fleckneymike Posted 20 May 2015 Posted 20 May 2015 Oh fair enough. I do agree that it is rather depressing that sexuality and marriage is still a 'thing' As far as I know allowing gay marriage wont mean all us hetrosexuals will be forced to mary a gay person so I can't see why anyone would object to it.
ADK Posted 20 May 2015 Posted 20 May 2015 It's not illegal just not recognised legally so a little bit different.
BoyJones Posted 23 May 2015 Posted 23 May 2015 As I understand it the bakers human rights have been breached. They contend they did not discriminate against the litigants sexuality, but as said earlier against the message which was contary to their profound religious beliefs. Your religious beliefs are normally sacrosanct under current legislation. This case is not finished because the bakers were found guilty based on subjective arguments, no irrefutable proof was provided by the procecution to support their case; the jury dismissed the bakers defence, but gave no reason. Can see this being overturned by a decent lawyer.
BoneDog Posted 25 May 2015 Posted 25 May 2015 A man (not sure about women yet - it's a tough one) should be free to turn down any business he chooses. He should also be free to refuse to put pink icing on a cake if he so chooses. If a homosapien cake buyer doesn't like it then he can shop elsewhere, or better yet stop kicking up a fuss and have a different message written on the cake. Anyway, shouldn't a gay couple be making their own cakes?
Rincewind Posted 25 May 2015 Posted 25 May 2015 Simple answer is to ask before placing an order. The baker can the recomend a baker that will do it if he cannot. He would not have to give a specific reason for refusing. Another solution is for the baker not to advertise that they will meet any request. There was no need for it to go as far as it did. Both parties were at fault for stbborness. Word would have got around about the baker's refusal and potential customers may have been lost.
1993fox Posted 25 May 2015 Posted 25 May 2015 If a business owner doesn't want to serve for something he/she doesn't agree with then that should be the end of it. Sick and tired of liberals forcing homosexuality down our throats.
Jimothy Posted 25 May 2015 Posted 25 May 2015 I think whoever made the judgement has got a bit clouded between two things. I think the baker has every right to turned down making a cake with a political/religious/etc statement that they don't agree with. Doesn't mean they are discriminating against gay people, it could easily have been a straight person ordering a cake supporting gay marriage. What I don't think they have the right to do is turn down making a cake for a gay person or making a wedding cake for a gay marriage, that would be clear discrimination. i think the ruling opens up a can of worms that would mean printers for example would have to produced clearly discrimatory literature for fear of discriminating against those discriminating. Madness.
The Blur Posted 25 May 2015 Posted 25 May 2015 I think whoever made the judgement has got a bit clouded between two things. I think the baker has every right to turned down making a cake with a political/religious/etc statement that they don't agree with. Doesn't mean they are discriminating against gay people, it could easily have been a straight person ordering a cake supporting gay marriage. What I don't think they have the right to do is turn down making a cake for a gay person or making a wedding cake for a gay marriage, that would be clear discrimination. i think the ruling opens up a can of worms that would mean printers for example would have to produced clearly discrimatory literature for fear of discriminating against those discriminating. Madness. I think that is similar to refusing to make a cake due to the conflict in the baker's religious beliefs though. Good post nevertheless.
Strokes Posted 25 May 2015 Posted 25 May 2015 I think whoever made the judgement has got a bit clouded between two things. I think the baker has every right to turned down making a cake with a political/religious/etc statement that they don't agree with. Doesn't mean they are discriminating against gay people, it could easily have been a straight person ordering a cake supporting gay marriage. What I don't think they have the right to do is turn down making a cake for a gay person or making a wedding cake for a gay marriage, that would be clear discrimination. i think the ruling opens up a can of worms that would mean printers for example would have to produced clearly discrimatory literature for fear of discriminating against those discriminating. Madness. Yeah pretty much agree with that entirely. I think the bakers are daft to turn down business, it's also madness to think they can't, if it displays a message they don't agree with.
Captain... Posted 29 May 2015 Posted 29 May 2015 I think that is similar to refusing to make a cake due to the conflict in the baker's religious beliefs though. Good post nevertheless. Not if it is a standard wedding cake with no personalisation/indication of the nature of the wedding. If it said just married Dave and Barry and they requested 2 grooms on top instead of a bride and groom then it could cause a disagreement.
The Blur Posted 29 May 2015 Posted 29 May 2015 Not if it is a standard wedding cake with no personalisation/indication of the nature of the wedding. If it said just married Dave and Barry and they requested 2 grooms on top instead of a bride and groom then it could cause a disagreement. That is what I meant- if they are aware that it is a cake for a gay marriage- I find that same thing as refusing to bake a cake based on their religious beliefs.
Captain... Posted 29 May 2015 Posted 29 May 2015 That is what I meant- if they are aware that it is a cake for a gay marriage- I find that same thing as refusing to bake a cake based on their religious beliefs. I think even if they are aware it is for a gay wedding they shouldn't be able to refuse it if it is just a standard wedding cake with no personalisations.
Bettsj2 Posted 29 May 2015 Posted 29 May 2015 Not baking the cake wont make all gays disappear. Bake the fvcking cake.
BoneDog Posted 29 May 2015 Posted 29 May 2015 Not baking the cake wont make all gays disappear. No, but wham a nuke on Brighton and another on Lesbos and we might just pull it off.
Carl the Llama Posted 29 May 2015 Posted 29 May 2015 No, but wham a nuke on Brighton and another on Lesbos and we might just pull it off. Calm down buddy, you wouldn't need more than a clusterbomb to take out somewhere the size of Brighton.
Jimothy Posted 29 May 2015 Posted 29 May 2015 Not baking the cake wont make all gays disappear. Bake the fvcking cake. Well not disappear, but they'll certainly take up less space if there's less cake to eat.
BrokenRecord Posted 29 May 2015 Posted 29 May 2015 It's funny when illogical beliefs get in the way of making money, and two people's wishes. "Forcing homosexuality down our throats" what a joke hahahaha. Grown men upset by the fact that other men might fvck each other
Rincewind Posted 30 May 2015 Posted 30 May 2015 It's funny when illogical beliefs get in the way of making money, and two people's wishes. "Forcing homosexuality down our throats" what a joke hahahaha. Grown men upset by the fact that other men might fvck each other Plenty of men don't seem to have a problem with watching two women conoodling and entwining their sweaty bodies around each other. Even some straight women take part. Men can be replaced very easily. Maybe for a lot of gays it is not bum sex but they find a male body more attractive to snuggle up with in bed. Not for me but I won't try and stop anyones choice of fun as they won't be knocking on my bedroom door the next time I am having my wicked way with a young lady. Besides I hate my dreams being disturbed.
VLC86 Posted 30 May 2015 Posted 30 May 2015 Anyway, shouldn't a gay couple be making their own cakes? No need to be racist.
Steven Posted 30 May 2015 Posted 30 May 2015 If a business owner doesn't want to serve for something he/she doesn't agree with then that should be the end of it. Sick and tired of liberals forcing homosexuality down our throats. Sick and tired of right wingers forcing hate, bigotry and intolerance down own throats.
Webbo Posted 30 May 2015 Posted 30 May 2015 Sick and tired of right wingers forcing hate, bigotry and intolerance down own throats. Who's forcing what down whose throats? The baker didn't want to make the cake, the gay lobby wanted to force him.
Steven Posted 30 May 2015 Posted 30 May 2015 Who's forcing what down whose throats? The baker didn't want to make the cake, the gay lobby wanted to force him. http://www.foxestalk.co.uk/forums/topic/95979-gay-cake-row/page-5#entry3419138 The baker is not in business. He/she/it/they are only happy to be in business on their own terms. Anything outside those terms is not acceptable. Clearly that is an attempt to force their own bigoted views on their customers. If you do not want to compromise your views, don't be in business.
Webbo Posted 30 May 2015 Posted 30 May 2015 http://www.foxestalk.co.uk/forums/topic/95979-gay-cake-row/page-5#entry3419138 The baker is not in business. He/she/it/they are only happy to be in business on their own terms. Anything outside those terms is not acceptable. Clearly that is an attempt to force their own bigoted views on their customers. If you do not want to compromise your views, don't be in business. Or if you don't like somebody's views shop somewhere else. The baker's the one losing money. Just another pressure group forcing their opinions on others.
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