Older drivers no more dangerous, accident data study says

[davieG]

New research from Swansea University challenges the idea that older people are dangerous drivers.

Analysis of data on vehicle accidents showed that drivers aged 70 are involved in 3-4 times fewer accidents than 17-21 year old men.

By observing older drivers, the study found that most mistakes made occurred on right turns and overtaking.

Young men are more likely to be involved in incidents resulting from driving too fast and losing control.

The research findings were outlined at the British Science Festival in Swansea.

Charles Musselwhite, associate professor of gerontology at Swansea University's Centre for Innovative Ageing, found that dangerous driving is not generally an issue for older people.

While the elderly are more likely to be involved in an accident than the safest-driving cohort in their 40s, they are less likely than very young drivers to be involved in accidents.

Older drivers tended to make mistakes when they felt under pressure from other road users, the study found.

The most accident-prone age group, by a substantial margin, is young men. Indeed, 17 to 21 year-olds are three to four times more likely to have an accident than 70 year-olds.

Accident demographics

There is an increase in accidents among the over-75 age group, which Prof Musselwhite puts down to increasing physical frailty.

Older and younger drivers are also involved in different types of accident. While young men are more likely to be involved in single vehicle incidents, usually caused by speeding and losing control, older people tend to have smaller impact collisions.

Older women are more likely to have small accidents when doing tight manoeuvres. Older people are also more likely to be involved in accidents involving other older drivers, suggesting they make similar errors.

However, Prof Musselwhite said that older drivers compensate for their declining powers by driving more carefully, slowing down, leaving larger gaps, and choosing better weather and quieter times to go out in the car.

He also noted that this may change as people work and live longer.

Road safety concerns have prompted discussion about re-testing older drivers, but such programmes have been conducted in other countries like Australia and Denmark without improving results.

The question of whether and under what circumstances older people should face losing their licence is complicated. Prof Musselwhite argues that officials should implement more rigorous testing, especially eye tests, and extra monitoring of the effects of prescription drugs.

The solution right now is a market-based one: at some point it becomes so expensive for old people to insure their cars that they have no choice but to give up driving.

Loss of independence

Clearly there are issues when conditions such as dementia or other health problems affect cognitive skills, but Prof Musselwhite says that denying old people a licence should not be taken lightly.

They often need to drive when public transport is not convenient and shops have moved from villages to out-of-town locations.

There is also a psychological need. Older people told Prof Musselwhite that driving was of great importance for them, comparing losing their licence to losing a limb.

Older people say they need to drive for the feeling of freedom and mobility, to feel useful and have a role in the family. Taking away driving licences can lead to depression and loss of mobility.

Rather that urging restrictions on older drivers, Prof Musselwhite said that "a lot of existing infrastructure doesn't work all that well for the elderly". He suggested that dedicated filter arrows for right turns across traffic, or wider lanes, could help. But he noted that this might inhibit traffic flow, or even encourage young drivers to drive faster.

There are numerous problems for older pedestrians as well. For instance the average speed that someone needs to cross the road is set at 4.7km/h. In separate studies, 86% of old people did not walk that fast, rising to 94% for older women.

As mobility and freedom of movement are closely linked to physical and mental wellbeing in older people, Prof Musselwhite said driverless cars are a promising development for future elderly cohorts.

[Arriba Los Zorros]

Sorry, just don't buy it. Old drivers are by far the most dangerous, they have tunnel vision and are also too cautious. If anything, the reason lots of old drivers don't have accidents is because they only drive within a 5-mile radius of their house.

[StanSP]

they drive too fvcking slow to have accidents that's why

[DB11]

That research is a load of crap then.

 

I wonder what it is percentage wise if you scale it up because 17-21 year olds will be driving much more than drivers aged 70 and over so I bet when you scale it up likeliness to have an accident vs. numbers of hours spent driving I bet you will find older drivers feature much more heavily.

 

Then you've got the misjudging other vehicle's speed at junctions and pulling out in front of them, which won't be recorded anywhere but will only have not resulted in an accident because the younger, much quicker to react, driver is able to take evasive action.

[DB11]

11 minutes ago, davieG said:

There is also a psychological need. Older people told Prof Musselwhite that driving was of great importance for them, comparing losing their licence to losing a limb.

Older people say they need to drive for the feeling of freedom and mobility, to feel useful and have a role in the family. Taking away driving licences can lead to depression and loss of mobility.

 

What about comparing their dangerous driving to losing lives?

And if that means safer roads then that's a trade-off that has to take place. If losing a driving licence would lead to depression and loss of mobility then I'm sorry but perhaps independent living is no longer appropriate and alternative care packages should be looked at.

[Vacamion]

 

They might not be involved in accidents themselves, but there must be plenty of accidents caused by people getting frustrated by the way the greyheads drive. 

 

Of course, it's up to the rest of us to drive defensively.

 

Instead of speeding up and swerving around some codger driving Miss Daisy at 31mph in a 60 zone, I always find that the properly British way of dealing with it is to make unheard passive aggressive comments whilst gripping the steering steering wheel a bit tighter and wishing that they pass away soon in their sleep.

 

I've not had an accident in 20 years of driving around for a living....

[Thracian]

26 minutes ago, Arriba Los Zorros said:

Sorry, just don't buy it. Old drivers are by far the most dangerous, they have tunnel vision and are also too cautious. If anything, the reason lots of old drivers don't have accidents is because they only drive within a 5-mile radius of their house.

What nonsense. I drive all over the country - my car's got 350,000 miles on the clock and I've done a good portion of it. Speak to people who hire vehicles out - particularly commercial vehicles -  and a good many will tell you they prefer older people to drive them because they drive more responsibly.

 

People drive more sensibly as they get older and are not usually in such a rush to get to places. I don't think that means they drive slowly either.

 

There's a few on here who've had me drive them to matches and I don't think they'd say the journey was particularly slow. Nor do older friends of mine drive slowly.

 

They just don't drive recklessly as so many youngsters do, because most have long been there, done that and are often experienced enough to see danger before it arises.

 

It's wasted intelligence anyway because cars will drive themselves soon. Also, for many, the onset of age problems is getting later.

 

I'm in my 68th year,  play about four competitive games of golf a week, mostly to a single-figure handicap. Then there's two or three games of squash a week, usually against people aged 18-45. Which actually means I'm considerably fitter now than I was five-10 years ago when I was still working and suffering considerable knee problems which I've rectified naturally and which no longer exist.

 

I wonder what proportion of motoring scrapes relate to people under 40 compared with over 40. My belief is that far more happen in the under 40's group.            

 

 

      

[yorkie1999]

New research from Swansea University challenges the idea that older people are dangerous drivers.

Probably funded by the Association of British insurers, which means they can justify ripping young drivers off with ridiculous premiums. My daughter has had two accidents, both were oap drivers crashing into her, yet she still gets stung because of it.

[Jon the Hat]

70 is the new 60, I don't think 70 year olds are the problem.  The key statement is There is an increase in accidents among the over-75 age group, which Prof Musselwhite puts down to increasing physical frailty.

 

The roads are so busy now that there ought to be a tougher test for the over 75s. 

[Samilktray]

Older drivers generally are pretty terrible. Some even drive mobility scooters on roads which says it all imo 

[StanSP]

14 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

70 is the new 60, I don't think 70 year olds are the problem.  The key statement is There is an increase in accidents among the over-75 age group, which Prof Musselwhite puts down to increasing physical frailty.

 

The roads are so busy now that there ought to be a tougher test for the over 75s. 

should be made to re-do tests about 60-65 years old. Doesn't even have to be a strict test like your first one will be. 

 

I don't think it's right that you can pass your test at 17-18 and be done for life. Or if you first took your test after 50 years old then you don't have to do it obviously. 

[foxy boxing]

older drivers are not the one's that will be speeding or revving up their engines all the time?

[Bellend Sebastian]

My Dad's 76 and I think he'll be OK for at least a couple of years. He drives at the speed limit, which is what he's always done, which I expect a lot of folk find incredibly frustrating, but that's their problem, isn't it?

 

He knows his limits and I'm confident that he'll notice when his competency falls to a level where he should stop. He won't be one of those old twats that keeps going until someone hides his car keys.

 

I think we get too hung up on this whole young/old thing. Part of the problem is that as soon as we're behind the wheel we tend to consider ourselves brilliant at driving; you might hear someone say they're a bit shit at parallel parking but nobody ever says Jesus Christ I never really got the hang of this driving lark. I think a lot of people have far too much confidence in their own abilities - what proportion of drivers can negotiate a relatively tight right hand bend without crossing into the oncoming lane? If Swain Street Bridge and the bend by the Old Hare and Hounds in Anstey are anything to go by, less than half, and all demographics are well represented in the group that can't. 2 of the last 3 times driving to Anstey along Gynsill Lane I've had an Audi A3 (as far as I know not the same one) come round the bend towards me in the middle of the road because they've messed up and taken it too fast. I don't consider myself to be an amazing driver but bloody hell, some people are hopeless

[davieG]

Coming down the Meridian section of the ring road towards J21 yesterday doing my legal 50 mph I could see 3 cars in the rear mirror bombing down the outside lane they must have been doing 60 to 70 mph but boy did they have to slam the brakes on when they saw the police camera van driving along in front of me.

 

Coincidentally or not all 3 cars where BMWs. 

[Wymsey]

Taxi drivers are probably the worst.

 

Some can be quite arrogant and their actions can be seen as they're owning the roads.

[Vacamion]

6 hours ago, yorkie1999 said:

New research from Swansea University challenges the idea that older people are dangerous drivers.

Probably funded by the Association of British insurers, which means they can justify ripping young drivers off with ridiculous premiums. My daughter has had two accidents, both were oap drivers crashing into her, yet she still gets stung because of it.

I've said this few times in here  (long term slave to the insurance industry here).

 

Young uns pay more premium because they have more accidents anyway and certainly more catastrophic accidents in the small hours with a back seat full of passengers distracting them than older people tend to.

 

Young people who submit to "black box" type monitoring by their insurers can significantly reduce their motor insurance costs if they don't spend their post midnight hours speeding along country roads home from the nightclub with the rest of their gang piled into their souped-up Subaru and the stereo banging out that old favourite "DOOF DOOF DOOF DOOF".

[yorkie1999]

3 minutes ago, Vacamion said:

 

 

I've said this few times in here  (long term slave to the insurance industry here).

 

Young uns pay more premium because they have more accidents anyway and certainly more catastrophic accidents in the small hours with a back seat full of passengers distracting them than older people tend to.

 

Young people who submit to "black box" type monitoring by their insurers can significantly reduce their motor insurance costs if they don't spend their post midnight hours speeding along country roads home from the nightclub with the rest of their gang piled into their souped-up Subaru and the stereo banging out that old favourite "DOOF DOOF DOOF DOOF".

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thing is though, most young drivers buy cheap cars which, unless you crash into another car, don't cost a lot to repair or replace. I would imagine a fair percentage of expensive cars are driven by older drivers, simply because they can afford them and the insurance. If they prang them the insurance payouts are far higher, yet they pay a far lower premium. 

[Webbo]

1 minute ago, yorkie1999 said:

Thing is though, most young drivers buy cheap cars which, unless you crash into another car, don't cost a lot to repair or replace. I would imagine a fair percentage of expensive cars are driven by older drivers, simply because they can afford them and the insurance. If they prang them the insurance payouts are far higher, yet they pay a far lower premium. 

As you say it's the damage they do to other cars/lives that are expensive.

[Vacamion]

 

You break someone's bones, the payout is in the thousands.

 

You paralyse them, it can be in the millions.

 

You can buy a lot of souped up Saxos for that. 

[yorkie1999]

2 minutes ago, Webbo said:

As you say it's the damage they do to other cars/lives that are expensive.

As i said earlier, the only evidence i can go by is my daughter, a young drive, being driven into, twice, by oap drivers. I also think the actual driving test is far stricter and far more difficult to pass than when i was taking my test after helping both my kids with it, and i know for certain older drivers, such as myself, would struggle to pass it. I mean how may older drivers know the correct compression depth when giving cpr. There's 1000 possible questions that you have to know the answers to.

[Webbo]

2 minutes ago, yorkie1999 said:

As i said earlier, the only evidence i can go by is my daughter, a young drive, being driven into, twice, by oap drivers. I also think the actual driving test is far stricter and far more difficult to pass than when i was taking my test after helping both my kids with it, and i know for certain older drivers, such as myself, would struggle to pass it. I mean how may older drivers know the correct compression depth when giving cpr. There's 1000 possible questions that you have to know the answers to.

When my daughter passed her test she only had to do one manoeuvre, reversing into a parking space. I had to do a three point turn and reverse around a corner as well. It seems easier to me.

 

No one is saying older drivers don't have accidents but stats prove young drivers are more likely to have accidents than them.

[fuchsntf]

8 hours ago, DB11 said:

That research is a load of crap then.

 

I wonder what it is percentage wise if you scale it up because 17-21 year olds will be driving much more than drivers aged 70 and over so I bet when you scale it up likeliness to have an accident vs. numbers of hours spent driving I bet you will find older drivers feature much more heavily.

 

Then you've got the misjudging other vehicle's speed at junctions and pulling out in front of them, which won't be recorded anywhere but will only have not resulted in an accident because the younger, much quicker to react, driver is able to take evasive action.

Wrong..

I live in an area, where young and middle age drunken drivers alike always gets it wrong at junctions.

Young fast drivers cant use their youth, because they over estimate their reaction time. Then die..

Its 17-340 year old group who nick cars, and get into dangerous road races.

Its young offenders who get in cars while banned.

Its the young who v forget they are not the Only users of the road but have to share it with all types.

Its the young who believe its the right to ignore road signs in town c and on country roads.

Its the young who believe they have to prove their manhood, by ignoring Road awareness just to show their mates.

 

I was sitting in my son in laws lorry, and from a Junction a young man thought he had all the above assets Mentioned in other posts, including not seeing a policecar on the junction...

Fuk your reactions, your great evasive speedy minds..Many of you are lying on cold slabs

due to your own incompetence and arrogance.

My young son in law, is no angel v and neither am I, this young junction racer put his friend

in the bush flying through the windowscreen..coma. Himself broken arm, pelvis, legs kncluding loss of foot. I bet he thought he was a quick thinker.

My son in law 24yrs says its the youngsters who have no control Of sight, road coordination,

Nor surroundings. His 30ton truck has seen many a younger brain spead  over Motorways and byeways.Even if not involved itself...

Self esteem on the road kills..Young or old. Its not the age but the understanding of own competence.

 

I drove a 7 ton expeditions truck   through Asia, when meeting the Local lorry and bus drivers at the 

Cafe/restaurant stops on the high mountainous roads...The young coach drivers confirmed

the older lorry drivers sentiments, if a young coach driver reaches a good age, He survived and he his now  a Wise Lorry driver, if not he like his passengers, are at a bottom of a valley

1-2thousand meters down, feeding the birds.

 

[yorkie1999]

2 hours ago, Webbo said:

When my daughter passed her test she only had to do one manoeuvre, reversing into a parking space. I had to do a three point turn and reverse around a corner as well. It seems easier to me.

 

No one is saying older drivers don't have accidents but stats prove young drivers are more likely to have accidents than them.

I still believe that the stats are manipulated in order drive up the costs of insurance for younger drivers simply because they can't argue about it. Here is some data taken from government Department for transport Statistics. It's from 2 years ago but i would think it's still applicable.

                                         MALE                               FEMALE

                           Involved Casualties    %    Involved Casualties    %

Under 17	63	47	75	7	2	29
17-19	5,370	2,705	50	3,314	2,154	65
20-24	12,710	5,929	47	8,679	5,363	62
25-29	12,341	5,201	42	8,238	4,745	58
30-34	11,731	4,593	39	7,722	4,081	53
35-39	9,878	3,834	39	6,600	3,380	51
40-49	20,055	7,539	38	13,618	7,004	51
50-59	14,979	5,492	37	9,536	4,908	51
60-69	9,666	3,350	35	4,865	2,409	50
70 and over	8,076	3,298	41	3,799	2,033	54
Age not reported	8,197	379	5	2,867	236	8
All ages	113,066	42,367	37	69,245	36,315	52

 

So when you look at ages 17-24 there were 30073 accidents, but ages 40-49 there were 33673, which is a similar amount considering the extra year the data is taken over. But when you look at the actual amount of drivers in those age groups, 2754897 and 8007046 respectively (big spreadsheet on government website so i've took the relevant data from it) The percentages, or stats, are:

1.09% of 17-24 year olds have an accident

0.4% of 40-49 years olds have an accident

so therefore 17-24 year olds are 2.5 times more likely to have an accident, but the reality is both age groups have roughly the same amount of accidents, or in other words you're just as likely to have a kid smack into you as you are an old bloke, but you can be safe in the knowledge that the saxo will probably fall apart, and not so safe when you realise that bmw 7 series is going to flatten you.  

[Thracian]

9 hours ago, Vacamion said:

 

They might not be involved in accidents themselves, but there must be plenty of accidents caused by people getting frustrated by the way the greyheads drive. 

 

Of course, it's up to the rest of us to drive defensively.

 

Instead of speeding up and swerving around some codger driving Miss Daisy at 31mph in a 60 zone, I always find that the properly British way of dealing with it is to make unheard passive aggressive comments whilst gripping the steering steering wheel a bit tighter and wishing that they pass away soon in their sleep.

 

I've not had an accident in 20 years of driving around for a living....

 

 

If people cause accidents because of the frustration of slow traffic - whether it be an old person or a tractor moving between farms that entirely makes the case about bad drivers. 

 

We all get faced with potential frustrations - and the more so the more miles we drive - but the good driver accepts the situation for what it is and doesn't compromise his own good judgement.  

[Countryfox]

Younger drivers (especially male) drive a bit too quick cus they know it all, think they are invincible and have loads of testosterone ...   They learn eventually ....    Much older drivers are a bit slower ...   They have to be to avoid an accident ...   Give them some time and respect !   ...    We'll all be old one day !    Drink drivers are scum and ruin other peoples lives ...    They deserve all they get.   We get the odd accident at roundabouts when you see nothing coming but the woman in front hasn't moved cus she juuuuust wants to be sure ...   (Silly cows) ....  Yep I've hit one !!     But overall we, as a nation,  are bloody good drivers compared to most tw@ts that drive abroad.