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[Countryfox]

39 minutes ago, Buce said:

 

Do you have evidence to suggest he's wrong?

 

12 minutes ago, Strokes said:

Do I need too?

 

3 minutes ago, Buce said:

 

Of course not, mate.

 

 

 

[Guest SO1]

Sure. Go ahead, deregulate and privatize your healthcare system just like us.

Circling the garbage can just like us. Increasing the costs by adding on the middle man and profit margin and expecting better results.

The Evil Rich don't give a xxxx about you they want your money.

Like us the'll increase prices until, like me, you can't go to the doctor for anything. Emergency Surgery your bankrupt. As simple as.

They won't let you die in the street. Not as long as there's more profit to be made.

[Strokes]

1 hour ago, SO1 said:

Sure. Go ahead, deregulate and privatize your healthcare system just like us.

Circling the garbage can just like us. Increasing the costs by adding on the middle man and profit margin and expecting better results.

The Evil Rich don't give a xxxx about you they want your money.

Like us the'll increase prices until, like me, you can't go to the doctor for anything. Emergency Surgery your bankrupt. As simple as.

They won't let you die in the street. Not as long as there's more profit to be made.

Hysterical nonsense as per usual. They would be bidding for contracts, they wouldn’t be controlling policy. Imagine if I said I don’t want Pakistani firms bidding for healthcare services.

[Bryn]

3 minutes ago, Strokes said:

Hysterical nonsense as per usual. They would be bidding for contracts, they wouldn’t be controlling policy. Imagine if I said I don’t want Pakistani firms bidding for healthcare services.

 

I don't want Pakistani firms bidding for NHS contracts.

 

I definitely don't want US firms bidding for them.

 

Public healthcare in the US is a joke.

[Kopfkino]

5 minutes ago, Bryn said:

 

I don't want Pakistani firms bidding for NHS contracts.

 

I definitely don't want US firms bidding for them.

 

Public healthcare in the US is a joke.

But EU firms and any other country with which the EU has FTAs non-discrimination clauses are fine

[Kopfkino]

1 hour ago, SO1 said:

Sure. Go ahead, deregulate and privatize your healthcare system just like us.

Circling the garbage can just like us. Increasing the costs by adding on the middle man and profit margin and expecting better results.

The Evil Rich don't give a xxxx about you they want your money.

Like us the'll increase prices until, like me, you can't go to the doctor for anything. Emergency Surgery your bankrupt. As simple as.

They won't let you die in the street. Not as long as there's more profit to be made.

Which is why only the smallest minority in the UK would ever go near a healthcare system like in the US. It's just used as a scare tactic for people playing politics, it has no traction.

[Nick]

Privatised public services seem to be a joke in general. I also acknowledge that previous poorly run public services also became a joke but there has to be a way of running public services not for profit in a more stringent and less wasteful but effective fashion.

[Strokes]

16 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said:

Privatised public services seem to be a joke in general. I also acknowledge that previous poorly run public services also became a joke but there has to be a way of running public services not for profit in a more stringent and less wasteful but effective fashion.

Nice side step.

[Nick]

1 minute ago, Strokes said:

Nice side step.

I wasn’t aware I was part of any argument to side step away from! Profiting based privatisation of services ranging from healthcare, prisons to public transport in the UK over the past few decades has been an absolute disaster in relation to service provision across the board but okay for share holders and the ‘preferred providers’ who screw up again and again and yet still get awarded more contracts. Doesn’t seem that approach is about the people or the service being provided.

 

Just sayin.

[What the Fuchs?]

2 hours ago, SO1 said:

Sure. Go ahead, deregulate and privatize your healthcare system just like us.

Circling the garbage can just like us. Increasing the costs by adding on the middle man and profit margin and expecting better results.

The Evil Rich don't give a xxxx about you they want your money.

Like us the'll increase prices until, like me, you can't go to the doctor for anything. Emergency Surgery your bankrupt. As simple as.

They won't let you die in the street. Not as long as there's more profit to be made.

That's the problem with privatisation - people say it encourages fair prices through competition but that isn't really true, just look at the train lines where train companies get a monopoly on a line and then can charge whatever they want, and no one can use a different company. The healthcare system in America is truly awful, geared for exploiting the maximum profit from patients; I've heard of people even being reluctant to call an ambulance because of the extortionate price, and an X Ray is ridiculously expensive. Many people there can simply not afford to be sick. Since Thatcher we've been edging slowly closer to the American model, where greed is king. One of the reasons I support renationalisation of the railways for instance.

[Kopfkino]

3 minutes ago, What the Fuchs? said:

That's the problem with privatisation - people say it encourages fair prices through competition but that isn't really true, just look at the train lines where train companies get a monopoly on a line and then can charge whatever they want

That's clearly a problem of design not privatisation per se. The franchise system transferring state monopolies to private monopolies is terrible for everyone involved (including TOCs), it's not very good but that's the fault of those that design it to be that way. The two open-access operators Hull Trains and Grand Central work reasonably well, delivering lower prices, innovations and customer satisfaction. It's had good success in Italy too.

 

Oh also most of the extortionate fares are regulated by government anyway.

[Strokes]

30 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said:

I wasn’t aware I was part of any argument to side step away from! Profiting based privatisation of services ranging from healthcare, prisons to public transport in the UK over the past few decades has been an absolute disaster in relation to service provision across the board but okay for share holders and the ‘preferred providers’ who screw up again and again and yet still get awarded more contracts. Doesn’t seem that approach is about the people or the service being provided.

 

Just sayin.

Apologies, I mistakenly read your post as by someone else. Too much sun and beer.

[Nick]

2 minutes ago, Strokes said:

Apologies, I mistakenly read your post as by someone else. Too much sun and beer.

Hey no worries! ?

[Guest SO1]

54 minutes ago, Strokes said:

Hysterical nonsense as per usual. They would be bidding for contracts, they wouldn’t be controlling policy. Imagine if I said I don’t want Pakistani firms bidding for healthcare services.

"they wouldn't be controlling policy". I'm not familiar with your system of government to know that. Here "they" make very large contributions to our corrupt politicians to control policy. Large corporations write the laws and legislation that our government considers https://www.alecexposed.org/wiki/ALEC_Exposed  

The problem isn't just who writes the contracts. It's privatization and putting health care in harms way of the "market"and profit margins.

Something we ought not do with a vital service. If government can't be trusted to perform this service than why does it exist?

 

[Guest SO1]

1 hour ago, Kopfkino said:

Which is why only the smallest minority in the UK would ever go near a healthcare system like in the US. It's just used as a scare tactic for people playing politics, it has no traction.

Thank God.

[Guest SO1]

1 hour ago, Bryn said:

 

I don't want Pakistani firms bidding for NHS contracts.

 

I definitely don't want US firms bidding for them.

 

Public healthcare in the US is a joke.

The stories here are Legendary. People paid up on their bills and deductibles getting declined or denied care as a matter of fact. Sure everybody has the time to hang out on the phone all day fighting to get the insurance company to cover and pay for what they promised.

The corporations want you to give up and pay the bill. Good luck litigating against some country in Asia or India. And some get surprised about people going postal. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qn16DsftSjI

 

Edited 3 June 2019 by SO1

[Dr The Singh]

47 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said:

Hey no worries! ?

You should do a Buce, and offer to slap him 

[leicsmac]

9 hours ago, Kopfkino said:

What's the risk? The UK government still pays the firms for the provision of services under a contract, people still get those services. Unless you're saying that US firms will just disregard the contract and the law they'll be operating under the same process as EU, Swiss, EEA, Canadian etc firms.

 

The risk is, from my point of view, that those companies get enough clout to convince those in the UK government to go along with similar models to what they use in the US, and members of the government who would like to see such changes would push for measures to allow them to do so.

 

It might be a small risk in the eyes of a lot of people, but given the magnitude of the consequences I think it better that the chance not be taken at all if other options are available, unless those firms come to the table offering a mighty big carrot in return.

[Guest MattP]

Depressing how any conversation on the NHS turns into a "we can't touch it or it will be like the USA" argument. 

 

There are plenty of models in between that produce far better results than both.

[Nick]

58 minutes ago, MattP said:

Depressing how any conversation on the NHS turns into a "we can't touch it or it will be like the USA" argument. 

 

There are plenty of models in between that produce far better results than both.

I agree - but we need a party that will employ those models. Not just privatise and hand out contracts to the same failing providers.

[Foxin_Mad]

Also depressing how the leader of her majesty's opposition sees fit not to attend a state banquet with the president of the most powerful country on Earth.

 

Whether you agree with what Trump has done and does, the UK needs a trading relationship with America, upsetting a country where a lot of our trade and investment come from is just dumb. He was democratically elected by the US public. 

 

Corbyn is of course happy to meet with Hezbollah, Hamas, Numerous Russians, The Chinese, South American countries, Iran who all have questionable records with Human rights/equality, the first few are just out right terrorist organisations. 

 

The man is a joke, I have no idea how anyone could put a cross next to the Labour Party with him as leader. 

[ealingfox]

 what a joke.

 

https://amp.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jun/04/change-uk-poised-to-lose-at-least-half-its-mps-heidi-allen-chuka-umunna-lib-dems?utm_term=Autofeed&CMP=twt_gu&utm_medium=&utm_source=Twitter&__twitter_impression=true

[Foxin_Mad]

Never understood why they didn't just join the Lib Dems anyway. They are filling the remain/centre ground already why split the vote?

[Guest MattP]

3 hours ago, Foxin_Mad said:

Also depressing how the leader of her majesty's opposition sees fit not to attend a state banquet with the president of the most powerful country on Earth.

 

Whether you agree with what Trump has done and does, the UK needs a trading relationship with America, upsetting a country where a lot of our trade and investment come from is just dumb. He was democratically elected by the US public. 

 

Corbyn is of course happy to meet with Hezbollah, Hamas, Numerous Russians, The Chinese, South American countries, Iran who all have questionable records with Human rights/equality, the first few are just out right terrorist organisations. 

 

The man is a joke, I have no idea how anyone could put a cross next to the Labour Party with him as leader. 

His cult is probably about 10% of the electorate - I'd imagine the rest who'll vote for him just despise the Tories so much they are prepared to make him Prime Minister.

[Foxin_Mad]

21 minutes ago, MattP said:

His cult is probably about 10% of the electorate - I'd imagine the rest who'll vote for him just despise the Tories so much they are prepared to make him Prime Minister.

Why not vote Lib Dem Instead? Much less offensive. 

 

I can not see how anyone who votes remain can ever vote for them, I don't see how the leavers in the North can vote for them.

 

Having him as Prime Minister is by far the most stupid thing this country could ever do, the damage to wealth and the economy would be far beyond that prophesised over Brexit.