Wednesday post match

[Haywood_6]

34 minutes ago, phildw said:

We were literally seconds away from a controlled 1nil win and the reactions on here would have been good result move on. Its no good moaning about 'boring' football that puts us top of the league. That's how it is going to be this season, the tactics have been set out and they are clearly working. As I said all teams are going to have a few blips along the way but the key is to get out of this league at the first attempt or its normally a long hard battle after that. Maresca has clearly found a way (the table doesn't lie) if its boring it's boring, but you cant have it both ways. 

Did you see the game? It was anything but a controlled win. They should of had two goals in the first 5 minutes. Two great chances missed. I'm angry with that performance. After we scored the goal - we were far too passive. This is against a team who's bottom of the league - near enough resigned to relegation. The players looked like they thought all they had to do was turn up to win. 

[Fazzer 7]

Just watched the so called hi lights back on lcfc. Now Hermansen is a decent keeper we all know that. But what the hell goes through a professionals mind that would make him play that ball to one of their players right in the centre of goal. Obviously it wasn't intended but you just wouldn't have played that ball, surely. So reckless. 

[phildw]

3 minutes ago, Haywood_6 said:

Did you see the game? It was anything but a controlled win. They should of had two goals in the first 5 minutes. Two great chances missed. I'm angry with that performance. After we scored the goal - we were far too passive. This is against a team who's bottom of the league - near enough resigned to relegation. The players looked like they thought all they had to do was turn up to win. 

I was there yes. I dont buy into this 'resigned to relegation' were only 18 games in. They were fighting for their lives so the total opposite

[whoareyaaa]

5 minutes ago, Haywood_6 said:

Did you see the game? It was anything but a controlled win. They should of had two goals in the first 5 minutes. Two great chances missed. I'm angry with that performance. After we scored the goal - we were far too passive. This is against a team who's bottom of the league - near enough resigned to relegation. The players looked like they thought all they had to do was turn up to win. 

Apart from those two earlier chances we dominated the ball all second half I think the players thought 1 goal was enough without going full pelt and becoming to open at the back unfortunately they managed to get a goal in the dying minutes 

[Chelmofox]

5 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

And to be honest I don't think he did much wrong yesterday. Casadei and Akgun I think aren't good enough to be both starting in the midfield. They had zero presence. But we weren't going to know that until we tried it, we need to rotate and they're the worst team in the league, it was the right time to do so. 

 

Sometimes you just have off days. 

 

Bang on this. I'm starting to lose faith in Casadei, but Akgun hasn't actually played much since his injury and needs to be given time as we have seen promise. But until you try, you don't know, and Ndidi and KDH weren't able to just steamroller them either from the bench. 

 

 

[5waller5]

One thing we did learn last night.

 

We really struggle without the energy and forward drive of KDH!

[inckley fox]

6 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

This isn't said anywhere near enough really. It's his first ever real, proper season in management (he didn't even last this long at Parma and really didn't have the support he does here.)

 

We're top, we're comfortably ahead of third and we've only dropped points in four games. 

 

And to be honest I don't think he did much wrong yesterday. Casadei and Akgun I think aren't good enough to be both starting in the midfield. They had zero presence. But we weren't going to know that until we tried it, we need to rotate and they're the worst team in the league, it was the right time to do so. 

 

End of the day, tactics, formations, systems, etc all only take you so far. The players that go out there have to perform and yesterday we didn't. To man we were absolutely awful. Whatever the reason, let's just draw a line under it and get on to the next match with hopefully a better showing. 

 

Sometimes you just have off days. 

 

A bit of context is needed for both the over-reactions and the under-reactions.

 

For the former, the obvious point is that Maresca started superbly, he's still learning as you say and we're in a position, overall, which should afford the manager some backing. Dips are bound to occur and, while any new boss deserves ample time, his early success warrants even more patience on our part. 

 

For the latter take, I'd say we are pretty much where the squad which, on paper, is the best in the division, should be right now. Points totals are all relative, but the margin between us and 2nd, and them and 3rd is roughly what most pundits expected right now. So yes he's delivered over the short-term, but no, he's not done anything yet which goes above and beyond expectation, regardless of how thrilling it may be to see the points clocked up after a couple of years of decline. And yes, we've only dropped points in four games, but three of those games were in the last four, so we can't simply dismiss it as an off day that we draw a line under.

 

As for comparisons with Rodgers, well, BR really did have a lot in the bank when his decline occurred. He had achieved success which went above and beyond, which is why people didn't want to acknowledge that anything was up. We don't need to make that same mistake because of a fine run of form early in a second tier season. Because of those lofty and justifiable expectations, the manager will either prove himself or otherwise, in a fairly short-term timespan, as a result of the tweaks he makes to remedy this dip. Regarding comparisons in footballing style, I'd say that they have a fair bit in common. There's a lot of apparently (but not necessarily) purposeless possession with very little variation on the theme and not too many chances created. Yes there's an inverted full back, no ten, two 8s and even less risk-taking in offensive areas, but it's still easier to draw comparisons between Enzo and BR or Puel than it is with most managers, and most of our managers in living memory.

 

Quite apart from that is how you feel about the football. But if it's deemed negative and dull, you're always going to have to provide the results to back up your choices. As blistering a start as it was, we don't know whether he can deliver that yet, and there are a few worrying signs.

[Rigga]

2 hours ago, Fox92 said:

A decent side would have been.

Which has been my point…

although in control of most games  possession wise this season, we have given the opposition chances..

thankfully the opposition has been pretty poor even for championship level imo..

[Fox92]

17 minutes ago, Rigga said:

Which has been my point…

although in control of most games  possession wise this season, we have given the opposition chances..

thankfully the opposition has been pretty poor even for championship level imo..

I was agreeing with you.

 

I said in another thread the other day but the quality of finishing between Championship and Premier League is massive. Teams miss 2 or 3 chances against us, compared to any decent Premier League striker who will convert the first or second chance he has.

 

But that's why we're in the Championship ourselves.

[Happy Fox]

We really were poor, definitely need a vast improvement against West Brom.

[foxinsocks]

49 minutes ago, 5waller5 said:

One thing we did learnIlast night.

 

We really struggle without the energy and forward drive of KDH!

I learnt that we are thru with Casadei - waste of space. Stop the experiment now - I have seen enough

[foxinsocks]

55 minutes ago, whoareyaaa said:

Apart from those two earlier chances we dominated the ball all second half I think the players thought 1 goal was enough without going full pelt and becoming to open at the back unfortunately they managed to get a goal in the dying minutes 

If we are going to go for  one nil we have to learn to close the game out with possession football - not panic

[South Shire Fox]

Weve known since the summer we need a creative CAM since Maddison left who can thread the ball through the eye of a needle. An absolute must in January 

Edited 30 November 2023 by South Shire Fox

[st albans fox]

1 hour ago, phildw said:

I was there yes. I dont buy into this 'resigned to relegation' were only 18 games in. They were fighting for their lives so the total opposite

But we did have an air of a group of players who looked like they thought it would be easy so that bit was right 

 

1 hour ago, whoareyaaa said:

Apart from those two earlier chances we dominated the ball all second half I think the players thought 1 goal was enough without going full pelt and becoming to open at the back unfortunately they managed to get a goal in the dying minutes 

Sadly I agree which is most frustrating- hopefully this will teach them that they need to keep up the intensity to get a second and then they can manage the game 

[Chelmofox]

11 minutes ago, South Shire Fox said:

Weve known since the summer we need a creative CAM since Maddison left who can thread the ball through the eye of a needle. An absolute must in January 

These guys dont grow on trees, and what evern money we spend we have to consider whether we spend championship money on someone who might not step up, of lower PL money with all the risks that brings in. But i agere, creativity and someone who can deal well with set pieces is sadly missing.

[Oldblueyes]

51 minutes ago, Happy Fox said:

We really were poor, definitely need a vast improvement against West Brom.

So where is that going to come from?

[sacreblueits442]

1 hour ago, whoareyaaa said:

Apart from those two earlier chances we dominated the ball all second half I think the players thought 1 goal was enough without going full pelt and becoming to open at the back unfortunately they managed to get a goal in the dying minutes 

...dominating the ball is not exerting pressure on your opponents!!!

  To be honest, I  believe other teams are now happy for us to have the ball, so long as they hold their defensive position, they can take a breather and look to press at the end of games. The only team that looked under the kosh at the end, was ourselves and it is now strategy being used to combat us.

  We need to be effective with our 60 odd %, we are toothless in the last third, other managers know that.

[Jabbaranks]

The myth has been busted. We had that weird period a few games back when Brizzle, Stoke and Preston all turned up and set up as if we were peak Barcelona, zero press, zero pressure, zero desire to come at us and we sailed through those games because of that. Sunderland were the first to set fire to that myth, and very quickly everyone has cottoned on. 

 

I understand Enzo has a desire to play a certain way, but I really don't get, like or understand a complete disregard of trying to turn teams around by balls into channels for players with pace (which we have) and getting at teams more dynamically and aggressively.

 

Last night was a shambles from start to finish. If that's not going to make him rethink that there has to be an alternate way to 'doing Plan A better' then I worry where this will end up.

[Rigga]

1 hour ago, Fox92 said:

I was agreeing with you.

 

I said in another thread the other day but the quality of finishing between Championship and Premier League is massive. Teams miss 2 or 3 chances against us, compared to any decent Premier League striker who will convert the first or second chance he has.

 

But that's why we're in the Championship ourselves.

Agreed..

 

im glad our rebuild is in the championship rather than PL

 

oppositions  high press will find us out very quickly..

[Munshi]

Yesterday showed that KDH is the most important player in this side.

[Trev3939]

was at the game and watched the extended highlights now- Did Vardy not get fouled in the box when he had that great chance- wasn't even on the extended highlights which shocked me as it looked a great chance and a potential foul. 

[hburton81295]

worst 2nd half ive seen in a long time we need to paly better we should of put the game to bed at 2-0 a darw to sheffield wedensday feels disappointing it feels like a defet

[lcfcell]

Seen a fair few Wednesday fans saying we’re the worst side they’ve played this season 

[Qwerty]

18 minutes ago, Trev3939 said:

was at the game and watched the extended highlights now- Did Vardy not get fouled in the box when he had that great chance- wasn't even on the extended highlights which shocked me as it looked a great chance and a potential foul. 

I was there too and thought it was a foul, but Vardy didn’t complain much did he, so I suppose it wasn’t 

[Qwerty]

3 minutes ago, lcfcell said:

Seen a fair few Wednesday fans saying we’re the worst side they’ve played this season 

Well why didn’t they beat us then?