Is it just the defence?

[SkidsFox]

I don't claim to be great on the tactics side, so I'm hoping for some feedback on this. We've been on the back foot all season because of all the injuries to our defence, but is the way we play putting extra pressure on our back 4 or 5? Or will we somehow stop conceding easy goals once Wes is back?

[BenTheFox]

It's not just the defence. We defend as a team and our work off the ball is nowhere near good enough. 

[foxes_rule1978]

6 minutes ago, SkidsFox said:

I don't claim to be great on the tactics side, so I'm hoping for some feedback on this. We've been on the back foot all season because of all the injuries to our defence, but is the way we play putting extra pressure on our back 4 or 5? Or will we somehow stop conceding easy goals once Wes is back?

We need leaders on the pitch and I honestly don’t think we have that especially without Vardy. The work rate doesn’t seem high to me and we are far too light weight 

[An Away Move]

8 minutes ago, SkidsFox said:

I don't claim to be great on the tactics side, so I'm hoping for some feedback on this. We've been on the back foot all season because of all the injuries to our defence, but is the way we play putting extra pressure on our back 4 or 5? Or will we somehow stop conceding easy goals once Wes is back?

The defence has been understandably weakened. Fofana offers so much. Not just when defending but interfacing with midfield. I think losing that on the eve of the season was massive. However we also need more movement off the ball in midfield and upfront otherwise the already weakened defence don't have good options. This has been made worse when we've played Vardy as the sole striker as he's lost pace, as clever as he is, and can no longer muscle players off the ball. It's been refreshing to see Daka offer this when we play that system, but his first five yards are slow compared to Vardy. It would be interesting to find out where we rank in terms of player sprints now. We were bottom of the league a while back. That could be a very telling stat IMO. Is it fair to say that a lack of hunger might show up in lack of sprints? Perhaps generosity is missing. The want to sprint for your team mate to offer him an option.

Edited 7 February 2022 by An Away Move

[tickler28]

100% no....players in forward positions losing possession to easily....lazy passing and Ndidi not doing his job to cover the back 4.

[Dahnsouff]

Depends what you mean by 'just the defence', are the issues only the defensive area? No, certainly not.

Has the lack of defensive confidence damaged every area of the pitch? Yes

[Dan]

Collective problem. Too many luxury players. Dropping Dewsbury-Hall was madness. You need players like that in your side to be afforded the luxuries.

[RowlattsFox]

Defending is the problem. Or more the organisation of it. Not just defenders but the midfield/attackers too. 

 

Everything looks confused, unsure and lazy. 

[FoxinNotts]

Yes

[tickler28]

1 minute ago, FoxinNotts said:

Yes

So you think Ndidi and Tielemans are doing their jobs properly and Barnes and Lookman are tracking back? 

[Stadt]

There's total lack of organisation off the ball. Even at the tail end of last season we conceded 8 against Spurs & Newcastle, Fofana was fit then.

 

We're so easy to play through because we don't know how or when to press. Our defensive actions have dropped off year-on-year under Rodgers, we've been at our best when we've been aggressive but we just don't have any belief anymore hence why we revert to a deep back line, then invariably invite too much pressure on ourselves. Pannik buying that lump in the summer was so stupid as it's the antithesis of all of our good recruitment over the past few years.

 

We're just not physically up for it either, whether it's a lack of stamina, aggression or physicality so many of our players just don't make it difficult enough. Tielemans is never a particularly energetic player and with him running his contact down whilst he wants a move isn't going to bust a gut. Not picking KDH was a mistake because his energy and aggression help the whole side out.

[SkidsFox]

2 minutes ago, Stadt said:

There's total lack of organisation off the ball. Even at the tail end of last season we conceded 8 against Spurs & Newcastle, Fofana was fit then.

 

We're so easy to play through because we don't know how or when to press. Our defensive actions have dropped off year-on-year under Rodgers, we've been at our best when we've been aggressive but we just don't have any belief anymore hence why we revert to a deep back line, then invariably invite too much pressure on ourselves. Pannik buying that lump in the summer was so stupid as it's the antithesis of all of our good recruitment over the past few years.

 

We're just not physically up for it either, whether it's a lack of stamina, aggression or physicality so many of our players just don't make it difficult enough. Tielemans is never a particularly energetic player and with him running his contact down whilst he wants a move isn't going to bust a gut. Not picking KDH was a mistake because his energy and aggression help the whole side out.

Great analysis. Possible post of the year contender!

[fazzyfox]

The amount of times a conceded goal is being replayed on the tv screen then it cuts to the opposition bearing down on us again and I'm shouting "how the hell have they lost it that quickly", prime example being the two cases of two goals in two minutes. There really is some thoughtless stuff going on out there and started to see some arguments after the Forest goals. When we're being battered we need to give the defence a breather when we do get the ball just through solid unspectacular possession instead of head down trying to take on one man too many and losing it with team mates committed to supporting runs. 

[FoxinNotts]

3 minutes ago, tickler28 said:

So you think Ndidi and Tielemans are doing their jobs properly and Barnes and Lookman are tracking back? 

Not necessarily, but the issue you described there are also defending duties. 
 

Football is easily over complicated imo

 

This season we would be in a far better place if;

 

- we cut out basic errors in defence

- we defended set pieces better

- our DMs offered better protection

- Kasper distribution was better 

 

all of the above are defence issues. So as per my first answer….yes

[Leicester_Loyal]

It's a collection of everything, injuries, players being tired, manager having his limitations, players lacking the work rate, suicidal tactics, players vs. manager situation.

 

The people who were purely just blaming injuries and players being tired are idiots, an injury doesn't stop your team being able to defend a corner, each man has his job, shouldn't matter which player plays, the job remains the same.

 

We're too far gone now to sort the issue, either the players go or the manager does, usually it's the manager, and I don't think it'll be any different here, but thankfully two or three players will be moved on as well.

 

It's time for a fresh start.

[nnfox]

A lot has been made of our injury induced defensive frailties this season and undoubtedly they have played a part in what has been a very disappointing campaign.  With that said, the tactics are, and have been for sometime, stifling our attacks.

 

Even with Vardy on the pitch, there have been so many games where he has been an absolute passenger, but look at yesterday... Half time, we are 3-1 down.  It's a cup game, we have to go for it.  Goal difference isn't a concern, we had to go out and score goals, at least one fairly early on in the second half, against lower league opposition.  What happened? Barnes came off and an extra striker was put on.  The result? Daka snatched at a half chance early on, the next opportunity didn't come until the 80th minute in the form of a 20 yard volley by Daniel Amartey of all people.  Then, right at the death, Ricardo dragged one wide.

 

This is in a game against lower league opposition where we HAVE TO score goals.

 

So defensive issues are easy to point at to blame for our worful season, but look deeper and all too often, with a squad containing the likes of Tielemens, Perez, Barnes, Lookman, Maddison, Vardy, Iheanacho and Daka, we go absolutely awol up front.  How many games this season have there been with only one or two decent chances for us?  Too many. I just don't believe that is down to technical skills of those individuals, there are some very, very good players there. It's the tactics.

[Bert]

The problem is when we concede we instantly shit ourselves, go into our shells and have no clue what to do next. Twice in three games now we’ve conceded a goal within minutes of conceding another. 

[turlo]

we've been one of the easiest teams in the league to break down on the counter for a while now. Our midfield gets cut through with ease and we've been very reliant on an inform Wilf to prevent this from happening. Now Wilf is out of form we're getting ran over in midfield by relegation fodders and championship level clubs. 

[Hammo]

The defenders have no confidence, in themselves or each other, and those in front of them have no confidence in the defenders, which makes us collectively disorganised and easy to play against - especially at set pieces.

 

And, most worryingly, the manager appears to have no idea how to fix it.

[Foxdiamond]

14 minutes ago, Stadt said:

There's total lack of organisation off the ball. Even at the tail end of last season we conceded 8 against Spurs & Newcastle, Fofana was fit then.

 

We're so easy to play through because we don't know how or when to press. Our defensive actions have dropped off year-on-year under Rodgers, we've been at our best when we've been aggressive but we just don't have any belief anymore hence why we revert to a deep back line, then invariably invite too much pressure on ourselves. Pannik buying that lump in the summer was so stupid as it's the antithesis of all of our good recruitment over the past few years.

 

We're just not physically up for it either, whether it's a lack of stamina, aggression or physicality so many of our players just don't make it difficult enough. Tielemans is never a particularly energetic player and with him running his contact down whilst he wants a move isn't going to bust a gut. Not picking KDH was a mistake because his energy and aggression help the whole side out.

This seems to be spot on. It's almost we want to be purists without putting in the hard yards . You must have a toughness and a physical presence. We had Mahrez but we also had Huth. Balance and ability to mix it up. You remember when Arsenal went soft after losing their hardness. We are bullied it seems to me.

[The Quick Brown Fox]

53 minutes ago, foxes_rule1978 said:

We need leaders on the pitch and I honestly don’t think we have that especially without Vardy. The work rate doesn’t seem high to me and we are far too light weight 

Yesterday, they were all over us and when you looked at Youri, you never saw him telling anybody what to do, where to go, who to cover or even give them a bollocking, just jogging around and not giving a toss. We need a mouthy captain that will lead from the front and put a boot up the boys arses if they're not giving everything. 

[seanymac]

We seem to be much better when we defend higher up the pitch. Suyuncu in particular is a much better defender when we are on the halfway line and he is aggressively nipping it to pinch the ball etc.  But in order for that to happen we need to be pressing from the front and pushing the opposition back which we don't seem to do as much.  Too often we are sat very deep in our own half, which presents two problems;  One we can't defend deep, Evans is our only real natural defender and he is crocked, and two we seem to really struggle to play out once we are deep in our half and teams can and do pin us in.  Like forest did yesterday.  Personally I think it's a confidence issue.  I think the injuries to evans and fofana mean we are trying to compensate by defending slightly deeper and the consequence is we are not dominating possession and attacking because they are too busy tactically covering off their weaknesses.  Equally, Rogers has opted more often for a tactic of sitting in and keeping it tight for 60 mins and then playing a more expansive game last twenty.  It has worked in some games, LIverpool etc but too often it has resulted in essentially us being battered for the first half and the game then running away from us like the arsenal home game.   All in all I think we've struggled to find a balance all season, a task not helped by a plethora of injuries as well. 

[seanymac]

7 minutes ago, browniefox said:

Yesterday, they were all over us and when you looked at Youri, you never saw him telling anybody what to do, where to go, who to cover or even give them a bollocking, just jogging around and not giving a toss. We need a mouthy captain that will lead from the front and put a boot up the boys arses if they're not giving everything. 

MIdfield were awful yesterday.  Against a team a league below ndidi, tilemenas and maddison should be good enough to get their foot on the ball and dictate the game. Failed to impose themselves at all yesterday

[LCCFox96]

For me there are two key issues. Consistency - applicable to the form of key players and availability - and mentality. I think our defence this season has been worst affected on all of those issues and sums up our season perfectly. Since February last year we've had every defender bar Vestergaard and Thomas out for a sustained period whilst usually reliable players like Soyuncu have seen an alarming dip in form. We've also perennially struggled to see out leads and ride out rough patches in games which we have previously held division leading stats in under Rodgers' tenure.

 

My favourite win this season was Brentford away. It was vintage Leicester. We had some good spells in the game, got in front with a goal on the break and dug in hard to see it out. We defended well and managed the game well. Both things we are not doing regularly enough. 

 

I do hope we catch a break in terms of availability and believe that being able to name a consistent side for a more sustained period will help our case. But as a collective - including BR - we need to put right some of these issues. The backline named yesterday is more than capable of picking up results and the full backs will contribute going forwards too. We have a host of attacking and CM options capable of hurting anyone in the division. Yet we're limping through games. Something deeper isn't quite right.

[Marshall Cockney Fox]

Defence is a whole teams responsibility. But the reality is, all 4 forest goals were in some part attributable to our defence being poor. Doesn't matter who is picked in the back 4 / 5 now. They are psychologically shot. There is zero belief now in themselves and their capacity to not concede. Pundits are writing how shocking our defence is am how flawed we are at this & that i.e. set pieces. It's actually truly depressing how much we've been found out and how vulnerable we are - even to Champ sides.