Waghorn

[5waller5]

I'm not judging whether or not he should be sold on one season though. So far this season he hasn't scored enough goals, but he is capable of scoring goals, and in recent weeks has been one of our better player, but you'd drop him instantly and sell him which I just can't agree with. If you think it's fair to judge a player on goals scored in 13 games why were you not desperate for us to sell Beckford this time last year?

Why do you think that??

He's scored 19 in 103 appearances in his whole pro career. Take anytime frame and any measure you choose and he's not good enough and certainly not good enough to be a £3m player spearheading our drive into the premiership.

[5waller5]

Cardiff are top and only have Helguson with 7 league goals and no other striker anywhere near that from what I can see.

What they do have are goals from defence with 7 from Connolly and Hudson alone let alone a few from others. We have two goals from defenders so far this season. So you could argue our inability at set pieces is costing us as much as our forward line.

I agree with this though .... we don't score enough from set pieces / corners .... and haven't for a while (don't want to open this can of worms - but we looked more likely to score from Sven set pieces) ... central defenders should be weighing in with 5-10 goals a season for me.

[Manwell Pablo]

Are we actually blaming our lack of goals on central defenders.

Jesus christ.

[5waller5]

Are we actually blaming our lack of goals on central defenders.

Jesus christ.

I'm not at all ..... I think I'm being pretty clear that i blame it on a lack of support striker and that Nugent is the only forward at the club. But goals should come from set pieces too .... and i think Babylon has a point that those goals tip a few games a season from a draw to a win.

[Captain...]

My Apologies - he's definitely good enough now.

I'm not saying that, I'm saying your stats don't reflect the amount of times he was subbed on or off, and you are using them to judge his career, which is inaccurate. Some of those games were only 1 minute.

The most accurate and only fair way to statistically judge someone on their goals is by minutes on the pitch.

But then statistics are not a true judge of ability, and can be used to support anyone's argument as long as it has a hint of truth about it.

[Manwell Pablo]

I'm not at all ..... I think I'm being pretty clear that i blame it on a lack of support striker and that Nugent is the only forward at the club. But goals should come from set pieces too .... and i think Babylon has a point that those goals tip a few games a season from a draw to a win.

Yeah it's also something you can't correct their dependant on the ball in and some defenders are better at attacking balls than others, Morgan and Whitbread have never been particularly good at scoring goals I bet neither has got anywhere near 5 a season, St Ledger is probably the best for that but then I don't think he's ever scored for us. They are primarly there to stop the ball going in at the other end. Unless you want to start dropping Wes Morgan because his goals per minutes played isn't good enough is a ridiculous point

[Babylon]

So Cardiff are top and therefore in order to get anywhere we have to be just like them?

Well they finish top? I heavily, heavily doubt it.

Did I say we have to be just like them? Happy fox is seemingly saying that we need a second striker who will also score 15 as well as Nugent to stand a chance of promotion, and you agreed with him.

Clearly the table currently suggests that that is a bull plop suggestion. Whether they finish top or not, they currently are top and by quite a few points. Palace are second, they have a striker on 15 and again no other strikers anywhere near.

I have said several times if the money is there I would buy another striker. What I refute is that what we have is currently useless, that it's not better than what we had last year and that you have no chance without two strikers banging in 15/20 goals each.

People are heaping all of their woes onto the strike force, when their is clearly another major problem and that is goals from the back at set pieces.

[Manwell Pablo]

I'm not saying that, I'm saying your stats don't reflect the amount of times he was subbed on or off, and you are using them to judge his career, which is inaccurate. Some of those games were only 1 minute.

The most accurate and only fair way to statistically judge someone on their goals is by minutes on the pitch.

But then statistics are not a true judge of ability, and can be used to support anyone's argument as long as it has a hint of truth about it.

it doesn't even need that, Beckfords Premier League record shows him to be a better top level strilker than Robin Van Persie.

[kingfox]

Are people still arguing over Waghorn, flaming hell.

People even going through stats now.

This is getting silly.

[Manwell Pablo]

Did I say we have to be just like them? Happy fox is seemingly saying that we need a second striker who will also score 15 as well as Nugent to stand a chance of promotion, and you agreed with him.

Clearly the table currently suggests that that is a bull plop suggestion. Whether they finish top or not, they currently are top and by quite a few points. Palace are second, they have a striker on 15 and again no other strikers anywhere near.

I have said several times if the money is there I would buy another striker. What I refute is that what we have is currently useless, that it's not better than what we had last year and that you have no chance without two strikers banging in 15/20 goals each.

People are heaping all of their woes onto the strike force, when their is clearly another major problem and that is goals from the back at set pieces.

Palace have Wilfred Zaha on 4 goals and he is a contributing factor to Murrays 15, and he has every chance of getting 10-15 assuming Wenger doesn't sign him and ruin him. Borough have a collection several strikers chipping in with goals, and Mowbray still wants another one. Milwall strike force is excellent.

Unfortuantly I have to go home now otherwise I would continue.

[Babylon]

Are we actually blaming our lack of goals on central defenders.

Jesus christ.

There are 11 players on the pitch, we need to score from all over. These are the top scoring strikers for the top two. Our strikers are actually fairly comparable to most teams with one main striker and one support.

Cardiff

Helguson 7 goals

Mason 3 goals

Palace

Murray 15

Zaha 4

Leicester

Nugent 9 goals

Vardy 3 goals

Again for clarity, I would love another great striker. But it's not the hopeless cause some would have us out to be without one.

[Babylon]

Palace have Wilfred Zaha on 4 goals and he is a contributing factor to Murrays 15, and he has every chance of getting 10-15 assuming Wenger doesn't sign him and ruin him. Borough have a collection several strikers chipping in with goals, and Mowbray still wants another one. Milwall strike force is excellent.

Unfortuantly I have to go home now otherwise I would continue.

So Zaha is on 4 and is in with a chance of 15, but Vardy is on 3 and an utterly hopeless cause. I don't quite get that.

[Mark_w]

I think you should scroll up for my previous posts - I'm judging him on his previous 96 games and 18 goals, or 3 and a half years and 18 goals. It was you that wanted to use minutes instead.

Yes I wanted to use minutes played over the course of his career (I think that's a fair way to judge him), not in the last 13 matches.

Why do you think that??

He's scored 19 in 103 appearances in his whole pro career. Take anytime frame and any measure you choose and he's not good enough and certainly not good enough to be a £3m player spearheading our drive into the premiership.

Under Nigel Pearson his goal scoring record in terms of goals per minutes played, he has a pretty good goal scoring record.

[5waller5]

OK. I'm so curious how you can justify that Waghorn (blazes over) is good enough I've done the research and counted the bloody minutes on the pitch in each game this season!!

Leeds 77

Sheff Weds 85

Ipswich 74

Forest 95

Bolton 85

Watford 30

Brighton 71

Birmingham 72

Huddersfield 12

Hull 18

Burnley 17

Wolves 21

Burton 94

751 minutes. 1 Goal.

Can you think of another criteria to justify that he's good enough - because it seems minutes isn't working either!!!!!!!

I'm not saying that, I'm saying your stats don't reflect the amount of times he was subbed on or off, and you are using them to judge his career, which is inaccurate. Some of those games were only 1 minute.

The most accurate and only fair way to statistically judge someone on their goals is by minutes on the pitch.

But then statistics are not a true judge of ability, and can be used to support anyone's argument as long as it has a hint of truth about it.

Maybe you didn't see the minutes analysis of Waghorn (blazes over) season.

[5waller5]

Yes I wanted to use minutes played over the course of his career (I think that's a fair way to judge him), not in the last 13 matches.

Under Nigel Pearson his goal scoring record in terms of goals per minutes played, he has a pretty good goal scoring record.

I give up!!! You carry on rating him Mrs Waghorn, but every time i see the lad play and every stat i see suggest he is not good enough to get Leicester promoted.

[5waller5]

Are people still arguing over Waghorn, flaming hell.

People even going through stats now.

This is getting silly.

Maybe don't click on the "Waghorn" thread if you don't want to read a conversation about "Waghorn"??

[_Fatboyslow_]

For what is worth it looks quite simple to me. Pearson said he had looked but none of the targets are available (loaners) so Waghorn will play, if he is not scoring by the new year and/or if Nugget is still unfit we have to bring someone in who WILL do a job up front, I nearly put even if it means the return of Beckford but I won't

[kingfox]

Maybe don't click on the "Waghorn" thread if you don't want to read a conversation about "Waghorn"??

I look at all the threads, so if I wanted to have a look on this one, I will have a look.

But surprised that the same old people are still banging on about him, and even getting stats out now.

[Carl the Llama]

I look at all the threads, so if I wanted to have a look on this one, I will have a look.

But surprised that the same old people are still banging on about him, and even getting stats out now.

What you rather they argued over baseless conjecture?

[Mark_w]

if he is not scoring by the new year and/or if Nugget is still unfit we have to bring someone in who WILL do a job up front

Wouldn't it be great if it was that simple, if you could just buy a 'big name' striker on deadline day, give him £20,000+ a week and watch him fire you to the Premier League.

We've only had two out of those three in recent years though.

[_Fatboyslow_]

I look at all the threads, so if I wanted to have a look on this one, I will have look

Are we now bitching about if you should or shouldn't read a thread

[5waller5]

I look at all the threads, so if I wanted to have a look on this one, I will have a look.

But surprised that the same old people are still banging on about him, and even getting stats out now.

Probably don't be surprised that people are talking about "Waghorn" in a "Waghorn" thread is exactly my point. "Even getting stats out" ..... Stats not allowed then?? Someone had better tell Sky, the BBC, and almost anyone that talks about football ..... it really is nothing new!!!

[yorkie1999]

Simple answer for waghorn, just rename the kop to the barn door end, then with any luck he'd miss that and the only place left for the ball to end up is in the back of the net.

[Corky]

If only we'd signed Yakubu.

[_Fatboyslow_]

Wouldn't it be great if it was that simple, if you could just buy a 'big name' striker on deadline day, give him £20,000+ a week and watch him fire you to the Premier League.

We've only had two out of those three in recent years though.

If we don't it will be a fight to make the play offs, mmmm make it £40k a week