Brendan Rodgers

[coolhandfox]

1 hour ago, Astleyfox said:

Its not a proper trophy though, is it?

Take you weren't jumping around when we beat PSV or Rennes? Will you be sitting quietly if we win in Albania in the last minute? 

 

English snobbery, did you see the reaction of the Rennes and PSV fans when they lost?  

[foxes_rule1978]

1 hour ago, Astleyfox said:

Its not a proper trophy though, is it?

Well it is a proper trophy yes, plus a route into Europe next year 

[coolhandfox]

21 minutes ago, volpeazzurro said:

Not so much the trophy but what it leads to. However, what's the point in that if Rodgers treats it as he did this year? I think part of the reason he's only treated this competition seriously is down to him thinking of himself. His management skills this year, despite any media love ins, essentially put him out of the running of any big job and we're currently the best he can get. If he gets the push here I can see his career nosediving. 

Rodgers is living rent free in your head.

 

Think you are over thinking all this, take it you have meet the man to have such insight into his psyche.

[volpeazzurro]

Just now, HighPeakFox said:

Volpe, you're going to have to explain this to me.

I just think that performances in the Premiership have been so poor, that without the run he's had in this competition (even the media have used the very thin excuse that we're concentrating on Europe 🤭), then I think job wise, he'd be skating on thin ice.

 

As they say, the table doesn't lie and even forgetting the dismal football being served up, ignoring the top 4 etc, look at all the teams that are currently a couple of points or so either side of us from 8th down to 16th. Even Newcastle that until recently were considered dead and buried by some and they're above us! Hardly big spenders yet either. Proper management of a team utilising their strengths?

 

At the start of the season, notwithstanding some of the bigger clubs spent well, we still had a squad on paper that could reasonably be expected to finish around 5th to 7th. Yes, we had injuries, as did others but even our squad players on paper are far better than some of those teams just below us including Brentford who just got promoted and a Southampton team we thrashed 9 nil before Rodgers started weaving his magic. Yes people point to 2 top 5 finishes but, with the players he had then compared to our then competitors, that really wasn't over-achieving at all. 

 

His tactics and failed philosophy have been readily apparent for about a year now. The current European exploits are merely papering over the cracks imo. Give this man full reign to spend money to prop that failed system of play up further and you have a recipe for disaster. 

 

My point was that had it not been the saving grace of this competition, his league performances would have perhaps had him under far more scrutiny I believe. 

[David Hankey]

4 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

Take you weren't jumping around when we beat PSV or Rennes? Will you be sitting quietly if we win in Albania in the last minute? 

 

English snobbery, did you see the reaction of the Rennes and PSV fans when they lost?  

I don't think it's snobbery, more like ignorance.

[The Year Of The Fox]

1 hour ago, Astleyfox said:

Its not a proper trophy though, is it?

This is tongue in cheek right?

 

All competitions have to start somewhere

 

The calibre of the quarter finalists showed all we needed to know about it.

 

I don’t like the manager, but would absolutely love it if he could help us win this 

[HighPeakFox]

Just now, volpeazzurro said:

I just think that performances in the Premiership have been so poor, that without the run he's had in this competition (even the media have used the very thin excuse that we're concentrating on Europe 🤭), then I think job wise, he'd be skating on thin ice.

 

As they say, the table doesn't lie and even forgetting the dismal football being served up, ignoring the top 4 etc, look at all the teams that are currently a couple of points or so either side of us from 8th down to 16th. Even Newcastle that until recently were considered dead and buried by some and they're above us! Hardly big spenders yet either. Proper management of a team utilising their strengths?

 

At the start of the season, notwithstanding some of the bigger clubs spent well, we still had a squad on paper that could reasonably be expected to finish around 5th to 7th. Yes, we had injuries, as did others but even our squad players on paper are far better than some of those teams just below us including Brentford who just got promoted and a Southampton team we thrashed 9 nil before Rodgers started weaving his magic. Yes people point to 2 top 5 finishes but, with the players he had then compared to our then competitors, that really wasn't over-achieving at all. 

 

His tactics and failed philosophy have been readily apparent for about a year now. The current European exploits are merely papering over the cracks imo. Give this man full reign to spend money to prop that failed system of play up further and you have a recipe for disaster. 

 

My point was that had it not been the saving grace of this competition, his league performances would have perhaps had him under far more scrutiny I believe. 

And a lot of that is fair comment, even if it's not what I bolded. Despite respecting the case you make, I just don't necessarily agree (and don't want to be dismissed as an apologist either, which helps nobody) - I just don't think his ego comes into it, it's just a repeated piece of pub folklore, essentially. And he has taken this competition seriously - he just wasn't really thinking about it when trying to get top 2 in the Europa League. Those were the bolded comments I was aiming to discuss. 

 

Currently, we're patchy and don't look great at times, but I don't see the awfulness some of you see (although I did not see yesterday) - I see a team/squad/manager trying to gradually steady the ship and find some confidence again after a poorish season and calamitous injuries, on top of 2 mentally damaging season endings. I'm not telling you you're wrong, but there is room for optimism - the world is awful enough without it.

[volpeazzurro]

2 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

Rodgers is living rent free in your head.

 

Think you are over thinking all this, take it you have meet the man to have such insight into his psyche.

Do you not think over a year of poor on field performances, failure to address defensive issues, poor team selections, tactics and strange substitutions with repeated mistakes are not some form of evidence? If you hire someone to repair your car or invest your money, you don't have to know them personally to recognise if their cocking things up.

 

Do you personally, after 3 years, have faith in him enough for him to spend the clubs money on his choice of players? Is there anything in his current or past history to corroborate such faith?

[coolhandfox]

3 minutes ago, The Year Of The Fox said:

This is tongue in cheek right?

 

All competitions have to start somewhere

 

The calibre of the quarter finalists showed all we needed to know about it.

 

I don’t like the manager, but would absolutely love it if he could help us win this 

100% this, The European Cup/CL didn't start off in 1955 the competition it is today, nether did the Europa League in 1971.

 

I get that people don't like the manager, but to undermine achievement like this and the FA Cup and Community shield and this is crazy.

 

We win this, we will have beat Rennes, PSV, Roma and one of Feyenoord or  Marseille in knock out ties/

 

For a club that had managed to win 2 knock out European cup ties in it history before this season that would be some achievement. 

[Ric Flair]

1 hour ago, coolhandfox said:

Playing devil advocate, they aren't fully back and firing in those nine league games; 

 

Fofana has played 270 minutes out of 810 minutes
Evans has played 180 minutes 
Ricardo has played 196 minutes
Castange has played 335 minutes 

Justin has played more but is coming back from an ACL.

 

We have a moaned endless about rushing players back, we are now doing it the right way, and it will take time for them all to be back to their best. 

Maddison needs to be back at ten or in the middle of the park, no doubt, but Hamza is not the answer. He is not good enough.

 

I would like to see KDH and Mendy given a go, but I think you do nullify one of KDH's strengths putting him there, which is his pressing from the front. 

 

I think KHD dip is pretty natural for a player who burst onto the scene; starting well is the easy bit; performing over a season is the hard part.

 

The 3 to help with Mendy's biggest weakness his lack of physicality. He's a lovely little footballer but is easily targeted by a team leading to turnovers. 

 

I'm not surprised to see our links with a Seko Fofana and Sangare. The purchase of Soumare, which seems to have not worked out, indicates we want a solid base in a midfield two of Ndidi and one other or still being able to field that physicality when Ndidi is unavailable.

 

Interesting people's biggest bugbear with BR was his lack of pragmatism in the past. Now, they are beating him for going the other way. I think we sell Youri and bring in a CM in the shape of Fofana or Sangare, allowing us to have two of one of those and Ndidi or KDH. 

 

Maddison is back at 10, quality RW and a fully fit back four, and we will be looking a lot better. 

 

I'm absolutely fine with the defensive rotation, no issue whatsoever and it's the right thing to do to the end of the season and then regroup. It was more a pointer that this current system isn't benefitting from a better calibre of defender then allowing our creative players the platform to be at their most dangerous, we're lucky if we must more than a couple of shots on target of a game, its very workmanlike and we have to properly regroup in the summer. 

 

We seem to have finished the last 3 seasons without the correct players for the system he's deployed. 19/20 and 20/21 he played 3-4-1-2 but the midfield was never right and the wingbacks better full backs than wingbacks and now 4-3-3 the two banks of 3 are not ideal either, its so frustrating.

[The Year Of The Fox]

3 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

100% this, The European Cup/CL didn't start off in 1955 the competition it is today, nether did the Europa League in 1971.

 

I get that people don't like the manager, but to undermine achievement like this and the FA Cup and Community shield and this is crazy.

 

We win this, we will have beat Rennes, PSV, Roma and one of Feyenoord or  Marseille in knock out ties/

 

For a club that had managed to win 2 knock out European cup ties in it history before this season that would be some achievement. 

Steady on though 😅

[BKLFox]

Despite not having a defence for a 3rd of the season, despite apparently playing shit for whole of the season they have still managed to get the same amount of home game points as they did last season after finishing 5th that’s 28pts and they still have 3 home games to play so should surpass.

As most teams form is bred from their home displays are we actually doing that poorly or was last season shit as well??

Edited 24 April 2022 by BKLFox

[volpeazzurro]

4 minutes ago, HighPeakFox said:

And a lot of that is fair comment, even if it's not what I bolded. Despite respecting the case you make, I just don't necessarily agree (and don't want to be dismissed as an apologist either, which helps nobody) - I just don't think his ego comes into it, it's just a repeated piece of pub folklore, essentially. And he has taken this competition seriously - he just wasn't really thinking about it when trying to get top 2 in the Europa League. Those were the bolded comments I was aiming to discuss. 

 

Currently, we're patchy and don't look great at times, but I don't see the awfulness some of you see (although I did not see yesterday) - I see a team/squad/manager trying to gradually steady the ship and find some confidence again after a poorish season and calamitous injuries, on top of 2 mentally damaging season endings. I'm not telling you you're wrong, but there is room for optimism - the world is awful enough without it.

And I fully accept your opinion and acknowledge I may be very wrong. I think the ego thing is partly pub folklore but it gets easier to believe when in interview, it's always the players to blame usually and never himself, even when pundits and supporters alike can recognise glaring errors. It's such lack of ownership of mistakes at times that makes him perhaps come over as a smug know it all professor of football. I suppose we've all come across Billy Bullshits in our different lines of work. Some are better than others and I've been fooled a few times 🤣.

[coolhandfox]

2 minutes ago, volpeazzurro said:

Do you not think over a year of poor on field performances, failure to address defensive issues, poor team selections, tactics and strange substitutions with repeated mistakes are not some form of evidence? If you hire someone to repair your car or invest your money, you don't have to know them personally to recognise if their cocking things up.

Which is all fine observations, rather then sweeping statements about his motivation.

2 minutes ago, volpeazzurro said:

Do you personally, after 3 years, have faith in him enough for him to spend the clubs money on his choice of players? Is there anything in his current or past history to corroborate such faith?

No I trust the club.

 

Under his management we have had some hit and misses just like we have under all LCFC PL managers.

 

Everyone act like we made no poor signings under other managers, for all his good signs Puel spent 38m on Ghezzzal, Benkovic and Ward for Example. 

 

He made some poor signing, but also good ones like Justin, Fofana, Castange 

 

 

[HighPeakFox]

Just now, volpeazzurro said:

And I fully accept your opinion and acknowledge I may be very wrong. I think the ego thing is partly pub folklore but it gets easier to believe when in interview, it's always the players to blame usually and never himself, even when pundits and supporters alike can recognise glaring errors. It's such lack of ownership of mistakes at times that makes him perhaps come over as a smug know it all professor of football. I suppose we've all come across Billy Bullshits in our different lines of work. Some are better than others and I've been fooled a few times 🤣.

And I get why people hear that in his interviews, but I just don't - I don't hear much wrong, but if one cares to look for fault.... it happens enough on this forum, people (not necessarily you, I must emphasise) are just so ready to be offended and play the victim.

[Guest Chocolate Teapot]

The irony of this thread is that i used to think Aston Villa had the most delusional fans, but after yesterday and reading of some of the comments here I'm pretty sure it's us.

[adejo92]

A team who has just spent £100m + on a new training ground, with a squad mostly full of internationals, should not be 10th in the table, 2 points above Brentford!!

 

It wouldn't be so bad if the reason for our poor performances weren't so clear to everyone but Brendan.

 

Feel a bit bad for the owner, this is a massive underachievement for the money invested and he seems happy with it.

 

 

[Fox in the North]

3 minutes ago, adejo92 said:

A team who has just spent £100m + on a new training ground, with a squad mostly full of internationals, should not be 10th in the table, 2 points above Brentford!!

 

It wouldn't be so bad if the reason for our poor performances weren't so clear to everyone but Brendan.

 

Feel a bit bad for the owner, this is a massive underachievement for the money invested and he seems happy with it.

 

 

Completely appreciate your opinion, however the training ground doesn’t just mean instant rewards. Sure it means that the 1st team should feel boosted by better facilities but obvious it’s an investment in the future. St George’s park didn’t mean an instant upturn in Englands fortunes. Just look at the benefit they are now reaping years later. 

[foxinsocks]

56 minutes ago, volpeazzurro said:

Not so much the trophy but what it leads to. However, what's the point in that if Rodgers treats it as he did this year? I think part of the reason he's only treated this competition seriously is down to him thinking of himself. His management skills this year, despite any media love ins, essentially put him out of the running of any big job and we're currently the best he can get. If he gets the push here I can see his career nosediving. 

If this conference competition is so important then I cant understand why we didnt try harder in higher  eufa  competition.

 

 Where we routinely sacrificed points to poor sides

[Guest Chocolate Teapot]

16 minutes ago, adejo92 said:

A team who has just spent £100m + on a new training ground, with a squad mostly full of internationals, should not be 10th in the table, 2 points above Brentford!!

 

It wouldn't be so bad if the reason for our poor performances weren't so clear to everyone but Brendan.

 

Feel a bit bad for the owner, this is a massive underachievement for the money invested and he seems happy with it.

 

 

If its an underachievement for him imagine how it feels for villa, Leeds, everton, etc.... - they've spent more.....

[Foxdiamond]

2 hours ago, Astleyfox said:

Its not a proper trophy though, is it?

Any trophy competing with the likes of PSV, Roma et al is worthy enough in my opinion. Don't think we should dismiss any European trophy. Think of the decades of not a sniff of this sort of match to look forward to

[StanSP]

People like @Astleyfox specifically want us to lose on Thursday because they don't see the value in the competition.

 

I believe the phrase would be cutting your nose off to spite your face? 

[st albans fox]

2 hours ago, Astleyfox said:

Its not a proper trophy though, is it?

Think of it as the old cup winners cup 

 

that was the third option when there were three trophies 

 

wouldn’t have turned my nose up winning that and I won’t do so with this …..

 

over the next decade, the winners of this trophy will all be ‘big sides’ 

[Webbo]

I can't understand how you can support a club, in any sport, and not want to win trophies? 

[Fox in the North]

Irrelevant of what hopes we had at the start of the season, we still have a tangible chance to win a trophy that means European football for a third successive season. Few clubs get a chance these days at silverware because the money involved. Who wouldn’t want 1) another trophy?! 2) more European football irrespective of the level?