All eyes on the Loanees

[Mort]

we should recall the lot and start preparing for next season now

Lets stay up for now... the likes of Shush!, Dodds and Logan anit comming back... Gradel though has got to have earnt his chance, at the very least during pre-season.

[Zingari]

gradel seems to be troubling a lot of defenders ,

http://www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/sport/...64375-20668014/

[Ric Flair]

gradel seems to be troubling a lot of defenders ,

http://www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/sport/...64375-20668014/

One of only few reasons why i'm looking forward to next season.

[Manwell Pablo]

I know Im suppose to mention him but did anyone watch Leeds Walsall on Saturday?? Shush! did alright, didn't really stand out.

**Disclaimer, Thracian is not allowed to reply to this post.

[Father Ted]

I know Im suppose to mention him but did anyone watch Leeds Walsall on Saturday?? Shush! did alright, didn't really stand out.

**Disclaimer, Thracian is not allowed to reply to this post.

[Thracian]

I know Im suppose to mention him but did anyone watch Leeds Walsall on Saturday?? Shush! did alright, didn't really stand out.

**Disclaimer, Thracian is not allowed to reply to this post.

:D

Thracian well knows that he won't convince any of the many fans who are as committed to experience as Holloway. But then he doesn't really need to.

Our tumble into the relegation zone on the back of our pitiful results since we either sidelined or denied ourselves the chance of using Shush!, Gradel, Wesolowski, Beswick and King has been there for all to see - as has our lack of goals.

It is so ironic that even now we are searching for yet another striker when Gradel, King and Beswick could well have helped the ones we've got no end, together with some decent free kicks instead of the shit we've had since Christmas.

[Manwell Pablo]

:D

Thracian well knows that he won't convince any of the many fans who are as committed to experience as Holloway. But then he doesn't really need to.

Our tumble into the relegation zone on the back of our pitiful results since we either sidelined or denied ourselves the chance of using Shush!, Gradel, Wesolowski, Beswick and King has been there for all to see - as has our lack of goals.

It is so ironic that even now we are searching for yet another striker when Gradel, King and Beswick could well have helped the ones we've got no end, together with some decent free kicks instead of the shit we've had since Christmas.

I don't think anyone is arguing with you over Gradel Thracian.

[Koke]

I'll give you King and Gradel, everybody would want them involved, especially Gradel. I don't know much about Beswick - and Wesolowski isn't a potential goal scorer. Alan Shush! is a LB and is a position we are least worried about. And the lad is poppycock anyway how ever much you love him.

Having said that, you somehow seem convinced that if we had played those said kids we would not be fighting against relegation. I'm not so sure. Or maybe I've misunderstood you.

[bigneville]

:D

Thracian well knows that he won't convince any of the many fans who are as committed to experience as Holloway. But then he doesn't really need to.

Our tumble into the relegation zone on the back of our pitiful results since we either sidelined or denied ourselves the chance of using Shush!, Gradel, Wesolowski, Beswick and King has been there for all to see - as has our lack of goals.

It is so ironic that even now we are searching for yet another striker when Gradel, King and Beswick could well have helped the ones we've got no end, together with some decent free kicks instead of the shit we've had since Christmas.

I'm not being funny or anything.

But in your opinion, would playing these youngters see a serious rise in the table? If so how far?

I also don't know much about Beswick, and i agree with Manwell, that Gradel for me without a doubt should be back at the club and playing for us.

But i'm interested to know what kind of improvement you would see from playing these youngsters?

[Thracian]

I'm not being funny or anything.

But in your opinion, would playing these youngters see a serious rise in the table? If so how far?

I also don't know much about Beswick, and i agree with Manwell, that Gradel for me without a doubt should be back at the club and playing for us.

But i'm interested to know what kind of improvement you would see from playing these youngsters?

Right now a serious rise in the table is anything that sees us out of the relegation places at 4.50 pm on the last day of the season.

And in my view the players I've mentioned would have made all the difference and that's not in hindsight, I explained what would happen at New Year when the blinkered drive towards experience started, just like last year.

Don't think I had used all the youing players in the team all the time or at once. I wouldn't. But the are two big reasons for believing as I do.

Our big need is for some goals to be scored or created from other parts of the pitch to supplement anything we get from the main strikers. So, ignoring the strikers what's happened?

a) We've chosen to blood a series of relatively inexperienced strangers anyway - Bori, Laczko, Etuhu. We've also brought in Clapham and Hendrie. Goals as a result? None from any of them. Assists? One by Hendrie and none by all the rest put together. Consequence? Seven goalless games out of 15 since January 19 and seven defeats.

b) Gradel has scored seven goals in 28 appearances or 1 every 4, a brilliant return for a genuine winger in his first senior season. He's also had four assists meaning 11 direct contributions to goals in those 28 games or one every 2.5 games roughly. We'll have had 16 games since January 1 come Saturday so Gradel might have been expected to have a hand in, say, six or seven goals in that time and those figures don't consider secondary assists.

c) Shush! remains second in our assists table and he scored two and made five officially in 24 appearances or one direct contribution every 3.5 games approximately. Again that takes ignores the many other near things Shush! created but , even based on official figures we might have expected another four goals resulting from his efforts.

That's a total of 10 goals, quite enough to have given us several more points and to have kept us clear of the relegation places even without counting anything from King who's scored almost every game he's played for the reserves and Academy since Christmas and has regularly provided final passes for goals. On top of that he's a quick passer and can be used in defence or attack according to necessity and particularly for arriving late in the box, something none of our other midfielders ever seem to do.

Beswick's much like King, he's forever scoring and creating something and I just cannot see how he could possibly have been less effective than anyone else we've used on the left flank. Beswick is a simple, efficient and intelligent footballer who has played a major part in the Academy's success. And he takes excellent free-kicks.

That leaves Weso and someone's said he's not a goalscorer. No he's not but he's an excellent passer and just the chirpy sort of character who knows these players well and can help bring the best out of them because he plays their type of football. Weso was by far our best midfielder for the first five matches of the season before he got injured and he's been sadly missed.

The players I've mentioned wouldn't have needed time to integrate because they know their team-mates and have trained with the first team constantly. They are also used to winning which is important because it breeds confidence.

Had we put those players with the likes of Hendrie, Oakley, Etuhu (maybe) and Howard - and used them regularly and sensibly, I am quite sure we would have done fine and saved ourselves a lot of expense, needless experiment and disappointment as well.

That's my case and it adds up pretty convincingly as far as I can see.

[lookwhaticando]

:D

Thracian well knows that he won't convince any of the many fans who are as committed to experience as Holloway. But then he doesn't really need to.

Take note everyone... for today was the day that Thracian revealed his true identity.

Arise, Sir Micky of Adams.

[Father Ted]

:D

Thracian well knows that he won't convince any of the many fans who are as committed to experience as Holloway. But then he doesn't really need to.

Our tumble into the relegation zone on the back of our pitiful results since we either sidelined or denied ourselves the chance of using Shush!, Gradel, Wesolowski, Beswick and King has been there for all to see - as has our lack of goals.

It is so ironic that even now we are searching for yet another striker when Gradel, King and Beswick could well have helped the ones we've got no end, together with some decent free kicks instead of the shit we've had since Christmas.

Gradel and Weso should definitely be in and around the first team no doubt. King though i'm not too sure, he was brought in through an injury crisis and I believe that when he came in he did a good job but was still a bit lightweight but in 2 years he will definitely be running around the pitch on a saturday with the likes of Stearman and Mattock.

[bigneville]

Right now a serious rise in the table is anything that sees us out of the relegation places at 4.50 pm on the last day of the season.

And in my view the players I've mentioned would have made all the difference and that's not in hindsight, I explained what would happen at New Year when the blinkered drive towards experience started, just like last year.

Don't think I had used all the youing players in the team all the time or at once. I wouldn't. But the are two big reasons for believing as I do.

Our big need is for some goals to be scored or created from other parts of the pitch to supplement anything we get from the main strikers. So, ignoring the strikers what's happened?

a) We've chosen to blood a series of relatively inexperienced strangers anyway - Bori, Laczko, Etuhu. We've also brought in Clapham and Hendrie. Goals as a result? None from any of them. Assists? One by Hendrie and none by all the rest put together. Consequence? Seven goalless games out of 15 since January 19 and seven defeats.

b) Gradel has scored seven goals in 28 appearances or 1 every 4, a brilliant return for a genuine winger in his first senior season. He's also had four assists meaning 11 direct contributions to goals in those 28 games or one every 2.5 games roughly. We'll have had 16 games since January 1 come Saturday so Gradel might have been expected to have a hand in, say, six or seven goals in that time and those figures don't consider secondary assists.

c) Shush! remains second in our assists table and he scored two and made five officially in 24 appearances or one direct contribution every 3.5 games approximately. Again that takes ignores the many other near things Shush! created but , even based on official figures we might have expected another four goals resulting from his efforts.

That's a total of 10 goals, quite enough to have given us several more points and to have kept us clear of the relegation places even without counting anything from King who's scored almost every game he's played for the reserves and Academy since Christmas and has regularly provided final passes for goals. On top of that he's a quick passer and can be used in defence or attack according to necessity and particularly for arriving late in the box, something none of our other midfielders ever seem to do.

Beswick's much like King, he's forever scoring and creating something and I just cannot see how he could possibly have been less effective than anyone else we've used on the left flank. Beswick is a simple, efficient and intelligent footballer who has played a major part in the Academy's success. And he takes excellent free-kicks.

That leaves Weso and someone's said he's not a goalscorer. No he's not but he's an excellent passer and just the chirpy sort of character who knows these players well and can help bring the best out of them because he plays their type of football. Weso was by far our best midfielder for the first five matches of the season before he got injured and he's been sadly missed.

The players I've mentioned wouldn't have needed time to integrate because they know their team-mates and have trained with the first team constantly. They are also used to winning which is important because it breeds confidence.

Had we put those players with the likes of Hendrie, Oakley, Etuhu (maybe) and Howard - and used them regularly and sensibly, I am quite sure we would have done fine and saved ourselves a lot of expense, needless experiment and disappointment as well.

That's my case and it adds up pretty convincingly as far as I can see.

Now to some elements i agree,

But some of your stats contain reserve and academy figures, and i know your a regular watcher of this level.

Have you perhaps taken into consideration the difference in standard of opposition, and the added pressure of playing for the first team when formulating your opinions.

Not i've no doubt some would have been great inclusions at time, but for example.

King Vs Southampton, i personally felt he looked out of his depth, now its only one game, so judgement is reserved slightly.

Do you think the standard between the difference in teams within the club is that small that a player could easily make the step up to the first team and still make the impact he has made at the level below?

As you have very valid arguments and stats that back is up, i'm just concerned that apart from Shush none have really performed regularly at the Championship level. So do you stats not become a little invalid by not taking into account the situation they would be put in?

As personally, i still feel Sheenan would have added something to the side and to some extents Gradel as an impact player from the bench, but i'm still unsure of the validation of your claims and stats of the other youngsters of which you like to promote.

[reynard]

Right now a serious rise in the table is anything that sees us out of the relegation places at 4.50 pm on the last day of the season.

And in my view the players I've mentioned would have made all the difference and that's not in hindsight, I explained what would happen at New Year when the blinkered drive towards experience started, just like last year.

Don't think I had used all the youing players in the team all the time or at once. I wouldn't. But the are two big reasons for believing as I do.

Our big need is for some goals to be scored or created from other parts of the pitch to supplement anything we get from the main strikers. So, ignoring the strikers what's happened?

a) We've chosen to blood a series of relatively inexperienced strangers anyway - Bori, Laczko, Etuhu. We've also brought in Clapham and Hendrie. Goals as a result? None from any of them. Assists? One by Hendrie and none by all the rest put together. Consequence? Seven goalless games out of 15 since January 19 and seven defeats.

lazco at least one assist vs Norwich. Bori hardly played but instrumental in one goal vs coventry. etuhu looks hopeless frankly.

b) Gradel has scored seven goals in 28 appearances or 1 every 4, a brilliant return for a genuine winger in his first senior season. He's also had four assists meaning 11 direct contributions to goals in those 28 games or one every 2.5 games roughly. We'll have had 16 games since January 1 come Saturday so Gradel might have been expected to have a hand in, say, six or seven goals in that time and those figures don't consider secondary assists.

Agreed but can he do it at a higher level? good experience for next season by the looks of it.

c) Shush! remains second in our assists table and he scored two and made five officially in 24 appearances or one direct contribution every 3.5 games approximately. Again that takes ignores the many other near things Shush! created but , even based on official figures we might have expected another four goals resulting from his efforts.

That's a total of 10 goals, quite enough to have given us several more points and to have kept us clear of the relegation places even without counting anything from King who's scored almost every game he's played for the reserves and Academy since Christmas and has regularly provided final passes for goals. On top of that he's a quick passer and can be used in defence or attack according to necessity and particularly for arriving late in the box, something none of our other midfielders ever seem to do.

Didn't get forward that much when he did play.

Beswick's much like King, he's forever scoring and creating something and I just cannot see how he could possibly have been less effective than anyone else we've used on the left flank. Beswick is a simple, efficient and intelligent footballer who has played a major part in the Academy's success. And he takes excellent free-kicks.

Have to bow to your better knowledge on him. But it would be a big big ask to chuck him in now.

That leaves Weso and someone's said he's not a goalscorer. No he's not but he's an excellent passer and just the chirpy sort of character who knows these players well and can help bring the best out of them because he plays their type of football. Weso was by far our best midfielder for the first five matches of the season before he got injured and he's been sadly missed.

he's okay. But only okay. never really looked the part since he broke his leg imo. Don't agree about his passing. Would like to see his completion rate but don't think it would be that good.

The players I've mentioned wouldn't have needed time to integrate because they know their team-mates and have trained with the first team constantly. They are also used to winning which is important because it breeds confidence.

Had we put those players with the likes of Hendrie, Oakley, Etuhu (maybe) and Howard - and used them regularly and sensibly, I am quite sure we would have done fine and saved ourselves a lot of expense, needless experiment and disappointment as well.

That's my case and it adds up pretty convincingly as far as I can see.

[Thracian]

Now to some elements i agree,

But some of your stats contain reserve and academy figures, and i know your a regular watcher of this level.

Have you perhaps taken into consideration the difference in standard of opposition, and the added pressure of playing for the first team when formulating your opinions.

Not i've no doubt some would have been great inclusions at time, but for example.

King Vs Southampton, i personally felt he looked out of his depth, now its only one game, so judgement is reserved slightly.

Do you think the standard between the difference in teams within the club is that small that a player could easily make the step up to the first team and still make the impact he has made at the level below?

As you have very valid arguments and stats that back is up, i'm just concerned that apart from Shush none have really performed regularly at the Championship level. So do you stats not become a little invalid by not taking into account the situation they would be put in?

As personally, i still feel Sheenan would have added something to the side and to some extents Gradel as an impact player from the bench, but i'm still unsure of the validation of your claims and stats of the other youngsters of which you like to promote.

My stats on Gradel and Shush! are in senior football only.

King was hindered by playing some of his senior football when not fully fit, a situation which will again be the case now because Holloway hasn't used him and the reserves haven't played.

Gradel's arguably playing at the level we'll be at soon anyway. Crewe were in our League last season and their fans applauded the lad off the field when he played against them and the Leeds crowd were pretty impressed too so no concerns there.

As for Beswick, he and King played endless games in the same teams as Gradel and were just as good in their different ways. Beswick would arguably find the adjustment easiest because he hardly ever has more than one or two touches at most so he'll be doing no different to what he's always done when I've seen him.

And free-kicks/corners are no harder to take in the first team than the Academy and his are invariably dangerous.

The problem at City is the endless anxiety that seems to exist. For non-seniors it seems to be one bad game and you're out which is ridiculous. Young players need to be involved gradually but consistently. Not given one game before being forgotten for weeks.

The same should go for new signings to be honest which only emphasises how important it is to do your proper homework and we get it wrong far too often.

[Ric Flair]

Right now a serious rise in the table is anything that sees us out of the relegation places at 4.50 pm on the last day of the season.

And in my view the players I've mentioned would have made all the difference and that's not in hindsight, I explained what would happen at New Year when the blinkered drive towards experience started, just like last year.

Don't think I had used all the youing players in the team all the time or at once. I wouldn't. But the are two big reasons for believing as I do.

Our big need is for some goals to be scored or created from other parts of the pitch to supplement anything we get from the main strikers. So, ignoring the strikers what's happened?

a) We've chosen to blood a series of relatively inexperienced strangers anyway - Bori, Laczko, Etuhu. We've also brought in Clapham and Hendrie. Goals as a result? None from any of them. Assists? One by Hendrie and none by all the rest put together. Consequence? Seven goalless games out of 15 since January 19 and seven defeats.

b) Gradel has scored seven goals in 28 appearances or 1 every 4, a brilliant return for a genuine winger in his first senior season. He's also had four assists meaning 11 direct contributions to goals in those 28 games or one every 2.5 games roughly. We'll have had 16 games since January 1 come Saturday so Gradel might have been expected to have a hand in, say, six or seven goals in that time and those figures don't consider secondary assists.

c) Shush! remains second in our assists table and he scored two and made five officially in 24 appearances or one direct contribution every 3.5 games approximately. Again that takes ignores the many other near things Shush! created but , even based on official figures we might have expected another four goals resulting from his efforts.

That's a total of 10 goals, quite enough to have given us several more points and to have kept us clear of the relegation places even without counting anything from King who's scored almost every game he's played for the reserves and Academy since Christmas and has regularly provided final passes for goals. On top of that he's a quick passer and can be used in defence or attack according to necessity and particularly for arriving late in the box, something none of our other midfielders ever seem to do.

Beswick's much like King, he's forever scoring and creating something and I just cannot see how he could possibly have been less effective than anyone else we've used on the left flank. Beswick is a simple, efficient and intelligent footballer who has played a major part in the Academy's success. And he takes excellent free-kicks.

That leaves Weso and someone's said he's not a goalscorer. No he's not but he's an excellent passer and just the chirpy sort of character who knows these players well and can help bring the best out of them because he plays their type of football. Weso was by far our best midfielder for the first five matches of the season before he got injured and he's been sadly missed.

The players I've mentioned wouldn't have needed time to integrate because they know their team-mates and have trained with the first team constantly. They are also used to winning which is important because it breeds confidence.

Had we put those players with the likes of Hendrie, Oakley, Etuhu (maybe) and Howard - and used them regularly and sensibly, I am quite sure we would have done fine and saved ourselves a lot of expense, needless experiment and disappointment as well.

That's my case and it adds up pretty convincingly as far as I can see.

If I remember rightly, Gradel actually has 8 goals this season and one other that went down as a dubious own goal that could easily have been his (you'll like that) so his record is even more impressive, plus all of his assists.

I often make ridiculous statements, but I think Gradel could potentially be absolute quality, I hope and pray to dear god that we don't ruin him.

[The People's Hero]

Gradel needs to get as far away from this club as quickly as possible.

[Ric Flair]

Gradel needs to get as far away from this club as quickly as possible.

Bournemouth's about as far south as he could get, next season he's going north. Stornaway Academicals are looking at a loan deal for him.

[Manwell Pablo]

If I remember rightly, Gradel actually has 8 goals this season and one other that went down as a dubious own goal that could easily have been his (you'll like that) so his record is even more impressive, plus all of his assists.

I often make ridiculous statements, but I think Gradel could potentially be absolute quality, I hope and pray to dear god that we don't ruin him.

Yes, I remember James Wesolowski and world class being mentioned in the same sentance at one point

[Ric Flair]

Yes, I remember James Wesolowski and world class being mentioned in the same sentance at one point

[ronnup]

I agree with Gradel, can't see the sense in loaning Etuhu with him an option. Kings not ready to rely on but he's a handy option for the last twenty minutes.

These lads have all got balls. That's what comes from winning regularly in the academy. Perhaps they could give some of our bottleless cuckolds a bit of a testosterone boost, but unfortunately, it's all too late this season.

It does bode well for league 1 though as we'll need the little mites bless em.

[Bryn]

These lads have all got balls. Perhaps they could give some of our bottleless cuckolds a bit of a testosterone boost.

Kinky.

[Koke]

I have balls too. Two of them.

[lildave3]

I have balls too. Two of them.

The Sappletiser has 12.

[Koke]

I dread to think how many Sir Baz has. Its unimaginable.