Make Leicester British.. channel 4 next week..

[lestajigs]

I've no idea, mate. I saw some Polish (?) folks in church and then I went back to emptying the tumble dryer

.

[bovril]

I think we should accept immigrants based on how good their countries takeaways are

 

I prefer an elaborate strength of lager to price ratio.... 

[Webbo]

You should.

I was going to say "Bloody Thrummies, stealing our jobs and stealing our women" but that's never actually happened.

[kingfox]

Hardly heard them talking about how much Leicester has changed, surely that was the point of the programme.

 

Suky could of gone on for days, talking about how much Narborough Road has become shit.

[Guest MattP]

If they do one of these in every City in Europe they still wouldn't find a small table of people who would all tolerate Somalians.

[Steve_Guppy_Left_Foot]

All the people on here sorely lacking in any form of empathy, basically scum. I wonder what you'd do if you'd seen/had your parents murdered, had to walk god knows how far every day to get unclean water, watch your children die from the conditions around you, no schools, no hospitals, surrounded by war and poverty every single day. Some people have it that bad, worse, even. If you were in their position would you sit still and watch it happen? ****ing idiots.

[DennisNedry]

All the people on here sorely lacking in any form of empathy, basically scum. I wonder what you'd do if you'd seen/had your parents murdered, had to walk god knows how far every day to get unclean water, watch your children die from the conditions around you, no schools, no hospitals, surrounded by war and poverty every single day. Some people have it that bad, worse, even. If you were in their position would you sit still and watch it happen? ****ing idiots.

 

[Leicester_Loyal]

All the people on here sorely lacking in any form of empathy, basically scum. I wonder what you'd do if you'd seen/had your parents murdered, had to walk god knows how far every day to get unclean water, watch your children die from the conditions around you, no schools, no hospitals, surrounded by war and poverty every single day. Some people have it that bad, worse, even. If you were in their position would you sit still and watch it happen? ****ing idiots.

 

Still doesn't mean I should be working 40 hours a week to pay for them (or any other immigrants or dole dossers) to live here comfortably.

[leicsmac]

Self-interest and the "I'm all right Jack" attitude are a pretty ingrained part of society, pretty much wherever you go. Leicester (and indeed on here) isn't exactly special in that respect. Look at nationalism (which is self-interest and supremacy played out on a bigger scale) for instance. 

 

Which is a shame, because that attitude will one day end up wth humanity going the way of the other 99% of species that have been about.

[GingerrrFox]

Somalians are ****ing pirates. Always have been and always will be.

[Charl91]

No problems with Somalians who wish to work. She clearly did not. 

[C-man]

Christ this is more depressing reading than the LCFC Forum.

Let me begin by saying I only watched the last 30 minutes after watching Made in Chelsea and I struggle to believe I missed any bigger cvnts on Channel 4.

Immigration is an extraordinarily complex thing to defend given the multitude of reasons that people participate in it for, and because bashing it takes no thought whatsoever you are always going to get more of the shouty right speaking up against it.

Same with long-term unemployment - there's plenty of reasons why people don't work in the long-run but no-one bothers to articulate them.

I've seen a few posts in here saying that we should close borders, others saying that first generation immigrants from the 50s/60s (perhaps represented by this Suky fella) are fine to be here - probably cos some of them are saying right we should lock the doors too to ward off the 'scroungers'. Well, the London School of Economics reckons that recent immigrants are 45% less likely to claim benefits than the native population so for me that's an argument that doesn't really stack up.

Here's another stat from the same researchers: Between 2001 and 2011, those same recent immigrants (all scroungers from Eastern Europe or wartorn Africa, some would have you believe) made a net fiscal contribution of £25bn to the UK economy compared with a £624.1bn negative contribution of the native population during the same period.

So, if we're talking about making contributions to the economy or taking away from it, shall we boot the long-term (white-)British out too?

No doubt I'll be called a leftist for trawling out basic facts. Why let educated statistics get in the way of a bit of prejudice?

[absolutelegend]

No problems with Somalians who wish to work. She clearly did not. 

 

This.

 

And to the chap above that ranted about not having empathy for genuine asylum seekers, he's missing the point by miles.

[Bettsj2]

Immigration and Asylum seeking are not the same thing.

This is a very basic fact that seems to be distorting many opinions.

[leicsmac]

This.

 

And to the chap above that ranted about not having empathy for genuine asylum seekers, he's missing the point by miles.

 

Can you elaborate? There is an awful lot of generalisation going on in here.

[Charl91]

Immigration and Asylum seeking are not the same thing.

This is a very basic fact that seems to be distorting many opinions.

 

 

True. It didn't help her case that she was clearly talking crap. She kept going on that "Asylum Seekers can't have bank accounts"; well, that's not true, they can have bank accounts as soon as their Asylum case is processed.

 

All in all, I thought most people on the program came off quite well, other than her.

[Webbo]

If all immigrants are hard working and all indigenous white people so lazy and useless why is our country so much better off than theirs?

Also, not all asylum seekers are genuine.

[absolutelegend]

Christ this is more depressing reading than the LCFC Forum.

Let me begin by saying I only watched the last 30 minutes after watching Made in Chelsea and I struggle to believe I missed any bigger cvnts on Channel 4.

Immigration is an extraordinarily complex thing to defend given the multitude of reasons that people participate in it for, and because bashing it takes no thought whatsoever you are always going to get more of the shouty right speaking up against it.

Same with long-term unemployment - there's plenty of reasons why people don't work in the long-run but no-one bothers to articulate them.

I've seen a few posts in here saying that we should close borders, others saying that first generation immigrants from the 50s/60s (perhaps represented by this Suky fella) are fine to be here - probably cos some of them are saying right we should lock the doors too to ward off the 'scroungers'. Well, the London School of Economics reckons that recent immigrants are 45% less likely to claim benefits than the native population so for me that's an argument that doesn't really stack up.

Here's another stat from the same researchers: Between 2001 and 2011, those same recent immigrants (all scroungers from Eastern Europe or wartorn Africa, some would have you believe) made a net fiscal contribution of £25bn to the UK economy compared with a £624.1bn negative contribution of the native population during the same period.

So, if we're talking about making contributions to the economy or taking away from it, shall we boot the long-term (white-)British out too?

No doubt I'll be called a leftist for trawling out basic facts. Why let educated statistics get in the way of a bit of prejudice?

 

So you're saying, that just because the net financial impact of migrants is positive then it's OK to have an open immigration policy?  Great "educated" point.  I think is by far the most generalistic post I have read yet.

 

The show was discussing more specific cases, showing some people who come and work (largely accepted on this forum), and others that come and chose not to.  It is the latter that people had issues with.  They didn't have a positive fiscal impact on our countries economy. 

 

And I have read a couple of posts that basically say "but it's OK as there are native people who don't work either".  Yes we all know that and aren't happy with that situation either.  My argument would be why make the problem worse?

 

Simple solutions in my mind:

- Bring back powers to the UK to allow it to more easily flex our immigration quotas, based on the situation and needs of a country at a given time

- For the immigrants entering the country, stricter vetting procedures based around the skills that they will bring

[bovril]

If all immigrants are hard working and all indigenous white people so lazy and useless why is our country so much better off than theirs?

 

 

That's obviously not true that we are "lazy" but also the respective wealth of a country is never solely down to how hard locals work.

 

Re the post above about people not showing compassion. I think we've got a bit of compassion fatigue at the moment. I'm sure 99% in the UK do feel sorry for those less fortunate but we have lives to lead as well.

 

So you're saying, that just because the net financial impact of migrants is positive then it's OK to have an open immigration policy?  Great "educated" point.  I think is by far the most generalistic post I have read yet.

 

 

I think he was responding to the cliche that a lot of them are scroungers. I'm all for more controlled immigration but the benefits argument is a complete red herring.

[leicsmac]

That's obviously not true that we are "lazy" but also the respective wealth of a country is never solely down to how hard locals work.

 

Re the post above about people not showing compassion. I think we've got a bit of compassion fatigue at the moment. I'm sure 99% in the UK do feel sorry for those less fortunate but we have lives to lead as well.

 

 

I think he was responding to the cliche that a lot of them are scroungers. I'm all for more controlled immigration but the benefits argument is a complete red herring.

 

Exactly. More to the point, a far greater proportion of 'native' Brits are 'scroungers' than immigrants.

 

Edit: Agree with you on the compassion fatigue point, the hard times of the last few years has made people want to look after no.1. But do we really want to become a society so cynical and lacking in empathy?

 

It's no coincidence that overt nationalism and (often) war based on it flourish after economic downturns.

[DennisNedry]

You have to ask yourself why so many Asylum Seekers want to come to the UK instead of the numerous other safe countries they pass through to get here.

 

I also think comparing native British scroungers to immigrants/asylum seekers irrelevant. You can't deport people who were born here. There's not much we can do about them. 

[leicsmac]

You have to ask yourself why so many Asylum Seekers want to come to the UK instead of the numerous other safe countries they pass through to get here.

 

I also think comparing native British scroungers to immigrants/asylum seekers irrelevant. You can't deport people who were born here. There's not much we can do about them. 

 

And why not? Surely the logic goes that a 'scrounger' is a 'scrounger' (though I fvcking hate that term), regardless of nationality?

[DennisNedry]

And why not? Surely the logic goes that a 'scrounger' is a 'scrounger' (though I fvcking hate that term), regardless of nationality?

 

scrounger

noun

informalderogatory

 

1. a person who borrows from or lives off others.

    

    

    

   Don't know why you hate the term. Perfectly describes those living on benefits.

    

    

   I agree that we should confront scroungers of all nationality as strongly as each other. But like I said, you can deport foreign scroungers. Native scroungers you can't do much about. Unless you drastically reduce benefits to a level that people out of work would be plunged in to poverty, but it would never happen (and shouldn't happen to that extent)

    

   Have a watch of 'The Tangled Web' episode of Yes, Prime Minister

    

    

    

[leicsmac]

 

scrounger

noun

informalderogatory

 

1. a person who borrows from or lives off others.

    

    

    

   Don't know why you hate the term. Perfectly describes those living on benefits.

    

    

   I agree that we should confront scroungers of all nationality as strongly as each other. But like I said, you can deport foreign scroungers. Native scroungers you can't do much about. Unless you drastically reduce benefits to a level that people out of work would be plunged in to poverty, but it would never happen (and shouldn't happen to that extent)

    

   Have a watch of 'The Tangled Web' episode of Yes, Prime Minister

    

    

    

 

 

Yeah, perhaps I should qualify. I hate the derogatory way that it is used, rather than the term itself.

 

I agree the whole area of benefits is a tangled web indeed (and I shall watch that episode of YPM), as it ties into the work market as a whole which is directly linked to the economy as a whole. Also, there are definitely those out there who play the system for their own benefit and really really should be working. But one thing I will say is that generalisations about benefit claimants isn't going to solve anything.

 

Perhaps we should be looking at a more mass-employment-centric economic model? Though there are consequences to that too.

 

Back on-topic, again my problem is the generalisation of immigrants that goes on up and down the country regarding how many of them are actually 'scroungers', and it being used as a political stick when in fact there are far, far worse drains on the economy.

[Bettsj2]

If all immigrants are hard working and all indigenous white people so lazy and useless why is our country so much better off than theirs?

Also, not all asylum seekers are genuine.

Not all immigrants are hard working and not all indiginous white people are lazy. Sweeping generalisations are the complete problem with these sorts of debates.

There are disingenuous people in regard to everything. Asylum, benefit claims, paying tax, paying wages etc etc. the truth is, the people in charge (governments) know that it costs far too much to even attempt to properly filter out the fraud so just let it slide but make noise about trying to stop it in order to appease the general public.

I did an insurance review for the government on asylum seekers a few years ago and some of the content was ridiculous. Genuine asylum seekers definitely dont come here for the benefits but the illusion that they'll be protected from whatever evils they're running from is pretty much bullsh!t too.

Disingenuous asylum seekers who claim benefit on arrival are often suprised at how little they get to what they expected. 5 in 1 bed flat and £7 a day etc. There are some that say 'we shouldnt be paying anything to anyone that aint British' etc and to be honest, I kind of agree. But I also dont agree with benefits of any kind that go to anyone that is physically and mentally able.

An ex-girlfiriend's grandparents lived in a council house (and a pretty big one at that) all of their lives and ended up buying it for a pittance. There was nothing wrong with either of them other than they didnt earn very much money.

Now why is that scenario (that is massively common in this country) ok with some people? Just because they're white and British its ok because we're looking after our own? Fvck that. I work my ass off, pay shit loads of tax to subsidise that? Bollocks. All of it should end. It never will so I just carry on earning loads and buying what I like.

The thing that pisses me off more than anything is peoples double standards in this sort of subject.

'Its not ok to give this group of people money, but its ok to hand out cash to this group of people'. Get fvcked. If you work and work damn hard, you should be allowed to live in whichever country you want. If you dont, you should have what you deserve.

Provide asylum if someone deserves it, but remove that stupid fvcking rule about not being able to work until the case is proved. Have them clean the prisons or pick up litter or scrub chewing gum off pavements or clean fvcking public toilets or milk cows at 3am or anything really. Contribution makes the world work so get everyone and I fvcking mean EVERYONE doing something other than fvck all.

If there was a hotline I could call so an asylum seeker could come around to my house, clean the fvcker, do my fvcking ironing and polish my shoes, it's be on god damn speed dial.

Contribution. Earn your fvcking way.