Guest Posted 10 September 2015 Posted 10 September 2015 How exactly do you check them? Border Control "Are you a terrorist?" Migrant "No" Border Control "Are you sure?" Migrant "Yes" That's about the sum of it. whoosh! How do they check all the tourists coming into the country?
Wymsey Posted 10 September 2015 Posted 10 September 2015 Think the police are doing everything they can (despite the apparent cut-backs), but can't stop thinking that something will happen again unfortunately. Edit: comment wasn't for this thread, got moved to here, was for Terrorist Arrest Increase one that got deleted.
Guest Posted 10 September 2015 Posted 10 September 2015 Saved from what? Many of them fled from the war months if not years ago and have been living in another country. Whilst your imagined lines speech is nice in principle, the whole world cannot live in a handful of countries. A worldwide open border system would lead to utter chaos. There is a difference to be made here between refugees and migrants that you seem to be ignoring.
Babylon Posted 10 September 2015 Posted 10 September 2015 whoosh! How do they check all the tourists coming into the country? Do you think they have a database that contains information on everyone in the world or something? It might have escaped your attention, but these aren't exactly people hopping off a plane on two week holiday with their passports and visa.
Guest Posted 10 September 2015 Posted 10 September 2015 Do you think they have a database that contains information on everyone in the world or something? It might have escaped your attention, but these aren't exactly people hopping off a plane on two week holiday with their passports and visa. You have completely missed my point. TWICE!
Babylon Posted 10 September 2015 Posted 10 September 2015 There is a difference to be made here between refugees and migrants that you seem to be ignoring. I'm well aware of the difference, it seems others aren't though because they are all being lumped under one banner. Dead boy on the beach "oh we must save the refugees", well he was a migrant as they had been living in Turkey.
Guest Posted 10 September 2015 Posted 10 September 2015 I'm well aware of the difference, it seems others aren't though because they are all being lumped under one banner. Dead boy on the beach "oh we must save the refugees", well he was a migrant as they had been living in Turkey. Now you're starting to understand where I'm coming from.
Babylon Posted 10 September 2015 Posted 10 September 2015 You have completely missed my point. TWICE! Is the discussion not about checking migrants to make sure they aren't terrorists. We can physically attempt to check the details of these people (which is what your point was), but there will be nothing to check as they aren't tourists coming over on a plane with a passport and Visa. Many won't have documents. So whilst you can try and check, it's going to be impossible to actually know no matter what checks you do (which is my point).
Guest Posted 10 September 2015 Posted 10 September 2015 Is the discussion not about checking migrants to make sure they aren't terrorists. We can physically attempt to check the details of these people (which is what your point was), but there will be nothing to check as they aren't tourists coming over on a plane with a passport and Visa. Many won't have documents. So whilst you can try and check, it's going to be impossible to actually know no matter what checks you do (which is my point). Now pop back and find my first post you mention and then see what it was in reply to and then ask yourself if I have ever made a sarcastic post in Gen.
Jattdogg Posted 10 September 2015 Posted 10 September 2015 If people think isis is not smart enough to send some sleepers as migrants or refugees then they are mistaken. There has to be some serious detention and background checking done. Once they have a clearer picture then they can integrate them into regular society but i think we would be stupid not to monitor them. Cant just let a boat load of people in from a war torn country that the west has played a part in destroying or damaging in some shape or form without due dilligence checks. I do believe that the majority are truly regular humans who just want to be safe and happy. For that alone you must be very giving to allow them in. Nothing wrong with being vigilant though. I do also understand it could be hard to truly check them out and know for sure if they are terrorists or have terror related beliefs
Guest Posted 10 September 2015 Posted 10 September 2015 If people think isis is not smart enough to send some sleepers as migrants or refugees then they are mistaken. There has to be some serious detention and background checking done. Once they have a clearer picture then they can integrate them into regular society but i think we would be stupid not to monitor them. Cant just let a boat load of people in from a war torn country that the west has played a part in destroying or damaging in some shape or form without due dilligence checks. I do believe that the majority are truly regular humans who just want to be safe and happy. For that alone you must be very giving to allow them in. Nothing wrong with being vigilant though. But would you not be willing to give places to those truly regular humans who just want to be safe and happy? Rhetorical question - I know that you would. Don't you think that the intelligence services will be monitoring all those who are accepted? Don't you think that there is more possibility that a British ISIS sympathiser is more likely than ISIS managing to get unwatched "sleepers" into the country as refugees?
Jattdogg Posted 10 September 2015 Posted 10 September 2015 Of course they will monitor them the only concern i suppose is the sheer numbers we allow in could make it hard to track. But i leave that to the pros. I think that homegrown sympathizers are the most dangerous threat seeing as they may have or are most likely to be fully integrated into our society and seem "normal" to those they hang around.
ozleicester Posted 10 September 2015 Posted 10 September 2015 I might be wrong though. Happy to discuss alternative interpretations. Been out so havent had the chance to double check, but this was where my thinking was based.... The 1951 Refugee Convention, to which Australia is not only a party (and therefore legally bound) but which Australia helped to draft, explicitly states that refugees must not be penalised or punished for their method of arrival in a country. So thats why they should be allowed in... in regard to your comment about how many boats are coming or have been stopped... we simply dont know, our government does not tell us. Unbelievable i know, but they tell us its national security and therefore secret. we do know, our government has taken refugees off of their boats, loaded them onto australian boats and then towed them back to Indonesia! (we dont know how many times of course, coz thats top secret.) The mantra here is, "stop the boats" because people are dying trying to get here.... all this does is stop people dying in Australia's waters and leaves them to die in Indonesia, it doesnt prevent death, just moves it. Its like telling ambulances to stop taking patients to hospital, to reduce the death rates at hospitals.
Merging Cultures Posted 10 September 2015 Posted 10 September 2015 Been out so havent had the chance to double check, but this was where my thinking was based.... The 1951 Refugee Convention, to which Australia is not only a party (and therefore legally bound) but which Australia helped to draft, explicitly states that refugees must not be penalised or punished for their method of arrival in a country. So thats why they should be allowed in... in regard to your comment about how many boats are coming or have been stopped... we simply dont know, our government does not tell us. Unbelievable i know, but they tell us its national security and therefore secret. we do know, our government has taken refugees off of their boats, loaded them onto australian boats and then towed them back to Indonesia! (we dont know how many times of course, coz thats top secret.) The mantra here is, "stop the boats" because people are dying trying to get here.... all this does is stop people dying in Australia's waters and leaves them to die in Indonesia, it doesnt prevent death, just moves it. Its like telling ambulances to stop taking patients to hospital, to reduce the death rates at hospitals. Ah OK, so if they arrive at a port of entry and claim asylum immediately, then they would have to take them to process. Even if they are there legally or illegally. The UK obviously takes asylum seekers who have arrived illegally.I guess they don't make it to a port of entry in Australia as they get towed elsewhere. France and the rest of Europe is our buffer I guess. And the countries should really be checking the status of people in their country, especially if the country they are trying to get to isn't Schengen and there are borders.
Frank to be Posted 10 September 2015 Posted 10 September 2015 I must admit the thought of ISIS infiltrating the country via foot soldiers pretending to be refugees is a bit of a concern. The desire to help those in need may be stronger but that doesn't mean we should ignore the risk. Our intelligence services are no doubt very good but do they have the resources to effectively monitor thousands of people at a time? If they do, I'd then be concerned that they're using powers of observation that we don't know about and that are probably illegal. In the case of Germany, there's no way they could monitor hundreds of thousands of refugees without using illegal means of observation. Either way it's a legitimate concern and isn't to be taken lightly.
Babylon Posted 10 September 2015 Posted 10 September 2015 Now pop back and find my first post you mention and then see what it was in reply to and then ask yourself if I have ever made a sarcastic post in Gen. When so many of your posts are, how do I put it nicely... a bit out there... it's hard to see the difference between sarcasm and seeming just being plain old silly.
Guest Posted 10 September 2015 Posted 10 September 2015 When so many of your posts are, how do I put it nicely... a bit out there... it's hard to see the difference between sarcasm and seeming just being plain old silly. You just need to broaden your mind Genius is often misunderstood.
Rincewind Posted 11 September 2015 Posted 11 September 2015 Some at the place I was volunteering were talking about a project going on where groups of people chefs included were going down to dover and other ports where the camps are to feed the refugees. They are asking for volunteers and donations. There may be a link on Facebook but it is gone 3am so I won't post it now. The project is called Food For Thought and it is a group of chefs who will be travelling to Calais in October. They are asking for donation and kitchen equipment.
Guest Posted 11 September 2015 Posted 11 September 2015 Some at the place I was volunteering were talking about a project going on where groups of people chefs included were going down to dover and other ports where the camps are to feed the refugees. They are asking for volunteers and donations. There may be a link on Facebook but it is gone 3am so I won't post it now. The project is called Food For Thought and it is a group of chefs who will be travelling to Calais in October. They are asking for donation and kitchen equipment. Watched a news article on Calais the other day. They have literally tonnes of donations that will take them months to sort through and give out. They also have too many people - many English - driving down to help but just getting in the way. They are asking people to stop with the donations in Calais for a while.
johnny the fox Posted 11 September 2015 Posted 11 September 2015 god preserve us from millionaire celebrities entering the fray with lectures to the screen on how we should react and "educating" us plebs on our response..
Great Boos Up Posted 11 September 2015 Posted 11 September 2015 Round em up,.....bung em in a field, ....and....get them to cut the tops off cauliflowers.
Frank to be Posted 11 September 2015 Posted 11 September 2015 The guardian are calling the celebrities they've convinced to tell us how we should behave "cultural figures". Excuse me while I vomit.
Parafox Posted 11 September 2015 Posted 11 September 2015 http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/555434/Islamic-State-ISIS-Smuggler-THOUSANDS-Extremists-into-Europe-Refugees Worrying...
Wymsey Posted 11 September 2015 Posted 11 September 2015 http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/555434/Islamic-State-ISIS-Smuggler-THOUSANDS-Extremists-into-Europe-Refugees Worrying... I don't like the 'free entry' tag on Europe, but I think this is the case if true.
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