Does anyone actually know anything about the finances?

[Les-TA-Jon]

14 minutes ago, cityfanlee23 said:

From listening to people like Kevin Maguire and some of the more finance-savvy members on here, I think we are in a financial mess, but not so much of a mess that it cannot be fixed, and I don't expect we will be scratching around in the dirt for free transfers, but this very much relies on a few things, 1) We sell our big players quickly, 2) We get a fee for them that would align with market value, 3) we get promoted within a couple of seasons. 

In my opinion, shedding 40-50m from the wage budget from our out-of-contract players leaving, selling some key assets like Madders, Barnes and probably players like Soumare, Praet and Nacho, alongside parachute payments and we will be in a position to buy some young hungry players with a point to prove like Elanga. I would expect us to maybe spend £20-30m on key signings, we already have a core squad good enough to fight for promotion.

But this is speculation from my side. 

Agree - but less so on this - if we do the above it leaves us with 8 senior outfield players

 

Thomas, Justin, Daka, Pereira, Dewsbury-Hall, Faes, Souttar and Kristiansen

 

 

[coolhandfox]

Whilst financial we will be hit hard we have enought sellable asset to work it though.

 

The wages bill will he massively reduced with the out of contract players 20m alone.

 

I also expect to bring in between 50m-100m in sales, which will also reduce wages some more.

[sacreblueits442]

1 hour ago, Bats8711 said:

Not sure why anybody would be giving the club the benefit of the doubt when it comes to having relegation wage clauses in effect (or anything). Maybe for some of the newer signings - but unless there’s some kind of official source I haven’t seen, there’s no way you’ll convince me players like Vardy, Maddison, Barnes, even Ricardo had clauses. 

...I can understand the reluctance to accept that there are relegation clauses in our players' existing contracts!!!

Going by what this club chooses to do, regarding our players and protecting them has always been the club's default stance. Having a relegation clause may be prudent, but from what we have witnessed over the years, we probably believed we could ride the loss of revenue should the worse thing happen.

  Let us hope that there are clauses in their contracts, but our failure to adequately plan for the future is there for all to see.

[st albans fox]

10 minutes ago, sacreblueits442 said:

...I can understand the reluctance to accept that there are relegation clauses in our players' existing contracts!!!

Going by what this club chooses to do, regarding our players and protecting them has always been the club's default stance. Having a relegation clause may be prudent, but from what we have witnessed over the years, we probably believed we could ride the loss of revenue should the worse thing happen.

  Let us hope that there are clauses in their contracts, but our failure to adequately plan for the future is there for all to see.

Everyone in football who speaks from a point of knowledge of contracts says that relegation clauses are standard 

 

where I’d make a stab in the dark is that where we are paying what seems to be excessive salaries, there will be a larger correction re relegation clause.  to me that makes some sense - over pay in the PL but protect the club in case of relegation 

[cityfanlee23]

2 hours ago, Les-TA-Jon said:

Agree - but less so on this - if we do the above it leaves us with 8 senior outfield players

 

Thomas, Justin, Daka, Pereira, Dewsbury-Hall, Faes, Souttar and Kristiansen

 

 

Yeah I think it will be a balancing act really, we do have some young players that were not really going to get chances in the premier league who can now get more game time though like Will Alves and Sammy Braybrooke, so hopefully they can step up and alleviate at least some of the desperation to sign players. Both players are highly regarded by the club but given how we've been for the last 18 months neither really got a chance to prove themselves. 

[st albans fox]

4 minutes ago, cityfanlee23 said:

Yeah I think it will be a balancing act really, we do have some young players that were not really going to get chances in the premier league who can now get more game time though like Will Alves and Sammy Braybrooke, so hopefully they can step up and alleviate at least some of the desperation to sign players. Both players are highly regarded by the club but given how we've been for the last 18 months neither really got a chance to prove themselves. 

Wouldn’t have been fair to thrust them into a relegation scrap if they’d been fit 

[cityfanlee23]

Edit:
Wrong thread

Edited 5 June 2023 by cityfanlee23

[Aus Fox]

Does anyone know the actually difference in revenue between the Championship and PL?

With the sale of Maddison and Barnes potentially bringing in £80m, and potentially Castagne and Iheanacho another £20m - add this to the departures of Tielemans, Evans, Bertrand, Soyuncu and Perez all reported to be on big money deals.

Then add the parachute payments coming in.

Are we close to breaking even on what we would have made if we had stayed in the PL?

[Chrysalis]

15 hours ago, Aus Fox said:

Does anyone know the actually difference in revenue between the Championship and PL?

With the sale of Maddison and Barnes potentially bringing in £80m, and potentially Castagne and Iheanacho another £20m - add this to the departures of Tielemans, Evans, Bertrand, Soyuncu and Perez all reported to be on big money deals.

Then add the parachute payments coming in.

Are we close to breaking even on what we would have made if we had stayed in the PL?

On revenue no.

 

Of course with outgoing players and relegation clauses, on profit/loss maybe yes.

[Foxmeister]

On 29/05/2023 at 11:52, Bluearmyfox28 said:

Please explain this to me like I am 10 years old  

Think interest only mortgage

[Freeman's Wharfer]

It’s an interesting question for me: at what point can we start saying ‘no’?

 

We’ve lost Maddison for less than we really should have. Barnes going for less than £45m would be another hit we’d be swallowing.

 

With the relegation clauses reducing wages and a load gone on free transfers, we must surely be at the point of being a little less susceptible to being taken advantage of?

 

This line “if they don’t want to be here, let them go” often gets trotted out in situations like this but I strongly disagree. To the likes of Daka, Faes, Thomas and Dewsbury-Hall: you got us into this mess, now get us out of it.

 

After Barnes goes, I’d also like to think the likes of Ndidi, Iheanacho, Justin and Castagne will only go if we get a genuinely good market value for them. And that not all of them will be allowed to depart.

[Gamble92]

2 hours ago, Freeman's Wharfer said:

It’s an interesting question for me: at what point can we start saying ‘no’?

 

We’ve lost Maddison for less than we really should have. Barnes going for less than £45m would be another hit we’d be swallowing.

 

With the relegation clauses reducing wages and a load gone on free transfers, we must surely be at the point of being a little less susceptible to being taken advantage of?

 

This line “if they don’t want to be here, let them go” often gets trotted out in situations like this but I strongly disagree. To the likes of Daka, Faes, Thomas and Dewsbury-Hall: you got us into this mess, now get us out of it.

 

After Barnes goes, I’d also like to think the likes of Ndidi, Iheanacho, Justin and Castagne will only go if we get a genuinely good market value for them. And that not all of them will be allowed to depart.

I already think we can now. I just think Barnes has asked to go, and they've had a lot of meetings to make sure they change their approach after Tielemans ran down his contract. 

 

 

[UniFox21]

Looks like we've renewed our loan with the Aussie bank 

 

 

[Sly]

[Freeman's Wharfer]

2 hours ago, UniFox21 said:

Looks like we've renewed our loan with the Aussie bank 

 

 

Can anyone explain what this is likely to mean in simple/layman’s terms for those of us without finance knowledge?!

[coolhandfox]

2 minutes ago, Freeman's Wharfer said:

Can anyone explain what this is likely to mean in simple/layman’s terms for those of us without finance knowledge?!

We take out a loan each season for cash flow.

 

As we pay one off we take out another one bit like a pay day loan.

[Paninistickers]

30 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

We take out a loan each season for cash flow.

 

As we pay one off we take out another one bit like a pay day loan.

Correct. Except the loan is based on gauranteed money. 

 

So this deal will be for the money are are due for year 2 of the parachute, which I think is half (45m) ....after that, we are out of options other than player sales

Edited 28 July 2023 by Paninistickers

[coolhandfox]

Just now, Paninistickers said:

Correct. Except the pain is based on gauranteed money. 

 

So this deal will be for the money are are due for year 2 of the parachute, which I think is half (45m) ....after that, we are out of options other than player sales

I assume they are hoping we are back in the PL but then.

[Paninistickers]

Just now, coolhandfox said:

I assume they are hoping we are back in the PL but then.

Exactly. It's classic KP behaviour. They perpetually roll the dice and when out of money, find something, somehow and keep rolling the dice

[coolhandfox]

7 minutes ago, Paninistickers said:

Exactly. It's classic KP behaviour. They perpetually roll the dice and when out of money, find something, somehow and keep rolling the dice

How we have financed thing isn't the issue.

 

It the money we have wasted 60m in one window with the likes of Daka, Soumare, Vesty etc.

 

Plus losing 60m worth of talent for free.