knew she was in the house with him? Is this thing with the bloody bat true? If so that story doesn't really check out. He's clearly full of shit, his story is absolute bollocks. surely she'd have screamed too after the first shot? and he'd recognise it was her? just seems a bit too far fetched really, taking it all into account.
ScouseFox Posted 24 February 2013 Posted 24 February 2013 Pretty sure I read somewhere that shots were said to be fired downwards, so he must've had his legs on, so he didn't just dive out of bed and shoot. He woke up, put his legs on, walked to the bathroom and shot.
marko Posted 24 February 2013 Posted 24 February 2013 surely she'd have screamed too after the first shot? and he'd recognise it was her? just seems a bit too far fetched really, taking it all into account. But if the first bullet hit her in the head there's no way she'd be able to scream. Also, the four shots are likely to have been shot in rapid succession, which again would mean by the time she shouted - assuming she would have - it'd be too late anyway.
theessexfox Posted 24 February 2013 Posted 24 February 2013 But if the first bullet hit her in the head there's no way she'd be able to scream. Also, the four shots are likely to have been shot in rapid succession, which again would mean by the time she shouted - assuming she would have - it'd be too late anyway. Do you actually believe that he thought it was a burglar?
BoneDog Posted 24 February 2013 Posted 24 February 2013 I'd bet they were both awake and up and he already had his legs on when it all happened. The whole story sounds like a crock of shit.
marko Posted 24 February 2013 Posted 24 February 2013 Do you actually believe that he thought it was a burglar? I honestly don't know and there's only one person who knows the truth. I'm just offering possible explanations as to why he shot, she locked the door, etc, etc. I don't think the suggestions I've made are beyond the realms of possibility and we'll all have a better idea when Oscar takes the stand at trial and is examined by both defence and prosecution. Until then there's going to be a lot of conjecture and hearsay.
David Guiza Posted 25 February 2013 Posted 25 February 2013 He'll be getting a custodial sentence whatever the verdict as, presuming South Africa operates on a similar basis to the UK self defence is the only compete defence. And self defence itself requires 'reasonable force', no judge in the land can deem shooting a person through a door 4 times as reasonable force. The whole bail debate isn't really an issue for me, he's practically under house arrest and isn't a threat to society. It isn't a conclusive indication towards no murder conviction by any means. Either way, come June, it will be a very interesting case.
marko Posted 25 February 2013 Posted 25 February 2013 He'll be getting a custodial sentence whatever the verdict as, presuming South Africa operates on a similar basis to the UK self defence is the only compete defence. And self defence itself requires 'reasonable force', no judge in the land can deem shooting a person through a door 4 times as reasonable force. The whole bail debate isn't really an issue for me, he's practically under house arrest and isn't a threat to society. It isn't a conclusive indication towards no murder conviction by any means. Either way, come June, it will be a very interesting case. I'm afraid you're wrong. There are a number of instances where burglars have been shot and stabbed - one even died - and they were not charged, or later had charges dropped, as they were deemed to have used "reasonable force".
David Guiza Posted 26 February 2013 Posted 26 February 2013 Those circumstances are usually when the burglar is deemed to be a threat to the defendant. I think it's going to be difficult to prove that someone who is cowering behind a door and 4 gun shots as reasonable.
marko Posted 27 February 2013 Posted 27 February 2013 Those circumstances are usually when the burglar is deemed to be a threat to the defendant. I think it's going to be difficult to prove that someone who is cowering behind a door and 4 gun shots as reasonable. Yes, but it's all a question of fact and he'll obviously be quizzed as to why he believed it was necessary to use such force, and why he felt threatened when the 'intruder' was in the toilet.
FoxyPV Posted 27 February 2013 Posted 27 February 2013 I'm purely hypothesizing here because I'm genuinely curious... If you'd been in bed with your partner, and you're the only people in the house, if one of you were to get up and go to the bathroom would you really lock the door? I know I wouldn't... perhaps I'm just freakishly liberal! Maybe you'd locked the door because your partner was being abusive and physically threatening?
Charl91 Posted 27 February 2013 Posted 27 February 2013 Why would a burglar be in the bathroom anyway? I'm pretty sure it's not where I keep my valuables.
marko Posted 27 February 2013 Posted 27 February 2013 Why would a burglar be in the bathroom anyway? I'm pretty sure it's not where I keep my valuables. The bathroom window was open and there were ladders on the side of the house as he'd had contractors in doing some work on the house. I'm guessing he thought the 'intruder' used the ladders and climbed through.
Kitchandro Posted 27 February 2013 Posted 27 February 2013 The bathroom window was open and there were ladders on the side of the house as he'd had contractors in doing some work on the house. I'm guessing he thought the 'intruder' used the ladders and climbed through. So why did he not check where his girlfriend was? That's the biggest question for me. Who wakes up, knowing their girlfriend is in the house, hears someone is in the bathroom and thinks 'I better get my gun'?
Charl91 Posted 27 February 2013 Posted 27 February 2013 Or more importantly, if South Africa is such a dangerous place, so dangerous that you keep fire arms in your house and that you'd rather fatally shoot an "intruder" through the door rather than call out to find out who it is...... ....then why would you leave the bloody window open with a ladder by it?
pSinatra Posted 27 February 2013 Posted 27 February 2013 She's been shagging Francois Hougaard, he found out, they had a row, he got scary with a cricket bat, she locked herself in the toilet & he shot her 4 times. Seems pretty straight forward to me
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