The OH Leuven Thread

[reynard]

11 hours ago, Bonanza said:

As things stand right now, KV Mechelen will go to 1A and Tubize will drop to the 1st amateur division. Lokeren will drop from 1A to 1B. There are still 3 teams in the running to come up from the 1st amateur division. This will either be Deinze, Lierse or Virton but they still have to play promotional play-offs. Thes Sport is the 4th team is these play-offs, but they don't have the necessary requirements to play professional football.

 

All this can still change because of "Operation Clean Hands". Mechelen and Waasland-Beveren (1A) are accused of matchfixing and we all wait for the verdict in this case. If they are found guilty, Mechelen will drop down to the 1st amateur division, while Waasland-Beveren will drop to 1B. This would mean Lokeren stays in 1A, Beerschot goes up to 1A and Tubize stays in 1B.

 

Moeskroen (also 1A) is another club that is currently under review for money laundering and for being owned by football agent Pini Zahavi. If they are found guilty they to will get relegated which means Union St. Gilles will go up to 1A.

 

But this is all 'big if'. 

Any preference to who comes up etc? Which team/s would make it easier for you guys to win promotion or is there nothing in it?

[Guest]

On 20/04/2019 at 20:54, leuven said:

Relief at last. Now we need a great summer transfer window, it's incredible how poor our transfers were last summer given the large budget and wages. Next season we must compete to get promoted, no more excuses.

 

How is Sam Hughes performing in the U23 after coming back from injury? Seemed to be a good prospect for a loan.

That would be terrible for Sam Hughes. He deserves to play in the championship at the very least. Belgian second division would be a complete waste of the player. 

Edited 22 April 2019 by Guest

[Foxxed]

1 hour ago, FIF said:

That would be terrible for Sam Hughes. He deserves to play in the championship at the very least. Belgian second division would be a complete waste of the player. 

Josh Knight is roughly at the same level as Sam Hughes and Knight was loaned out to a league one outfit for half a season. Is the Beligian second equivalent to our third tier?

 

And another thing, are we ever getting Elliot Moore back? Surely two seasons in the Belgian second is enough for his development? Are we going to loan him out to them again in the hope they game promotion and then he'll get a season in the Belgian first? He's 22 now. I'd rather loan him out to a league one outfit tbh.

[The Horse's Mouth]

We're using Leuven all wrong, the quality of football isn't really good enough to be developing any players. We needed them in their toppest tier before we're going to reap any rewards from these loan players

[Foxxed]

8 minutes ago, The Horse's Mouth said:

We're using Leuven all wrong, the quality of football isn't really good enough to be developing any players. We needed them in their toppest tier before we're going to reap any rewards from these loan players

We could be loaning them players so they do get to the top tier although the players who are sent there now are hardly going to reap developmental rewards although for Moore captaining the team must be better than playing in PL2... for a season.

Edited 22 April 2019 by Foxxed

[foxes21]

On 20/04/2019 at 19:54, leuven said:

Relief at last. Now we need a great summer transfer window, it's incredible how poor our transfers were last summer given the large budget and wages. Next season we must compete to get promoted, no more excuses.

 

How is Sam Hughes performing in the U23 after coming back from injury? Seemed to be a good prospect for a loan.

If you need a striker we have an exciting prospect coming through called Ryan Loft. 

 

 

 

[Bonanza]

4 hours ago, reynard said:

Any preference to who comes up etc? Which team/s would make it easier for you guys to win promotion or is there nothing in it?

I doubt any of the teams coming up will be a contender for the league title. I think they would be happy if they can fight off relegation.

 

Personally I don't have a preference. But if I had to choose I hope it isn't Virton, since it's a very long trip on away days and they don't bring a lot of fans to their away games.

[The Horse's Mouth]

31 minutes ago, Foxxed said:

We could be loaning them players so they do get to the top tier although the players who are sent there now are hardly going to reap developmental rewards although for Moore captaining the team must be better than playing in PL2... for a season.

The quality between the two divisions cant be much, but if I were Moore getting to spend sometime in Belgium for a piss up would be all on my mind

[Bonanza]

36 minutes ago, Foxxed said:

Josh Knight is roughly at the same level as Sam Hughes and Knight was loaned out to a league one outfit for half a season. Is the Beligian second equivalent to our third tier?

 

And another thing, are we ever getting Elliot Moore back? Surely two seasons in the Belgian second is enough for his development? Are we going to loan him out to them again in the hope they game promotion and then he'll get a season in the Belgian first? He's 22 now. I'd rather loan him out to a league one outfit tbh.

Yes, I think Leuven would be a League One team in England.

 

About Elliot Moore, I doubt he'll ever be a player for your first squad. Last season he was one of our best players, this season one of our worst. Like I said before, he's doing better since he plays alongside Sascha Kotysch, but he never reached his level of last year. It seems to me that he has stopped developing.

[ozleicester]

18 hours ago, LinekersApples said:

Who’s coming up? 

 

Who’s coming down?

 

[Foxxed]

2 minutes ago, Bonanza said:

Yes, I think Leuven would be a League One team in England.

 

About Elliot Moore, I doubt he'll ever be a player for your first squad. Last season he was one of our best players, this season one of our worst. Like I said before, he's doing better since he plays alongside Sascha Kotysch, but he never reached his level of last year. It seems to me that he has stopped developing.

I can't help but feel his development has stagnated and he'd be better off loaned to a team in one of our divisions. He and Chilwell were both up for academy player of the year a few years ago. Chilwell was forced to play above his level last year and eventually succeeded. Moore's been playing second division football in Belgium and has stagnated. For his own development, I'd prefer to see him loaned out to a league one outfit here to see how he performs.

[Bonanza]

45 minutes ago, The Horse's Mouth said:

We're using Leuven all wrong, the quality of football isn't really good enough to be developing any players. We needed them in their toppest tier before we're going to reap any rewards from these loan players

I have to agree. Belgian players that went to the Premier League were all players that excelled in the Belgian 1st division.

 

Look at Tielemans. He was Anderlecht's best player when he got transferred to Monaco. Same goes for Dendoncker, who went to Wolves this summer. Courtois, De Bruyne, Lukaku, Fellaini, Benteke, Batshuayi,... the list goes on. Before we can be a good "feeder team" for Leicester, we have to be a top 6 team in our first division.

 

The same thing goes for players that come here on loan. The level of the Belgian 2nd division is simple not good enough for real prospect to develop. For example, I would have loved for Harvey Barnes to have come on loan last summer. He would have been a top player for us, but it would have been a disaster for his development.

 

When we are a 1st division team we would be the perfect team for players that are not good enough yet for Leicester's first team. We would benefit from their talent, the players can make that final step in their development and Leicester gets good players. Win-win-win 

 

 

[Bonanza]

38 minutes ago, Foxxed said:

I can't help but feel his development has stagnated and he'd be better off loaned to a team in one of our divisions. He and Chilwell were both up for academy player of the year a few years ago. Chilwell was forced to play above his level last year and eventually succeeded. Moore's been playing second division football in Belgium and has stagnated. For his own development, I'd prefer to see him loaned out to a league one outfit here to see how he performs.

I see what you mean and you could be right. Personally I don't see Elliot ever becoming a 1st team player for Leicester, but I hope he can prove me wrong. 

[SemperEadem]

3 hours ago, Bonanza said:

I have to agree. Belgian players that went to the Premier League were all players that excelled in the Belgian 1st division.

 

Look at Tielemans. He was Anderlecht's best player when he got transferred to Monaco. Same goes for Dendoncker, who went to Wolves this summer. Courtois, De Bruyne, Lukaku, Fellaini, Benteke, Batshuayi,... the list goes on. Before we can be a good "feeder team" for Leicester, we have to be a top 6 team in our first division.

 

The same thing goes for players that come here on loan. The level of the Belgian 2nd division is simple not good enough for real prospect to develop. For example, I would have loved for Harvey Barnes to have come on loan last summer. He would have been a top player for us, but it would have been a disaster for his development.

 

When we are a 1st division team we would be the perfect team for players that are not good enough yet for Leicester's first team. We would benefit from their talent, the players can make that final step in their development and Leicester gets good players. Win-win-win 

 

 

Would you really want to be that?

[Guest]

Going to Leuven was a good move for Elliot but staying there this season has been a big backward step. If the club wasn't owned by our owners then there is no way we'd have wasted this season for him. He'd have been back at the U23s and then loaned out to a championship/league 1 team IMO.

 

From what I've seen of the Leuven games they would struggle in league 1. I think they'd be a non-league team over here.

 

I can understand the owners wanting to help them out (not that it has) but unless it's a young player leaving to get some match practice before hoping to move into a decent loan in England, we shouldn't be sending our players there. 

 

I feel sorry for Elliot who was on the outer fringes of making the bench when he left. Now he wouldn't even be our no.7 CB.

 

A player like Kapustka was worth trying out as his career had entered a cul-de sac. A Diabaté may have been worthwhile - but then he may as well have stayed in the lower French leagues.

 

If we wanted to "help" Leuven we should've sent them Benny and Shinji, Slimani and Simpson. Let them have Wes next year 

[leuven]

there's no difference between the level of our second division and most of our first division teams. I think 3 of the teams in second division would have been able to outplay most of the teams outside of the top 6 in the first division.  

 

Unfortunately the players that were sent over from Leicester did not have much impact this season. Last season was different, when Moore was an immediate quality injection. This season, he started out poorly. Got better after the winterbreak. Kapustka showed some signs of his potential, but all in all didn't bring anything extra. Others like Sowah did not even make the bench most of the time.

 

So maybe it's better not to go that route anymore and look for players that suit the special competition that is 1B. I would not mind Moore staying, he's been better since Kotysch is playing next to him.

[Bonanza]

28 minutes ago, baker11 said:

Would you really want to be that?

I strongly believe that both Leicester City and OH Leuven can work together with both teams benefiting from the alliance.

 

Would I like 20 English players in OH Leuven with the hopes that maybe one or two can make it to Leicester's first squad and all the rest being rubbish? Absolutely not! And to be honest, I don't think that has even been King Power's plan.

 

What I would like is for OHL to be a decent 1st division club. We would have "our own" players, but we could get some players on loan from Leicester who are 1 step away from being first squad players (for Leicester). For example, Leicester could send players like Benkovic on loan to us, instead of sending them to Celtic. We would have a great defender, Benkovic can develop and take that extra step that makes him a first team player and Leicester gets a good player out of it. Win-win-win.

 

Maybe the term feeder team was a poor choice of words, but you get my drift.

[LinekersApples]

1 hour ago, Bonanza said:

I strongly believe that both Leicester City and OH Leuven can work together with both teams benefiting from the alliance.

 

Would I like 20 English players in OH Leuven with the hopes that maybe one or two can make it to Leicester's first squad and all the rest being rubbish? Absolutely not! And to be honest, I don't think that has even been King Power's plan.

 

What I would like is for OHL to be a decent 1st division club. We would have "our own" players, but we could get some players on loan from Leicester who are 1 step away from being first squad players (for Leicester). For example, Leicester could send players like Benkovic on loan to us, instead of sending them to Celtic. We would have a great defender, Benkovic can develop and take that extra step that makes him a first team player and Leicester gets a good player out of it. Win-win-win.

 

Maybe the term feeder team was a poor choice of words, but you get my drift.

I understand what you're saying and I would love this to work out for everyone, but i fear that there is a fundamental issue if OHL don't become a top 6 club (which I know is the aim).  Benkovic playing in front of 60k in a heated derby is worth it's weight in gold.  The average attendance in the championship this season is over 20k (Top 9 averaging 25k) and the top 6 in league 1 average over 10k (Sunderland 31k, Portsmouth 18k, Bradford 16k).

 

Playing in GB, in front of big crowds is crucial for development and sadly can't be matched playing lower league football abroad.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Bonanza said:

I strongly believe that both Leicester City and OH Leuven can work together with both teams benefiting from the alliance.

 

Would I like 20 English players in OH Leuven with the hopes that maybe one or two can make it to Leicester's first squad and all the rest being rubbish? Absolutely not! And to be honest, I don't think that has even been King Power's plan.

 

What I would like is for OHL to be a decent 1st division club. We would have "our own" players, but we could get some players on loan from Leicester who are 1 step away from being first squad players (for Leicester). For example, Leicester could send players like Benkovic on loan to us, instead of sending them to Celtic. We would have a great defender, Benkovic can develop and take that extra step that makes him a first team player and Leicester gets a good player out of it. Win-win-win.

 

Maybe the term feeder team was a poor choice of words, but you get my drift.

And how would Benkovic develop playing what is essentially non-league level football? He's playing for a Champion's League, treble trophy winning team who have average attendances of 60,000. I don't know what your average attendance is but I'm pretty sure you don't get as many through your turnstiles in a season as Celtic get in 2 games.

 

Please be real. If you get anyone it's our youth players with talent looking at a first season away from home - and then it has to be a specific type of person as Belgium is a pretty foreign lifestyle to a lot of our kids.

[Bonanza]

49 minutes ago, FIF said:

And how would Benkovic develop playing what is essentially non-league level football? He's playing for a Champion's League, treble trophy winning team who have average attendances of 60,000. I don't know what your average attendance is but I'm pretty sure you don't get as many through your turnstiles in a season as Celtic get in 2 games.

 

Please be real. If you get anyone it's our youth players with talent looking at a first season away from home - and then it has to be a specific type of person as Belgium is a pretty foreign lifestyle to a lot of our kids.

FIF, you have to read my posts more carefully.

 

At this point it would absolutely be stupid to send Benkovic to Leuven, with us being in down in 2nd division. This is what I mean when I say that Leuven is no good use to Leicester when it comes to being a 'feeder club' at this moment. But if we get to the 1st division things would change, because we would play better teams. Like I said, if we would grow to be a top 6 club, we would be a better "help" for Leicester. I'm pretty sure Benkovic would develop fine if he was send on loan to Club Brugge, Genk, Standard Liege, Anderlecht or even Gent as the Scottish League isn't really any better than the Belgian 1st division. Yes, Celtic Glasgow is a much bigger club than any of our Belgian clubs, but aside from Rangers they don't have any opposition in their domestic league or cup.

 

To be honest, I disagree when it comes to your idea of sending youth players to Leuven for some experience away from home. I think it would be best to send them on loan to an English club so they learn to play with the big boys. If they do this well, then it's time for the next step and you can send them to a foreign club. George Hirst is a great example of a player that had no experience playing in a senior squad or away from home and look how that turned out.

 

 

Edited 22 April 2019 by Bonanza

[Bonanza]

56 minutes ago, LinekersApples said:

I understand what you're saying and I would love this to work out for everyone, but i fear that there is a fundamental issue if OHL don't become a top 6 club (which I know is the aim).  Benkovic playing in front of 60k in a heated derby is worth it's weight in gold.  The average attendance in the championship this season is over 20k (Top 9 averaging 25k) and the top 6 in league 1 average over 10k (Sunderland 31k, Portsmouth 18k, Bradford 16k).

 

Playing in GB, in front of big crowds is crucial for development and sadly can't be matched playing lower league football abroad.

I agree. I really wasn't talking about Benkovic specifically, he was just an example. At this point, it would make no sense to send a guy that is on the brink of being a 1st squad player for Leicester to Leuven as he wouldn't get to develop. We would have to become a top 6 club for that to happen.

[Guest]

11 hours ago, Bonanza said:

FIF, you have to read my posts more carefully.

 

At this point it would absolutely be stupid to send Benkovic to Leuven, with us being in down in 2nd division. This is what I mean when I say that Leuven is no good use to Leicester when it comes to being a 'feeder club' at this moment. But if we get to the 1st division things would change, because we would play better teams. Like I said, if we would grow to be a top 6 club, we would be a better "help" for Leicester. I'm pretty sure Benkovic would develop fine if he was send on loan to Club Brugge, Genk, Standard Liege, Anderlecht or even Gent as the Scottish League isn't really any better than the Belgian 1st division. Yes, Celtic Glasgow is a much bigger club than any of our Belgian clubs, but aside from Rangers they don't have any opposition in their domestic league or cup.

 

To be honest, I disagree when it comes to your idea of sending youth players to Leuven for some experience away from home. I think it would be best to send them on loan to an English club so they learn to play with the big boys. If they do this well, then it's time for the next step and you can send them to a foreign club. George Hirst is a great example of a player that had no experience playing in a senior squad or away from home and look how that turned out.

 

 

Overall I agree with what you say Bonanza but I can't see that Leuven will be a step up from the championship or league 1 ever. Unless of course they manage to become a top team that qualifies for European competition. Until then the English leagues or Celtic are better options.

[KFS]

All in good time, chaps.

[Lizhang]

11 hours ago, FIF said:

Overall I agree with what you say Bonanza but I can't see that Leuven will be a step up from the championship or league 1 ever. Unless of course they manage to become a top team that qualifies for European competition. Until then the English leagues or Celtic are better options.

lol, ok.

 

So far, of all the players that came to Leuven through the Leicester connection (not just LFC youth players), only one has been "somewhat" of an added value. Sowah can count the minutes he's played on his ten fingers. Hirst can count his goals after an entire season on his three fingers. Kapustka can count his decent games on one hand. Moore has had one good season and has grown better deep into his second season (but was dire most of it). So, maybe start sending us some better players, because our level has been dreadful this year, mainly thanks to Pearson, Hirst, and Kapustka, who were supposedly sent over to raise our level, not sink it, lol. The team we were supposed to be battling for promotion this year, is now playing the final of our National Cup. Against Gent, a team that kicked Tottenham out of the EL two years ago.

 

So excuse me if I think you are underestimating the Belgian leagues or the quality of the football that is being played, and especially the potential to let players develop here. Obviously it depends on which player you would want to send out, and with what reason. A small technical player that is being bullied in the Championship, could very well thrive here. Meet Leandro Trossard, here in OHL shirt, played at OHL 3 years ago. Now being courted by Wolfsburg, Arsenal, Sevilla... You don't have to play in the best team in order to improve. He was still playing against the best teams in Belgium (even if we weren't one of them). We were a bottom team back then (we even relegated that same season). Guys like Benteke (Kortrijk), Dufour (KV Mechelen), Odoi (a homegrown OHL player btw), Mitrovic (Anderlecht), Batshuayi (Standard), De Bruyne, Courtois (Genk), Mertens (started as a kid at Leuven, moved to lower tier Belgian and Dutch teams before resurfacing in the Dutch second div), Lukaku, Tielemans, Dendoncker (all Anderlecht), Witsel, Fellaini (Standard), Vertonghen, Alderweireld, Dembélé, Naingolan (all grown at Beerschot (currently in our league) , before spreading out)... They all came from or passed through Belgian clubs, and not all of them played for the big Belgian CL or EL teams. Unless you think those players all suck, it's obvious our league isn't bad at all to develop talent, and they don't have to play for the top teams in order to do so.

 

But my conclusion after two years of co-dependancy, is that i would rather have as little as possible players sent to us from Leicester. Either they lack the quality, or they are miscast. Unless our (non-Pearson) manager is 100% convinced we're talking about a reinforcement and the player wants to come. If not, let's not bother. It's not helping Leicester, it's not helping the players, and it definitely isn't helping us. So, by all means, if you want to send them to your 3rd tier league because you think they're better off there, please do. Chances are we wouldn't have much use for them anyway, judging by what we've been sent our way so far.

---

In completely other news, our youth team is leading the league with 3 points, and one more game to play. It would be the 3rd or 4th time they top the league in the last 5 years in 2nd div.

Edited 23 April 2019 by Lizhang

[CosbehFox]

I think the bottom line is that the idea of farming youngsters to a club abroad will improve the club is absurd. 

 

For example at Leicester if we were in the Championship, would a load of Real Madrid B players work in that division ? Highly doubtful. You look back to how teams build themselves in the Championship to gain promotion - knowhow is very important 

 

Assist Leuven in getting out of the second tier. Whatever the winning formula is in that division they should adopt it. Then when in the first tier, there’s a case in a more expansive division players can develop better and easier at reward to both clubs. 

Edited 23 April 2019 by Cardiff_Fox