FT General Election Poll 2019

[jaylcfc94]

bye bye corbyn! all the free stuff didnt work. worst labour leader ever. 

 

Lets get brexit done! 

Edited 15 December 2019 by jaylcfc94

[UpTheLeagueFox]

4 hours ago, Beechey said:

 

Blaming the electorate for being stupid. 

This is why Labour struggle, at times they simply don't get it.

[Dr The Singh]

8 minutes ago, UpTheLeagueFox said:

Blaming the electorate for being stupid. 

This is why Labour struggle, at times they simply don't get it.

That woman is the reason why Labour lost

[Mark_w]

1 minute ago, Dr The Singh said:

That woman is the reason why Labour lost

Well no, she's not.

[Facecloth]

I've always been against the tribal support of politics so I've never considered joining a party. Saying that I have always been more towards the red than the blue side of our politics, although labour are too far left for me atm, and I'm really a fan of Corbyn and co.

 

So saying that, I am considering joining the labour party. Not because I'm a corbyn fan as I said, but the opposite. I think the party needs to be pulled away from the grips this lot currently have on it, and that won't happen by people like me sitting around just hoping they'll **** off. So i intend to join, get involved, and hope others do the same, and get a moderate sensible labour party back and functioning.

[Dr The Singh]

10 minutes ago, Mark_w said:

Well no, she's not.

Arrogance, ignorant, aggressive, single minded,totally oblivious to reality and was a massive remainer......that's who she is and that's why they lost.

 

 

[Dr The Singh]

7 minutes ago, Facecloth said:

I've always been against the tribal support of politics so I've never considered joining a party. Saying that I have always been more towards the red than the blue side of our politics, although labour are too far left for me atm, and I'm really a fan of Corbyn and co.

 

So saying that, I am considering joining the labour party. Not because I'm a corbyn fan as I said, but the opposite. I think the party needs to be pulled away from the grips this lot currently have on it, and that won't happen by people like me sitting around just hoping they'll **** off. So i intend to join, get involved, and hope others do the same, and get a moderate sensible labour party back and functioning.

 I'm thinking of joining, because the bar is so low for being a leader, I think within a few days eclipse any of them to the top

[Izzy]

12 minutes ago, Facecloth said:

I've always been against the tribal support of politics so I've never considered joining a party. Saying that I have always been more towards the red than the blue side of our politics, although labour are too far left for me atm, and I'm really a fan of Corbyn and co.

 

So saying that, I am considering joining the labour party. Not because I'm a corbyn fan as I said, but the opposite. I think the party needs to be pulled away from the grips this lot currently have on it, and that won't happen by people like me sitting around just hoping they'll **** off. So i intend to join, get involved, and hope others do the same, and get a moderate sensible labour party back and functioning.

@Alf Bentleys recruitment drive begins 

[LiberalFox]

4 minutes ago, Facecloth said:

I've always been against the tribal support of politics so I've never considered joining a party. Saying that I have always been more towards the red than the blue side of our politics, although labour are too far left for me atm, and I'm really a fan of Corbyn and co.

 

So saying that, I am considering joining the labour party. Not because I'm a corbyn fan as I said, but the opposite. I think the party needs to be pulled away from the grips this lot currently have on it, and that won't happen by people like me sitting around just hoping they'll **** off. So i intend to join, get involved, and hope others do the same, and get a moderate sensible labour party back and functioning.

Out of interest did you consider the Lib Dems? 

[Facecloth]

1 minute ago, LiberalFox said:

Out of interest did you consider the Lib Dems? 

I have voted Lib Dem once in the past. I think in the past maybe, but right now we need a labour party back in a sensible area of politics to get have any chance of ousting the Tories.

[Guest MattP]

Whatever we all think and our tribal loyalties aside. 

 

How wonderful this is.

 

 

[Milo]

3 minutes ago, MattP said:

Whatever we all think and our tribal loyalties aside. 

 

How wonderful this is.

 

 

I sincerely hope that he is openly gay and has not just been outed by that odious toad Tatchell...

[Kendal Fox]

On 14/12/2019 at 01:45, leicsmac said:

And that's the bit I don't really understand. What exactly is that fear based on? A fear of being alone, perhaps?

 

I mean, I think you're right as there's certainly a lot of evidence for it but I really cannot understand the idea behind a collective sense of belonging with people who just so happened to share the same arbitrary patch of ground you were born in, if their own worldviews about that and other topics differ so significantly from your own. Surely a sense of belonging should come from shared beliefs, not just being born in the same place?

 

Kinda hoping someone who feels a strong sense of national identity can come in and explain because I honestly don't get it.

 

 

I think that's spot on, but also I think it depends on the type of success, really.

 

For instance, the UK tends to lionise artists and musicians and sport players (often before tearing them down tbf) but tends to treat STEM luminaries as simply "that bloke with the shed at the bottom of the garden" no matter what amount of achievement they obtain (or simply remarking on her appearance rather than her ability if it's a lady).

But you can certainly feel a sense of belonging with those from your area, without being carbon copies of one another. 

 

For me, the Left is being used or (misused). And I honestly think, if you get rid of all the labels that they constantly create, (some of which you've listed), this current incarnation of Labour is coercing people more and more into being unspontaneous, extremely predictable and actually very un-indiviudal, which I find highly ironic.

People should be able to agree to disagree when necessary and cherish the fact that there are differences and the healthiness of the dynamics that go with that. That is more enriching to me instead of being intimidated into agreeing for fear of being demonised disproportionately and ostracised. Or having to adopt the "If you can't beat em, join em" approach, even though many, deep down probably realise they feel hollow having to do that. 

 

I mean, (as a parallel to the identity thing) why do we support Leicester City? Isn't that an example (probably not the only one) of where we come together? Maybe a cheesy example, but surely more than a grain of truth in it.

Edited 15 December 2019 by Kendal Fox

[LiberalFox]

10 minutes ago, Kendal Fox said:

But you can certainly feel a sense of belonging with those from your area, without being carbon copies of one another. 

 

For me, the Left is being used or (misused). And I honestly think, if you get rid of all the labels that they constantly create, (some of which you've listed), this current incarnation of Labour is coercing people more and more into being unspontaneous, extremely predictable and actually very un-indiviudal, which I find highly ironic.

People should be able to agree to disagree when necessary and cherish the fact that there are differences and the healthiness of the dynamics that go with that. That is more enriching to me instead of being intimidated into agreeing for fear of being demonised disproportionately and ostracised. Or having to adopt the "If you can't beat em, join em" approach, even though many, deep down probably realise they feel hollow having to do that. 

 

I mean, (as a parallel to the identity thing) why do we support Leicester City? Isn't that an example of where we obviously come together? Maybe a cheesy example, but surely more than a grain of truth in it.

Thing is with football you don't treat people differently based on what football team they support, at least not on issues that matter. 

[LiberalFox]

23 minutes ago, Facecloth said:

I have voted Lib Dem once in the past. I think in the past maybe, but right now we need a labour party back in a sensible area of politics to get have any chance of ousting the Tories.

So it's about being part of the opposition to the Tories and that means Labour due to their entrenched position under FPTP?

[Alf Bentley]

35 minutes ago, UpTheLeagueFox said:

Blaming the electorate for being stupid. 

This is why Labour struggle, at times they simply don't get it.

 

It makes me laugh how differently some people react to comments, depending on whether it's someone on "their side" or "the other side".

 

Flint claims to be revealing something that Thornberry said to her in a private conversation - and you immediately take it as evidence of Labour being out of touch.

Johnson refers publicly to "tank-topped bumboys", "piccaninnies" & "letterboxes" and Tory supporters see this as evidence only of his colourful sense of humour.

 

Maybe Thornberry meant that private comment to Flint humorously? I don't know - and nor do you, I assume.

I do know that Flint meant Thornberry harm by publicly revealing a private comment that could be viewed negatively.

I also knew Flint a bit several decades ago - a friendly, chatty person, but very career-oriented, unsubtle & lacking in humour.

 

Never take up a career in journalism, will you? If you're so quick to jump to biased conclusions, you'd be absolute rubbish at it! 

[Facecloth]

2 minutes ago, LiberalFox said:

So it's about being part of the opposition to the Tories and that means Labour due to their entrenched position under FPTP?

It's also about bringing labour back to a place where I want to vote for them, like I have in the past.

[Strokes]

15 minutes ago, Milo said:

I sincerely hope that he is openly gay and has not just been outed by that odious toad Tatchell...

That did cross my mind, hopefully not.

[Kendal Fox]

9 minutes ago, LiberalFox said:

Thing is with football you don't treat people differently based on what football team they support, at least not on issues that matter. 

That's not the point though. I was using it as an example that it's possible to come together with others who share varied beliefs and opinions (which I think is healthy and actually on the decline under the current incarnation of Labour) to support something with a distinguished history. 

Edited 15 December 2019 by Kendal Fox

[Kendal Fox]

7 minutes ago, Facecloth said:

It's also about bringing labour back to a place where I want to vote for them, like I have in the past.

Exactly my thoughts on it.

[Alf Bentley]

48 minutes ago, Izzy said:

@Alf Bentleys recruitment drive begins 

 

I'm sure @Facecloth can make his own decisions without me getting involved. Though I'd encourage him to get in touch with his local branch/ward party if he wants to give it a try.

In my experience, most local party members tend to be decent, kind, friendly people, if sometimes a bit dull. You'd have to be unlucky to come across more than the odd bitter, raving extremist, despite media depictions (I was very active in the 80s, another period when the Hard Left were a problem).....except perhaps the odd place in inner London or Merseyside.

 

Although I'm still a Labour Party member, I've not been active for years now. I considered getting active again a couple of years ago, but all the meetings were on a night when I was on parental duty.

I might get involved again, but will probably wait until things calm down a bit - let the people who have been active have their own post-mortem without intruders......then I could get in there to argue with Corbynistas and Blairites alike, as a Soft Left type. 

 

Edited 15 December 2019 by Alf Bentley

[Izzy]

5 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

 

I'm sure @Facecloth can make his own decisions without me getting involved.

In my experience, most local party members tend to be decent, kind, friendly people, if sometimes a bit dull. 

Sounds like he’d fit in perfectly 

[Facecloth]

Just now, Izzy said:

Sounds like he’d fit in perfectly 

You're such a **** 

[Facecloth]

7 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

 

I'm sure @Facecloth can make his own decisions without me getting involved. Though I'd encourage him to get in touch with his local branch/ward party if he wants to give it a try.

In my experience, most local party members tend to be decent, kind, friendly people, if sometimes a bit dull. You'd have to be unlucky to come across more than the odd bitter, raving extremist, despite media depictions (I was very active in the 80s, another period when the Hard Left were a problem).....except perhaps the odd place in inner London or Merseyside.

 

Although I'm still a Labour Party member, I've not been active for years now. I considered getting active again a couple of years, but all the meetings were on a night when I was on parental duty.

I might get involved again, but will probably wait until things calm down a bit - let the people who have been active have their own post-mortem without intruders......then I could get in there to argue with Corbynistas and Blairites alike, as a Soft Left type. 

Yeah I'm think of waiting a little while, not jumping straight in. I think people joining in droves now will give Corbynistas something to grasp on to as the membership numbers increase.

[UpTheLeagueFox]

44 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

1) It makes me laugh how differently some people react to comments, depending on whether it's someone on "their side" or "the other side".

 

2) Never take up a career in journalism, will you? If you're so quick to jump to biased conclusions, you'd be absolute rubbish at it! 

1) There are plenty around who didn't like the result who suggested the electorate is stupid.

 

2) I won't, don't worry, because I would be worse than rubbish at it!