The Tactics Thread

[AjcW]

One of the issues I have with moving to the lopsided formation is that we decided to do this based on one performance against arguably the worst side in the league.

 

It also smells a little of keeping a player (Nacho) happy so that he doesn't ask for a January move and leave us woefully short up top. 

 

I personally think we played just as well with Maddison in the 10 and would rather we switched back to that for more balance.

 

Nacho should be challenging Vardy by impressing in training and in his 20 minutes at the end... and I don't think he's far off... but I don't want us to tweak formation just to keep people happy which is how this comes across.

[Hanan96]

Btw I just watch our lineup vs Liverpool. It seems offensive with both fullback and winger are tend to venture forward. (Ricardo Ghezzal. And Chilwell Gray) 

Anybody would tell me why the same setup get hammered against Bournemouth 1st half? 

It seems the rest of the team are same anyway 

[turtmcfly]

1 minute ago, AjcW said:

One of the issues I have with moving to the lopsided formation is that we decided to do this based on one performance against arguably the worst side in the league.

 

It also smells a little of keeping a player (Nacho) happy so that he doesn't ask for a January move and leave us woefully short up top. 

 

I personally think we played just as well with Maddison in the 10 and would rather we switched back to that for more balance.

 

Nacho should be challenging Vardy by impressing in training and in his 20 minutes at the end... and I don't think he's far off... but I don't want us to tweak formation just to keep people happy which is how this comes across.

You don't think he's that far off what - starting ahead of Vardy?

[StriderHiryu]

4 minutes ago, Hanan96 said:

Btw I just watch our lineup vs Liverpool. It seems offensive with both fullback and winger are tend to venture forward. (Ricardo Ghezzal. And Chilwell Gray) 

Anybody would tell me why the same setup get hammered against Bournemouth 1st half? 

It seems the rest of the team are same anyway 

Defensively we were awful against Bouremouth. Wilson and King easily got the better of both Maguire and Morgan all game long. Offensively we actualyl started very well and were on top of the game, and were unlucky not to score when Vardy was through and it came back to Maddison who hit the crossbar. But the issue was that we kept getting the high line offside trap wrong. The first two occasions Fraser scored and though the Ricardo penalty was harsh, Bournemouth should have got a penalty earlier in the half from another foul Ricardo made which was also the result of the offside trap failing. In terms of mental concentration Maguire and Morgan had a shocker that day.

 

I think Puel decided to be a little more conservative after Bournemouth because that day we fell apart. As a footballer Amartey isn't the greatest but the positional side of his game isn't too bad at all compared to Ricardo. Against Liverpool, despite also conceding two goals, and one early goal, we defended much better in open play. It was that set piece on the stroke of half time that killed us in that game.

 

I think that once the team understands the system better we will go back to both full backs raiding, but I think it makes sense to be a bit more pragmatic first.

 

 

[Hanan96]

6 minutes ago, StriderHiryu said:

Defensively we were awful against Bouremouth. Wilson and King easily got the better of both Maguire and Morgan all game long. Offensively we actualyl started very well and were on top of the game, and were unlucky not to score when Vardy was through and it came back to Maddison who hit the crossbar. But the issue was that we kept getting the high line offside trap wrong. The first two occasions Fraser scored and though the Ricardo penalty was harsh, Bournemouth should have got a penalty earlier in the half from another foul Ricardo made which was also the result of the offside trap failing. In terms of mental concentration Maguire and Morgan had a shocker that day.

 

I think Puel decided to be a little more conservative after Bournemouth because that day we fell apart. As a footballer Amartey isn't the greatest but the positional side of his game isn't too bad at all compared to Ricardo. Against Liverpool, despite also conceding two goals, and one early goal, we defended much better in open play. It was that set piece on the stroke of half time that killed us in that game.

 

I think that once the team understands the system better we will go back to both full backs raiding, but I think it makes sense to be a bit more pragmatic first.

 

 

Well it seems you were said that Liverpool game were when maguire morgan plays well and the next they aren't good. 

 

Are we ready to play with this scheme or not for now, once evans fit? Maguire didn't play bad anymore seems. 

 

Or there's another issue? 

[Jonaldinho]

1 hour ago, AjcW said:

One of the issues I have with moving to the lopsided formation is that we decided to do this based on one performance against arguably the worst side in the league.

 

It also smells a little of keeping a player (Nacho) happy so that he doesn't ask for a January move and leave us woefully short up top. 

 

I personally think we played just as well with Maddison in the 10 and would rather we switched back to that for more balance.

 

Nacho should be challenging Vardy by impressing in training and in his 20 minutes at the end... and I don't think he's far off... but I don't want us to tweak formation just to keep people happy which is how this comes across.

 

I don't think it's anything to do with keeping Iheanacho happy, I think it's simply Puel's attempt to give Vardy such much needed support while keeping a back four and Maddison in the side without being completely overrun in midfield. It is lopsided yes but having Maddison come inside while Chilwell covered the entire left wing was causing Everton lots of problems - until Morgan was sent off. 

 

That said, I wouldn't be surprised to see us revert to a more conventional 4-2-3-1/4-5-1 this weekend to try and give Chilwell more support defensively on the left flank and an extra man in midfield. I hope we're not too defensive - Arsenal have glaring defensive weaknesses despite their good run.

[AjcW]

1 hour ago, turtmcfly said:

You don't think he's that far off what - starting ahead of Vardy?

Not necessarily from his own hard work but if JV is going to keep missing chances it's not fair to not give someone a start ahead of him IMHO, he's scored against a poor Huddersfield, a pen against Newcastle and got a consolation against United... he often never gets any stick though.. not exactly setting the world alight.

[StriderHiryu]

36 minutes ago, Hanan96 said:

Well it seems you were said that Liverpool game were when maguire morgan plays well and the next they aren't good. 

 

Are we ready to play with this scheme or not for now, once evans fit? Maguire didn't play bad anymore seems. 

 

Or there's another issue? 

Players are human and not every player can play to their best level every match. Even Messi and Ronaldo sometimes have off days!

 

Personally I think Maguire overall has been a bit below his standards last season, and I blame the World Cup for that in adding mental fatigue. He's still been decent, but I think he will get better as the season goes on. 

 

In terms of being able to play the system... I think one issue is that Ricardo does not have the physicality for the league to play right back. He's clearly a very good player but it may well be that even though we signed a 20M right back, we need another one hence why we have been linked with Clyne. Otherwise I think the main thing to remember is to be patient. It took Klopp and Guardiola quite some time to get their teams playing the way they wanted. Our players aren't as good as Man City / Liverpool players so we should expect it to take a bit longer, especially given they are so young. We are coming up to 10 games into the seasons that's a good time to judge what the team is like. Then we can compare what we are like just after Christmas. 

 

I expect us to be between 8-10th this season and quite inconsistent. But I think that's OK if players continue to develop. Look how much Chilwell improved in just one year... if some of our other players can improve in the same way then next season I want us to get 7th and be pushing for 6th! When the stadium expansion is complete, it should debut our return to the Champions League  !

[Hanan96]

10 hours ago, StriderHiryu said:

Players are human and not every player can play to their best level every match. Even Messi and Ronaldo sometimes have off days!

 

Personally I think Maguire overall has been a bit below his standards last season, and I blame the World Cup for that in adding mental fatigue. He's still been decent, but I think he will get better as the season goes on. 

 

In terms of being able to play the system... I think one issue is that Ricardo does not have the physicality for the league to play right back. He's clearly a very good player but it may well be that even though we signed a 20M right back, we need another one hence why we have been linked with Clyne. Otherwise I think the main thing to remember is to be patient. It took Klopp and Guardiola quite some time to get their teams playing the way they wanted. Our players aren't as good as Man City / Liverpool players so we should expect it to take a bit longer, especially given they are so young. We are coming up to 10 games into the seasons that's a good time to judge what the team is like. Then we can compare what we are like just after Christmas. 

 

I expect us to be between 8-10th this season and quite inconsistent. But I think that's OK if players continue to develop. Look how much Chilwell improved in just one year... if some of our other players can improve in the same way then next season I want us to get 7th and be pushing for 6th! When the stadium expansion is complete, it should debut our return to the Champions League  !

I still did not understand why the club like Liverpool with the likes of mane, salah, didn't expose Ricardo badly while another team, mid table team did it

[st albans fox]

3 hours ago, Hanan96 said:

I still did not understand why the club like Liverpool with the likes of mane, salah, didn't expose Ricardo badly while another team, mid table team did it

the players were more switched on against Liverpool....... at Bournemouth, we were making the running and the players quickly became mentally lethargic. hence the lapses in team shape and Eddie Howe didn’t need a second invitation to exploit that ......

[Hanan96]

7 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

the players were more switched on against Liverpool....... at Bournemouth, we were making the running and the players quickly became mentally lethargic. hence the lapses in team shape and Eddie Howe didn’t need a second invitation to exploit that ......

So practically, Ricardo didn't struggle with the defence aspect of epl for now, he's only switched off? 

Most of the time I saw his struggling with epl for now. But it's a shock how he's not getting much issue against Liverpool 

[st albans fox]

10 minutes ago, Hanan96 said:

So practically, Ricardo didn't struggle with the defence aspect of epl for now, he's only switched off? 

Most of the time I saw his struggling with epl for now. But it's a shock how he's not getting much issue against Liverpool 

Not only Ricardo ........... remember how he struggled first half against wolves until Puel tweaked things. It’s ok for Ricardo to go marauding as long as others are taking steps to cover the stretching of our shape when this happens. Similar with Chilwell.  Bournemouth was just a mess re team awareness/responsibilities/concentration.  We play with two holding midfielders to allow us to cover spaces. Ricardo is an attacking full back. Simmo is a defensive full back. Some full backs are good at both aspects. Some aren’t. Chilwell is more balanced but doesn’t excel yet at either end, offering a good attacking outlet and decent defensive cover.  With continued coaching and experience he could end up the England left back for many years to come. 

[Foxxed]

We're playing Iheanacho - not to appease a possible move - but to play a player who's assisting and scoring well and to give experience to a youthful striker who in a couple of years will be our main striker.

[StriderHiryu]

9 hours ago, Hanan96 said:

I still did not understand why the club like Liverpool with the likes of mane, salah, didn't expose Ricardo badly while another team, mid table team did it

Well for Liverpool's first goal, Ricardo was partly at fault for letting Robertson get past him to cross the ball. He got brushed off the ball rathwr easily, though Maguire, Morgan and Chilwell could all have done a bit better in that passage of play too. Perhaps Bournemouth looked at that game and idenitfied it as a weakness to expose as a result.

 

1 hour ago, Gerbold said:

I see tweaking/tinkering as a short-term palliative - but it's still early days. One thing that did disturb me was an analysis of the number twos (sorry) at each Premier club featured in Monday's Guardian. Our newest second-in-command, Jacques Bonnevay, was described thus:

" Joined Leicester in June to replace the departing Michael Appleton, who was part of Craig Shakespeare’s staff before Claude Puel took over as manager. Aged 57, Bonnevay is vastly experienced and has coached in the UAE, Morocco, Turkey and Japan as well as in France. His influence at Leicester is limited, however, because Puel is so hands-on and oversees everything. Bonnevay puts on a few drills but Puel takes the training sessions."

That indicates that Puel has a need to control - which will stifle the expressiveness of all around him.

Do you have a link to the article? It would be interesting to read. Perhaps that's the reason why Appleton and Planque ended up leaving - Puel may not have been happy with the results from training sessions or is one of those that wants to be hands-on. Personally I don't think it's a bad thing at all and perhaps he and Bonnevay work together in more of a discussion basis than a coaching role. Bonnevay was one of the pundits on French TV for the World Cup and is thought of as being quite shrewd in terms of being able to analyse problems. 

[StriderHiryu]

2 hours ago, Gerbold said:

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2018/oct/14/premier-league-assistant-managers-who-are-they-what-do

Thanks! That's a very good article. And whilst I can see the trepidation around Puel, this quote about Klopp means I don't think it's anything to worry about:

Klopp leads the training sessions – he is every inch the tracksuit manager – but involves Krawietz and Lijnders in daily tactical meetings.

[AjcW]

4 hours ago, Gerbold said:

I see tweaking/tinkering as a short-term palliative - but it's still early days. One thing that did disturb me was an analysis of the number twos (sorry) at each Premier club featured in Monday's Guardian. Our newest second-in-command, Jacques Bonnevay, was described thus:

" Joined Leicester in June to replace the departing Michael Appleton, who was part of Craig Shakespeare’s staff before Claude Puel took over as manager. Aged 57, Bonnevay is vastly experienced and has coached in the UAE, Morocco, Turkey and Japan as well as in France. His influence at Leicester is limited, however, because Puel is so hands-on and oversees everything. Bonnevay puts on a few drills but Puel takes the training sessions."

That indicates that Puel has a need to control - which will stifle the expressiveness of all around him.

I actually think that's a bit speculative as a comment. I mentioned in a match thread a few weeks back that the players seem to absolutely love Bonnevay! He was doing the old high fives and hugs pearson style.

 

So he may be having a communication influence, which is needed, rather than a tactical one.

Edited 17 October 2018 by AjcW

[That_Dude]

8 hours ago, Gerbold said:

This scenario devolves into either of two premises - your suspicion that tweaking goes on in order to keep the players 'happy' or that Puel is genuinely trying to adapt, with various line-ups, to each team next on the to play list. Or it could be both.

If it's the former then it just indicates that player-power has gone too far in their favour and that a new balance needs to be introduced by the FA -  for all those clubs whose stability (rather than performance) is prejudiced by players attitude.

Iheanacho strikes me as someone who has that necessary arrogance of a top-class striker yet, if he allows it to dominate his relationship with the Club, can do neither any good.

For me, tweaking, subbing and other tactical changes, are advantageous when used to surprise the opposition or to redress an imbalance presented by the opposition. We have a caucus of excellent players now - but still possibly not enough to allow Puel to let the team get on with it.

The contradictory factor - having players who subordinate their individuality to create a cohesive team, yet the need for initiative at moments when they see opportunities presented, is ever present in football (and other heavily populated team games). We applaud players whose quickness of thought and movement undo defences or attacks, but only so far. For instance, both Gray and Diabate have been criticised for wandering into dead-ends after promising initial movements. I guess this is what distinguishes great teams and great individualists - the ability to see and follow through with these moves. Which calls for a high degree of responsiveness from those players around the playmaker.

We have plenty of players teetering on the brink of creating a good team, but, realistically, so have those other teams with similar potential to us.

Maddison and Chilwell are at key points in their careers and Leicester's potential. Both are apparently committed to City - it's up to Puel to now begin to tighten up his squad so that his team/sub choices are self-selecting (keeping in mind injuries and othe problems).

I see tweaking/tinkering as a short-term palliative - but it's still early days. One thing that did disturb me was an analysis of the number twos (sorry) at each Premier club featured in Monday's Guardian. Our newest second-in-command, Jacques Bonnevay, was described thus:

" Joined Leicester in June to replace the departing Michael Appleton, who was part of Craig Shakespeare’s staff before Claude Puel took over as manager. Aged 57, Bonnevay is vastly experienced and has coached in the UAE, Morocco, Turkey and Japan as well as in France. His influence at Leicester is limited, however, because Puel is so hands-on and oversees everything. Bonnevay puts on a few drills but Puel takes the training sessions."

That indicates that Puel has a need to control - which will stifle the expressiveness of all around him.

That is simultaneously his greatest strenght and greatest weakness. Based on his CV it's one of the major reasons if the not the first of his demise and I have no doubt that should we part ways with him it will be because of that. His coaching style is suited for young players who he can model and develop as he sees fit cetainly but less so with older players who don't need a father anymore. I simply can't see young players following a "dull" manager like he's often described here by some experts who're able to judge a manager's personality through five minutes of PR crap.

 

That said, I'm behind him because he's massively investing in young players which can only be good for us in the long term. Most of his work is gooing underground, giving us solid foundations to build upon in the future - with or without him - and that's what the Puel Out brigade either fails or doesn't want to see. And to the contrary to a tenacious myth here his playing style favourizes attacking. He demands more defensive discipline from the midfield with two CMs to protect the CBs while FBs are allowed to push forward and stretch the opponent's defensive line. His teams are also organized around a free roaming flair player (Hazard, L.Lopez, Ben Arfa, Mahrez, Maddison) who dictates the game forward. All of his flair players have thrived under his management and there is just no way he's a defensive minded manager. Southampton being the exception because his spell there ended more as being a fireman rather than a manager.

 

He's undertaken a massive work to shift our way of playing and inconsistency is to be expected until all the players get used to it, not just for a couple of games but seasons. If he gets it right sooner more power to him, but as long as we stay in the top ten and our team is improving it would be madness to sack him.

Edited 17 October 2018 by That_Dude

[fuchsntf]

On 16/10/2018 at 15:33, AjcW said:

Not necessarily from his own hard work but if JV is going to keep missing chances it's not fair to not give someone a start ahead of him IMHO, he's scored against a poor Huddersfield, a pen against Newcastle and got a consolation against United... he often never gets any stick though.. not exactly setting the world alight.

No !! He isn't setting the world alight,and I have also brought up this indifferent lack of form in front of goal...

But it would be foolish to drop him,Vardy has proved in the past,he can pull himself around...

I'LL he's still one of the top 4 strikers in the PL....Sometimes one has to step back,an simply be patient....Class,wanes occasionally

but never goes away...Vardy stays our no1 man..!!!

[sacreblueits442]

15 hours ago, Gerbold said:

This scenario devolves into either of two premises - your suspicion that tweaking goes on in order to keep the players 'happy' or that Puel is genuinely trying to adapt, with various line-ups, to each team next on the to play list. Or it could be both.

If it's the former then it just indicates that player-power has gone too far in their favour and that a new balance needs to be introduced by the FA -  for all those clubs whose stability (rather than performance) is prejudiced by players attitude.

Iheanacho strikes me as someone who has that necessary arrogance of a top-class striker yet, if he allows it to dominate his relationship with the Club, can do neither any good.

For me, tweaking, subbing and other tactical changes, are advantageous when used to surprise the opposition or to redress an imbalance presented by the opposition. We have a caucus of excellent players now - but still possibly not enough to allow Puel to let the team get on with it.

The contradictory factor - having players who subordinate their individuality to create a cohesive team, yet the need for initiative at moments when they see opportunities presented, is ever present in football (and other heavily populated team games). We applaud players whose quickness of thought and movement undo defences or attacks, but only so far. For instance, both Gray and Diabate have been criticised for wandering into dead-ends after promising initial movements. I guess this is what distinguishes great teams and great individualists - the ability to see and follow through with these moves. Which calls for a high degree of responsiveness from those players around the playmaker.

We have plenty of players teetering on the brink of creating a good team, but, realistically, so have those other teams with similar potential to us.

Maddison and Chilwell are at key points in their careers and Leicester's potential. Both are apparently committed to City - it's up to Puel to now begin to tighten up his squad so that his team/sub choices are self-selecting (keeping in mind injuries and othe problems).

I see tweaking/tinkering as a short-term palliative - but it's still early days. One thing that did disturb me was an analysis of the number twos (sorry) at each Premier club featured in Monday's Guardian. Our newest second-in-command, Jacques Bonnevay, was described thus:

" Joined Leicester in June to replace the departing Michael Appleton, who was part of Craig Shakespeare’s staff before Claude Puel took over as manager. Aged 57, Bonnevay is vastly experienced and has coached in the UAE, Morocco, Turkey and Japan as well as in France. His influence at Leicester is limited, however, because Puel is so hands-on and oversees everything. Bonnevay puts on a few drills but Puel takes the training sessions."

That indicates that Puel has a need to control - which will stifle the expressiveness of all around him.

....from the Arsene Wenger school of management!!!

  They are cut from the same cloth. Pat Rice was there to keep his company in the dug out. Steve Bould was at one time for a few games allowed to set up the team to be more difficult to beat and be more defensively aware. Arsenal did not concede but they could not score either. Wenger put his foot down and took back the reigns and Bould ended up as just a cardboard cut out placed on a chair beside Wenger. The idea was for Bould to be in place to take over but that was never going to happen with Wenger controlling everything.

  I recently posted that Puel needs a number 2 who is strong  and someone who he could respect. It seems with Puel there is something missing, something you struggle to put your finger on but you know something just is not right.There is a lack of balance with him and as such a reflection of the teams he sends out to play.

[Hanan96]

On 17/10/2018 at 16:40, StriderHiryu said:

Well for Liverpool's first goal, Ricardo was partly at fault for letting Robertson get past him to cross the ball. He got brushed off the ball rathwr easily, though Maguire, Morgan and Chilwell could all have done a bit better in that passage of play too. Perhaps Bournemouth looked at that game and idenitfied it as a weakness to expose as a result.

 

Do you have a link to the article? It would be interesting to read. Perhaps that's the reason why Appleton and Planque ended up leaving - Puel may not have been happy with the results from training sessions or is one of those that wants to be hands-on. Personally I don't think it's a bad thing at all and perhaps he and Bonnevay work together in more of a discussion basis than a coaching role. Bonnevay was one of the pundits on French TV for the World Cup and is thought of as being quite shrewd in terms of being able to analyse problems. 

Could we say that Ricardo, in the beggining didn't show much problem as right back, until the team start to target him? 

[st albans fox]

45 minutes ago, Hanan96 said:

Could we say that Ricardo, in the beggining didn't show much problem as right back, until the team start to target him? 

well his first game wasn't at full back and his second was against the 'black country portugese team' who clearly knew how to drag him out of position and isolate him.  thereafter, opposition managers would know our right was susceptible 

[StriderHiryu]

1 hour ago, Hanan96 said:

Could we say that Ricardo, in the beggining didn't show much problem as right back, until the team start to target him? 

I would say yes. Liverpool actually tried to isolate Chilwell, something a number of teams did last season and played the long diagonal in behind him multiple times. But this season he’s not getting done by it as he’s really upped both his defensive positioning and his physicality. He literally looks stronger this year and it’s paying off. 

 

But teams definitely exploited Ricardo at right back. Amartey is nowhere near the footballer that Ricardo is but he doesn’t lose physical duels. Everton scores from Bernard using skill to beat Amartey (and others) but that’s trickier than just smashing a goal kick into our right back position and getting in that way. 

[Hanan96]

Thank you. Great answer. Now I understand what's going on about Ricardo. 

 

Now mendy. What kind of midfield he is? When he's signed for us many article said he's a holding midfield. Wiki says carbon copy of makalele. 

 

Somehow he's seems much more mobile and aggressive than those things. 

 

[Paninistickers]

Surely the no. 2 is all about dynamic? There's no archetypal no. 2. 

 

I watched the man city Amazon doc. Arteta the supposed no. 2 seemed peripheral. Pep had however total trust in his water polo best mate who had nothing to do with tactics at all.

 

Bonnevay's CV and twitter appear a bit underwhelming. Comes across as a senior league style proper football man. Man's man.

 

That said, I was glad to see Puel get rid of Appleton. He came across dreadfully on radio and TV. Plus, he was easily suckered into discussing mahrez's move and the benefit of him playing for a big club. I'dve sacked the cant on the spot for gross misconduct for that Alone

 

 

[StriderHiryu]

4 hours ago, Hanan96 said:

Thank you. Great answer. Now I understand what's going on about Ricardo. 

 

Now mendy. What kind of midfield he is? When he's signed for us many article said he's a holding midfield. Wiki says carbon copy of makalele. 

 

Somehow he's seems much more mobile and aggressive than those things. 

 

I think comparing Mendy to Makelele is a very lazy comparison and has been made because both are defensive minded midfielders, both are french and both are black. But both players are very different in their style of play. I'm going to use stats from the official Premier League site to compare them objectively as well as give some subjective opinion too.

Claude Makelele

 

 

A player so good he had a position named after him! The "Makelele" role was to sit at the base of a midfield diamond or three and make be disciplined enough to hold the line so that other players on the team could attack and make things happen. Here is his starting position in the 2003 Champions League final which Real Madrid won thanks to a brilliant Zinedine Zidane goal. In fact Zidane would later go on record as saying that selling Makelele to Chelsea was one of the worst decisions that Real Madrid ever made. He might not have been as technically brilliant as the other galacticos but with zero ego, Makelele was arguably the most important player in a team full of superstars because he facilitated the others into being able to play their game. After all I don't think you would have seen Figo or Zidane running back to make a challenge after losing the ball!

 

  

If you look at his stats, Makelele had a brilliant tackle success rate and tons of recoveries, but made rather few passes per match. Just like at Real Madrid his job was to sit back and protect, making sure the team kept it's shape so that counter attacks were nullified.

 

 

Nampalys Mendy

 

 

 

Mendy only has eleven appearances in the Premier League but you can already see he is a very different type of player. He has a lower tackle success rate but makes many more passes per match. In fact he has the highest passing stats of any player in our team this season. So his role in our team is very different indeed. He is more of an engine room type of player for us and is very dynamic. Though he doesn't bomb forward like a box-to-box midfielder he does get about a lot and recovers the ball and distributes it to the attacking players in front of him. I've also attached a picture of the system Nice would sometimes use when Mendy was there, where performed a a very similar role to now.

Mendy played under Puel for Nice and was both Captain there and once voted their player of the season. His role is therefore as one part of the double pivot talked about in the first post in this thread. He's actually been tried in both roles, sometimes as the more defensive of the two, but recently as the more offensive one. That's why if you see the pictures of the game against Everton you see Ndidi drop back in front of the defenders whilst Mendy pushes on. Given Mendy is a much better passer than Ndidi (and the stats actually say he is our best passer) this makes sense. The interesting thing here is that for Nice, he played alongside Seri (now at Fulham) and it was Seri who pushed forward. So that's an interesting development to see.

 

  

So whilst both players are defensive midfielders, their roles are quite different. Makelele was all about being disciplined and tactically aware. Making sure the team's shape never broke and there was never an opportunity to break on his team. And given how important he was for France, Real Madrid and Chelsea he goes down in history and one of the best "water carrier" type of midfielders ever. The player most like him would probably be Deschamps.

Mendy is a defensive double-pivot style player and "the engine room of our own half." His job is to help get the bacll from our defenders to our attacking players but via short, incisive and accurate passing. We no longer just smash the ball from defence to attack, but now try to play through the lines. But Mendy is there to bring it to the attacking players and it's up to Maddison primarily to take it from there and run the attacking third side of our game. If you look at French football there are still a number of teams that play this way but if I had to describe a player most similar to him right now... I'd actually go for Busquets of Barcelona and Spain even though he is quite a different player.

Edited 18 October 2018 by StriderHiryu