davieG Posted 3 January 2013 Author Posted 3 January 2013 Are you talking about the UK? Third world education system????? no, a lack of skilled work?..a lack of skilled workers more like. Depends on your definition of skilled, does it mean having a degree? Seems to me a combination of too many jobs, mostly desk bound unnecessarily require a degree on your CV and too many people with degrees that don't fit the skills, that are not degrees that a lot of jobs require. Hope that makes sense.
The People's Hero Posted 3 January 2013 Posted 3 January 2013 Problem is a lot of people want to go to middling institutions to do second rate qualifications with little or no thought about what they eventually want to study. Having received this qualification, they then apply for jobs believing that the qualification is enough, often with a very poorly thought out CV. If they do get an interview, they often then fail to adequately prepare for the interview giving the impression they simply don't want the job or the job is beneath them. Too many graduates then just mope and fall in to some inertia and stop trying to further themselves at all. There are so many ways to further yourself. I am not going to bother going through what I've done to further myself and gain more opportunities because its irrelevant really, but I'm actually in a job. I've tried to get a few people I know involved in the following: Charity work Voluntary schemes for young people (sport) Free to attend lectures/seminars (admittedly about the insurance industry) Free workshops on entry to various industries/help with CV. Many graduates feel that all this is beneath them and are awaiting a cushy £25k job to present itself. No sympathy.
ADK Posted 3 January 2013 Posted 3 January 2013 Are you talking about the UK? Third world education system????? no, a lack of skilled work?..a lack of skilled workers more like. Yeah i'm talking about the UK. I definately think the education system is shockingly bad. Complete waste of time. I am talking about state schools. Our universities are pretty good (well the traditional ones). Also i said there is a lack of UNskilled work. Not everyone has good communication skills, numeracy, literacy, customer service etc. Even so, i do find it ironic that you think we have a good education system but that our workforce has a lack of skills. One would have thought the education system if it were good, would provide people with the skills they need?
Guest Posted 3 January 2013 Posted 3 January 2013 Problem is a lot of people want to go to middling institutions to do second rate qualifications with little or no thought about what they eventually want to study. Having received this qualification, they then apply for jobs believing that the qualification is enough, often with a very poorly thought out CV. If they do get an interview, they often then fail to adequately prepare for the interview giving the impression they simply don't want the job or the job is beneath them. Too many graduates then just mope and fall in to some inertia and stop trying to further themselves at all. There are so many ways to further yourself. I am not going to bother going through what I've done to further myself and gain more opportunities because its irrelevant really, but I'm actually in a job. I've tried to get a few people I know involved in the following: Charity work Voluntary schemes for young people (sport) Free to attend lectures/seminars (admittedly about the insurance industry) Free workshops on entry to various industries/help with CV. Many graduates feel that all this is beneath them and are awaiting a cushy £25k job to present itself. No sympathy. This.
Guest Posted 3 January 2013 Posted 3 January 2013 Yeah i'm talking about the UK. I definately think the education system is shockingly bad. Complete waste of time. I am talking about state schools. Our universities are pretty good (well the traditional ones). Also i said there is a lack of UNskilled work. Not everyone has good communication skills, numeracy, literacy, customer service etc. Even so, i do find it ironic that you think we have a good education system but that our workforce has a lack of skills. One would have thought the education system if it were good, would provide people with the skills they need? So you are criticising me for blaming some young people of feeling entitled and not doing enough whilst you blame the education system. How many other education systems have you experience of? Sure there are many ways that the UK education system can be improved but it is clearly an elite system when compared internationally and when I say "elite" I mean very, very good. I'd tend to critisize the Universities more than the lower education system. They have slipped into a commercial position where they think too much of getting money in compared to teaching prowess (not all of them obviously). I'd critisize the government for not linking their "qualifications needed" to the education system sufficiently and even more so their ridiculous need to have official qualifications for all sorts of jobs limiting the ability of people to get those jobs. I would have more practical skills taught at school - plumbing, electrical, mechanic etc... These jobs are always needed, local and it would also help people to do some home jobs on their own. I like the idea of an initiative to help people set up their own businesses but these need to be far broader. Why can't they help Rincewind to set himself up as a local "security agent" for example. It really can't cost much more than unemployemnt etc... benefits. sure most small businesses don't last too long but the experince learned is invaluable.
Guest Posted 3 January 2013 Posted 3 January 2013 plumbing, electrical, mechanic etc And I also mean - decorating, cleaning, cooking etc...
Webbo Posted 3 January 2013 Posted 3 January 2013 My youngest daughter is severely dyslexic. At the start of the school year the school suggested she went to Brooksby College to study animal care for an afternoon a week rather academic subjects that she was unsuited to. Last month we pulled her out and asked the school to start teaching her again. In 3 months all she'd done was to muck out the animals. If it had been a couple of weeks mucking out leading to lessons in animal care or the first half mucking out and then some sort of lesson then fair enough we all have to start somewhere. It appeared to us that the school was just fobbing off their problems on someone else. Pretending that they were giving a practical education but just sticking them out of the way where they won't effect their place in the league table.
Thracian Posted 3 January 2013 Posted 3 January 2013 Make no mistake, huge numbers of kids cope wonderfully. They work hard, play hard, learn quickly, improvise and think for themselves. But a lot of the time they've got family and friends who've done exactly the same. The strugglers so often live in an environment of excuse makers...people who always blame others for their own inadequacies and predicaments. Excuse: "I only stole cos i had no money and no food or electric for my kids". Excuse: "I couldn't get to the job interview cos there wasn't a bus". Excuse: "They wanted me to work for a pittance and I was better off on benefit". Excuse: i borrowed some money cos my son needed a football kit - and then found I couldn't pay it back". Excuse: "I never did my homework cos there was no point and I suffer from dyslexia". "Excuse: "I smoke cos my mates smoke and it's my only pleasure". It's pathetic. Set your own standards and row your own boat if you have to. Or learn from someone you can admire and respect. But most of all do something. Put something in - and you'll get something out. And if you don't then try again, and again until you do.
HEGGSY Posted 3 January 2013 Posted 3 January 2013 How are you serving behind a bar if you're only 17? Bit naughty. As long as there is a licensee behind the bar, I can serve.
The People's Hero Posted 3 January 2013 Posted 3 January 2013 Make no mistake, huge numbers of kids cope wonderfully. They work hard, play hard, learn quickly, improvise and think for themselves. But a lot of the time they've got family and friends who've done exactly the same. The strugglers so often live in an environment of excuse makers...people who always blame others for their own inadequacies and predicaments. Excuse: "I only stole cos i had no money and no food or electric for my kids". Excuse: "I couldn't get to the job interview cos there wasn't a bus". Excuse: "They wanted me to work for a pittance and I was better off on benefit". Excuse: i borrowed some money cos my son needed a football kit - and then found I couldn't pay it back". Excuse: "I never did my homework cos there was no point and I suffer from dyslexia". "Excuse: "I smoke cos my mates smoke and it's my only pleasure". It's pathetic. Set your own standards and row your own boat if you have to. Or learn from someone you can admire and respect. But most of all do something. Put something in - and you'll get something out. And if you don't then try again, and again until you do. I'm agreeing with Thracian again. Is this a sign that the apocalypse is nigh?
Jon the Hat Posted 3 January 2013 Posted 3 January 2013 I'm agreeing with Thracian again. Is this a sign that the apocalypse is nigh? Yes! Run for your lives!!
Bayfox Posted 3 January 2013 Posted 3 January 2013 Make no mistake, huge numbers of kids cope wonderfully. They work hard, play hard, learn quickly, improvise and think for themselves. But a lot of the time they've got family and friends who've done exactly the same. The strugglers so often live in an environment of excuse makers...people who always blame others for their own inadequacies and predicaments. Excuse: "I only stole cos i had no money and no food or electric for my kids". Excuse: "I couldn't get to the job interview cos there wasn't a bus". Excuse: "They wanted me to work for a pittance and I was better off on benefit". Excuse: i borrowed some money cos my son needed a football kit - and then found I couldn't pay it back". Excuse: "I never did my homework cos there was no point and I suffer from dyslexia". "Excuse: "I smoke cos my mates smoke and it's my only pleasure". It's pathetic. Set your own standards and row your own boat if you have to. Or learn from someone you can admire and respect. But most of all do something. Put something in - and you'll get something out. And if you don't then try again, and again until you do. whilst i agree that kids now days have to many excuses and aren't willing to put a full days graft in for average pay, which although may never earn them a fortune or get them a sports car or mansion, there are up shots to working, socially and in terms of self worth, feel good factor etc, taking pride in what you are doing. The highlighted quote above, is all that is wrong in this country, most youngsters either can't be arsed or are stuck so far up their own arse, that they find work beneath them. But if I could earn the same sort of cash sitting around doing bugger all, every day after 14 years in the same workplace, 1st grafting hard for peanuts, then working long hours etc and never seeing my mates and now running the place in a shit economy with the stress 24/7. If i'm being honest I might be tempted, only the sheer determination to prove people wrong, hopefully still be trading when the economy picks up and the chance to better my life for the sake of my kids and keep my loyal employees in jobs and out the benefits office, keeps me going.
Stadt Posted 3 January 2013 Posted 3 January 2013 I'm shiiting it. I'm 15 and currently in my first year of my GCSE's and I'm relatively intelligent, at the moment I'm working at A* in French and an A/A* english and B's in maths and Science, But I'm not really sure what I want to do after my A levels, I definitely want to live abroad for a while. So would university be a good choice? My main worry is the massive debt. Cheers.
Vacamion Posted 3 January 2013 Posted 3 January 2013 I'm shiiting it. I'm 15 and currently in my first year of my GCSE's and I'm relatively intelligent, at the moment I'm working at A* in French and an A/A* english and B's in maths and Science, But I'm not really sure what I want to do after my A levels, I definitely want to live abroad for a while. So would university be a good choice? My main worry is the massive debt. Cheers. If you can't conjugate the verb "to shit it" properly, you don't deserve an A* in a language-based subject... You are FAR too young to be spending your time worrying about the future like this. You should be worried instead about how to buy beer/glue or whether girls like you, not your future finances. There are people paid good money to guide and advise you from School/Careers etc services, who should be able to set you straight about your concerns. If you want to take advice from punters you run into on the Interweb (admittedly not always a solid gold idea), FWIW, I went abroad as a young man to work for a year during my uni course and then again afterwards and those times were the best, most inspiring times of my life that gave me experiences which have stood me in good stead ever since. I would suggest that you try to do your best acadamically, try to go to a Uni (Maybe studying languages and "something useful" like business or law?) whilst working part time - tough, but you end up with less debt - and see where life takes you. Given your commitment to financial rectitude aged 15 you will either end up a millionaire or a nervous wreck... Good luck, either way, young man!
Stadt Posted 3 January 2013 Posted 3 January 2013 If you can't conjugate the verb "to shit it" properly, you don't deserve an A* in a language-based subject... You are FAR too young to be spending your time worrying about the future like this. You should be worried instead about how to buy beer/glue or whether girls like you, not your future finances. There are people paid good money to guide and advise you from School/Careers etc services, who should be able to set you straight about your concerns. If you want to take advice from punters you run into on the Interweb (admittedly not always a solid gold idea), FWIW, I went abroad as a young man to work for a year during my uni course and then again afterwards and those times were the best, most inspiring times of my life that gave me experiences which have stood me in good stead ever since. I would suggest that you try to do your best acadamically, try to go to a Uni (Maybe studying languages and "something useful" like business or law?) whilst working part time - tough, but you end up with less debt - and see where life takes you. Given your commitment to financial rectitude aged 15 you will either end up a millionaire or a nervous wreck... Good luck, either way, young man! Thank you for the advice!
Jon the Hat Posted 3 January 2013 Posted 3 January 2013 I'm shiiting it. I'm 15 and currently in my first year of my GCSE's and I'm relatively intelligent, at the moment I'm working at A* in French and an A/A* english and B's in maths and Science, But I'm not really sure what I want to do after my A levels, I definitely want to live abroad for a while. So would university be a good choice? My main worry is the massive debt. Cheers. Be clear - student loans are NOT debt. They are a tax which you only pay when you earn a good salary. You wouldn't decide not to go to Uni because you might have to pay higher rate tax, and you shouldn't let this concern you either.
Guest Posted 3 January 2013 Posted 3 January 2013 Be clear - student loans are NOT debt. They are a tax which you only pay when you earn a good salary. You wouldn't decide not to go to Uni because you might have to pay higher rate tax, and you shouldn't let this concern you either. Really don't know why people complain about these "loans" they are a no lose proposition.
pSinatra Posted 3 January 2013 Posted 3 January 2013 Be clear - student loans are NOT debt. They are a tax which you only pay when you earn a good salary. You wouldn't decide not to go to Uni because you might have to pay higher rate tax, and you shouldn't let this concern you either. I had a student loan........from way back when grants were being phased out & loans introduced. The terms of the loan didn't concern me in the slightest then & I needed to be earning a considerable wedge before ever having to pay it back. I don't know how much I had to be earning but it would probably be somewhere in the region of £25-30k. There was certainly no such thing as tuition fees back then & I think I borrowed around £5k in total? I am interested to know what a graduate has to be earning these days before they start having to pay anything back?
Webbo Posted 3 January 2013 Posted 3 January 2013 It seems to me from my limited experience that some people I know have found jobs by signing on with job agencies, starting as a temp and then getting a permanent job. Has anyone else had this experience?
FoxLAD Posted 3 January 2013 Posted 3 January 2013 I'm shiiting it. I'm 15 and currently in my first year of my GCSE's and I'm relatively intelligent, at the moment I'm working at A* in French and an A/A* english and B's in maths and Science, But I'm not really sure what I want to do after my A levels, I definitely want to live abroad for a while. So would university be a good choice? My main worry is the massive debt. Cheers. It really depends on what you want to do. do some research online on your career choice and see if a degree in needed. because most of the time you'll have to start from the bottem anyway. degree or no degree.
Guest Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 It seems to me from my limited experience that some people I know have found jobs by signing on with job agencies, starting as a temp and then getting a permanent job. Has anyone else had this experience? I've known people who have.
Captain... Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 I'm shiiting it. I'm 15 and currently in my first year of my GCSE's and I'm relatively intelligent, at the moment I'm working at A* in French and an A/A* english and B's in maths and Science, But I'm not really sure what I want to do after my A levels, I definitely want to live abroad for a while. So would university be a good choice? My main worry is the massive debt. Cheers. Don't stress about these things now, concentrate on your GCSEs and having fun, the advice I got when I was doing A-levels and not sure about Uni was to start the process send off application forms and see what happens, it is always possible to opt out, but if you decide towards the end of your A-levels you actually do want to go to university it will be too late. What convinced me about Uni was going to the open day in Sheffield. If you study a language at Uni you will almost certainly have a year studying abroad, and it will be a 4 year course (unless things have changed a lot in the last few years) so you have 2 years of A-levels and 4 years at Uni, in 6 years time the world be a very different place, with a whole host of new things to worry about it. By then tuition fees maybe scrapped completely, all debts wiped out and a Zombie Apocalypse in South America. It seems to me from my limited experience that some people I know have found jobs by signing on with job agencies, starting as a temp and then getting a permanent job. Has anyone else had this experience? It's what set me on the path to where I am now, I was sent to an office for 1 day of photocopying, they basically need a copy of everybody's contract so I had to unstaple, photocopy and then staple the original and the copy. Nobody wanted that job/had the time for it, so they I got sent there from the temp agency, got lost on the way, turned up late, still got it all done by lunch so they packed me off to work in customer services for the afternoon, they were so impressed by my ability to file, I think it was my command of the alphabet that really blew them away, that I was asked to stay on as a temp for a while, and after a few months got a permanent job, and ended up working in the IT department travelling round Europe installing software systems. It doesn't always work out like that, a friend of mine temped at Norwich Union for about 3 years, eventually got made permanent, now it is Aviva and he has just been made redundant as they close down UK based operations to run it all from a call centre in India. Unfortunately the 3 years as a temp don't count towards his redundancy pay.
RobHawk Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 I'm shiiting it. I'm 15 and currently in my first year of my GCSE's and I'm relatively intelligent, at the moment I'm working at A* in French and an A/A* english and B's in maths and Science, But I'm not really sure what I want to do after my A levels, I definitely want to live abroad for a while. So would university be a good choice? My main worry is the massive debt. Cheers. Agree with Jon regarding not classing them as loans. I work as a student finance adviser in a University and this is what i advise all prospective students. You finish your course and pay them back 9% of you earn over £21000, its taken straight from your pay just like tax and national Insurance. If you earn less than £21000 you pay nothing. After 30 years any debt you have left is cleared! This debt also amasses interest, the more you earn, the more interest you pay. The government are expecting that less than 1% of graduates will ever repay their full loans back as you have to earn far too much to ever pay it back in full. Therefore it is a 30 year graduate tax - Why they didn't brand it in this way i will never know! Therefore if you want to go to Uni, you should! Doing years abroad are also a great idea! You may end up borrowing more student loans but as stated above unless you become a millionaire its not going to matter - but you will have a great time. If you or anyone else on the forum wants more info on student loans - let me know! I had a student loan........from way back when grants were being phased out & loans introduced. The terms of the loan didn't concern me in the slightest then & I needed to be earning a considerable wedge before ever having to pay it back. I don't know how much I had to be earning but it would probably be somewhere in the region of £25-30k. There was certainly no such thing as tuition fees back then & I think I borrowed around £5k in total? I am interested to know what a graduate has to be earning these days before they start having to pay anything back? Depends when they studied but for new students paying £9000 a year fees its £21k per annum
pSinatra Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 Depends when they studied but for new students paying £9000 a year fees its £21k per annum I was wrongfully under the impression that if you were earning little more than minimum wage, you would have to start paying something back. It doesn't sound too different to the terms of my student loan back in the 90's. I know a lot of students from my time that have never earnt enough to begin repayments & are not too far from having it written off. You're right in saying that it is nothing more than a graduate tax & it isn't so outrageous that it should put people off from going to university.
The People's Hero Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 I was wrongfully under the impression that if you were earning little more than minimum wage, you would have to start paying something back. It doesn't sound too different to the terms of my student loan back in the 90's. I know a lot of students from my time that have never earnt enough to begin repayments & are not too far from having it written off. You're right in saying that it is nothing more than a graduate tax & it isn't so outrageous that it should put people off from going to university. Does make a difference though, they are taking quite a chunk from me each month.
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