Bellend Sebastian Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 42 minutes ago, Voll Blau said: Interesting that Starmer thinks he'll be fighting an election by 2023... https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/apr/03/we-have-a-once-in-a-generation-chance-to-rethink-our-future-lets-get-britain-working-again I read something at the weekend - possibly also in The Guardian - that the rationale is that the inevitable economic headwinds coming our way won't have been felt fully by then, so the Tories will want to have an election sooner rather than later. It makes sense I suppose - the longer you're in power, the more responsibility you have to take for things that might be going awry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UpTheLeagueFox Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 Latest leadership ratings for Boris and the other chap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UpTheLeagueFox Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpe's Fox Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 18 minutes ago, UpTheLeagueFox said: Latest leadership ratings for Boris and the other chap Starmer really has had a disaster since November after a very good summer. If Hartlepool and the May elections go badly and the next 6 months are as bad as the last I think he is toast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 32 minutes ago, Sharpe's Fox said: Starmer really has had a disaster since November after a very good summer. If Hartlepool and the May elections go badly and the next 6 months are as bad as the last I think he is toast. Corned beef on toast? Its probably quite nice to be fair, I’ll report back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buce Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 4 minutes ago, Strokes said: Corned beef on toast? Its probably quite nice to be fair, I’ll report back. There's only one way to eat corned beef, and that's Corned Beef Hash (just go easy on the hash... ) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voll Blau Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 42 minutes ago, Sharpe's Fox said: Starmer really has had a disaster since November after a very good summer. If Hartlepool and the May elections go badly and the next 6 months are as bad as the last I think he is toast. Say that does happen, who do you replace him with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 11 minutes ago, Voll Blau said: Say that does happen, who do you replace him with? Old McDonnell. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alf Bentley Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 47 minutes ago, Sharpe's Fox said: Starmer really has had a disaster since November after a very good summer. If Hartlepool and the May elections go badly and the next 6 months are as bad as the last I think he is toast. Labour/Starmer poll ratings in recent months have been bad - and I know that you're not keen on his politics in the first place. But, in all honesty, has he done anything different in recent months compared to last year, when he was getting good polls and Johnson's were plummeting? Geoff's poll states that Labour was last ahead in a poll in January. So, the poll collapse coincides precisely with the successful vaccination programme, roadmap for escape from lockdown and mood of greater hope/optimism (which might not last forever). As I've said before, if he had announced some great new vision/policies during peak Covid, I doubt he'd have got much positive attention or be getting better polls than he is now......though he certainly needs to start making an impression from now. Unfortunately, I reckon the Hartlepool/May elections will go badly, unless he produces something spectacularly popular soon or (more likely) something goes badly wrong for Johnson. Labour might narrowly hang on to Hartlepool but my money would be on the Tories as they'll harvest more of the massive 2019 Brexit Party vote than Labour, the outgoing Lab MP was in a scandal & there's a vaccine feelgood factor. 6 months? I'd hope that the party would give him at least 12 months to turn this round.....but he could be in trouble after that, if things continue like this. But with Covid dominating the agenda less, he should have an audience on other issues so must take that opportunity and sharpish. There's also an awful lot that could go wrong for Johnson within 6-12 months. This - or May elections - might be as good as it gets for the Tories and as bad as it gets for Labour. It's like in football, a year isn't often long enough to judge a "new manager".... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpe's Fox Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 22 minutes ago, Voll Blau said: Say that does happen, who do you replace him with? I'd imagine the Labour Right will have someone in place. I'm on the left of the party but am struggling. There really is a dearth of talent in the parliamentary party as a result of dropped in candidates and factionalism at the national level and this is due to all wings of the party. I think a primary system to find really talented local candidates could have helped but the right would never of let it happen. If you forced me to pick anyone? I'd say Clive Lewis but that's my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bovril Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 Just now, Alf Bentley said: Labour might narrowly hang on to Hartlepool but my money would be on the Tories as they'll harvest more of the massive 2019 Brexit Party vote than Labour, the outgoing Lab MP was in a scandal & there's a vaccine feelgood factor. Leave the monkey out of this. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpe's Fox Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said: Labour/Starmer poll ratings in recent months have been bad - and I know that you're not keen on his politics in the first place. But, in all honesty, has he done anything different in recent months compared to last year, when he was getting good polls and Johnson's were plummeting? Honestly? I think people have worked out he is a crap politician. When he was elected I, like most on the left, gave him the benefit of the doubt. He had led a big public institution, did the ten pledges thing and I sort of bought the argument you need a professional looking person to sell some sort of Corbyn/McDonnell-lite. That made sense. Since then though he really has been all at sea with the Jeremy Corbyn thing and the response to Covid. Just all over the place. Him and the people around him sold that he was professional but it just seems like his office runs a shoddy operation that goes from one week to the next. Edited 6 April 2021 by Sharpe's Fox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alf Bentley Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 15 minutes ago, Strokes said: Old McDonnell. I'd guess you're joking, but Starmer could do worse than bring him in from the cold (say, with a prominent economic role - overseeing public investment or Green New Deal). I very much doubt that McDonnell would be up for that, even if Starmer was. But McDonnell is a shrewd customer (much more so than Corbyn), strong on economics, has a bit of personality and it might reduce the risk of party splits with the Left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 1 minute ago, Alf Bentley said: I'd guess you're joking, but Starmer could do worse than bring him in from the cold (say, with a prominent economic role - overseeing public investment or Green New Deal). I very much doubt that McDonnell would be up for that, even if Starmer was. But McDonnell is a shrewd customer (much more so than Corbyn), strong on economics, has a bit of personality and it might reduce the risk of party splits with the Left. Yeah I’m massively joking, an appointment like that would close the door for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alf Bentley Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 2 minutes ago, Strokes said: Yeah I’m massively joking, an appointment like that would close the door for me. I wouldn't want McDonnell to be leader - and don't think Starmer deserves to get the boot (though he has a crucial year ahead of him). But despite not being a Corbynista, I liked McDonnell as Shadow Chancellor and don't see why he couldn't be a valuable member of the Starmer team (though probably not Shadow Chancellor again). If anything, his ideas on a National Investment Bank and a Green Industrial Revolution could be more relevant in the times of post-Covid reconstruction than they were pre-2019. Probably won't happen.... I don't see Starmer as some centrist Blair Mk. 2, as some on the Left like to do - and think he'd fail if he tried to do that in a turbulent post-Covid environment. Labour needs to seem competent, yes, but also needs to have a radical edge in what could become tough times, post-Covid & post-Brexit. There should be a (controlled) role within that for saner figures from the Left, like McDonnell & Long-Bailey. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon the Hat Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 2 hours ago, Alf Bentley said: I wouldn't want McDonnell to be leader - and don't think Starmer deserves to get the boot (though he has a crucial year ahead of him). But despite not being a Corbynista, I liked McDonnell as Shadow Chancellor and don't see why he couldn't be a valuable member of the Starmer team (though probably not Shadow Chancellor again). If anything, his ideas on a National Investment Bank and a Green Industrial Revolution could be more relevant in the times of post-Covid reconstruction than they were pre-2019. Probably won't happen.... I don't see Starmer as some centrist Blair Mk. 2, as some on the Left like to do - and think he'd fail if he tried to do that in a turbulent post-Covid environment. Labour needs to seem competent, yes, but also needs to have a radical edge in what could become tough times, post-Covid & post-Brexit. There should be a (controlled) role within that for saner figures from the Left, like McDonnell & Long-Bailey. Sane. Good one. If you want to never see a Labour Government again that seems the way to go. I would settle for a decent opposition at the moment. Literally no one in Parliament or elsewhere is holding this shower of a Government to account. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bovril Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 Labour 6/4 to win Hartlepool is still a good price imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UpTheLeagueFox Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UpTheLeagueFox Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 6 minutes ago, bovril said: Labour 6/4 to win Hartlepool is still a good price imo. That's an excellent price. Polls like this should mobilise the Labour troops on the ground. Good chance they'll sneak the seat again. But there seems to be plenty of the usual hard left nutters on social media hoping Keef loses so they can get one of their own back in. Surely pulling the warring factions together for the greater good of getting the Tories out would be a better solution, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bovril Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 Just now, UpTheLeagueFox said: That's an excellent price. Polls like this should mobilise the Labour troops on the ground. Good chance they'll sneak the seat again. But there seems to be plenty of the usual hard left nutters on social media hoping Keef loses so they can get one of their own back in. Surely pulling the warring factions together for the greater good of getting the Tories out would be a better solution, no? You have said yourself that social media isn't real life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UpTheLeagueFox Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 2 minutes ago, bovril said: You have said yourself that social media isn't real life. It isn't real life. What's your point though? Are the left and right of Labour closely aligned to GTTO or more interested in their own faction? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bovril Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 Just now, UpTheLeagueFox said: It isn't real life. What's your point though? Are the left and right of Labour closely aligned to GTTO or more interested in their own faction? My point is that you seem to give more credence to views on social media when they confirm your own beliefs. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UpTheLeagueFox Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 2 minutes ago, bovril said: My point is that you seem to give more credence to views on social media when they confirm your own beliefs. I see nonsense from all sides, all parties on social media and take them all with a large dose of salt. I was asking a question about the alleged warring factions inside Labour. This is the politics thread, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bovril Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 Just now, UpTheLeagueFox said: I see nonsense from all sides, all parties on social media and take them all with a large dose of salt. I was asking a question about the alleged warring factions inside Labour. This is the politics thread, no? It's funny though as others have mentioned that you actually repeat insults and retweet nonsense from "hard left nutters", seemingly unaware. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UpTheLeagueFox Posted 6 April 2021 Share Posted 6 April 2021 2 minutes ago, bovril said: It's funny though as others have mentioned that you actually repeat insults and retweet nonsense from "hard left nutters", seemingly unaware. Not sure I've ever retweeted nonsense from far left nutters but can check my Twitter timeline if that helps, sir. As for the original question, is it incorrect the left and right of the Labour party are not as closely aligned as they perhaps ought to be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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