Zapp Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 My username isn't banter and I've never claimed it is. so you would change it because they find it offensive?
Mark_w Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 so you would change it because they find it offensive? Kitchandro said the chants aimed at Brighton fans were banter, he told us to look up the definition of the word banter. I did just that, banter is defined as 'the playful and friendly exchange of teasing remarks.' The point I was making is that as Brighton fans have complained about it, it clearly isn't friendly and therefore clearly isn't banter. So Kitchandro and Matt needed to stop hiding behind that term. I've never said my username is banter. Your point is absolutely irrelevant to the discussion. Hope that's cleared things up.
Zapp Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 Kitchandro said the chants aimed at Brighton fans were banter, he told us to look up the definition of the word banter. I did just that, banter is defined as 'the playful and friendly exchange of teasing remarks.' The point I was making is that as Brighton fans have complained about it, it clearly isn't friendly and therefore clearly isn't banter. So Kitchandro and Matt needed to stop hiding behind that term. I've never said my username is banter. Your point is absolutely irrelevant to the discussion. Hope that's cleared things up. your point is sound offence only matters if the person causing offence describes it as banter because if people complained about your username (as I was saying earlier) you wouldn't change it because you don't describe it as banter
Mark_w Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 your point is sound offence only matters if the person causing offence describes it as banter because if people complained about your username (as I was saying earlier) you wouldn't change it because you don't describe it as banter Frankly I'm really just interested in what I find offensive. I find racism offensive so I'm against it. I find homophobia offensive so I'm against it. I find chants that make light of the deaths of 13,000,000+ people offensive so I'm against them. I don't find the username 'Mark_w' offensive and unless someone gives me a good explanation as to why it's offensive I wouldn't change it. My point about Brighton fans complaining was simply that because of that fact, Matt & Kitch couldn't claim it is banter.
Dan Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 I'm sorry but anyone genuinely offended by 'we can see you holding hands' needs to man up. I'm convinced nowadays you can actually pretend to be offended at something just to be able to take the moral high ground.
MooseBreath Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 To me banter is just the mutual piss taking that english blokes use to bond. It is meant to be given playfully and received with modesty and self-deprecation. It seems to me that people who don't like banter struggle with the modesty and the self-deprecation part and instead take offence, and therefore refuse what was actually in essence an invitation to proceed in some ritualistic bonding leading to friendship, which is something of a faus pax and is sure to make people not like you, and I reckon you could probably track 95% of school bullying cases down to an incident of that kind. It makes sense for there to be a higher proportion of socially incapable formally bullied school kids on an internet forum, so that's what I'll put the ridiculous hypersensitivity in this thread down to I think. Bottom line: there's absolutely nothing wrong with "we can see you holding hands". It is just a joke.
leftbackinthechangingroom Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 Not that im condoning the chants that were used in the programme but the thing is with this issue is that if you asked a thousand people (and this is a guess no maths involved) you could say that maybe 50 would complain About the holding hands chant, and that is really what it boils down to is that no matter what it's that no matter what you can't please everyone and like a previous poster said it's the fashionable thing to do is complain.
Mark_w Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 Bottom line: there's absolutely nothing wrong with "we can see you holding hands". It is just a joke. I don't think that particular chant is morally wrong, it's just not really that funny. Some of the stuff aimed at Brighton fans and homosexuals at football matches is awful though.
Dan Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 I don't think that particular chant is morally wrong, it's just not really that funny. Some of the stuff aimed at Brighton fans and homosexuals at football matches is awful though. The majority of chants aren't funny. They're more boring than anything lately as they're just the same ones that've been trotted out for years. Genuine wit and originality, now that is funny.
Guest MarshallForEngland Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 When Brighton played at our place most recently, some clown who sits near me every week kept saying really awful things all game, one of which was (and the rest similar to) "****ing hell, are you happy over there with your d*cks covered in sh*t you benders!" He said it with such anger and vitriol. Now, believe me the vulgarity itself doesn't bother me, I've heard much worse like everybody else has. But will anybody really say that this is a good thing to shout in any public place? People should be embarrassed to talk like that. There's nothing witty or humorous about it, although some humour may be derived from the very fact that somebody could deliver that sort of comment in the first place.
Dan Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 When Brighton played at our place most recently, some clown who sits near me every week kept saying really awful things all game, one of which was (and the rest similar to) "****ing hell, are you happy over there with your d*cks covered in sh*t you benders!" He said it with such anger and vitriol. Now, believe me the vulgarity itself doesn't bother me, I've heard much worse like everybody else has. But will anybody really say that this is a good thing to shout in any public place? People should be embarrassed to talk like that. There's nothing witty or humorous about it, although some humour may be derived from the very fact that somebody could deliver that sort of comment in the first place. That I can fully appreciate being dealt with in a serious manner, as that is genuine hatred and homophobia. Certain songs are boring, but shouldn't be taken seriously. The way they actually portrayed about 10 Burnley fans jokingly singing "just a town full of benders" as if they were neo-nazis was laughable.
absolutelegend Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 I'd rather go with this definition http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/tomchiversscience/100141906/if-you-like-banter-you-are-an-idiot/ "Banter is not humour; banter is what people have when they lack a sense of humour. Banter is a catch-all word for idiocy that warns the rest of us that Here Be Lads. Banter is Soccer AM. It is Andy Gray. It is middle-aged men on Top Gear pretending that they are edgy outsiders by mocking society's weakest, then going home to Chipping Norton where they live two doors down from the Prime Minister. It is an English stag do in Dublin or Amsterdam with matching T-shirts. It is cruelty unleavened by wit but which is excused because it is a bit like wit, if you look at it from a certain angle. It what is left when humour has died, and just the rotting, stinking carcass remains, bearing a resemblance to the living being but lacking all that made it good. Banter is the Dunning-Kruger effect writ large. If you like banter, you are an idiot." possibly one of the most pathetic set of words I have ever had the misfortune of wasting my time to read
ozleicester Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 The person that is saying something, does not decide if it is offensive, the person hearing it does. I may not be offended by being called a white cvnt or whatever, but my mate is offended by being called a black cvnt. When people are made aware that what they are saying or doing is offensive, a decent person stops doing it.
Iwan is a Welshman Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 I think people need to remember that, whilst it's not a decent thing to do, being offensive (rightly) isn't illegal and people have the right to be so if they wish. It's freedom of speech. As pointed out on here being offended is in the mind of the beholder. Almost all football chants are offensive - "you only sing when you're winning" is offensive. The problem is when it portrays prejudice.
LanguedocFox Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 You need to watch it. She was on the biggest power trip ever, there was about 20 people banging on the back of the stand and she picked on this 1 bloke to "make an example of". She came across like a massive ****. Definitely deserved a slap. If you think any woman "deserves" a slap, you need help. And no, to save you replying, it's not banter.
C-man Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 Regardless of whether it is offensive or not they are all just fvcking shit chants that need eradicating from the game immediately.
AnotherShitSeason Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 Can you imagine the type that goes to the match with his (or her) finger constantly hovering over the 'Kick it Out' Smartphone App? Feverishly canning the crowd for any hint of discrimination. That scene with the stewards. 'Sir sir! There's people up there singing mean songs. You must arrest the whole end!'
indierich06 Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 Banter; because acting like a **** needed a new, more acceptable name.
shade Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 To me banter is just the mutual piss taking that english blokes use to bond. It is meant to be given playfully and received with modesty and self-deprecation. It seems to me that people who don't like banter struggle with the modesty and the self-deprecation part and instead take offence, and therefore refuse what was actually in essence an invitation to proceed in some ritualistic bonding leading to friendship, which is something of a faus pax and is sure to make people not like you, and I reckon you could probably track 95% of school bullying cases down to an incident of that kind. It makes sense for there to be a higher proportion of socially incapable formally bullied school kids on an internet forum, so that's what I'll put the ridiculous hypersensitivity in this thread down to I think. Bottom line: there's absolutely nothing wrong with "we can see you holding hands". It is just a joke. I think people are missing the point. chants that refer to homosexuality aren't ultimately offensive to the heterosexuals in the stadium (although they may well be offended). it's offensive to gay people who, shock horror may hold hands and be the same sex. do you honestly think hundreds of people insulting a group of people for doing what you do naturally isn't harsh, come on.
Voll Blau Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 Regardless of whether it is offensive or not they are all just fvcking shi[i/]t chants that need eradicating from the game immediately. Exactly. Not wishing to trivialise the issue, but I just don't understand why people would rather chant the same old tired, boring, generic shite Brighton fans get everywhere than get behind their own team. It's like people who give the usual Welsh shite to Cardiff and Swansea thinking they're genuinely being witty and unique, as if they'll never have heard all that bollocks before. Also love how unbelievably riled up some folks are getting at that definition of the word "banter". You've proved his point quite nicely there. Remember lads, it's just banter eh?
Kitchandro Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 Kitchandro said the chants aimed at Brighton fans were banter, he told us to look up the definition of the word banter. I did just that, banter is defined as 'the playful and friendly exchange of teasing remarks.' The point I was making is that as Brighton fans have complained about it, it clearly isn't friendly and therefore clearly isn't banter. So Kitchandro and Matt needed to stop hiding behind that term. I've never said my username is banter. Your point is absolutely irrelevant to the discussion. Hope that's cleared things up. There's you assuming that all Brighton fans are actually gay If they're straight they have no more reason to take offence than a straight City fan standing next to me. So them complaining about it is irrelevant. If they get upset by that kind of thing then they should a) ignore it or b) stop going to the football. Seriously, they need to take a chill pill and stop giving a shit. It's really not worth worrying about.
shade Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 There's you assuming that all Brighton fans are actually gay If they're straight they have no more reason to take offence than a straight City fan standing next to me. So them complaining about it is irrelevant. If they get upset by that kind of thing then they should a) ignore it or b) stop going to the football. Seriously, they need to take a chill pill and stop giving a shit. It's really not worth worrying about. it is worth worrying about though.
indierich06 Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 There's you assuming that all Brighton fans are actually gay If they're straight they have no more reason to take offence than a straight City fan standing next to me. No, you're assuming that you have to be gay to be offended by homophobia, which is complete bullshit. All kinds of discrimination offend me. If someone next to me at the football shouts '**** off you black ****' or 'get the **** up, you mincing homo twat' you can bet I'm going to have a problem.
Kitchandro Posted 4 March 2014 Posted 4 March 2014 I think people are missing the point. chants that refer to homosexuality aren't ultimately offensive to the heterosexuals in the stadium (although they may well be offended). it's offensive to gay people who, shock horror may hold hands and be the same sex. do you honestly think hundreds of people insulting a group of people for doing what you do naturally isn't harsh, come on. I don't think chanting light hearted gay 'satire' at a group of predominantly straight people is harsh, no. Even if there were gay people in the crowd, surely they're mature enough to understand that it's aimed jokingly at a silly stereotype of the place? Again, if they're not, no biggy, but don't turn up to the football and insist on being offended. It's pathetic. it is worth worrying about though. It's really not. Life has many much more serious issues.
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