Young 'cannot cope with daily life'

[leicsmac]

Things will change, it wasn't BS, most people didn't expect this economic downturn, and even those that did didn't think it would last so long.

It may even get worse before it gets better, but hopefully a change will come soon, and we will readjust our way of thinking and living and whilst it may not return to the levels of 5 years ago, things will get better.

I hope you're right Cap Shrap...and as someone who balances on the line between idealism and cynicism I'm going to fall on the idealistic side this time and think you are right.

[Guest]

Things will change, it wasn't BS, most people didn't expect this economic downturn, and even those that did didn't think it would last so long.

It may even get worse before it gets better, but hopefully a change will come soon, and we will readjust our way of thinking and living and whilst it may not return to the levels of 5 years ago, things will get better.

I can't fully agree with this.

40 - 60 years ago a person who got a university degree was seen in a higher echelon of intelligence and definite to get a good job and a professional standing. 20 - 40 years ago many more people went to university and got degrees but the belief that this entitled them to a high level job persisted (mostly due to the older generation saying it - because it was true in their day). Nowadays if you don't go to university and get a degree you are either very highly motivated or seen as of a lower echelon of intelligence. Having a degree is just the norm (in France if you don't have a least a masters you have little chance of a decent job / job on leaving education) it no longer guarantees you a decent job and certainly doesn't guarantee respect. This generation are more intelligent but they still hold perceptions of the past.

I work with a lot of international students and I can assure you that most "foreign" students are far more qualified and harder working than a British graduate, they are also much more in touch with the reality of graft linked to work. They have seen what their parents had to do unlike Brits where the work/graft link is mostly another generation back - the grandparents or maybe further. Chinese students of today, for example, come home from school (from the age of 5) and do homework and other work until they go to bed. It's not TV and games machines and facebook. in fact it's only when they come to western countries to do a masters or a doctorate that they find all the leisure time they never knew of before.

We have made our children feel entitled and it's coming back to bite them on the ass.

[Captain...]

I can't fully agree with this.

40 - 60 years ago a person who got a university degree was seen in a higher echelon of intelligence and definite to get a good job and a professional standing. 20 - 40 years ago many more people went to university and got degrees but the belief that this entitled them to a high level job persisted (mostly due to the older generation saying it - because it was true in their day). Nowadays if you don't go to university and get a degree you are either very highly motivated or seen as of a lower echelon of intelligence. Having a degree is just the norm (in France if you don't have a least a masters you have little chance of a decent job / job on leaving education) it no longer guarantees you a decent job and certainly doesn't guarantee respect. This generation are more intelligent but they still hold perceptions of the past.

I work with a lot of international students and I can assure you that most "foreign" students are far more qualified and harder working than a British graduate, they are also much more in touch with the reality of graft linked to work. They have seen what their parents had to do unlike Brits where the work/graft link is mostly another generation back - the grandparents or maybe further. Chinese students of today, for example, come home from school (from the age of 5) and do homework and other work until they go to bed. It's not TV and games machines and facebook. in fact it's only when they come to western countries to do a masters or a doctorate that they find all the leisure time they never knew of before.

We have made our children feel entitled and it's coming back to bite them on the ass.

Like I said things will change and we will readjust our way of thinking and our view on the economy and the jobs market as well as other things.

[The People's Hero]

All depends on how prepared you are to work hard and seek out opportunities/create opportunities for yourself.

Nothing in life gets given to you on a plate.

[MooseBreath]

Fif you are like a ****ing cliche machine today.

Kids should be glad they were born in Britain... Not really. It's ok, a top-30 country, nothing more.

Foreign grads work harder... Cliche ****ing city.

The younger generation want everything handed to them... again, not really.

[Guest]

typical contribution from the moose - well not typical there wasn't a racist comment in there but added nothing to the thread as usual.

[MooseBreath]

typical contribution from the moose - well not typical there wasn't a racist comment in there but added nothing to the thread as usual.

I think I've added a few decent comments to this thread, certainly more based in reality than your bar stool sociology. I don't think I've ever witnessed someone with a mind as narrow as yours. You are like the guardian - wrong about everything, all of the time.

[indierich06]

All depends on how prepared you are to work hard and seek out opportunities/create opportunities for yourself.

Nothing in life gets given to you on a plate.

Exactly right. Things are bleak right now, make no mistake - but it's the same for everyone. If you're motivated and you keep looking for stuff, there are jobs out there. Once you're in a job and paying your bills, then you can start looking for a job that you really want. That's how I did it. I did absolutely anything I could so I wouldn't have to sign on, then after about a year I got the job I'm currently in and I really enjoy it - the money still isn't great to be honest, but I know once I've grafted here for a bit longer then I'll be able to look for another job paying a bit more. Just got to keep trying, that's the key.

[Guest]

I think I've added a few decent comments to this thread, certainly more based in reality than your bar stool sociology. I don't think I've ever witnessed someone with a mind as narrow as yours. You are like the guardian - wrong about everything, all of the time.

another nothing post from a nobody. You don't even know what a cliché is do you?

[Webbo]

Can we keep this thread on track please and not let it descend into personal bickering.

[Finnegan]

Can we keep this thread on track please and not let it descend into personal bickering.

Not without giving FIF a 24hr ban, he's clearly trying his best to be edgy and controversial today.

So cool.

[J.Lisemore]

I think the motto is ' you get out what you put in, in life'

Works for me.

[ADK]

When Moose is the one talking sense you know theres something ****ed up.

I can't agree with any of the rubbish FIF is spouting.

[Jon the Hat]

Things are certainly tougher now than when I graduated in 1999. I am no superstar but I had three job offers within a month from British Gas, Procter & Gamble and Sony. I have a lot of sympathy for new grads now who are finding it tough. It must be very demoralising. Not everyone is cut out to travel the world, or motivated to do charity work.

[The People's Hero]

Too many flimsy institutions handing out second rate qualifications and spouting rubbish about how attractive it will make the student as an employee in the future.

[Jon the Hat]

Too many flimsy institutions handing out second rate qualifications and spouting rubbish about how attractive it will make the student as an employee in the future.

Yep. On the comparison with foreign graduates, a lot of people miss the point that you are often comparing with high calibre people who got sposonsored to move the UK / EU. I have a Chinese lady in my team who has two undergrad and one post grad degree to achieve that.

[Vacamion]

It's tough now, but it's never felt easy.

I was lucky enough to have the State pay for my education and upkeep when I was a student.

I still needed to work for shit money in dangerous conditions on building sites to keep afloat financially whilst I looked for a 'graduate' job in the recession of the early 90s.

I can't imagine how difficult it is nowadays.

I think generations on here reproaching each other about who has/had it easy gets us nowhere.

Times, conditions and social norms change.

Some people are unlucky, others have life handed to them on a plate.

Life's a lottery. Always has been. All you can do is try your best with what you've got and keep a smile on your face.

[Finnegan]

Yep. On the comparison with foreign graduates, a lot of people miss the point that you are often comparing with high calibre people who got sposonsored to move the UK / EU. I have a Chinese lady in my team who has two undergrad and one post grad degree to achieve that.

It's also a ridiculous stereotype. A few of my closest friends are East Asian nationals (and one Ukrainian) who came here to study and they're no more motivated or talented than anyone else I know. They're just a bit more adventurous and like travelling.

One of them, a dear friend, is possibly the laziest girl I've ever met. Came here to study photography and is currently milling around in retail til her visa expires. Love her to bits and will be gutted when she goes but holding her up as an example to these allegedly useless British graduates would be absurd.

[pSinatra]

It's not just the young that may need to step up........everybody needs to.

Opportunities are scarce & there are people across the board who may need to take a look at themselves. I have worked in the private & public sector. There have been too many people who I have not been able to tell what exactly it is they do or what benefit they bring. Usually in middle management with made-up job titles. They may have worked hard (or kissed enough arses) to get to that position, but that is no reason to expect a free ride when there are plenty of people more than happy to take their place.

[Tielemans63]

Successive governments have been so obsessed with results and 'improving standards' in our schools that teaching kids useful skills in school has been completely overlooked because there isn't the room within the curriculum. There was a half-hearted attempt with the introduction of Citizenship but it was a poorly conceived project (IMHO).

It always amazes me when I speak to my Sixth Formers about going to uni and I find some of them have no conception of how to budget, no idea of how a credit card works or even how to plan their own time. In my opinion we need to end this obsession with getting every single student student 10 GCSEs etc and instead work to find a balance between producing academically capable young people and providing society with functional, resourceful citizens. If we were able to ensure that all young people left school with those skills then then those who don't achieve brilliant results would still be more than capable of finding their own way in life whereas the higher achievers would do well anyway.

Sadly there's long been a culture of never allowing anyone to fail and it's resulted in too much 'spoon-feeding' in schools; that in turn has resulted in there being a large number of young people who have never had to think for themselves.

[Zingari]

Pffft , you young people today don't know how lucky you are !

We lived for three months in a brown paper bag in a septic tank. We used to have to get up at six o'clock in the morning, clean the bag, eat a crust of stale bread, go to work down mill for fourteen hours a day week in-week out. When we got home, our Dad would thrash us to sleep with his belt!

And we never complained , we just got on with it .

[sphericalfox]

Pffft , you young people today don't know how lucky you are !

We lived for three months in a brown paper bag in a septic tank. We used to have to get up at six o'clock in the morning, clean the bag, eat a crust of stale bread, go to work down mill for fourteen hours a day week in-week out. When we got home, our Dad would thrash us to sleep with his belt!

And we never complained , we just got on with it .

elderly humblebrag

[AoWW]

Successive governments have been so obsessed with results and 'improving standards' in our schools that teaching kids useful skills in school has been completely overlooked because there isn't the room within the curriculum. There was a half-hearted attempt with the introduction of Citizenship but it was a poorly conceived project (IMHO).

It always amazes me when I speak to my Sixth Formers about going to uni and I find some of them have no conception of how to budget, no idea of how a credit card works or even how to plan their own time. In my opinion we need to end this obsession with getting every single student student 10 GCSEs etc and instead work to find a balance between producing academically capable young people and providing society with functional, resourceful citizens. If we were able to ensure that all young people left school with those skills then then those who don't achieve brilliant results would still be more than capable of finding their own way in life whereas the higher achievers would do well anyway.

Sadly there's long been a culture of never allowing anyone to fail and it's resulted in too much 'spoon-feeding' in schools; that in turn has resulted in there being a large number of young people who have never had to think for themselves.

This.

[Zingari]

elderly humblebrag

I think Eldley Humblebrag would be a good name for a Dickensian character

I'd like to play him in a remake of Hard Times

Eldley Humblebrag gleefully encouraging youngsters to seek employment.

[The Year Of The Fox]

BBC

What a load of bollocks. Wonder what the percentage was like during WW2 for evacuees moving away from london. Kids of today have sod all to worry about in the grand scheme of things.

People are a lot more materialistic, needing to have the next big thing. You eventually grow up and realise how daft it all is.

The country needs to stop being so namby pamby