Statement from Foxes Trust regarding the FA Cup Final 2021

[Foxes_Trust]

Just 57% of tickets have been allocated to supporters. Foxes Trust and Chelsea Supporters’ Trust agree that this is unacceptable......

 

Statement from Foxes Trust regarding the FA Cup Final 2021 – Foxes Trust

[King of Gipsy Lane]

Well said 

Edited 6 May 2021 by King of Gipsy Lane

[st albans fox]

maybe they should have asked the university and those responsible for the test event evaluation before issuing the statement ?

 

semi final was all neutrals only with 4K fans 

 

League cup final was 8 k fans with 4K non neutral

 

cup final is 21k fans with 12.5k non neutral 

 

after the cup final the road map changes and as a result, stadia can have 25% occupancy  (but still no away fans) in may. 

 

they trust recognise that it’s a test event (driving data to assist wider re opening beyond may) - it seems pretty obvious that having different ‘groups’ in the stadiums provides for assessing how the groups behave and the risks of possible transmission.  Remember that this study will be used for the future when cases may well begin to increase again and we won’t just want stadia shut down again in response. 
 

the question about allocations for the fa cup final is a valid one but applying it to this particular one is isn’t. 

 

 

[jonthefox]

There is no criticism implied of Leicester City Football Club, who have dealt with the ticket allocation at short notice and have mitigated some of the travel costs imposed on our supporters.

 

 How much was the bus supposed to be then?

[Pliskin]

It is a disgrace. On the governments behalf or whoever made the decision not to give the clubs full allocation. If they wanted to give tickets to NHS staff I’m sure there is probably 6,000 here in Leicester that would have gladly accepted the offer. Sure a more realistic look at where we are with covid would be to have 12,000 travel from Leicester? Toss pot idea.....

[Footballwipe]

52 minutes ago, jonthefox said:

There is no criticism implied of Leicester City Football Club, who have dealt with the ticket allocation at short notice and have mitigated some of the travel costs imposed on our supporters.

 

 How much was the bus supposed to be then?

Quite. Was the bus £46? Was it £65? Even £100 before the subsidy. We have no idea, and the astronomical cost has no context in terms of the mitigation if we don't know what it originally was meant to be. Was this asked of the club? If not, why not. If so and you weren't told, could this be a bit of information you include. Context and openness is everything.

 

I note that a statement was released in advance of the Semi-Final calling for an even split in allocations. It talks about wanting the "backing of all fellow Premier League fans groups and also for the clubs involved to lobby the FA directly on ticket allocations." What happened here? There was no follow up to this. Did anyone get in touch? What direct contact was made or attempted with the FA to find this information out?

 

Again, if no one gave a shit, come out and say, express disappointment. The statement in the first post expresses platitudes of disappointment, but doesn't try to explain what the Trust have tried to do proactively to fight this, other than a press release and "calling on fan groups."

 

Are the Foxes Trust the weakest, meekest Supporters Trust in the Premier League? Just like the Supporters Club, it seems to be a cosy cartel of middle class, aging Leicester City fans who release the odd statement, have the odd meeting with club bods and have little to zero actual impact.

[Freeman's Wharfer]

Before anyone commends the Foxes Trust for this statement, take the time to go and read the Chelsea Supporters Trust statement.

 

Both start the same and use the exact same language throughout the majority of the statement but the Foxes Trust one is toned down and softened massively.

 

”No criticism implied of Leicester City Football Club”... I mean, does that sound like a supporters trust prepared to challenge the club or push hard on important issues?

 

I get that a lot of the decisions around this event were made in line with being a test event but let’s not pretend the club weren’t in discussions and didn’t have an opportunity to influence hugely. If Man City can come out of the same sort of discussions with three travel options for their fans, why couldn’t we?
 

The Foxes Trust are now deficient as an organisation. It served a purpose to try and help save the club at the time it did but it’s now just a band of yes men who have zero influence and are likely made to feel they are involved because the club know they’ll never truly challenge them on anything.

Time to move aside and let Union FS take it from here, guys. In just a few years I can mention so many notable things they’ve done as a group despite Foxes Trust having a 15+ year head start; food banks, tifos, pushing the club on safe-standing and ticket prices/policy. I honestly couldn’t mention one notable thing the Foxes Trust has achieved in all that time.

[Guest Lako42]

Most limp wristed statement imaginable. 

 

Get stuck into them for **** sake.

 

I bet the FA are trembling after reading that. 

[davieG]

15 minutes ago, Freeman's Wharfer said:

Before anyone commends the Foxes Trust for this statement, take the time to go and read the Chelsea Supporters Trust statement.

 

Both start the same and use the exact same language throughout the majority of the statement but the Foxes Trust one is toned down and softened massively.

 

”No criticism implied of Leicester City Football Club”... I mean, does that sound like a supporters trust prepared to challenge the club or push hard on important issues?

 

I get that a lot of the decisions around this event were made in line with being a test event but let’s not pretend the club weren’t in discussions and didn’t have an opportunity to influence hugely. If Man City can come out of the same sort of discussions with three travel options for their fans, why couldn’t we?
 

The Foxes Trust are now deficient as an organisation. It served a purpose to try and help save the club at the time it did but it’s now just a band of yes men who have zero influence and are likely made to feel they are involved because the club know they’ll never truly challenge them on anything.

Time to move aside and let Union FS take it from here, guys. In just a few years I can mention so many notable things they’ve done as a group despite Foxes Trust having a 15+ year head start; food banks, tifos, pushing the club on safe-standing and ticket prices/policy. I honestly couldn’t mention one notable thing the Foxes Trust has achieved in all that time.

Or maybe members of Union FS and others with strong feelings should join Foxes Trust and propel them from within considering their recognised status as a Trust in football and the FFS.

[foxinsocks]

9 minutes ago, davieG said:

Or maybe members of Union FS and others with strong feelings should join Foxes Trust and propel them from within considering their recognised status as a Trust in football and the FFS.

it seem reasonable that we should have more than one supporters group - where is the  Union FS statement on this subject?

 

[goose2010]

29 minutes ago, Lako42 said:

Most limp wristed statement imaginable. 

 

Get stuck into them for **** sake.

 

I bet the FA are trembling after reading that. 

This fixture is bigger than the FA. I would say they have zero input for this game. 

 

People were never going to be happy but let's be honest if this goes well it will help the whole football community across the UK start to get back to normality. Not just the premier league but the likes of Hinckley, Barwell, Coalville get fans back into their grounds spending money and keeping them afloat. 

 

It is a bit of sods law that we are in it for the first time in a lot of our life times but if this means that this game ticks a few scientists boxes and we can get back to full capacity along with fans in all grounds in the country in August then its a sacrifice both Chelsea and Leicester fans should make. 

 

It's massively frustrating but in a way the country is waiting with baited breath for the results of this 'event' 

 

It's actually out of order for the the trusts to complain. We are ahead of the likes of Spain, Italy, France etc. All their finals are behind closed doors still so maybe just cut the powers above Leicester and FA a bit of slack and realise that it's actually a stepping stone to actually getting the KP full for the first game of the season next year! 

 

[davieG]

2 minutes ago, foxinsocks said:

it seem reasonable that we should have more than one supporters group - where is the  Union FS statement on this subject?

 

Quite as they all serve different functions but if people want the Foxes Trust to be more dynamic and to push harder for change then they should join it and change it from within.

 

I suspect part of the problem is, as we've seen on here in the SL thread that people are reluctant to be critical of our owners who are by most people's view way above other owners in their ownership of the club and it's supporters. But there are areas where they lag behind other clubs.

[volpeazzurro]

2 hours ago, jonthefox said:

There is no criticism implied of Leicester City Football Club, who have dealt with the ticket allocation at short notice and have mitigated some of the travel costs imposed on our supporters.

 

 How much was the bus supposed to be then?

My thoughts entirely. £45 for a bus ticket that should be charged at a maximum £25-£30 is hardly mitigation. National express to London return is around £15 for reasonably timed journeys and considerably less if willing to travel at other times. 

[walkerleeds]

6 minutes ago, davieG said:

Quite as they all serve different functions but if people want the Foxes Trust to be more dynamic and to push harder for change then they should join it and change it from within.

 

I suspect part of the problem is, as we've seen on here in the SL thread that people are reluctant to be critical of our owners who are by most people's view way above other owners in their ownership of the club and it's supporters. But there are areas where they lag behind other clubs.

 

Logistically how do you think that would work? 

 

Union FS seem to want to make change and actively demonstrate it, whereas Foxes Trust want to put out the odd flimsy statement which only serves as a reminder they still exist. 

 

Two different ideologies ultimately.

[foxinsocks]

7 minutes ago, davieG said:

Quite as they all serve different functions but if people want the Foxes Trust to be more dynamic and to push harder for change then they should join it and change it from within.

 

I suspect part of the problem is, as we've seen on here in the SL thread that people are reluctant to be critical of our owners who are by most people's view way above other owners in their ownership of the club and it's supporters. But there are areas where they lag behind other clubs.

I differentiate between the owners and the operational decisions - e.g. the aggressive retailing at the shop

 

IMO the club have hidden behind the establish away ticketing scheme practices to avoid making any decision.  Yet this is not an away match - it is at a neutral venue.  Many long term ST holder have been excluded from the FA cup final... yet they have paid for 20 tickets per year, in advance, guaranteeing income and making that commitment to attend and support the team - plus joining the cup scheme. Members were give their usual ballot - the net effect is that these member had more change of getting a ticket than people who have had an ST for 40 years.

 

I presume the high coach cos is because the coaches are not full - but again it would have been helpful to subsidize these... BTW: where are the FA on "twenty is plenty" for the fans?

[Freeman's Wharfer]

12 minutes ago, walkerleeds said:

 

Logistically how do you think that would work? 

 

Union FS seem to want to make change and actively demonstrate it, whereas Foxes Trust want to put out the odd flimsy statement which only serves as a reminder they still exist. 

 

Two different ideologies ultimately.

Exactly. They wouldn’t be welcomed in the Foxes Trust (who might say they are but their appetite for change are entirely different) as they’re from completely different starting points.

 

Why should the Foxes Trust get to maintain recognised trust status when they’re doing nothing to earn that?

 

I’d like to think that our prominent and most recognised supporters group should be the one with a track record of doing things for the fans and community, who aren’t afraid to challenge the club and/or governing bodies. 
 

Why should a limp organisation like the Foxes Trust get to maintain their privileges just because they’ve been round longer?

[davieG]

11 minutes ago, walkerleeds said:

 

Logistically how do you think that would work? 

 

Union FS seem to want to make change and actively demonstrate it, whereas Foxes Trust want to put out the odd flimsy statement which only serves as a reminder they still exist. 

 

Two different ideologies ultimately.

The FT are the officially recognised supports organisation for contact with the Club, FA and are part of the FFA. Trusts themselves are seen as the way forward by those that want to see change. People are complaining that our Trust is not doing enough so I repeat if those people want the FT to do more then they should join and change it from within.

 

Maybe Union FS would have a better chance of influencing the Club with the changes they want if some of their members were also in the FT.

 

I'm not the one complaining I'm just offering a way forward for those that are.

[Sol thewall Bamba]

24 minutes ago, davieG said:

Quite as they all serve different functions but if people want the Foxes Trust to be more dynamic and to push harder for change then they should join it and change it from within.

 

I suspect part of the problem is, as we've seen on here in the SL thread that people are reluctant to be critical of our owners who are by most people's view way above other owners in their ownership of the club and it's supporters. But there are areas where they lag behind other clubs.

This is a good point, either try and influence an existing Supporter's Group, or start your own if there aren't any that you fancy.

 

31 minutes ago, foxinsocks said:

it seem reasonable that we should have more than one supporters group - where is the  Union FS statement on this subject?

Incoming, but will be slight change of tack with actions being asked of the club not just a "this is bad" type thing. 

[davieG]

13 minutes ago, foxinsocks said:

I differentiate between the owners and the operational decisions - e.g. the aggressive retailing at the shop

 

IMO the club have hidden behind the establish away ticketing scheme practices to avoid making any decision.  Yet this is not an away match - it is at a neutral venue.  Many long term ST holder have been excluded from the FA cup final... yet they have paid for 20 tickets per year, in advance, guaranteeing income and making that commitment to attend and support the team - plus joining the cup scheme. Members were give their usual ballot - the net effect is that these member had more change of getting a ticket than people who have had an ST for 40 years.

 

I presume the high coach cos is because the coaches are not full - but again it would have been helpful to subsidize these... BTW: where are the FA on "twenty is plenty" for the fans?

Well join the FT and become one of the negotiators then if you feel this strongly. Moaning on FoxesTalk will get people nowhere.

 

 

[davieG]

5 minutes ago, Freeman's Wharfer said:

Exactly. They wouldn’t be welcomed in the Foxes Trust (who might say they are but their appetite for change are entirely different) as they’re from completely different starting points.

 

Why should the Foxes Trust get to maintain recognised trust status when they’re doing nothing to earn that?

 

I’d like to think that our prominent and most recognised supporters group should be the one with a track record of doing things for the fans and community, who aren’t afraid to challenge the club and/or governing bodies. 
 

Why should a limp organisation like the Foxes Trust get to maintain their privileges just because they’ve been round longer?

If enough people joined, the board is voted on by 1 member 1 vote. So that's no excuse.

[foxinsocks]

5 minutes ago, davieG said:

Well join the FT and become one of the negotiators then if you feel this strongly. Moaning on FoxesTalk will get people nowhere.

 

 

I was in the fans consultative group - never impressed by FT.  I am still unsure as to why the club dropped it.  I expect there would be a right old tussle moving the old guard on form the FT.

 

NB: I was trying to show that disagreeing with the  club's operational decision is not the same as dissing the owners - and I think there are some reasonable positions that might question the correctness of the clubs decisions.  

 

IMO To engage with the  breadth of the supporter then the clubs should engage with FT as well Union FS...

 

[davieG]

29 minutes ago, foxinsocks said:

I was in the fans consultative group - never impressed by FT.  I am still unsure as to why the club dropped it.  I expect there would be a right old tussle moving the old guard on form the FT.

 

NB: I was trying to show that disagreeing with the  club's operational decision is not the same as dissing the owners - and I think there are some reasonable positions that might question the correctness of the clubs decisions.  

 

IMO To engage with the  breadth of the supporter then the clubs should engage with FT as well Union FS...

 

I'm not disagreeing with anyone's view of the owners I've criticised them myself  on the lack of LCFC related visuals outside and inside the stadium with too much emphasis on King Power. But I'm way to old to get involved now.

 

I'm trying to be Devil's Advocate and offering a way forward.

 

They already engage with the FT and the Supporters Group, I'm sure they don't want to involve lots of groups. Surely it would be better for fans to influence the FT to achieve what they want as Supporters Trusts are seen by the Football hierarchy as the official communication channels. People on here were comparing our FT with other clubs Trusts I think that suggests that Trusts are still the way to go.

 

I'd put money on the government, if they should decide on fan's representatives on Boards they would stipulate that it is done through Supporters Trusts where they exist.

[Robo61]

3 hours ago, volpeazzurro said:

My thoughts entirely. £45 for a bus ticket that should be charged at a maximum £25-£30 is hardly mitigation. National express to London return is around £15 for reasonably timed journeys and considerably less if willing to travel at other times. 

You do know LCFC are a football club and not a bus company.  Whether we like it or not the club were negotiating with coach companies in a sellers market due to having to source circa 200 buses with less that 2 weeks notice. 

[jammie82uk]

6 minutes ago, Robo61 said:

You do know LCFC are a football club and not a bus company.  Whether we like it or not the club were negotiating with coach companies in a sellers market due to having to source circa 200 buses with less that 2 weeks notice. 

Is it really going to cost near £200,000 to provide these coaches tho?

[volpeazzurro]

3 minutes ago, Robo61 said:

You do know LCFC are a football club and not a bus company.  Whether we like it or not the club were negotiating with coach companies in a sellers market due to having to source circa 200 buses with less that 2 weeks notice. 

Yes, fully aware of that but, when you have a customer base for a day of up to 6000 people plus potential ongoing business once covid restrictions are lifted, I'd say that Leicester City are in quite a powerful negotiating position wouldn’t you? If you think of the ongoing business Woods, Ausden Clark or whoever have had via Leicester City for years they'd be churlish to dump in their own nest for a quick profit and potentially lose such lucrative contracts next season and onwards. I'm sure there'd be other companies more than willing to pick up the slack if they got dumped.