Brendan Rodgers

[ian__marshall]

22 minutes ago, smudgerfox said:

He’d worked with Ryan Bennett too

In hindsight that was the first glimpse at was was to come. Scary when you look back at it. 

[MancFox24]

2 hours ago, Claudio Fannieri said:

I am really not sure how it can get any worse than it currently is under Rodgers. A manager earning in the region of £10m and has effectively checked out and downed tools, we have a squad devoid of confidence and a number of players that have been frozen out or regressing under stale and stubborn tactics. We have scored 1 goal in our last 5 games against premier league opposition, losing all 5 games. We are turning up to games at present and literally waving a white flag, we have not won a game in which we have conceded this season. We have such a weak mentality and this comes from the Manager, a change would lift the whole club and playing squad, however what the board have to do is make sure that the interim management team and then the subsequent permanent team are fully aligned and buy into the vision of the club and  how we want to move forward. 

What tactics would you use then? Long ball, higher press, crosses into the box? I just don't see any of those options available to us with the squad we've got. The biggest issues with this squad are the keeper, lack of cover for Evans, and not having a left footed right winger. Rodgers was publically saying for ages about needing 2 centre backs and a winger. Part of it is his fault cus of the Vestegaard signing (although I maintain that was a panic buy after Fofana's injury). But the fact that we're midway through the 3rd window in a row of still not addressing these things is ridiculous. I'm convinced if we do then we'll finish mid table. If not it's gonna be a real struggle whoever is in charge

 

[Claudio Fannieri]

6 minutes ago, MancFox24 said:

What tactics would you use then? Long ball, higher press, crosses into the box? I just don't see any of those options available to us with the squad we've got. The biggest issues with this squad are the keeper, lack of cover for Evans, and not having a left footed right winger. Rodgers was publically saying for ages about needing 2 centre backs and a winger. Part of it is his fault cus of the Vestegaard signing (although I maintain that was a panic buy after Fofana's injury). But the fact that we're midway through the 3rd window in a row of still not addressing these things is ridiculous. I'm convinced if we do then we'll finish mid table. If not it's gonna be a real struggle whoever is in charge

 

So you really think that the slow pedestrian based possession based style suits our players, if so why did we have that run of success pre World Cup where we played a counter attacking style and higher intensity and lo and behold won a few games and players like Barnes, Faes, Soumare and Daka looked to be playing with confidence and in some degree of form, we returned to Brendan Ball after resumption and we look horrific. 
 

I get the call outs about lack of investment but the tactics are appalling and I refuse to accept this is all he can do, pre World Cup proved this. 

[Vazman]

49 minutes ago, Dahnsouff said:

That stylish and painfully accurate quote is from me I think, but I am not a WUM but a contrarian or at least I like to consider alternate reasons rather than just parroting the current narrative

 

Also, @ARTY_FOX was replying to someone else

 

Hope this helps  

 

You mean argumentative, only kidding I like your alternative views and opinions 👍

[MancFox24]

1 minute ago, Claudio Fannieri said:

So you really think that the slow pedestrian based possession based style suits our players, if so why did we have that run of success pre World Cup where we played a counter attacking style and higher intensity and lo and behold won a few games and players like Barnes, Faes, Soumare and Daka looked to be playing with confidence and in some degree of form, we returned to Brendan Ball after resumption and we look horrific. 
 

I get the call outs about lack of investment but the tactics are appalling and I refuse to accept this is all he can do, pre World Cup proved this. 

No I don't think it suits Ward, Amartey and the non existent right winger. I do think it would be fine if we sorted those issues. Because what you call pedestrian build up play can be turned into patient build up play with a cutting edge. And you must know the difference between pre and post world cup is no Maddison, even though you didn't mention him in the list of players there. The fact is we've got a squad that is so unbalanced that we're totally reliant on 1 player.  Whether you blame Rodgers, the board, or both for that, I just don't see a change in manager being the answer 

[Guppys Love Child]

8 minutes ago, Claudio Fannieri said:

So you really think that the slow pedestrian based possession based style suits our players, if so why did we have that run of success pre World Cup where we played a counter attacking style and higher intensity and lo and behold won a few games and players like Barnes, Faes, Soumare and Daka looked to be playing with confidence and in some degree of form, we returned to Brendan Ball after resumption and we look horrific. 
 

I get the call outs about lack of investment but the tactics are appalling and I refuse to accept this is all he can do, pre World Cup proved this. 

Spot on ! 

 

I have said much the same in my 'Work Place' debates..

If we press and try and actually get over our halfway line with more urgency and also look to pass quickly, instead of the 38 side and backwards passes  just for proesssion sake under the excuse of "controlling the game" (all this does is give the opposition time to get back and reorganise themselves) we look a far better team, it plays to the strength of our squad and the results when we adopt this style have been more positive. In addition we are more entertaining to watch aswell.

[Claudio Fannieri]

4 minutes ago, MancFox24 said:

No I don't think it suits Ward, Amartey and the non existent right winger. I do think it would be fine if we sorted those issues. Because what you call pedestrian build up play can be turned into patient build up play with a cutting edge. And you must know the difference between pre and post world cup is no Maddison, even though you didn't mention him in the list of players there. The fact is we've got a squad that is so unbalanced that we're totally reliant on 1 player.  Whether you blame Rodgers, the board, or both for that, I just don't see a change in manager being the answer 

I actually think your argument regards Maddison actually strengthens the case for a change of manager as currently we are playing a style and tactical set up that is built around one player….. Maddison is a big miss but the Manager is paid considerable amounts of money to come up with alternative formations and selections to negate this. 
 

everyone is happy to heap praise on Rodgers for changing shape when we lost Barnes and Madders to injury and it coincided with Vardy and Iheanacho linking up to great effect and us winning the FA Cup so in this is instance he has to bear the brunt of the criticism that year we are playing a system and style that isn’t working and our players look devoid of confidence 

[Rusko187]

2 hours ago, J. James said:

Good managers are like good teachers, any fool can take a class of very bright kids and get them to excel!

 Conversely it takes a good teacher to get the not so bright ones to achieve excellence.

Good teachers recognise the strengths of their pupils and maximise their talents - they dont expect the kid who's a good artist but poor at maths to suddenly become the next Pythagoras,they work to encourage the person to excel in art!

 

There are teachers and managers who are good with near genius level charges and others who are good with the ones who are at or below average.

 

The great teachers/ managers are the ones who can take all abilities and elevate and enthuse, and those are very few.

 

Great managers take an average squad, improve them and play them to their strengths.

 

Great managers can and do adapt, recognising when a change of plan is needed.

 

Great managers take responsibility.

 

Great managers get paid £10 million a year.

Yeah I agree, Rodgers isn't any of that though. 

 

Team unmotivated and playing poorly

Sticking to the same tactics

Underhandedly passing off blame to the club for failures

 

He isn't a great manager.

[ealingfox]

We are not just on the path to oblivion, we have typed oblivion into the satnav and arranged several property viewings in central oblivion. Bloody ridiculous. 

[MancFox24]

2 minutes ago, Claudio Fannieri said:

I actually think your argument regards Maddison actually strengthens the case for a change of manager as currently we are playing a style and tactical set up that is built around one player….. Maddison is a big miss but the Manager is paid considerable amounts of money to come up with alternative formations and selections to negate this. 
 

everyone is happy to heap praise on Rodgers for changing shape when we lost Barnes and Madders to injury and it coincided with Vardy and Iheanacho linking up to great effect and us winning the FA Cup so in this is instance he has to bear the brunt of the criticism that year we are playing a system and style that isn’t working and our players look devoid of confidence 

I don't think his tactics are centred around Maddison. He's actually using Maddison out of position because of the lack of balance in the squad. If we could solve the problem areas of the pitch we wouldn't be so reliant on Maddison.

 

Not sure if you're saying we should go to vardy/daka and Iheanacho up front. If so it would mean 3 at the back (dont have the centre backs to do it) or 4-4-2 (not sure where KDH or Maddison fit into that system). 

 

I just think some (not you necessarily) want to party like it's 2016 again and go back to having 30% possession and knocking it long into the channels for vardy. I'm fine with having a team where the centre backs have the most touches in the game, most of the best teams do, the problem is when you've got Amartey as one of those centre backs and you're lacking a cutting edge on one of the flanks. If we solve those issues we can go back to being a decent team

[ClaphamFox]

35 minutes ago, MancFox24 said:

No I don't think it suits Ward, Amartey and the non existent right winger. I do think it would be fine if we sorted those issues. Because what you call pedestrian build up play can be turned into patient build up play with a cutting edge. And you must know the difference between pre and post world cup is no Maddison, even though you didn't mention him in the list of players there. The fact is we've got a squad that is so unbalanced that we're totally reliant on 1 player.  Whether you blame Rodgers, the board, or both for that, I just don't see a change in manager being the answer 

We've gained points in seven games this season - five wins and two draws. Maddison appeared in six of those - the 2-0 win against Leeds was the only game in which we've picked up points without Maddison in the team. Dewsbury-Hall played in all seven of those games. 

 

I still think Rodgers could do a lot better with the players at his disposal, but the impact on the team of Maddison's absence should not be underestimated. I also think we've badly missed KDH's work rate in recent matches.

Edited 17 January 2023 by ClaphamFox

[ARTY_FOX]

1 hour ago, Dahnsouff said:

That stylish and painfully accurate quote is from me I think, but I am not a WUM but a contrarian or at least I like to consider alternate reasons rather than just parroting the current narrative

 

Also, @ARTY_FOX was replying to someone else

 

Hope this helps  

 

Yes I was 

 

 

[Dahnsouff]

Just now, ARTY_FOX said:

Yes I was 

 

 

As well as telling me off!   

[Les-TA-Jon]

2 hours ago, volpeazzurro said:

Very true, but Ranieri didn't have much of the talent in the squad that Rodgers has had available to him for 3 years.

I wasn't trying to be pro-Rodgers. I was just using the historical precedent of Ranieri's sacking to try and inform what might happen with Rodgers. 

 

It indicates that rightly or wrongly - they will give him more time. 

 

They've also played themselves into a corner, because now would be a terrible time to change manager, given the window and fixture list

[Kilworthfox]

3 minutes ago, ClaphamFox said:

We've gained points in seven games this season - five wins and a draw. Maddison appeared in six of those - the 2-0 win against Leeds was the only game in which we've picked up points without Maddison in the team. Dewsbury-Hall played in all seven of those games. 

 

I still think Rodgers could do a lot better with the players art his disposal, but the impact on the team of Maddison's absence should not be underestimated. I also think we've badly missed KDH's work rate in recent matches.

So if we lose 1 or 2 players the gameplan fails to produce wins? 

 

Is that a sign of a good management? 

[ARTY_FOX]

3 minutes ago, Dahnsouff said:

As well as telling me off!   

I don't think I was. I know you like to play devil's advocate. It's something I can appreciate alot. 

 

But don't do it again! 

Edited 17 January 2023 by ARTY_FOX

[Bablemikey]

We have a major overhaul & rebuild project facing us. I’d be looking very closely at Vincent Company. What he & his management team have done at Burnley is both surprising and outstanding.

[ClaphamFox]

2 minutes ago, Kilworthfox said:

So if we lose 1 or 2 players the gameplan fails to produce wins? 

 

Is that a sign of a good management? 

It's the sign of a team that is massively dependent on the availability on a small number of quality players.

 

This does not excuse tactical incoherence, unmotivated players, a failure to do the basics, mental fragility, etc. As I said, Rodgers could and should be able to do better with the players available. But the fact is, we are very reliant on 3-4 players being available and performing week-in, week-out. Without them, we look like a Championship side.

[FoxinNotts]

2 minutes ago, Bablemikey said:

We have a major overhaul & rebuild project facing us. I’d be looking very closely at Vincent Company. What he & his management team have done at Burnley is both surprising and outstanding.

and why would h leave Burnley for us? especially as our trajectories are heading in differing directions

[Kilworthfox]

2 minutes ago, ClaphamFox said:

It's the sign of a team that is massively dependent on the availability on a small number of quality players.

 

This does not excuse tactical incoherence, unmotivated players, a failure to do the basics, mental fragility, etc. As I said, Rodgers could and should be able to do better with the players available. But the fact is, we are very reliant on 3-4 players being available and performing week-in, week-out. Without them, we look like a Championship side.

Agreed. 

 

How has it come to this? 

[SecretPro]

13 minutes ago, FoxinNotts said:

and why would h leave Burnley for us? especially as our trajectories are heading in differing directions

But, but, but, we've got a good training ground?

[Dahnsouff]

2 minutes ago, SecretPro said:

But, but, but, we've got a cursed training ground?

 

Edited 17 January 2023 by Dahnsouff

[FrankieADZ]

22 minutes ago, Bablemikey said:

We have a major overhaul & rebuild project facing us. I’d be looking very closely at Vincent Company. What he & his management team have done at Burnley is both surprising and outstanding.

we should really look at what Brighton or Newcastle(smart investment, not the money side) have done

 

Since Rodgers got more control we have gone backwards, no denying that, recruitment has for mostly been crap, I know Puel got a bad rep but jesus we wasnt half as bad as we are and have been, plus signings under him seemed to have a plan you know, 

[ARTY_FOX]

26 minutes ago, FoxinNotts said:

and why would h leave Burnley for us? especially as our trajectories are heading in differing directions

That's like asking why Alex Neil left Sunderland for Stoke. 

[Happy Fox]

What is our ambition this season staying up? In which case Rodgers is not the man for the job.