England vs. Moldova & Ukraine: lineups and predictions?

[Heart-Shaped Fox]

Am i the only one pleased with 0-0 and don't care if it was boring? Still unbeaten in competitive games under Hodgson and i don't care how bad we play if we keep that going.

If we got to the quarters of the WC and came up against Brazil or Spain get out played and scrape a one nil or a win on penalties, people would just moan.

We're not good enough to out play decent teams especially away from home so its good to be hard to beat.

[RonnieTodger]

Am i the only one pleased with 0-0 and don't care if it was boring? Still unbeaten in competitive games under Hodgson and i don't care how bad we play if we keep that going.

If we got to the quarters of the WC and came up against Brazil or Spain get out played and scrape a one nil or a win on penalties, people would just moan.

We're not good enough to out play decent teams especially away from home so its good to be hard to beat.

 

But if we carry on this way, we'll miss out without losing a single game. We've only beaten Moldova & San Marino, this campaign. We've had 4 games against half-decent sides and drawn them all. Have to step it up for the last 2, and nothing suggests we will do.

[Dan]

But we wouldn't, because Spain & Brazil are far better than sides like Ukraine and they'd make us look absolutely silly.

 

If we played like that against an on-form Spain, we would be hit for 5, at least.

 

The fact we're not good enough to outplay an off-form Ukraine side says it all. In the grand scheme of things, the result isn't terrible - but the performance was absolutely embarrassing and we should be fvcking ashamed by it rather than at all calling it a 'job well done'. A job well done getting a 0-0, creating absolutely fvck all against an under-performing Ukraine side?! Who the fvck have we become? Scotland?

 

Sorry, but the bigger picture here is extremely bleak. That was an embarrassment and if that's how we play 'in a cup final' (Hodgson's words) yet he comes out happy with it, then I really do despair.

 

Hodgson's hardly got the best toolbox, but holy fvcking shit.

[Heart-Shaped Fox]

I think the result here would have been so much better if we had already have won against Poland or Montenegro giving us a better point lead.

I think Hodgson is getting us playing more defensively and less open which isn't necessarily a bad thing. Beat Poland and Montenegro and then the results do look decent. I agree that we should be looking to win every game but having this hard to beat attitude certainly isn't a bad thing especially in tournaments.

I do have faith in that we'll win the two home games

[Uncle Albert]

Am i the only one pleased with 0-0 and don't care if it was boring? Still unbeaten in competitive games under Hodgson.

To be fair mate, I don't think people are annoyed with the result as that has benefited us and leaves it down to our own results whether we qualify or not for Brazil. Surely you can't be happy with that performance, or the performances under Hodgson in general since his reign? Have we improved since Capello in any area? I'd personally say we have declined if anything.

Also you say we're undefeated under Hodgson in competitive games, you're right we are. Although England have only won 6 of the 12 competitive games, the wins coming against Ukraine, Sweden, Moldova and San Marino.. Is that worth boasting about seriously? We're England for crying out loud!

The performances against Italy, Poland away and Ukraine home and away were poor, especially the Poland away and the Ukraine two, you can forgive the Italy one in sense as it was a European Championship Quater-Final, but we never looked like winning that game and in truth we were lucky for penalties.

The only credible draws I can accept are France at Euro 2012 and Montenegro away.

[Dan]

I think the result here would have been so much better if we had already have won against Poland or Montenegro giving us a better point lead.

I think Hodgson is getting us playing more defensively and less open which isn't necessarily a bad thing. Beat Poland and Montenegro and then the results do look decent. I agree that we should be looking to win every game but having this hard to beat attitude certainly isn't a bad thing especially in tournaments.

I do have faith in that we'll win the two home games

 

It is a bad thing though IMO because negativity breeds negativity. Put yourself in an England players position, how good are you going to feel about going to Ukraine and being told to play for a 0-0? You'll be made to feel bang average.

 

Our mentality is that of losers and the quality isn't nearly good enough. I can see someone unexpected turning us over in the World Cup (if we quality), if not, I think Poland may do it first.

 

To be fair mate, I don't think people are annoyed with the result as that has benefited us and leaves it down to our own results whether we qualify or not for Brazil. Surely you can't be happy with that performance, or the performances under Hodgson in general since his reign? Have we improved since Capello in any area? I'd personally say we have declined if anything.

Also you say we're undefeated under Hodgson in competitive games, you're right we are. Although England have only won 6 of the 12 competitive games, the wins coming against Ukraine, Sweden, Moldova and San Marino.. Is that worth boasting about seriously? We're England for crying out loud!

The performances against Italy, Poland away and Ukraine home and away were poor, especially the Poland away and the Ukraine two, you can forgive the Italy one in sense as it was a European Championship Quater-Final, but we never looked like winning that game and in truth we were lucky for penalties.

The only credible draws I can accept are France at Euro 2012 and Montenegro away.

 

Agreed with all of that except for the last bit. We were cruising at Montenegro and pretty much handed them the initiative. Terrible to watch.

[Tom17LCFC]

But we wouldn't, because Spain & Brazil are far better than sides like Ukraine and they'd make us look absolutely silly.

 

If we played like that against an on-form Spain, we would be hit for 5, at least.

 

The fact we're not good enough to outplay an off-form Ukraine side says it all. In the grand scheme of things, the result isn't terrible - but the performance was absolutely embarrassing and we should be fvcking ashamed by it rather than at all calling it a 'job well done'. A job well done getting a 0-0, creating absolutely fvck all against an under-performing Ukraine side?! Who the fvck have we become? Scotland?

 

Sorry, but the bigger picture here is extremely bleak. That was an embarrassment and if that's how we play 'in a cup final' (Hodgson's words) yet he comes out happy with it, then I really do despair.

 

Hodgson's hardly got the best toolbox, but holy fvcking shit.

 

I usually agree with your points but come on!

 

Firstly Ukraine are hardly off form. 7 wins in the last 9 and unbeaten in about a year, not conceded in 5 and scored 15.

 

Secondly we beat Brazil last time we played them albeit a friendly match but they still fielded a strong side.

 

Finally, my view on the game is that we went there with the intention of not losing, and got the job done. Whether or not we should have gone there to win is up for debate, but in a game as big as that without a strikeforce in reality I'll take the point.

 

EDIT: Scrap the Brazil comment. Still think a draw and a decent performance is impressive though.

[Samilktray]

The sooner people accept we're an awful footballing nation the better. Pretty embarrassing when people still talk about us like we're even remotely relevant amongst the big teams on the international stage.

[Uncle Albert]

Secondly we beat Brazil last time we played them albeit a friendly match but they still fielded a strong side.

No we didn't, we drew 2-2.

[Tom17LCFC]

No we didn't, we drew 2-2.

 

Edited, a draw in the Maracana is no mean feat still against the likes of Neymar.

[Dan]

I usually agree with your points but come on!

 

Firstly Ukraine are hardly off form. 7 wins in the last 9 and unbeaten in about a year, not conceded in 5 and scored 15.

 

Secondly we beat Brazil last time we played them albeit a friendly match but they still fielded a strong side.

 

Finally, my view on the game is that we went there with the intention of not losing, and got the job done. Whether or not we should have gone there to win is up for debate, but in a game as big as that without a strikeforce in reality I'll take the point.

 

EDIT: Scrap the Brazil comment. Still think a draw and a decent performance is impressive though.

 

I'm not on about off-form before, I'm on about tonight. A crowd of 70k packed into the place and they, if they have anything about them, would've left feeling disappointed with that performance. I thought Ukraine were worse than their usual standards tonight and created very little themselves, yet they had the better chances to win - how can we be happy with this?

 

If we go to Brazil in the World Cup and play like that, they will make absolute fools of us.

 

Going to Ukraine with the intention of not losing isn't a disaster in the current predicament, but that doesn't at all excuse not creating a single meaningful chance all game. This isn't Spain, Brazil, Italy, Germany etc... this is Ukraine, a side who have qualified for two major tournaments in their history, and they were below their usual standards. To not create a single meaningful chance against a poorly performing Ukraine side is absolutely appalling.

 

It's a results business, but if we'd played to the standard we're capable of, we'd have left with a comfortable victory tonight and we'd actually have genuine reason to believe we've all but qualified. The arrogance and failure to acknowledge how poor we were from the media has been completely laughable, do people really think we'll beat Poland or Montenegro playing like that? We'd do well to get a point.

 

We ride our luck so much it's unbelievable.

[Tom17LCFC]

I'm not on about off-form before, I'm on about tonight. A crowd of 70k packed into the place and they, if they have anything about them, would've left feeling disappointed with that performance. I thought Ukraine were worse than their usual standards tonight and created very little themselves, yet they had the better chances to win - how can we be happy with this?

 

If we go to Brazil in the World Cup and play like that, they will make absolute fools of us.

 

Going to Ukraine with the intention of not losing isn't a disaster in the current predicament, but that doesn't at all excuse not creating a single meaningful chance all game. This isn't Spain, Brazil, Italy, Germany etc... this is Ukraine, a side who have qualified for two major tournaments in their history, and they were below their usual standards. To not create a single meaningful chance against a poorly performing Ukraine side is absolutely appalling.

 

It's a results business, but if we'd played to the standard we're capable of, we'd have left with a comfortable victory tonight and we'd actually have genuine reason to believe we've qualified. The arrogance and failure to acknowledge how poor we were from the media has been completely laughable, do people really think we'll beat Poland or Montenegro playing like that? We'd do well to get a point.

 

We ride our luck so much it's unbelievable.

 

Ah right my mistake I see.

 

I did tweet earlier saying it's sad how we go to places like Ukraine not expecting the win anymore in comparison to previous years when it would be a near banker 3 points. Just sums up the predicament we're in though really. We're not the side we were. The 'golden generation' have peaked and are being replaced by the likes of Andros Townsend and Danny Welbeck. Don't get me wrong I think they're decent enough players but could anyone ever see them lifting a World Cup. Same goes for the likes of Ricky Lambert, genuinely can't even imagine him with a World Cup winners medal.

 

I think against Montenegro and the poles we'll perform better. The confidence that being at home brings with it and the fact that they'll both have to attack us. Still very confident we'll qualify but then it'll be same old next summer. The Ukraine manager said tonight 'we attacked and they defended & they attacked and we defended'. Sums it up really.

 

Hodgson's comment tickled me as well, something along the lines of 'a quality game between 2 good sides'

[Dan]

Ah right my mistake I see.

 

I did tweet earlier saying it's sad how we go to places like Ukraine not expecting the win anymore in comparison to previous years when it would be a near banker 3 points. Just sums up the predicament we're in though really. We're not the side we were. The 'golden generation' have peaked and are being replaced by the likes of Andros Townsend and Danny Welbeck. Don't get me wrong I think they're decent enough players but could anyone ever see them lifting a World Cup. Same goes for the likes of Ricky Lambert, genuinely can't even imagine him with a World Cup winners medal.

 

I think against Montenegro and the poles we'll perform better. The confidence that being at home brings with it and the fact that they'll both have to attack us. Still very confident we'll qualify but then it'll be same old next summer. The Ukraine manager said tonight 'we attacked and they defended & they attacked and we defended'. Sums it up really.

 

Hodgson's comment tickled me as well, something along the lines of 'a quality game between 2 good sides'

 

I think the whole game really was just a further reflection about how much England are slipping. We're on the decline and have been for absolutely years now.

 

Hodgson's comment sums up what a yes man he is. Anyone who was genuinely impressed by the quality on show tonight needs to up their ambition immediately. That was two sides in a very big game played in front of a capacity 70k crowd, that didn't offer any attacking inspiration between them other than the odd run from Yehven Konoplyanka.

 

I hope we up our game for Poland/Montenegro but it's not beyond the realms of possibility that it goes the total opposite way and they do a Croatia to us.

[Donut]

I think its also worth remembering that Montenegro and Ukraine both have a ''banker'' game to play that youd imagine them winning, whereas we have two tough games.

 

Montenegro and Poland will want the points just as much as us. they wont roll over for our benefit

[Harry - LCFC]

Am i the only one pleased with 0-0 and don't care if it was boring? Still unbeaten in competitive games under Hodgson and i don't care how bad we play if we keep that going.

If we got to the quarters of the WC and came up against Brazil or Spain get out played and scrape a one nil or a win on penalties, people would just moan.

We're not good enough to out play decent teams especially away from home so its good to be hard to beat.

 

I'm with you mostly. It seems fashionable to be over critical of England these days, this wasn't an encouraging performance but the exaggerations used just don't reflect how the game went - mediocre is the word I'd use to sum it up. It was bad at times but it wasn't that bad. If we do need a few dull performances to push us over the line then I'm happy to accept the occasional bore draw.

 

Like most I am concerned about our ability to get results against better teams and the game doesn't promise much I have to say, but I'll judge the team when we get to that bridge. Qualification is the minimum requirement atm and ticking that box would satisfy my demands so far.

[ScouseFox]

How f ucking shite is Kyle walker the little willy puller

[The Year Of The Fox]

That Wayne Rooney is shit, isn't he?

Yes he is. Just the type of game last night where he'd have had precisely no affect at all.

[Simmo86]

Yes he is. Just the type of game last night where he'd have had precisely no affect at all.

Didn't he score in Poland and Montenegro?

We're worse side without him. No question.

[Charl91]

At this point, I don't care if we qualify or not. We've been dreadful.

[The Year Of The Fox]

Didn't he score in Poland and Montenegro?

We're worse side without him. No question.

Lets get this straight it depends which Wayne Rooney turns up. He's nowhere near as good or influential on the national side as some people pretend. He's also probably not as bad as i sometimes make out.

How often do you read newspaper headlines after an England game which say that Rooney was ineffective or had a poor game.

[Fox92]

Very boring game. 

 

Can't wait for Rooney to be fit and get back in the side. At least he has the ability to pull something out of nowhere.

[Simmo86]

Lets get this straight it depends which Wayne Rooney turns up. He's nowhere near as good or influential on the national side as some people pretend. He's also probably not as bad as i sometimes make out.

How often do you read newspaper headlines after an England game which say that Rooney was ineffective or had a poor game.

 

He can be pretty shit and more often than not he is, but as Foxy says he has the ability to do something out of nothing which we lack when he's not around.

[Ric Flair]

I never thought i'd say this but Hodgson is tactically as inept as Steve MaClaren, he makes Sven and Fabio seem like king-ding-a-ling.

 

Moving Milner in to the centre was moronic beyond belief when we had Carrick on the bench and even Cleverley or Barkley.

 

I do not like the pairing of Jagielka and Cahill, ok we kept a clean sheet against a half decent team which we've not done for a while but they scare me together. Cahill brings more to the table but he needs to be alongside someone of higher calibre, sadly they've all retired.

 

What on earth is up with Theo Walcott? Crap vs Moldova and diabolical last night. Ashley Young has gone from being one of the best wingers in England to an absolute shadow inside 2 years, he was again anonymous when he came on.

 

That's Wilshere's first poor game for us and i've no qualms about how good he can be for us.

 

So much to work on. A fully fit squad and there's enough in midfield and attack to qualify but defensively we're bang average right now in terms of options.

 

What i'd do for Glen Hoddle to be manager again, scandalous comments aside he's about the only innovative English manager currently available.

[Ford Super Sunday]

All we had to do was get a point against Croatia at home to qualify for Euro 2008...

 

Now all we need to do is beat two of the 'big three' other teams in the group at home to make sure we get there. Easy (says the snore-inducing, stale media).

 

One slip up and we're done for. A two-legged entry into the World Cup would not be fun and if we managed to overcome that we probably wouldn't be seeded as a result, meaning we'd have a ridiculously tough group.

 

Of course we might win both games 3-0 and cruise to Brazil, though that's being optimistic.

[Dan]

Lets get this straight it depends which Wayne Rooney turns up. He's nowhere near as good or influential on the national side as some people pretend. He's also probably not as bad as i sometimes make out.

How often do you read newspaper headlines after an England game which say that Rooney was ineffective or had a poor game.

 

I still think Rooney's easily our best attacking player, I just don't agree with him being undroppable and made out to be some 'talisman' when he does often go missing.