Popular Post Alf Bentley Posted 28 February 2020 Popular Post Share Posted 28 February 2020 14 hours ago, BoyJones said: The likes of JC and DA were desperate to remain in the EU, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeremy_Corbyn#European_Union "Corbyn has previously been a left-wing Eurosceptic. In the 1975 EEC referendum, Corbyn opposed Britain's membership. Corbyn also opposed the ratification of the Maastricht Treaty in 1993, opposed the Lisbon Treaty in 2008, and backed a proposed referendum on Brexit in 2011. He accused the EU of acting "brutally" in the 2015 Greek crisis by allowing financiers to destroy its economy. During his leadership campaign, Corbyn said there might be circumstances in which he would favour withdrawal from the EU. In September 2015, Corbyn said that Labour would campaign for Britain to stay in the EU regardless of the result of Cameron's negotiations, and instead "pledge to reverse any changes" if Cameron reduced the rights of workers or citizens. In June 2016, in the run-up to the referendum, Corbyn said that there was an "overwhelming case" for staying in the EU. In a speech in London, Corbyn said: "We, the Labour Party, are overwhelmingly for staying in, because we believe the European Union has brought investment, jobs and protection for workers, consumers and the environment." He said he was "seven, or seven and a half" out of 10 for staying in the EU". In other words, Corbyn has been a left-wing Brexiteer since Farage was in short trousers! But once he became leader, he had to advocate Remain during the referendum & a "Labour Brexit" & then referendum, because that was the policy of his party, most of his MPs, most of his members and most of his voters. But he was rightly criticised for his half-hearted contribution to the referendum campaign (by Alan Johnson, who led it, among others) - he refused most interviews & did very little campaigning, apart from speaking to party audiences (where there were few votes to be won). 14 hours ago, BoyJones said: despite this meaning giving away our fishing rights, dissolving the armed forces by 2030, opening all borders, getting rid of the pound, giving Brussels (Berlin) the right to make all new laws and tax laws for the UK. We would have ended up a vassal state on the periphery of the action, part of a federal Europe in which we would have had no say. You've been blending the Daily Express with acid and injecting it intravenously, haven't you? 3 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tuna Posted 28 February 2020 Share Posted 28 February 2020 Thought this was a spoof when it came up on twitter - also the replies !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 28 February 2020 Share Posted 28 February 2020 1 hour ago, Tuna said: Thought this was a spoof when it came up on twitter - also the replies !! Open to anyone as well Well there is my Saturday afternoon sorted with no football, a few cans and ringing up Labour members asking them to vote for Burgon. Thought Nandy comfortably won the hastings on Sky last night. RBL has nothing does she? Can't believe she was the best that the hard left could put up, McDonnell would have been a better shout even with his IRA connections. Starmer says a lot without saying anything and his speeches should be available for insomniacs on the NHS. He's more Iain Duncan-Smith than Ed Miliband. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Oxlong Posted 28 February 2020 Share Posted 28 February 2020 (edited) 6 hours ago, Tuna said: Thought this was a spoof when it came up on twitter - also the replies !! Edited 28 February 2020 by Mike Oxlong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kopfkino Posted 28 February 2020 Share Posted 28 February 2020 Disappointed RLB has spent the last x years being a slave to the hard left, you can tell she doesn't really believe that stuff but that's what you get for being an arse lick. She'd be by far and away the best candidate if she had forged her own path. Also its painful seeing the delusion about their policies being popular. Asking people whether they would support or oppose nationalising x is a hell of a lot different to the policy being popular. Either define it so its not just a nebulous concept or add I couldn't give a **** as an option and the story would be different. Moreover, the policy can be popular but if you're seen as frivolous then it matters not one jot. The Conservatives won the election because they had simple messaging and deliverable policies on people's top priorities, Get Brexit Done, 50000 nurses, 20000 police officers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 1 March 2020 Share Posted 1 March 2020 Burgon on Marr this morning, should be a laugh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr The Singh Posted 1 March 2020 Share Posted 1 March 2020 59 minutes ago, MattP said: Burgon on Marr this morning, should be a laugh. He was good Dianne Abbott good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 2 March 2020 Share Posted 2 March 2020 He believes this as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alf Bentley Posted 2 March 2020 Share Posted 2 March 2020 45 minutes ago, MattP said: He believes this as well. That comment won Dawn Butler a 4th choice vote from me. I was clear that I'd be voting for Murray, Rayner & Allin-Khan ahead of either Burgon or Butler, but just couldn't bring myself to decide which of the latter two was least worst. Thankfully, Richard has now cleared that up for me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 2 March 2020 Share Posted 2 March 2020 4 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said: That comment won Dawn Butler a 4th choice vote from me. I was clear that I'd be voting for Murray, Rayner & Allin-Khan ahead of either Burgon or Butler, but just couldn't bring myself to decide which of the latter two was least worst. Thankfully, Richard has now cleared that up for me! FWIT I think you've got your vote absolutely spot on. I would be Nandy/KS/RBL and Murray/Khan/Rayner/Butler/Burgon. The biggest job for Starmer (assuming his courting of Corbynistas is a front just to win) is going to how he slots a few of them into the shadow cabinet into positions where they can't do too much damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alf Bentley Posted 2 March 2020 Share Posted 2 March 2020 5 minutes ago, MattP said: FWIT I think you've got your vote absolutely spot on. That's deeply worrying. I've clearly become a filthy Tory. 5 minutes ago, MattP said: The biggest job for Starmer (assuming his courting of Corbynistas is a front just to win) is going to how he slots a few of them into the shadow cabinet into positions where they can't do too much damage. Yep. Better than having them outside the tent pissing in, though. I could imagine some, such as Long-Bailey, largely playing a team game from the front bench. I also think that Labour will need to offer some attractive, radical policies both to appeal to voters and to keep most of the membership onside. In turbulent times, bland moderation and technocratic competence is unlikely to be enough. Assuming Starmer wins, he'll have to think carefully about what he does with idiots like Burgon, though - I could imagine Dicky Boy seeing himself as the new Tony Benn, foghorning leftist slogans as the "Left's leader in waiting" and giving the right-wing media all the ammunition they want for negative stories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Innovindil Posted 2 March 2020 Share Posted 2 March 2020 7 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said: I've clearly become a filthy Tory. Welcome Alf. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajthefox Posted 2 March 2020 Share Posted 2 March 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, MattP said: He believes this as well. I've not been paying much attention but everything I have seen points to Burgon being absolutely clueless. How anyone can seriously think that Corbyn isn't part of Labour's problem in winning a GE is beyond me. Edit: The more I see the train photo the more and more he reminds me of a child who has politely been told over and over again he's very able at something but is actually woefully inadequate and now he's just embarassing himself but he doesn't understand why. I almost feel sorry for him just looking at his face. Edited 2 March 2020 by ajthefox 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 3 March 2020 Share Posted 3 March 2020 https://www.thesun.co.uk/tvandshowbiz/11084704/eddie-izzard-the-sun/ EDDIE Izzard says he is quitting comedy to stand as a Labour MP. Shove him in Bradford West, see how he gets on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davieG Posted 3 March 2020 Share Posted 3 March 2020 1 hour ago, MattP said: https://www.thesun.co.uk/tvandshowbiz/11084704/eddie-izzard-the-sun/ EDDIE Izzard says he is quitting comedy to stand as a Labour MP. Shove him in Bradford West, see how he gets on. We'll probably get more laughs from him than we do as a professional comic. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 4 March 2020 Share Posted 4 March 2020 Set the record for Andrew Neil tonight. Hour special on BBC2 at 7 interviewing Starmer and RBL. Good on them both for agreeing as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dames Posted 4 March 2020 Share Posted 4 March 2020 I voted for Starmer and Allin-Kahn as they only sensible and credible options out of the choice presented. I like a lot of what Nandy says but this is too early for her. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WigstonWanderer Posted 4 March 2020 Share Posted 4 March 2020 Are we there yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kopfkino Posted 4 March 2020 Share Posted 4 March 2020 Good stuff from well intelligent lawyer man Sir Keir tonight. When asked about whether he'd defied Jeremy with his comments in January 19 where he said he wanted a 2nd ref and to campaign for to remain he said that shadow cabinet had decided on 2nd ref policy at that point so he didn't defy Jeremy. Later he mentioned how he had voted for a deal in the indicative votes before they had got to a 2nd ref position. Good stuff. I am dead excited for when the middle class public sector workers and angry students realise that dull and drab Keir, for all his intelligence and the positions he's held, comes across as exactly that and won't be able to beat a government that is just an unimaginative and terrible imitation of New Labour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guesty Posted 4 March 2020 Share Posted 4 March 2020 (edited) So frustrating watching them on Andrew Neil. It's like they've spent so long in a bubble talking to people who only agree with them they completely fall apart when challenged. Starmer was a bit of a car crash. Then Long-Bailey turned up and it was like a multi-pile car crash after the barriers didn't lift due to a trainwreck. How she thinks saying things like Labour's message didn't get through at the election was because their arguments were too intellectualised for their ordinary voters is going to win them back is beyond me. Squrims when she has to defend her defense of anti-semitism. Squirms when it turns out her main role as a soliciter for 7 years was to help the private sector build NHS buildings through PFI - yet seems to stand on a platform of the NHS needs to be protected from the private sector. Edited 5 March 2020 by Guesty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 5 March 2020 Share Posted 5 March 2020 14 hours ago, Kopfkino said: Good stuff from well intelligent lawyer man Sir Keir tonight. When asked about whether he'd defied Jeremy with his comments in January 19 where he said he wanted a 2nd ref and to campaign for to remain he said that shadow cabinet had decided on 2nd ref policy at that point so he didn't defy Jeremy. Later he mentioned how he had voted for a deal in the indicative votes before they had got to a 2nd ref position. Good stuff. I am dead excited for when the middle class public sector workers and angry students realise that dull and drab Keir, for all his intelligence and the positions he's held, comes across as exactly that and won't be able to beat a government that is just an unimaginative and terrible imitation of New Labour. Starmer is even shitter than I thought he was. I only managed to stay awake watching it because of Andrew Neil. No responsibility for anything that happened and his devotion to Corbyn is weird. There is courting the memberships but he's already promising to implement his manifesto. "Do you want free movement to continue" "We spoke a lot about free movement" They think the red wall is coming back with him? Nuts. RBL is crap but she might be a better shout than him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dames Posted 6 March 2020 Share Posted 6 March 2020 Starmer has to play a game as a lot of the membership are still very much members of Corbyns personality cult. Until this contest is over he is going to have to spend a lot of his time and energy appealing to them. I imagine if/when he wins he’ll be clever enough to shift his focus to winning the general public over. The manifesto was no feasible, every sensible person knows this. The Corbyn cult are not sensible and until they are won over it would not be a smart move to start trashing the manifesto. There is no way any new Labour leader would continue to campaign on a manifesto that lead the party to such a huge defeat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 7 March 2020 Share Posted 7 March 2020 19 hours ago, Dames said: Starmer has to play a game as a lot of the membership are still very much members of Corbyns personality cult. Until this contest is over he is going to have to spend a lot of his time and energy appealing to them. I imagine if/when he wins he’ll be clever enough to shift his focus to winning the general public over. The manifesto was no feasible, every sensible person knows this. The Corbyn cult are not sensible and until they are won over it would not be a smart move to start trashing the manifesto. There is no way any new Labour leader would continue to campaign on a manifesto that lead the party to such a huge defeat. Whenever he is asked on this he seems to want to keep absolutely everything, he is surely making this more difficult for himself than he needs too. The biggest weight on the shoulders of Labour long term is going to be the commitment to a net zero target of carbon emissions by 2030 - this will effectively be at the end of the term of whoever wins the next election. Do people want to tackle the issue? Of course. Will they vote for a party who will effectively have to ban domestic flights, ration car usage and gas heating? I can't see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lionator Posted 17 March 2020 Share Posted 17 March 2020 The landscape of this has completely changed now. The demand for a stronger social welfare system post COVID-19 will be apparent which gives the new leader something to work with. Furthermore, appearing as trustworthy and a safe pair of hands (aka KS) will probably have a lot more value than simply personality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 19 March 2020 Share Posted 19 March 2020 Only he could genuinely believe the Chinese government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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