What is wrong with St George's Day celebrations?

[Dr The Singh]

I'm at a vaisakhi celebration tomorrow in Birmingham. Around 50,000 people turning up. Total free event, funded not by the council but the Birmingham Sikh organisations, open to all the public.

Just like the Doctor has said, if the people want to do a St George celebration, there is nothing stopping them

[grandpa]

Surely the reason that many countries have a national day of their own is because,historically, they were occupied/colonized by other nations. Either they co-opted a religious festival [ 'saints day'] as a covert way of asserting their identity in the face of their occupier or they later adopted the date of their liberation as a day for celebration , usually calling it Independence Day. Since England has not been under occupation [ 1066 doesn't count in the same way] then we have never needed to place such a priority on a particular day. It has nothing at all to do with local councils,political correctness or any of the other spurious,lazy claims that get made at this time of year.

I'm of the older generation and it isn't true to say that it used to be a real big deal. It never was,really. Some towns,villages have sometimes organised their own events and I seem to recall that the Lord Mayors Parade in Leicester used to be on the Saturday closest to St.Georges Day but these were all just using the date for convenience. It has never been a major,national event and I don't think that we could now artificially construct it to be so.

Certainly the idea that ' everyone else has one so we should ' is pretty un-English and very unlikely to succeed.

As others have said,feel free to do your own thing; a few years back my brother had a party at his house and all the food,drink and music had to be English. A bit of fun to which I contributed by bringing along a CD of The Equals Greatest Hits. Went down well,and still seems more in keeping with the English way of doing things 

[Fox92]

Well Happy St Georges Day to all, shame there wasn't a match on today. Cause the club could have done something special, like given away free mini England flags, asked people to come in st georges day fancy dress.

 

What.

[Phube]

Eh... In Leicester saw this:

Close thread?

[DJ Barry Hammond]

The above comments about what an "Englishness celebration would involve" are very relevant to this, but I think there's a couple of other key reasons why the English find it difficult to celebrate Englishness.

I think one of the biggest ones is an almost identity crisis - if you asked an Englishman their nationality I expect the majority would say "British" not "English" but thats understandable - it's what's on our forms, our Parliament / Army / Ships / Queen, etc all fly the Union flag (because this is who they represent) and a signifncant number of our sporting teams / people compete under the British flag.

Being English hardly features in peoples minds because we hardly do anything as "just England". We built the British Empire - not the English! Look at our regular celebrations - The Queens Birthdays, Fireworks Nights, The last night of the Proms - all British celebrations - but that's what happens when you're a ruling power over partially devolved states.

Additionally, if you look across the land of England, i think people tend to cherish their regional heritage more due to the long historic divisions there have been country wide - but again this makes sense on the same principle I've alluded to above in that we as people see those things being represented more than anything specifically English.

To celebrate nationalism, you have to be able to identify with it and we just don't have enough to associate ourselves to at the moment. A guy that killed a dragon ages ago doesn't lend itself very well to a celebration - maybe, just maybe, the nation should consider changing its Saint or bringing in a marketing team to find an acceptable product placement gimmick?

But one thing for me is certain and that is if we want national "English" celebrations, we must reclaim our flag from the unsavoury groups that have used it and tarnished its reputation. We need to use it in many, many, more positive situations, restore pride in our flag, so that all can feel proud to walk down the street holding our flag, without fear of someone thinking it may mean anything else than being proud to be English (but accepting of others).

Hopefully our footballers can contribute towards that goal in June. Then the rest... is up to each and everyone of us

Happy St George's Day

[Webbo]

I'm British and English. I don't feel any post colonial guilt. I'm quite proud of my country, I just don't make a fuss about.

[DANGEROUS TIGER]

St George's Day is a celebration of our heritage. I am proud of my nationality.

 

In front of me is a St George's Day card from my son. Perfect!

 

Happy St George's Day, to one and all.

[Buce]

St George's Day is a celebration of our heritage. I am proud of my nationality.

In front of me is a St George's Day card from my son. Perfect!

Happy St George's Day, to one and all.

I thought you're a Jock, DT?

[digitalalba]

This is in reply to Finnaldo

 

Some people think football was boring until Sky promoted it. Englishness is not promoted, not in schools, not by authority, not by 10% - 15% of our immigrant friends. If you grew up in a school that did, you would probably have a liking for morris dancing and brass bands. They get a decent crowd in Market Harborough from all ages watching it. It is an area of the county that people generally appreciate things to do with being English, unlike some areas of Leicester and the country. It is interesting that those who left the cities and moved out into the counties, are more likely to celebrate than those who replaced them.

 

I've mentioned it in conversation to most I come in contact with over the last few days and by far the most likely reaction is that of indifferent surprise or a shrug. There's a massive event in West Brom to go to as well. Again, I could see most people below 40 (if not 50) finding brass bands and Morris dancing some of the most boring things you could be subjected to.

So if you were to organise it for the Council, what would you put in there? Because I'd rather watch the big, colourful Caribbean Carnival floats or the big, colourful Divali procession, than Morris Dancing & brass bands.

 

I would hire Abbey park for the entire weekend and put on a huge stage for amature and professional folk singers/bands,

I would have morris dancers and for people to learn it in a fun way.

I would invite the Steadfast trust to promote English culture to all especially the young who miss out at school.

I would have a tent with a big screen for the city match on sunday and footage of English culture.

Their would be a drinks tent with English wines, beers and food on sale.

I would invite some of those companies who act out old battles, including a Robin Hood show and a man on horse duel they do at Warwick Castle.

I would invite schools to create a play based on English culture to show people. A Shakespeare play would be cool.

[Webbo]

You like Morris dancers and folk singers?! Are you sure you're English?

[RobHawk]

This is in reply to Finnaldo

 

Some people think football was boring until Sky promoted it. Englishness is not promoted, not in schools, not by authority, not by 10% - 15% of our immigrant friends. If you grew up in a school that did, you would probably have a liking for morris dancing and brass bands. They get a decent crowd in Market Harborough from all ages watching it. It is an area of the county that people generally appreciate things to do with being English, unlike some areas of Leicester and the country. It is interesting that those who left the cities and moved out into the counties, are more likely to celebrate than those who replaced them.

 

I've mentioned it in conversation to most I come in contact with over the last few days and by far the most likely reaction is that of indifferent surprise or a shrug. There's a massive event in West Brom to go to as well. Again, I could see most people below 40 (if not 50) finding brass bands and Morris dancing some of the most boring things you could be subjected to.

So if you were to organise it for the Council, what would you put in there? Because I'd rather watch the big, colourful Caribbean Carnival floats or the big, colourful Divali procession, than Morris Dancing & brass bands.

 

I would hire Abbey park for the entire weekend and put on a huge stage for amature and professional folk singers/bands,

I would have morris dancers and for people to learn it in a fun way.

I would invite the Steadfast trust to promote English culture to all especially the young who miss out at school.

I would have a tent with a big screen for the city match on sunday and footage of English culture.

Their would be a drinks tent with English wines, beers and food on sale.

I would invite some of those companies who act out old battles, including a Robin Hood show and a man on horse duel they do at Warwick Castle.

I would invite schools to create a play based on English culture to show people. A Shakespeare play would be cool.

Well the council organised a festival, did you go?

[Soar Fox]

I'm at a vaisakhi celebration tomorrow in Birmingham. Around 50,000 people turning up. Total free event, funded not by the council but the Birmingham Sikh organisations, open to all the public.

Just like the Doctor has said, if the people want to do a St George celebration, there is nothing stopping them

How come you're not going to the one in Leicester Doc?

[Rincewind]

Google St Georges Day Events Leicester

[digitalalba]

Well the council organised a festival, did you go?

Did they, I didn't know. What was it like?

[RobHawk]

Did they, I didn't know. What was it like?

I don't know and I don't care. But this whole thread has come about because you have consistently got all high and mighty about the bloody council, and they had a festival which you didn't attend, even though it was mentioned in this thread. You could have just googled it. You are either a massive wum, or a complete tit.

[Rincewind]

We English are too polite.

[digitalalba]

I don't know and I don't care. But this whole thread has come about because you have consistently got all high and mighty about the bloody council, and they had a festival which you didn't attend, even though it was mentioned in this thread. You could have just googled it. You are either a massive wum, or a complete tit.

They had a festival? A festival? Really, a festival, an English festival celebrating Englishness, did they? Really?

 

NO they didn't, they had a banner and some food stalls, they do this every few months...

[digitalalba]

We English are too polite.

The greatest people in the world, so great, we take the most bullsh1t, no nationality takes so much cr@p from so many people and are abused for it too.

 

When the civil war ends, they will wonder why they felt the need to hurt us so badly.

[The Doctor]

You like Morris dancers and folk singers?! Are you sure you're English?

 

What's wrong with Morris dancing? Done it a few times and it's decent enough fun.

[Rincewind]

They had a festival? A festival? Really, a festival, an English festival celebrating Englishness, did they? Really?

 

NO they didn't, they had a banner and some food stalls, they do this every few months...

Which was yours?

[Dodgy Bob]

Someone said it above but regional pride works a lot better than national pride in England. National pride means I have to be proud of scousers, mancs, and people from Norfolk, and I'm not. I'm just not. Football probably doesn't help. Do I want to stand shoulder to shoulder in pride with some spurs or Derby fans? Not really.

Also, lots of England is grim. You must have been to Coventry. What is there to be proud of there, exactly?

We're not the greatest people in the world. For the most part we don't even like each other. Imagine someone talking to you on the train, your first thought? It's not, "excellent, a fellow great English man to talk to". It's more likely to be, "why on earth is this ****ing freak talking to me".

We are also a bit too bashful to make a big song and dance over something as shallow as national pride. It's not even a real source of pride, is it? Being born somewhere? Hardly sets you apart from the rest. Isn't there something else in your life you can be proud of, something which you've actually had a choice in and been a part of?

[digitalalba]

Someone said it above but regional pride works a lot better than national pride in England. National pride means I have to be proud of scousers, mancs, and people from Norfolk, and I'm not. I'm just not. Football probably doesn't help. Do I want to stand shoulder to shoulder in pride with some spurs or Derby fans? Not really.

Also, lots of England is grim. You must have been to Coventry. What is there to be proud of there, exactly?

We're not the greatest people in the world. For the most part we don't even like each other. Imagine someone talking to you on the train, your first thought? It's not, "excellent, a fellow great English man to talk to". It's more likely to be, "why on earth is this ****ing freak talking to me".

We are also a bit too bashful to make a big song and dance over something as shallow as national pride. It's not even a real source of pride, is it? Being born somewhere? Hardly sets you apart from the rest. Isn't there something else in your life you can be proud of, something which you've actually had a choice in and been a part of?

Coventry, like Leicester, is a sh1t hole, as is a lot of cities in England. Go out into the counties, then you see beautiful, mostly unspoilt landscape. Who was it that has destroyed our inner cities, turning them into sh1t holes?

 

You could have your 3rd paragraph in any country in the world.

 

National pride helped us win world wars, shallow? Pride is in the mind and the heart, you either fell it or you don't. You're either gay or you're something else.

[Vacamion]

They had a festival? A festival? Really, a festival, an English festival celebrating Englishness, did they? Really?

NO they didn't, they had a banner and some food stalls, they do this every few months...

What were you expecting?

Dragon slaying?

[Trav Le Bleu]

The thing is, rather like France and the U.S., we have a more secular national day on November 5th.

However, due to it's close proximity to Halloween and our, if not the world's, obsession with becoming more like America, that too is increasingly being forgotten.

[digitalalba]

What were you expecting?

Dragon slaying?

I would hire Abbey park for the entire weekend and put on a huge stage for amature and professional folk singers/bands,

I would have morris dancers and for people to learn it in a fun way.

I would invite the Steadfast trust to promote English culture to all especially the young who miss out at school.

I would have a tent with a big screen for the city match on sunday and footage of English culture.

Their would be a drinks tent with English wines, beers and food on sale.

I would invite some of those companies who act out old battles, including a Robin Hood show and a man on horse duel they do at Warwick Castle.

I would invite schools to create a play based on English culture to show people. A Shakespeare play would be cool.