FT General Election Poll 2019

[Voll Blau]

11 hours ago, Beechey said:

They're all unbelievably bad. How cringey is this?

 

 

I love the fact they had to label her.

[Sol thewall Bamba]

13 hours ago, Legend_in_blue said:

 

Can somebody please give me a valid reason for bothering to turn up and vote?

 

Costa is pretty keen on Safe Standing iirc. 

[Sol thewall Bamba]

11 hours ago, David Guiza said:

Some on both sides would applaud 6ft of stacked sh*t if it were wearing the correct ribbon. As has been proven some may argue.

 

I'm so fed up with tribal politics.

 

[Voll Blau]

2 hours ago, Mike Oxlong said:

JE - Does the truth matter in this election ? 
 

BJ - I think it does 

 

Ladies and gentleman, I give you Fact Check Uk - an independent, impartial and reliable service to ensure that you are getting the truth from your politicians - apparently 

 

That's the most alarming thing to come out of last night. If you vote Tory you should be at the very least embarrassed, if not outright appalled, at a stunt like that.

[Mike Oxlong]

Just now, Voll Blau said:

 

That's the most alarming thing to come out of last night. If you vote Tory you should be at the very least embarrassed, if not outright appalled, at a stunt like that.

You’d think they might have learnt their lesson after the Starmer video edit ! 

[Jon the Hat]

8 minutes ago, Voll Blau said:

 

That's the most alarming thing to come out of last night. If you vote Tory you should be at the very least embarrassed, if not outright appalled, at a stunt like that.

It was daft I’ll give you that,  but I don’t think anyone was taken in by it do you?

[Voll Blau]

1 hour ago, Mike Oxlong said:

You’d think they might have learnt their lesson after the Starmer video edit ! 

I think they're past the point of caring now. More depressingly, I think most voters are too...

 

Twitter say it's their last warning, and I hope they mean that.  It's beyond the stage of being "just not on", it's downright wrong.

[Voll Blau]

1 hour ago, Jon the Hat said:

It was daft I’ll give you that,  but I don’t think anyone was taken in by it do you?

Something being "daft" would be a mistake, and Cleverly has already defended the decision. This was a deliberate attempt to mislead, which is how Twitter has seen it.

 

You're right in saying most wouldn't get taken in by it, but we all know idiots who'll believe and share anything they see on social media (goes for people on the left too). There's simply no other explanation for it than they were hoping to get a few people too ignorant or thick to perform basic checks on the source of the information to nod their heads in agreement and share the tweets.

[Nick]

From the Lib Dem tweet to the Tory factshit, the level of integrity in British politics is absolutely rock bottom disgusting. Have they not learnt anything from lies on red buses and instead just gone to the Trump school of inventing a truth, ignoring anything else and when it becomes particularly threatening, just discrediting it by labelling it fake news?

 

How the fvck has British politics and British politicians become this low. This isn’t an election, it’s like choosing between two dying dogs which one to euthanise and which to die slowly, painfully and publicly.

Edited 20 November 2019 by Nick

[Jon the Hat]

37 minutes ago, Voll Blau said:

Something being "daft" would be a mistake, and Cleverly has already defended the decision. This was a deliberate attempt to mislead, which is how Twitter has seen it.

 

You're right in saying most wouldn't get taken in by it, but we all know idiots who'll believe and share anything they see on social media (goes for people on the left too). There's simply no other explanation for it than they were hoping to get a few people too ignorant or thick to perform basic checks on the source of the information to nod their heads in agreement and share the tweets.

Daft as in they thought it was a good idea, and it was a stupid idea, as it was always going to come back and bite them.  I doubt they were hoping that, they probably thought those who follow a press twitter account would get the joke.  Like I said, daft idea.

[Jon the Hat]

Just now, Swan Lesta said:

From the Lib Dem tweet to the Tory factshit they level of integrity in British politics is absolutely rock bottom disgusting. Have they not learnt anything from lies on red buses and instead just gone to the Trump school of inventing a truth, ignoring anything else and when it becomes particularly threatening, just discrediting it by labelling it fake news?

 

How the fvck has British politics and British politicians become this low. This isn’t an election, it’s like choosing between two dying dogs which one to euthanise and which to die slowly, painfully and publicly.

It really isn't anything like Trump level of nonsense.  Unless you count Corbyn STILL trying to make out the Conservatives are going to sell the NHS, whatever the hell that even means.  Not happening, and they know it isn't.

[StanSP]

3 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

Daft as in they thought it was a good idea, and it was a stupid idea, as it was always going to come back and bite them.  I doubt they were hoping that, they probably thought those who follow a press twitter account would get the joke.  Like I said, daft idea.

And just a purely pointless thing to do. 

[Jon the Hat]

Just now, StanSP said:

And just a purely pointless thing to do. 

They must have hired the PR guy who quit Prince Andrew's office on Friday.

[SMX11]

1 hour ago, Alf Bentley said:

Last night was no game-changer, then. In the short-term, that helps Johnson as it's Corbyn who needs to shift the polls/expectations.

 

Although last night won't shift many votes, it could help Corbyn further down the line - but only if something else changes the game.

I should think that many undecided voters would have been surprised that Corbyn seemed more competent than they expected - or, at least, not someone noticeably worse than Boris or completely beyond the pale.

But that only helps Labour if those voters are given some other reason to seriously consider voting Labour, be that a popular manifesto or Johnson disgracing himself or alienating voters.

 

Mainly, though, I was amazed at the issues that weren't discussed at all, or only superficially in passing:

- economy, personal tax (only corporation tax discussed, not income tax, VAT, inheritance tax?), education, crime, immigration, defence, foreign policy (apart from Brexit)..... 

 

Would be interesting to know what swing voters thought of Johnson, particularly how he kept returning to the Brexit issue & kept over-running his allotted time (Corbyn did, too, but not so much).

Most viewers will have approved or disapproved according to their intended voting preferences, but would be interesting to know about neutrals.

If Boris keeps getting the "get Brexit done" message across, it helps him to an extent.....but there's a limit beyond which he could alienate people, especially if he avoids other questions & blusters away... 

 

It is the same with any televised 'debate' they have too short of time to discuss a single subject and then devolves into soundbites and consequently interruptions from the moderator. Would much prefer a sit down format with Andrew Neil or similar scrutinising their manifestos for an hour or 2. Perhaps have a generic big picture one with the leaders but also have the relevant ministers discussing economic policy, home affairs etc for extended period to flesh out policy and ideas. It isn't a presidential election and the front benches need scrutiny as well as both sides look weak to me.

[Voll Blau]

1 hour ago, Jon the Hat said:

Daft as in they thought it was a good idea, and it was a stupid idea, as it was always going to come back and bite them.  I doubt they were hoping that, they probably thought those who follow a press twitter account would get the joke.  Like I said, daft idea.

You're being too kind. Cleverly has already offered up an official explanation, and it wasn't that.

[StanSP]

15 minutes ago, Voll Blau said:

You're being too kind. Cleverly has already offered up an official explanation, and it wasn't that.

And Raab saying apparently noone cares about the 'social media cut and thrust'. 

 

They just don't get it do they? 

[RoboFox]

Just when I thought UK politics couldn't get any lower. 

 

The Fact Check debacle undermined democracy. Its sole purpose was to deceive, and undermine the veracity of genuine fact-checkers. It's morally bankrupt at best, criminal at worst.

 

They have no problem demanding that social media platforms end disinformation when it suits them, yet they pull this. It's desperate, it's the sort of shit I wouldn't even expect from Trump's clowns in the US, and it's a total dystopian fvcking nightmare.

 

Last night, Johnson had the audacity to say that "the truth matters" (at which point the audience openly laughed at him, BTW). Him and his party are lying fvcking scum, and this country is fvcked.

 

Edited 20 November 2019 by RoboFox

[Voll Blau]

1 hour ago, StanSP said:

And Raab saying apparently noone cares about the 'social media cut and thrust'. 

 

They just don't get it do they? 

They do get it though, that's the problem. They know exactly what they're doing, and very few journalists (it would be unfair to say none at all) seem to be calling them out on such blatant contradictions like that.

[David Guiza]

I've seen posts on social media with thousands of interactions that are clearly untrue, but people have gobbled them up. I remember seeing a picture doing the rounds during the US election of Hilary Clinton and Osama Bin Laden that thousands seemingly believed to be true, for example. 

 

This week alone numerous people were convinced that Greta Thunberg is an alien thanks to a 'photograph' taken 100 years ago, so of course some people would have seen the posts in question and believed them instantly. 

 

"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act"

[EnderbyFox]

 

[leicsmac]

49 minutes ago, David Guiza said:

I've seen posts on social media with thousands of interactions that are clearly untrue, but people have gobbled them up. I remember seeing a picture doing the rounds during the US election of Hilary Clinton and Osama Bin Laden that thousands seemingly believed to be true, for example. 

 

This week alone numerous people were convinced that Greta Thunberg is an alien thanks to a 'photograph' taken 100 years ago, so of course some people would have seen the posts in question and believed them instantly. 

 

"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act"

 

"The different cardinal truths neither clash nor mesh. No one is invalidated, but nobody is right."

[Guest MattP]

2 hours ago, Voll Blau said:

That's the most alarming thing to come out of last night. If you vote Tory you should be at the very least embarrassed, if not outright appalled, at a stunt like that.

Of course we are, it's shameful we've ended up with this. As I'm sure the other side are embarrassed they have to go out and vote for an incompetent hard left idiot who has let antisemitism flourish in his own party and seemingly thrown his support behind every failed regime on the planet.

 

We all know this election is about choosing the better of two shit options.

 

Although the "fact check" was actually correct How did Corbyn not know the DUP had voted against the deal? 

Edited 20 November 2019 by MattP

[David Guiza]

2 minutes ago, MattP said:

Of course we are, it's shameful we've ended up with this. As I'm sure the other side are embarrassed they have to go out and vote for an incompetent hard left idiot who has let antisemitism flourish in his own party and seemingly thrown his support behind every failed regime on the planet.

 

We all know this election is about choosing the better of two shit options.

 

Although the "fact check" was actually correct How did Corbyn not know the DUP had voted against the deal? 

Regarding the DUP - it did make me chuckle when Boris was bleating on about the possibility of Labour clamoring to the SNP for power, given that the Tories handed Queen Herod £1bn to stay in power.  

[Guest MattP]

5 minutes ago, David Guiza said:

Regarding the DUP - it did make me chuckle when Boris was bleating on about the possibility of Labour clamoring to the SNP for power, given that the Tories handed Queen Herod £1bn to stay in power.  

And that's exactly what Corbyn will have to do as well if he wants to be PM. Because he isn't winning a majority.

[Rusko187]

Only 1 man for the job!