Happy Fox Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 We need to play 4-4-2 to get the best out him, therefore we will need at least two wingers come the next transfer window. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tewkesbury-fox Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 When we were linked with Beckford I knew that at some stage fans would turn on him, labelling shite or some other insult. i didn't realise that it would be this soon, but I always seem to underestimate our fans. It was clear from other fans, primarily Everton who said that he doesn't play well up front on his own. Therefore it rules him out being successful in a 4-5-1, 4-3-3, bar some very lucky poaching on his behalf. He's also a confidence player. The Leeds fans stated this prior to his acquisition of a Leicester shirt. So was he a good signing? Well he has bags of quality, pace and guile. It's sad that we haven't had the system put in place for him to shine, maybe this will happen under a new manager who knows. But if the fans turn against him before he has played in his optimum settings, then he is the type of character (historically) to sulk, and then we may never get to see it. I think people should give him room, lay off, and see what he can bring to the team given new leadership. Then by all means judge fairly. Totally spot on !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannythefox Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 We need to play 4-4-2 to get the best out him, therefore we will need at least two wingers come the next transfer window. Agree but who do you leave out? I feel sorry for Danns I think something's gone on wouldn't surprise me if you see a few going out on loan come January Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ttfn Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 When we were linked with Beckford I knew that at some stage fans would turn on him, labelling shite or some other insult. i didn't realise that it would be this soon, but I always seem to underestimate our fans. It was clear from other fans, primarily Everton who said that he doesn't play well up front on his own. Therefore it rules him out being successful in a 4-5-1, 4-3-3, bar some very lucky poaching on his behalf. He's also a confidence player. The Leeds fans stated this prior to his acquisition of a Leicester shirt. So was he a good signing? Well he has bags of quality, pace and guile. It's sad that we haven't had the system put in place for him to shine, maybe this will happen under a new manager who knows. But if the fans turn against him before he has played in his optimum settings, then he is the type of character (historically) to sulk, and then we may never get to see it. I think people should give him room, lay off, and see what he can bring to the team given new leadership. Then by all means judge fairly. I haven't seen any of this quality or guile in a City shirt, and saw barely any of it at Leeds (where he was playing in by far the best team [on paper] for most of the season) and Everton (where he was playing ahead of one of the best midfields in the country). His first touch is awful. It always has been and always will be. Also, we've played a variant of 4-4-2 in almost every game this season! Why on earth we should be building a team around a guy completely unproven at this level, and with the maturity of a four-year-old, is completely beyond me. Do you not think we should be building the team around players who clearly want to be here rather than those who don't? If Beckford caught the first train back to Liverpool, I'd not shed a tear and I doubt any others would either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Fox Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 Agree but who do you leave out? I feel sorry for Danns I think something's gone on wouldn't surprise me if you see a few going out on loan come January We need at the very least 5 Central Midfielders my 5 to choose from ( King, Fernandes, Abe, Wellens and Johnson), so Danns at this moment is out of the equation, I was hoping he would take Wellens place and he still may do. Wingers we only have one on the books in Dyer,so we need at least two more wingers. Sorted in the defense and attack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Fox Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 I haven't seen any of this quality or guile in a City shirt, and saw barely any of it at Leeds (where he was playing in by far the best team [on paper] for most of the season) and Everton (where he was playing ahead of one of the best midfields in the country). His first touch is awful. It always has been and always will be. Also, we've played a variant of 4-4-2 in almost every game this season! Why on earth we should be building a team around a guy completely unproven at this level, and with the maturity of a four-year-old, is completely beyond me. Do you not think we should be building the team around players who clearly want to be here rather than those who don't? If Beckford caught the first train back to Liverpool, I'd not shed a tear and I doubt any others would either. Fact is we paid a lot of money for him so instead of it going down the drain lets hope that the new manager can get him performing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Col city fan Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 Way too early to judge him yet... Lets see what our next boss can get out of him... Absolutely right... Certain players play for certain managers... This has always been the case.. Let's let Sparky Hughes have a go on him.. So to speak.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reynard Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 I think we need to face up to what you get with Beckford. 1 He was about our 6th choice for the striker position and we only turned to him in desperation. 2 His first touch has never been very good. 3 He's unproven at this level. Yes I know he scores 10 for Everton which is the same number Akinbiyi scored for us in the premier league but he hadn't been tested in the championship . I acknowledge he scored a lot of goals for Leeds in Division one but so did Fryatt for us. 4 He's always had questions over him about his work rate and his attitude. 5 Despite his record at Leeds I don't recall a queue of premiership sides for his signature. 6 Even considering their financial issues Everton seemed perfectly happy to let him go. They could have sold Cahill for a hell of a lot more but obviously Moyes thought he could easily do without him. If he was doing the business regularly for them they would not have sold him to us. 7 His current form is atrocious. His work rate almost non existent and he looks about as good as Akinbiyi did but without the effort. MY personal feeling is that he doesn't want to play for us. He looks like a disruptive and negative influence and at the moment I couldn't care less whether or not he plays or rots away in our non existent reserve team. At the moment I'd rather have young Schlupp in there. He may be far from the finished article but at least he tries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sphericalfox Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 I haven't seen any of this quality or guile in a City shirt, and saw barely any of it at Leeds (where he was playing in by far the best team [on paper] for most of the season) and Everton (where he was playing ahead of one of the best midfields in the country). His first touch is awful. It always has been and always will be. Also, we've played a variant of 4-4-2 in almost every game this season! Why on earth we should be building a team around a guy completely unproven at this level, and with the maturity of a four-year-old, is completely beyond me. Do you not think we should be building the team around players who clearly want to be here rather than those who don't? If Beckford caught the first train back to Liverpool, I'd not shed a tear and I doubt any others would either. I'm not sure where in my post I stated he has a great first touch or stated that we should be building our team around him... He's another option, but comparing our team to Leeds and the formation and team they put out is where your argument falls flat. They had wingers firstly. Everton he scored a few goals, but primarily when they had two fit strikers, and a midfield not decimated by injury. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ttfn Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 I'm not sure where in my post I stated he has a great first touch or stated that we should be building our team around him... He's another option, but comparing our team to Leeds and the formation and team they put out is where your argument falls flat. They had wingers firstly. Everton he scored a few goals, but primarily when they had two fit strikers, and a midfield not decimated by injury. You want us to change formation to suit him! Good players should be able to adapt. Ultimately that was the undoing of Fryatt; he couldn't play as the "1" in a 4-5-1. The first touch thing you definitely didn't say. I'm just bemused that he's made it as a professional footballer when he traps it further than I can kick it. Happy Fox is right though. He's here now, there's nothing we can do about it. There is a lot he can do about it though. He needs to buck his ideas up and fast. Would you start him (or even have him in the squad) on Tuesday Spherical? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sphericalfox Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 You want us to change formation to suit him! Good players should be able to adapt. Ultimately that was the undoing of Fryatt; he couldn't play as the "1" in a 4-5-1. The first touch thing you definitely didn't say. I'm just bemused that he's made it as a professional footballer when he traps it further than I can kick it. Happy Fox is right though. He's here now, there's nothing we can do about it. There is a lot he can do about it though. He needs to buck his ideas up and fast. Would you start him (or even have him in the squad) on Tuesday Spherical? That's not what I'm saying at all. You are assuming that I want him to be on the team sheet every week, and therefore we should change our formation to suit him. What I am saying is that we need to change formations based on who we are playing, be it away or at home. Therefore Beckford is suited to a 4-4-2, a formation that we currently can't successfully implement. Until we do so, or are capable of doing so will we see the best from him. Therefore I am questioning those who are simply calling him shit, without looking at things from all the sides of the problem. Yes it might be nice if he can change his way of playing, but I doubt that hanging him out to dry because he's being forced to play in a formation that doesn't suit him is the best way of going about things. Understanding why he isn't banging goals in, and why he and the fans are frustrated is a better angle to view things from. I've no doubt the next manager will want to address the situation, though he'll have his work cut out I'm sure. what we don't want is a more mobile, and pacier version of Fryatt on our hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Col city fan Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 I'm with the big fella on this one... Shock/horror!!!! I reckon we could still have a decent striker in Beckford, as long as he's brought into line by someone who ain't gonna take any of his shit. I could see this going one of two ways when we get the new boss in.. Either Beckford will dramatically pick up and we all grow to want him in the side, or he'll throw a major paddy and will be binned, probably quite quickly. What I wouldn't do is to build a team around him as I simply don't think he's good enough to warrant this. I'd expect commitment, effort and a willingness to play in whatever formation I picked him in For 25k a week this is the least I'd expect.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cecchini1976 Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 I think if we play attacking football & put balls in to the box he and nugent will both score bagfulls of goals. I think and hope Beckford will come good, but so far has been a joke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 I'm gunna guess that this has got loads of people moaning about his reaction when he was subbed, If you're going to give out the abuse to players you can't moan if they do something in return, couple of decent wingers and not just lumping balls up to then and all our strikers will score goals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
21st Century Fox Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 From the prematch warm up to when he got subbed he just didn't look as if he wanted to be there. I don't think its got anything to do with his ability it seems to be his mindset. We just hit long balls up to him all day and he didn't challenge for a single header. With decent service he could get his confidence or motivation back (which ever he seems to be lacking, I'd go with the latter). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 From the prematch warm up to when he got subbed he just didn't look as if he wanted to be there. I don't think its got anything to do with his ability it seems to be his mindset. We just hit long balls up to him all day and he didn't challenge for a single header. With decent service he could get his confidence or motivation back (which ever he seems to be lacking, I'd go with the latter). he came in not match fit, got injured and still hasn't yet got back to match fitness, has had shit service and been chucked in out of desperation, is it any wonder he's struggling? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
21st Century Fox Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 he came in not match fit, got injured and still hasn't yet got back to match fitness, has had shit service and been chucked in out of desperation, is it any wonder he's struggling? Yeah that was my point, its got nothing to do with his ability as a player, he's just not mentally there. The first half service we gave him was the same service we gave Howard in the second, completely negating as Beckford doesn't have the same strengths as Howard, he needs the ball at his feet, I wasn't surprised he didn't bother challenging for the headers because he can't do alot with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ttfn Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 Yeah that was my point, its got nothing to do with his ability as a player, he's just not mentally there. The first half service we gave him was the same service we gave Howard in the second, completely negating as Beckford doesn't have the same strengths as Howard, he needs the ball at his feet, I wasn't surprised he didn't bother challenging for the headers because he can't do alot with it. We played the ball into Nugent's feet and in behind against Derby. The reason we were able to do that is that Nugent and Vassell were moving and making decent runs. Beckford, for the most part, just stands there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freeman's Wharfer Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 he came in not match fit, got injured and still hasn't yet got back to match fitness, has had shit service and been chucked in out of desperation, is it any wonder he's struggling? He's going to find it hard to get his match fitness when: a) he keeps getting subbed because he's been poor b) he doesn't move for anything. I'd be astounded if he had a drop of sweat or a spec of mud on him as he trounced off yesterday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lee(lcfc) Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 every moan because yakubu was lazy, beckford is worst at least yakubu scored goals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toffee_Fox Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 Good player, goals scorer, team player and turns up to training early, just lacks confidence like at the start of his Everton career 7 games 0 goals, they didn't boo/sarcastically cheer, look at his record once he got amongst the goals in the premier league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dominicmsb Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liamsm Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 I think we need to face up to what you get with Beckford. 1 He was about our 6th choice for the striker position and we only turned to him in desperation. 2 His first touch has never been very good. 3 He's unproven at this level. Yes I know he scores 10 for Everton which is the same number Akinbiyi scored for us in the premier league but he hadn't been tested in the championship . I acknowledge he scored a lot of goals for Leeds in Division one but so did Fryatt for us. 4 He's always had questions over him about his work rate and his attitude. 5 Despite his record at Leeds I don't recall a queue of premiership sides for his signature. 6 Even considering their financial issues Everton seemed perfectly happy to let him go. They could have sold Cahill for a hell of a lot more but obviously Moyes thought he could easily do without him. If he was doing the business regularly for them they would not have sold him to us. 7 His current form is atrocious. His work rate almost non existent and he looks about as good as Akinbiyi did but without the effort. MY personal feeling is that he doesn't want to play for us. He looks like a disruptive and negative influence and at the moment I couldn't care less whether or not he plays or rots away in our non existent reserve team. At the moment I'd rather have young Schlupp in there. He may be far from the finished article but at least he tries. Well said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ttfn Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 Good player, goals scorer, team player and turns up to training early, just lacks confidence like at the start of his Everton career 7 games 0 goals, they didn't boo/sarcastically cheer, look at his record once he got amongst the goals in the premier league. Because he wasn't the top wage earner at the club, acting like he couldn't give a shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seenitall Posted 30 October 2011 Share Posted 30 October 2011 Good point though - City fans booing their own players - its rubbish - wouldn't have happened in my day and we had Craig Gordon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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