The Tactics Thread

[StriderHiryu]

It's a topic that gets fans talking all around the country every week. The tactics, formations and systems that various teams use can often be the defining factor between success and glory. We won a shock Premier League title in part due to Claudio Ranieri tactic of a deadly counter attack with high intensity pressing to beat teams that on paper should have put us to the sword. Guardiola has revolutionised football globally with his tiki-taka high possession based system, and Antonio Conte pulled off a masterstroke by switching Chelsea to a 3-4-3 formation to win the title in his first season at Stamford Bridge. So this thread is all about the tactics Leicester City employ, explaining them and discussing them. It might not be everyone's cup of tea!

Since we ditched out counter attacking style a lot of our fans I talk to don't appear to be aware of the system we are using and what roles our players are expected to perform in it. So let's start this thread off with a look at Leicester's system used at the start of both of the last two games, the 4-2-3-1.

Before we start I just want to say:

- By no means do I consider myself a football expert! I have an interest in tactics as I once worked on a Football video game where we were trying to accurately simulate how tactics influence a match with a given set of players. To get a better understanding we went to visit multiple top coaches who explained how various tactics and systems worked which was nothing short of eye-opening. However, a Sky Sports pundit I am not.

- I don't work day-to-day with the club, coaches or players do don't know the specific intricacies of our play our strategy as outlined by the manager. We will have subtleties and nuances that are unique to our players and club. Claude Puel may well read this write-up and laugh himself silly.

- Tactics and systems change all the time and no two teams usually play identical versions of the same system.

 

 

The 4-2-3-1 System

Background

Former Real Sociedad coach Juanma Lillo is generally credited for introducing the 4-2-3-1 formation into the game. It became an instant hit with numerous Spanish teams adopting the style in the 1990s before it spread throughout the world in the early years of the new millennium. To best explain the system, I'm going to use the real life example of another famous and successful team - the 1998 World Cup winning French team. They were a bit good

What’s the idea behind it?

The 4-2-3-1 isn't just a formation but a specific ideology in how to play football. Key traits in the system are:

• To control the game via absorbing pressure.
• Regain possession quickly high up the pitch.
• Transitioning into attack quickly.

The two defensive midfielders – also known as ‘double pivots’ – are essential to the system as they ensure that space left in front of the defence is catered for at all times. Once possession in won, they push forward along with the full backs, and the wingers try to get inside to assist the striker and the No. 10. If possession is lost, the wide distribution of players across the pitch ensures that the ball is regained as early as possible without the back line being broken. This is made possible by players pressing in the midfield region in order to outnumber the opposition.

I think some good examples of this play can be seen from the recent video showcasing our new Right Back Ricardo's play in our first two games. But don't just look out for him, but pay attention to the roles Maddison and Mendy play in some of these clips too. Notice how there are times attacks are built up by our own team, and other times where Ricardo recovers the ball quickly and turns it into attack with support from his teammates.

Player Roles

The striker (9) plays an important role in this formation as the furthest man up field. He will often not feature in the build-up play going on behind him, but has a pivotal role in dragging the defenders he's up against out of position, and linking up / playing in the other forward players and 10 who support the attack. As evidenced by Thiery Henry in the French team, you don't necessarily need to be a fantastic header of the ball if you are intelligent enough to be able to make the required runs to create space for your team mates. Jamie Vardy has adapted very well to the new requirements placed on him and you'll notice he drifts around a lot more and plays in others compared to the role he played for us in 15/16. At the same time it should be noted that the very best teams in the world often play a player in this position who is physically immense such as Lewandowski, Kane, Ronaldo or Lukaku as being able to hold up the ball or getting on the end of crosses can make a difference. France themselves made an adjustment to their system putting Trezeguet up top in Euro 200 and moving Henry to play as one of the forwards.

The No. 10 is the quintessential ‘playmaker’ in the team, capable of creative football just behind the striker. France had one of the greatest number 10's of all time in Zidane and he provides a fantastic template for what a world class number 10 should look to achieve in the 4231 system. His role is to link up play and feed in dangerous passes to both the two wider forward players who assist in attacking play along the flanks and cutting in to help the striker when necessary and feeding the number 9. He'll typically receive the ball from both the central midfielders and the fullbacks who gallop up and down the pitch. James Maddison was signed for this exact reason and he's performed the role well in his first two games for Leicester.

The two central defensive midfielders provide the platform on which attacks are created after regaining possession and this is often referred to as the double-pivot. The two must have precise positional sense and must complement each other perfectly. One of the two players is usually entrusted with the job of clearing attacks through tackling, while the other is more attack-oriented, and is the one to launch attacks through quick passing. These two often swap roles in order to avoid predictability and confuse the opposition. Looking at the French team of 1998, Deschamps was there to hold position and maintain shape, whereas Emanuel Petit or Patrick Vieira would be the one to join in and support the attack when they got on the ball. For Leicester, it's handled by Wilfred Ndidi and one of Silva, Mendy or Iborra.

The central defenders play a role similar to most other back four systems in stopping the opposition forwards from getting on the ball. Their primary job is to clear balls and repel attacks through tackles, heading and marking, but in a 4-2-3-1, they may often create passing triangles with the central defensive midfielders when possession is regained. You'll note this is where Harry Maguire excels in keeping the ball and helping us build moves from the back instead of pumping it down field as fast as possible as we used to play. It's also why Puel has brought in 3 new centre backs all of whom are comfortable on the ball, so that they offer an additional option to the central midfielders so that we can keep hold of the ball so we can try a risky pass in forward positions instead of turning over the ball in midfield by playing it long and high.

The full backs have a very demanding role in this system, being a hybrid of defenders and wingers in one package. They are expected to be physically fit and swift who should be both capable of clearing attacks by opposition wingers as well as launching wide attacks themselves. They will often overlap or underlap with the forward in front of them to create 2v1 "overload" scenarios to create attacking opportunities for the team. Of course naturally playing in such a way means that they leave huge spaces in behind them which can be exploited if the ball is turned over and lost up field.

The wide forwards are the final piece of the puzzle. These are often "inverted" wingers - that's to say a right footed player may play on the left and vice versa so that they can cut in and shoot with their stronger foot, whereas the fullback supporting them will play on the same side as their natural kicking foot so they can cross it. These players are expected to be highly mobile to create space and drag players out of position and may sometimes push as far forward to effectively make up another striker when in possession high up the pitch. They also perform a role as being one of the first forms of defence. If the ball is lost, they need to press very quickly to force the opposition to put it out of play or back to the goalkeeper so that the fullbacks have time to get back and recover the shape and position. You'll notice this has been a huge part of Demari Gray's play this season, with him successfully tracking back to recover the ball on a number of occasions. The forwards may also swap flanks during the game to give the opposition a new threat to deal with. Now the winger is going to go down the line as opposed to cutting in.

Summary

So that's the crash course in the system we are currently using. At times during the Wolves match we shifted to a 3-4-3 / 3-4-1-2 but I'll let someone else handle a write-up of that formation. But in explaining this system, I hope it makes a few things clearer in the way we play:

- We leave Jamie Vardy up front by himself because his role is to stretch the game and drag players out of position. Being fast, a nuisance and remarkably intelligent in footballing terms he adapted to the role very well last season. Of course why we continue to lump in high crosses to short player who is not physically immense compared to the centre backs in the division remains a mystery and something that hopefully the coaches are working on with the players.

- Our fullbacks are going to bomb on and leave gaps in behind. Danny Simpson was and still is a good defender, but he's lacking in the technical ability and pace departments required to support the forward play. The same is also the reason why Chilwell has become a mainstay under Puel. We are going to concede goals this season due to these players being too far forward and it's going to be a learning curve for the team and players to work out the optimal balance.

- Mendy played as one of the double pivots under Puel at Nice, hence why it's probably no surprise to see him back in the starting 11.

- Defenders need to be good on the ball to provide passing triangles for players in front of them and also so that we retain the ball as we need to build the play up whilst our fullbacks move forwards.

Now is this system and formation the best one we could / should be using? That's not for me to say and ultimately results will be used to judge the effectiveness of what we have built and invested in. I think there are lots of promising signs especially given that Maddison and Ricardo appear to have hit the ground running. But the season is 38 games long for a reason!

 

 

Lastly if this thread hasn't bored you to sleep already, here is another good video on the formation:

 

 

Edited 23 August 2018 by StriderHiryu

[Charl91]

I like the orange and green ones.

[fuchsntf]

My tactics...all players inside the whitewash,no matter what formation,strive forward keeping on the frontfoot,even when defending is needed.

Don't ponce around...if in doubt attack or feed the ball to teammate in a better position.If off the ball offer yourself up to support teammate on

Ball,both beware of space,and pressing and closing move of the oppo.....not forgetting at all times to communicate with team-members...

Occasionally laughing with ref...Then next telling him where he can find a local spec-savours

Then put that  round pesky evasive kicking thingy in the back of the net,you suppose to be attacking.....simples

[Izzy]

“Players lose you games, not tactics. There’s so much crap talked about tactics by people who barely know how to win at dominos”

Brian Clough 

[themightyfin]

So much talk about formations and tactics by the fans these days.

You can break it all down to attack as a unit and defend as a unit. It's a simple game.

[l444ry]

4 minutes ago, themightyfin said:

So much talk about formations and tactics by the fans these days.

You can break it all down to attack as a unit and defend as a unit. It's a simple game.

Very true, up to a point. A good manager still has to select the right formation and tactics that suit the players at his disposal.

[g7fox]

Great thread pal, without understanding tactics that Puel is trying to implement, half the punters here haven’t got a clue..

[StriderHiryu]

21 minutes ago, Izzy Muzzett said:

“Players lose you games, not tactics. There’s so much crap talked about tactics by people who barely know how to win at dominos”

Brian Clough 

Brian Clough was one of the best managers ever seen on these shores, but he got found out later in his career. When Forest were European champions he used to take the team out on the piss the night before a game so the players enjoyed their European tours immensely and it produced results on the pitch. But the game has advanced way beyond that now. He got relegated in final season at Forest and while there are many contributing factors to that happening, I'd argue Clough's inability to move with the times was one of them. He still goes down probably after Sir Alex as the second best manager in the country though.

12 minutes ago, themightyfin said:

So much talk about formations and tactics by the fans these days.

You can break it all down to attack as a unit and defend as a unit. It's a simple game.

You have a point for sure, but the amount of times you hear people at the game complaining about things that are intended shows there is a lack of understanding among many. I get it - we can sit here and play pretend football manager all we want to no effect. But at the same time the tactics we played in 15/16 had a HUGE effect on how we did that season. Ranieri found a system that played to the strengths of most of our team, e.g. exploiting pace on the break and forcing other teams wide to cross it in so Huth and Morgan could clear it all day long. Had we tried to play Tiki-Taka football with that squad, it wouldn't have worked out so well!

Definitely not a topic for everyone, but I think it's a worthwhile discussion.

Edited 23 August 2018 by StriderHiryu

[norwichfox]

my head just blew up....

[Bunyip]

So it's as boring to read as it is to watch. Thanks for explaining tedium.

[Izzy]

14 minutes ago, StriderHiryu said:

Brian Clough was one of the best managers ever seen on these shores, but he got found out later in his career. When Forest were European champions he used to take the team out on the piss the night before a game so the players enjoyed their European tours immensely and it produced results on the pitch. But the game has advanced way beyond that now. He got relegated in final season at Forest and while there are many contributing factors to that happening, I'd argue Clough's inability to move with the times was one of them. He still goes down probably after Sir Alex as the second best manager in the country though.

You have a point for sure, but the amount of times you hear people at the game complaining about things that are intended shows there is a lack of understanding among many. I get it - we can sit here and play pretend football manager all we want to no effect. But at the same time the tactics we played in 15/16 had a HUGE effect on how we did that season. Ranieri found a system that played to the strengths of most of our team, e.g. exploiting pace on the break and forcing other teams wide to cross it in so Huth and Morgan could clear it all day long. Had we tried to play Tiki-Taka football with that squad, it wouldn't have worked out so well!

Definitely not a topic for everyone, but I think it's a worthwhile discussion.

I think Cloughie was a bit of a bully actually. There's no way he'd get away with treating today's pampered, millionaire prima donnas like that 

Definitely a worthwhile discussion but not one for a simplistic dinosaur like me. Maybe if I played Football Manager I might have something to contribute, but I don't so I'll leave it to the experts 

Edited 23 August 2018 by Izzy Muzzett

[Guest ttfn]

Absolutely brilliant, the most informative thing I’ve read on here.

[StriderHiryu]

Just now, Izzy Muzzett said:

I think Cloughie was a bit of a bully actually. There's no way he'd get away with treating today's pampered, millionaire prima donnas like that 

I have to say it would be hilarious to see Clough deal with someone like Pogba or Dele Alli. They wouldn't know what hit em!

[Guest ttfn]

19 minutes ago, StriderHiryu said:

the amount of times you hear people at the game complaining about things that are intended 

I’m sure I’ve been guilty of this before but this is so true.

We’re going to have to get used to our defenders being absent from defending the back post because they’ve been caught up the pitch. It would never happen with Simpson on the pitch but then again Simpson never got 2 assists in 2 games (I’d be surprised if he managed 2 assists in a season).

[Izzy]

8 minutes ago, StriderHiryu said:

I have to say it would be hilarious to see Clough deal with someone like Pogba or Dele Alli. They wouldn't know what hit em!

Literally 

[StriderHiryu]

Just now, ttfn said:

I’m sure I’ve been guilty of this before but this is so true.

We’re going to have to get used to our defenders being absent from defending the back post because they’ve been caught up the pitch. It would never happen with Simpson on the pitch but then again Simpson never got 2 assists in 2 games (I’d be surprised if he managed 2 assists in a season).

It's a totally different way of playing compared to what we are used to. Maybe it's for the better, maybe it's for the worse. E.g. I think Belgium played the most attractive football at the World Cup, but France went home winning it! It will be interesting to see how our team copes with situations like this because other coaches will look to exploit the weaknesses in our play and as good as Ricardo looks to be, if you *know* he's going to bomb on all the time, you can look for the long diagonal in behind him as a way to pose us problems.

13 minutes ago, Bunyip said:

So it's as boring to read as it is to watch. Thanks for explaining tedium.

It's not for everyone!

I worked on a football video game, so we had the very real problem of making the players on the pitch stand in believable places and do things you'd expect them to do in real life. So the best way we thought to get that right would be talk to real coaches, who would draw diagrams showing us where every player on the pitch would be depending on where the ball was. Whilst it was really full on and quite dull, it did also make me massively respect coaches for drilling this into players because I don't think we as fans appreciate the day-to-day training that goes into making sure that positioning is correct. When I play football (to an admittedly poor standard) it really made me realise how I was standing in completely the wrong position for most of my life as a central midfielder and how just understanding where to stand at what times makes such a huge difference.

[Bunyip]

13 minutes ago, StriderHiryu said:

It's a totally different way of playing compared to what we are used to. Maybe it's for the better, maybe it's for the worse. E.g. I think Belgium played the most attractive football at the World Cup, but France went home winning it! It will be interesting to see how our team copes with situations like this because other coaches will look to exploit the weaknesses in our play and as good as Ricardo looks to be, if you *know* he's going to bomb on all the time, you can look for the long diagonal in behind him as a way to pose us problems.

It's not for everyone!

I worked on a football video game, so we had the very real problem of making the players on the pitch stand in believable places and do things you'd expect them to do in real life. So the best way we thought to get that right would be talk to real coaches, who would draw diagrams showing us where every player on the pitch would be depending on where the ball was. Whilst it was really full on and quite dull, it did also make me massively respect coaches for drilling this into players because I don't think we as fans appreciate the day-to-day training that goes into making sure that positioning is correct. When I play football (to an admittedly poor standard) it really made me realise how I was standing in completely the wrong position for most of my life as a central midfielder and how just understanding where to stand at what times makes such a huge difference.

They are professional players playing at the very top in football they shouldn't need telling where to stand. This system explained simply. pass side to side then back then forward only a few feet than side to side and back again. Slowly build up while the opposition gets back in numbers and read every pass you make. Then when you do get the ball in their area make sure you only have one striker who is isolated and easily closed down. Against Wolves we had an own goal and a deflected goal from a midfielder and our goal post on three occasions to get us the points. Plus how many other teams in the Prem play this system?

Edited 23 August 2018 by Bunyip

[KFS]

I actually really enjoyed that, thank you

[murphy]

1 hour ago, Bunyip said:

So it's as boring to read as it is to watch. Thanks for explaining tedium.

Like it says in the original post.  Not everyone's cup of tea.

There are plenty of other threads where you can have a bun fight with someone or slag Wes off or something.

[The Doctor]

1 hour ago, ttfn said:

Simpson never got 2 assists in 2 games (I’d be surprised if he managed 2 assists in a season).

Stoke at home 16/17 he got two assists in the one game. But the point behind it is sound

[Stadt]

1 hour ago, ttfn said:

I’m sure I’ve been guilty of this before but this is so true.

We’re going to have to get used to our defenders being absent from defending the back post because they’ve been caught up the pitch. It would never happen with Simpson on the pitch but then again Simpson never got 2 assists in 2 games (I’d be surprised if he managed 2 assists in a season).

He got two against Stoke at home in 16/17 haha, although one was a square ball to Ndidi thirty yards from goal and then he twatted it from there so it hardly counts. It boils down to risk against reward and it's inherently riskier playing more offensively minded full backs, we might concede more goals but given sides are more inclined to sit deep against us, especially at home, the trade off is worth it if offers us more in attack.

[mozartfox]

1 hour ago, ttfn said:

Absolutely brilliant, the most informative thing I’ve read on here.

With all due respect that is not saying very much is it?

[l444ry]

Can't stand the system myself. All systems have strengths and weaknesses but full backs are isolated 1v1 too often my my liking and one up front is so bloody boring. Acquired taste I suppose. 

[shade]

4 minutes ago, l444ry said:

Can't stand the system myself. All systems have strengths and weaknesses but full backs are isolated 1v1 too often my my liking and one up front is so bloody boring. Acquired taste I suppose. 

this is my concern too, why not just push that touch further, maddison as a front two turning it into a 442

[foxinyourbox]

I remember an interview with Ranieri where he said that when he arrived at the club he didn't implement his own tactics, instead he told the players they'd been playing well under their previous system and just to carry on doing what they'd been doing.

Similarly, I remember an interview with Sam Allardice where he said when he goes into a failing club he gets the players into his office individually, tells them what their strengths are and tells them to do exactly that.

Sometimes you need to allow players the freedom to do what they do best.

Edited 23 August 2018 by foxinyourbox